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RE: M/s needs? - 12/27/2005 4:12:29 PM

Delvin

Posts: 151
Joined: 8/23/2005
From: Texas
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: nonuts4thshoney

In an M/s relationship is it only about the Masters needs being met? Or is about both the Master and sub/slave having their needs met?

What is it to be a slave? What needs do you have as a slave? What requirements are needed to be in place to be a slave? What is your agenda?

In my home, my needs are met and in doing so, my slaves needs are met. She came to me to serve so she will serve. As harsh as some things may sound, she is simply property which lives in my home. She benifits from my life, she is protected from the elements, protected from strangers, she has a full belly each night, clothes on her back, and amazingly enough a smile that refuse to leave. She is a slave. Her needs are met.

D

(in reply to nonuts4thshoney)

Post #: 21

RE: M/s needs? - 12/27/2005 5:16:19 PM

Sunshine119

Posts: 611
Joined: 8/8/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

quote:

ORIGINAL: fyreredsub
there is one concern after you give consent to Master...that is his needs

That's a nice thing to say, but not very realistic.

I like to put it as "there is only one ULTIMATE concern"

However, we still have all the other concerns to deal with. Yes, as long as I am with an owner, then I can rely on my needs being met and do not have to directly concern myself with it, as long as I am attending to HIS needs and desires (which include a need and desire to have me as a fulfilled slave) then things will be taken care of.

This doesn't mean I can no longer CONCERN myself with other things. His way of making sure my needs are met might be by telling me "go and get a job and keep finances together and make sure thing's get done right."

That means *I* have to concern myself with day to day issues and making sure things are done right.

As well, no matter how awesome a master I may have, no one will take away concerns for my family members and loved ones if they get hurt or are sick. I can be as devoted a slave as possible, and still be sad to not see my nephews.

So it sure SOUNDS nice to say "a slave only has to concern herself with making sure the masters needs are met" but in real life, concerns don't just go away because you are with a good and capable master. They simply get redirected and reprioritized.

Well said, realistic and written by someone who lives and helps guide others in this lifestyle. No matter who in life we are, we are ultimately selfish. The master is just as selfish as the slave and vice versa. There is no one who exists who is altruistic alone. As human beings, we ALL need to have our needs met. It is nice when the needs of one who wants to serve is matched with one who wants to be served. However, only in fiction does a slave find total fulfillment in fulfilling his/her master's every request and has none of his/her own.

Ask yourself this next time you are considering the OP's question: How many of us would stop talking to our siblings, our parents, our friends, abstain from the internet, read nothing not given to us, have none of our own beliefs or hold no political opinion except our master's, IF we were told to?

Might work for a short amount of time. Then the master would have a very weary, bored, restless, troublesome slave on his/her hands. Fiction and reality constantly clash. LOL

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)

Post #: 22

RE: M/s needs? - 12/27/2005 5:30:35 PM

IrishMist

Posts: 7480
Joined: 11/17/2005
Status: offline

quote:

Ask yourself this next time you are considering the OP's question: How many of us would stop talking to our siblings, our parents, our friends, abstain from the internet, read nothing not given to us, have none of our own beliefs or hold no political opinion except our master's, IF we were told to?

I would. Because I would know that the reason behind such an order was for my own good.

quote:

Might work for a short amount of time. Then the master would have a very weary, bored, restless, troublesome slave on his/her hands. Fiction and reality constantly clash. LOL

And no, it could work for a good many years. After my daughter was born, due to some circumstances, I was restricted from talking to or seeing my family. It was a good thing because it took away some stress that was in my life at that time. I read what was allowed to me to read, though my political views never changed ( but he enjoyed a good spirited debate ).

In no way did these restrictions turn me into a boring robot, LOL, in fact, the views and opinions that I gained from some things clashed with his, and made our lives more enriched.

(in reply to Sunshine119)

Post #: 23

RE: M/s needs? - 12/27/2005 5:52:52 PM

KnightofMists

Posts: 7149
Joined: 7/29/2005
Status: offline

One only "needs" to breathe if one wants to "live"!

No matter what our relationship structure happens to be, our needs are very much a reflection of what we want in life to give us happiness. There are indeed basic physiological needs that are required to sustain our life and if that is all one wants are to sustain their life then that is all we will need. However, generally we want more than just to sustain our life. If we look to fulfill our life and reach levels a healthy psychological well-being we will need more than just our physiological needs to be met. The question then is what psychological needs are required to be met in order for one to have a healthy Well-Being. In addition, these psychological needs must be fulfilled directly or indirectly from the particular M/s relationship in question. Our individual perceptions of what brings us a sense of psychological Well-being are very much driven not by natural instinctive drives, but our individual wants for happiness. It is important that a slave has a basic understanding of what they want in their relationships and choose a Master that is compatible to those wants. I read once on the forums of a person that felt that developing and understanding our limitations (Hard Limits etc) is not a sufficient basis to form a relationship. I complete agree with this opinion and would had that thou establishing of limitations may protect our Well-Being, It is the fulfillment of our needs and desire that will bring enhance our Well-being and bring us a sense of enlightenment and happiness

_____________________________

Knight of Mists

An Optimal relationship is achieved when the individuals do what is best for themselves and their relationship.

(in reply to nonuts4thshoney)

Post #: 24

RE: M/s needs? - 12/27/2005 7:01:23 PM

Nendarye

Posts: 147
Joined: 12/23/2005
From: Texas
Status: offline

quote:

After my daughter was born, due to some circumstances, I was restricted from talking to or seeing my family. It was a good thing because it took away some stress that was in my life at that time

Irish girl, I remember that you cried for a month when that happened. But I also know the circumstances surrounding it, and yes, it did help in the long run.

quote:

Ask yourself this next time you are considering the OP's question: How many of us would stop talking to our siblings, our parents, our friends, abstain from the internet, read nothing not given to us, have none of our own beliefs or hold no political opinion except our master's, IF we were told to?

Might work for a short amount of time. Then the master would have a very weary, bored, restless, troublesome slave on his/her hands. Fiction and reality constantly clash. LOL

But I agree with this. 99% of the time, fiction does clash with reality. And the results are less than enthusiastic.

_____________________________

" You may be suffering, but you will always suffer with love"

@~~Proud property of Master Michael~~@

(in reply to IrishMist)

Post #: 25

RE: M/s needs? - 12/27/2005 10:15:35 PM

buffiyum

Posts: 119
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

......However, we still have all the other concerns to deal with. Yes, as long as I am with an owner, then I can rely on my needs being met and do not have to directly concern myself with it, as long as I am attending to HIS needs and desires (which include a need and desire to have me as a fulfilled slave) then things will be taken care of......

one quite agree with LuckyAlbatross on this.

one does know that each of us has human needs and concerns which can include things which are not directely and implicitely concern with the Master. To use the example stated already, one might feel sad at not seeing ones relatives. Not the Master's relatives, but the slaves. This is simply 'being human', only that.
buffy feel that, as has already been said in differente words, each of us comes to the Life on individual paths or, to put it another way, 'view' the Life through a lens which is individual to each of us alone (many thanks to the Sir who first told buffy this analogy, she like it a lot)..... the thing each of us need to do in this journey to finding a One or a one, is find someone whose path through the Life most closely resembles our own or.... whose lens (perspective) most closely matches our own. The same thing but one is fond of semantics. Sorry about that.
It sounds like many here, have been most fortunate to find a 'match' as to 'needs'...that is wonderful ~smiles~
one would also say this.............
There are not any 'hard and fast' "rules" on this Lifestyle.... it is all a matter of 'perspective'. What works for one, may not work at all for another and yet, neither may work for buffy. Yet all three ways and more, are valid.
Perspective, acceptance. Big words for a simple way of viewing life.
And especialely, the Life. buffy doesnot always remember this (perspective), and is not always able to do this (acceptance), but she work on this each day and from this, she learns and in learning, she grows.
respectfully
buffy

< Message edited by buffiyum -- 12/27/2005 10:28:08 PM >

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)

Post #: 26

RE: M/s needs? - 12/28/2005 6:24:26 AM

Wildfleurs

Posts: 1650
Joined: 9/24/2004
From: Connecticut
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sunshine119

Well said, realistic and written by someone who lives and helps guide others in this lifestyle. No matter who in life we are, we are ultimately selfish. The master is just as selfish as the slave and vice versa. There is no one who exists who is altruistic alone. As human beings, we ALL need to have our needs met. It is nice when the needs of one who wants to serve is matched with one who wants to be served. However, only in fiction does a slave find total fulfillment in fulfilling his/her master's every request and has none of his/her own.

Ask yourself this next time you are considering the OP's question: How many of us would stop talking to our siblings, our parents, our friends, abstain from the internet, read nothing not given to us, have none of our own beliefs or hold no political opinion except our master's, IF we were told to?

Might work for a short amount of time. Then the master would have a very weary, bored, restless, troublesome slave on his/her hands. Fiction and reality constantly clash. LOL

I understand the point behind this but what fustrates me is that arguements on M/S are always predicated on the owner being a complete asshole that has the time to exercise all of this control in random ways for no clear reason. I've known owners that wouldn't let their slaves talk with certain people that were friends in the past, but I've never known one that did everything you listed (and also this leap of faith in your hypothetical also requires that both people have contrary beliefs and political opinions and don't value reading). Its the same when you talk about anything... for instance you talk about the concept of no limits or boundaries the FIRST thing the owner in the hypotheticals wants to do is cut off your arm. And somehow setting up all of these boundaries, hoops, and must haves will protect you from an owner like you are describing up there.

C~

_____________________________

"Just because you've always done it that way doesn't mean it's not incredibly stupid." -despair.com

~~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~
The heart of it all - http://www.wildfleurs.com
~~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~

(in reply to Sunshine119)

Post #: 27

RE: M/s needs? - 12/28/2005 6:55:16 AM

KatyLied

Posts: 13029
Joined: 2/24/2005
From: Pennsylvania
Status: offline

I am steadfast in my opinion that two people in a relationship = two sets of needs (wants).

You can call them "wants" if you like, I know there is a bit of a difference. A lot of my need is in pleasing him. But I have needs beyond that and those get met as well. Being a slave does not mean that you give up your wants and needs. You subjugate them, but they are still there. And if you find happiness in ignoring your needs, that's cool too. It just would never work for me.

_____________________________

“If you want to live a happy life, tie it to a goal, not to people or things.”
- Albert Einstein

(in reply to Wildfleurs)

Post #: 28

RE: M/s needs? - 12/28/2005 7:14:45 AM

Quivver

Posts: 1953
Joined: 11/27/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: KatyLied

I am steadfast in my opinion that two people in a relationship = two sets of needs (wants).

You can call them "wants" if you like, I know there is a bit of a difference. A lot of my need is in pleasing him. But I have needs beyond that and those get met as well. Being a slave does not mean that you give up your wants and needs. You subjugate them, but they are still there. And if you find happiness in ignoring your needs, that's cool too. It just would never work for me.

yea, what she said............

_____________________________

The problem with communication ... is the illusion that it has been accomplished. ~George Bernard Shaw

(in reply to KatyLied)

Post #: 29

RE: M/s needs? - 12/28/2005 7:19:26 AM

shandra

Posts: 26
Joined: 1/25/2005
Status: offline

the owner has a need or invitation to own and the slave has a need to be owned that is enough
beyond that is individual to the relationship

< Message edited by shandra -- 12/28/2005 7:21:01 AM >

(in reply to KatyLied)

Post #: 30

RE: M/s needs? - 12/28/2005 7:57:51 AM

LadyKim

Posts: 191
Joined: 11/11/2004
Status: offline

I think it is important to remember that in any healthy relationship all involved need to have their needs met. However, it is also true that not everyone desires to have those needs met in the same way. Using a broad brush to define the base needs of a submissive (note I'm not saying this applies specifically to every person), submissives need to feel they are 'serving', 'helpful', 'useful', and appreciated for their role. Everyone likes to know that their efforts are acknowledged by someone. Dominants (wide brush definition again) need to be able to direct activities and feel they are molding a submissive into a better person/sub/slave than they were first introduced to.

In the way I practice the lifestyle, I focus on finding out what the submissive believe he/she needs early on in a relationship, then I observe their behavior over time to determine if what they THINK they need is what they TRULY need. From their I blend a mixture of the two with my needs. I enjoy helping people to grow as individuals as well as submissives.

One boy I enjoyed for several months was wonderful at lip service (and oral...... but that is neither here or there), but he was going through so much that he was overwhelmed in his vanilla world. I made it a practice to give him some form of positive influence or thought on a daily basis to help him to remember he could take the steps necessary to get his world under control. Despite being disappointed and upset when our relationship ended (he'd gotten to my heart), I know the efforts I made to help his outlook on his life to improve took root. We still communicate from time to time, and he has done what he needed to do to further his career, help his family, and find more time to do what is important for his life to be rewarding. I do feel he neglects one NEED in his life, but I also know that eventually the NEED will win out when he feels more secure with his present and finds the ability to add the time into his schedule to meet that need.

I think it is also important to remember that we all have needs that have different degrees of urgency, and there are times when someone is better served to ignore one need to fulfill a stronger one. It's like building a house. You have to start with the foundation, frame it, roof it, and finish it before moving in the furniture. If you move the furniture to the lot when it is first purchased, it will be ruined before you are ready to move in. Same applies with relationships......... if you don't pay attention to build the foundation and meet the important needs first, then it is going to be ruined eventually.

Just my two cents.
MzKim

PS......... I think it is important to remember too that not every relationship we enter into vanilla, D/s, or M/s is meant to be an LTR. There are some times when the relationship is only there to help one or both fulfill a need or provide life education to prepare the person for another relationship. While we do not end up in a long term committed relationship with everyone we have feelings for, the effects of that relationship are long term. Helping us to grow for future relationships and find what is and is not really important.

(in reply to nonuts4thshoney)

Post #: 31

RE: M/s needs? - 12/28/2005 8:09:07 AM

LuckyAlbatross

Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyKim
submissives need to feel they are 'serving', 'helpful', 'useful', and appreciated for their role. Everyone likes to know that their efforts are acknowledged by someone. Dominants (wide brush definition again) need to be able to direct activities and feel they are molding a submissive into a better person/sub/slave than they were first introduced to.

That is something I have always found interesting- doms get upset when they feel like they aren't being useful or solving things. They blame themselves a lot just like subs do.

(in reply to LadyKim)

Post #: 32

RE: M/s needs? - 12/28/2005 8:15:46 AM

Mercnbeth

Posts: 11766
Status: offline

quote:

Everyone likes to know that their efforts are acknowledged by someone.

Not true. Some folks go out of their way to be anonymous with their deeds because they do not desire praise and recognition for their efforts. it makes some people feel uncomfortable.

(in reply to LadyKim)

Post #: 33

RE: M/s needs? - 12/28/2005 8:33:26 AM

MistressDREAD

Posts: 2943
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

In My Opinion:
D/s
Both seek out and desire to fullfill their own need of satifaction of kinks.
be it the Dominant or the submissive with one another for the moment.
M/s
Both seek out another to fullfill a need of the other, the slave desiring to
give totally of self in release to be controled completly and the
Master/Mistress desiring to take totally the being and physical self of
another in control and care for all times.

All 4 positions are sought out and needs fullfilled if all know self and seek
out that which fits their true kink and need, otherwise the relation will fail,
be it for a few hours of munchie scening or a lifetime commitment of TPE.
So first seek out that which will gain you the information needed to know
who you are and what you are and what your need or desire is befor seeking
out another for what ever gratification you seek. JMO

< Message edited by MistressDREAD -- 12/28/2005 8:38:28 AM >

(in reply to Mercnbeth)

Post #: 34

RE: M/s needs? - 12/28/2005 9:19:31 AM

LadyKim

Posts: 191
Joined: 11/11/2004
Status: offline

Merc n beth,

I did not say that they sought recognition for EVERY action they do from EVERYONE. But they do want the person that the holds the highest place in their heart to acknowledge their efforts on their behalf.

(in reply to Mercnbeth)

Post #: 35

RE: M/s needs? - 12/28/2005 10:44:50 AM

nonuts4thshoney

Posts: 550
Joined: 6/12/2005
From: Southern California
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: KatyLied

I am steadfast in my opinion that two people in a relationship = two sets of needs (wants).

You can call them "wants" if you like, I know there is a bit of a difference. A lot of my need is in pleasing him. But I have needs beyond that and those get met as well. Being a slave does not mean that you give up your wants and needs. You subjugate them, but they are still there. And if you find happiness in ignoring your needs, that's cool too. It just would never work for me.

i agree with this. Alot of my need is to please Her. i know that some of my needs She is unable to fulfill for me and i understand why. i guess i find happiness to some extent in ignoring those needs because i already know that it's a need not worth ever asking for because it can't be provided for me. i'm not sure what this could do to me in the long run but for right now i am managing ok. i love her very much and do my best to obey Her wishes. Although i am saddened by it at times. She does come first in my life though and i am very happy serving Her.

(in reply to KatyLied)

Post #: 36

RE: M/s needs? - 12/28/2005 11:06:40 AM

FlorentineBob

Posts: 17
Joined: 2/6/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: phoenixslave

i am more at his feet than i ever was standing on my own. He builds me up as a person and in valuing his property his property becomes that much more valuable. He owns my body, mind, heart and trust. Many would disagree or choose another way. The key is finding the right person for whatever "style" makes you the best you can be.

The understanding of what it is to be human... The ability to be our authentic selves... these are the things that make us not only who we are, but who we can be.

Responsibility is what defines a Masters place in the relationship. To me, a Master has the responsibility to guide a partner to be all they can be in every facet of their life. This isn't about micro-management, but rather being supportive and encouraging the submissive to achieve their goals, reset goals, and grow further. Those who only see growth as surpassing or extending limits, miss the joy of seeing a submissive find new levels of accomplishment in the other arenas that life takes them. Often, a simple word, or a suggestion, are sufficient to add the power a partner needs to grow. If one doesn't see this or provide it, both are denied the reflection of power that comes from growth.

Full acceptance of a slave requires a tolerance of imperfection from the Master. Any Dominant can “master” perfect slaves. But there aren’t any perfect slaves or, for that matter, any perfect Masters. It is part of the beautiful mystery of human nature that even the most immature, inept or lazy person is capable of greatness if wisely led. Many otherwise capable Dominants are disqualified as Masters because they cannot handle less-than-perfect slaves. slaves grow confident in their slavery when their Masters empathize with them and when they are accepted for who they are, even though their service or performance may be judged critically in terms of what they are capable of doing.

Robert Blount

Power whispers... it has no reason to yell

[Mod Note: email address deleted. Personal contact info is not allowed in forum posts]

< Message edited by ModeratorEleven -- 12/29/2005 1:11:27 PM >

(in reply to phoenixslave)

Post #: 37

RE: M/s needs? - 12/28/2005 4:16:28 PM

LadiesBladewing

Posts: 944
Joined: 8/31/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: nonuts4thshoney

In an M/s relationship is it only about the Masters needs being met? Or is about both the Master and sub/slave having their needs met?

As in any relationship, everyone involved must have their needs met. The difference in our household is that a servant who comes to serve with us turns over the right to determine his or her own needs, and SR and I make the decision about what is a "need" and what is a "want". Those decisions don't always go in the Owner's favor at our house, either. As an example, we released a girl last night that we believed had a great deal of potential as a servant. The reason that we released her is because we determined that she needed to focus on other responsibilities in her life, and that taking care of us was a pleasant distraction, but a distraction that she could not afford. She needed time to focus, and to put into practice some of the things she'd learned of late, and she needed to develop self-confidence by realizing that she was both capable and strong enough to do what she knew she needed to do. We could have told her that she was obligated to stay and finish out her 3 month consideration period, but doing so might have lost her an opportunity to take HUGE strides in becoming who she is meant to be, and might impact another's development and progress profoundly at the same time. Her serving us was a "want" on our part... and the servant's need superseded the Owners' want.

We decide for our servants what is a "want" and what is a "need"... we do so by determining what will be in the best interests of our household as a -whole-... which includes our servants. There are many people who can't distinguish between a "want" and a "need", and this eliminates confusion. If we determine it is a "need", it will be taken care of. If we determine it is a "want", whether or not it is provided is purely up to our discretion.

Lady Zephyr

< Message edited by LadiesBladewing -- 12/28/2005 4:17:04 PM >

_____________________________

"Should have", "could have", "would have" and "can't" may be the most dangerous phrases in the English language.
Bladewing Enclave

(in reply to nonuts4thshoney)

Post #: 38

RE: M/s needs? - 12/28/2005 6:41:56 PM

Sunshine119

Posts: 611
Joined: 8/8/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Wildfleurs

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sunshine119

Well said, realistic and written by someone who lives and helps guide others in this lifestyle. No matter who in life we are, we are ultimately selfish. The master is just as selfish as the slave and vice versa. There is no one who exists who is altruistic alone. As human beings, we ALL need to have our needs met. It is nice when the needs of one who wants to serve is matched with one who wants to be served. However, only in fiction does a slave find total fulfillment in fulfilling his/her master's every request and has none of his/her own.

Ask yourself this next time you are considering the OP's question: How many of us would stop talking to our siblings, our parents, our friends, abstain from the internet, read nothing not given to us, have none of our own beliefs or hold no political opinion except our master's, IF we were told to?

Might work for a short amount of time. Then the master would have a very weary, bored, restless, troublesome slave on his/her hands. Fiction and reality constantly clash. LOL

I understand the point behind this but what fustrates me is that arguements on M/S are always predicated on the owner being a complete asshole that has the time to exercise all of this control in random ways for no clear reason.

I think you've made quite a jump there. It is a question predicated on NO assumptions, but rather, poses a question based upon the comments made in the preceding messages and adds some to push this hyposition into the absurd. There are no assumptions about owners being complete assholes. If you are so well acquainted with my posts, you will realize that I AM owned! I just believe that we all get what we need or we wouldn't stay within the relationship we are in....unless we are too traumatized to leave.

quote:

I've known owners that wouldn't let their slaves talk with certain people that were friends in the past, but I've never known one that did everything you listed (and also this leap of faith in your hypothetical also requires that both people have contrary beliefs and political opinions and don't value reading).

I'm glad YOU have never met anyone who fit this profile but, trust me, they do exist. 20 years in social services has taught me that. Often they are nothing but abusive people who hide as Dom(me)s, but some people, newly in this lifestyle don't understand this difference. The typical profile of an ABUSER is one who isolates their partner from friends/family, who tells them what to think, and what they can and can not do, WITHOUT it fulfilling their needs as well. (Please again note: In a D/s relaltionship, the submissive does get his/her needs fulfilled by fulfilling the needs of their dominant and feels satisfaction and pride in it)

quote:

Its the same when you talk about anything... for instance you talk about the concept of no limits or boundaries the FIRST thing the owner in the hypotheticals wants to do is cut off your arm. And somehow setting up all of these boundaries, hoops, and must haves will protect you from an owner like you are describing up there.

Now, You've totally lost me. What is this about talking about limits or boundaries??? Cutting off one's arm? I searched my name with the words "boundary", "boundaries", "limit", "limits", "arm". You obviously have misquoted me. I did find the post you were referring to, but you are quoting someone else, and have mistakenly jumped to the conclusion it was me. Good move!

However, I'm glad you have decided that I talk the same way about "anything". To me, that is a great thing. It means my ethics are consistent and large enough to fit most situations. LOL. Please make sure you are referring to the appropriate person before name calling.

(in reply to Wildfleurs)

Post #: 39

RE: M/s needs? - 12/28/2005 6:56:32 PM

plantlady64

Posts: 755
Joined: 5/19/2005
Status: offline

Hello There,
I think technically it's viewed as being about what the master needs. I also feel a good Master takes good care of his sub/slaves and would naturally want to meet their needs.
My Master says taking care of my needs, and giving me some of my wants, makes me a happier slave. He likes it when I'm at peace and content so he chooses to meet my needs and more.

Masters analogy is a good sub/slave is like a Ferrari. She'll take you anywhere you want to go in style, but needs maintenance, and care to last. If you don't take the time to maintain her, and keep her in good working order she'll leave you by the side of the road one day when she breaks down.

I think overall in our relationship both of us have our needs met by the other.
I also feel if my Master and I both have needs I want His to be met first.
Sincerely,
sub suzanne

(in reply to nonuts4thshoney)

Post #: 40

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