RE: How can I give you what is already yours?

RE: How can I give you what is already yours? (Full Version)

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tsatske -> RE: How can I give you what is already yours? (12/11/2008 7:26:22 PM)
Oh, AquaticSub - Congrats!!!! Kiss

SailingBum -> RE: How can I give you what is already yours? (12/11/2008 8:08:56 PM)
Beware of the spelling police they are everywhere BadOne

youngsubgeoff -> RE: How can I give you what is already yours? (12/11/2008 10:40:40 PM)
Even though I am a sub, I understand that I am just as responsible for maintaining the relationship as Mistress. I enjoy waking Her up to a warm cup of coffee and a clean kitchen without Her asking either one of me. However, by the same token, I'm not in trouble if I don't do it. If I felt unappreciated, I wouldn't do it. I make sure I clear my activities with Mistress first. However, I am allowed to speak my mind as long as it is not disrespectful to Her. By the same token, She also treats me with respect when speaking to me. I have no problems or restrictions in asking for playtime, sex, etc. However, it is still up to Her whether we do or not. The point I am trying to make here is that this is a relationship. This requires thought and action by BOTH of us. We have worked long and hard to get to this place that we are at right now, where we are both extremely happy. These things don't make Her any less dominant, or make me any less submissive. It does, however, make us both human. Cheers to all the others who have actually posted something real on this thread. Seems to be a shortage of that lately.

AquaticSub -> RE: How can I give you what is already yours? (12/12/2008 12:05:09 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: agirl I'm not at ALL condescending about what you or others' do and in fact was quite oblivious until you mentioned it. You obviously are content, and so am I. Is there a problem? We must disagree - I believe your post was incredibly condescending. "No, I don't faff about trying to work out what he wants. If he wants something, he is a sensible, able adult that can ask for it. " implies that those who "faff" around have owners that aren't "sensible adults" and "The bottom line is ...If HE's in control, then he is in the position where he can have things how he'd like them. It's not an elaborate game where I have to mess around guessing" implies that those who don't do things your way go around guessing and their owners aren't in control. Like I said, I'm sure your way works wonderfully for you and yours. It's entirely your way of speaking of it in relation to other dynamics that I am taking issue with.

AquaticSub -> RE: How can I give you what is already yours? (12/12/2008 12:06:21 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tsatske Oh, AquaticSub - Congrats!!!! Kiss Thank you!!! hugs and kisses It was unexpected, the symbol itself lovely... perfect for us. [:)]

SteveAndJaz -> RE: How can I give you what is already yours? (12/12/2008 1:06:04 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: youngsubgeoff The point I am trying to make here is that this is a relationship. This requires thought and action by BOTH of us. We have worked long and hard to get to this place that we are at right now, where we are both extremely happy. These things don't make Her any less dominant, or make me any less submissive. It does, however, make us both human. C Well said George This thread brings to mind my ex husband (sub) who needed constant micro management, didn't have an idea, didn't have imagination and lived in his own little world of neediness. That neediness was to serve me, let me make every decision from what he should wear to where should we go on holiday and to do everything unquestioningly. What he never gave me though was the inner him and in not doing that he created a 'living with a stranger scenario'. I eventually woke up one morning and thought, 'I don't know this man and I'm bloody exhausted' and with that I left.

CreativeDominant -> RE: How can I give you what is already yours? (12/12/2008 11:50:50 AM)
I like Timoty's post and Padriag's post...different from each other and yet expressing valid points of view. I state in my profile that I seek not just a D/s dynamic but a relationship. I want those two to be interwoven and for that to work, there has to be communication of wants, needs, desires, thoughts, conundrums, anxieties, questions as to how to make the dynamic better. I also state that there is room for two partners in this relationship/dynamic but room for only one leader and that is not the submissive. I want an intelligent submissive, one who can go out and live her life productively without me overseeing her interactions with her co-workers, her family or the people at the store. I want her to be able to look inside herself at both herself AND the dynamic she is in with me and the relationships she has with others and what their effects, however minimal, might be on the primary relationship with me. I want her to be intelligent enough to question how she might improve her submission to ME and then, to come to me as the leader and ask about these things. While Timoty notes the niceness of a spontaneous back rub or a flower placed upon the table at dinner, that is a whole lot different than deciding to rearrange my closet because "Sir is so anal about most things...I am sure he would appreciate me straightening his closet". Really? Is that why it was done? Or, is it as Padriag notes below: The OP's rather innocent sounding assertion that she does things until she is told not to bugged me. Above I alluded to some important questions, which weren't being asked, about submissives doing creative, spontaneous things. Here's one of those questions. Why are they doing it? The assumption most take is the obvious one... to please the dominant. But, sometimes people do things they haven't been specifically told not to do as a form of exerting control... authority. Now if the relationship is supposed to be a TPE, M/s relationship (especially a new one)... the slave passively and subtely exerting authority does seem kind of counter productive, doesn't it. (Note the complete lack of a question mark there) It would be very tiring for a dominant to have to constantly correct a submissive telling them not to do this and not to do that, until by process of elimination... the relationship dies. The OP suggested that a submissive ought to be working to improve the relationship, I agree. That includes going a step further than simply doing something until told not to. It means not only considering what they might do to improve their service... but what they shouldn't do... and in both cases seeking out their dominant's opinion on the matter rather than the advice of online strangers. Going to the dominant first and, by seeking his opinion, allowing him to lead; by listening to him and doing as he says, yielding to his will and not your own. _________________________________________________________________________ Where I come from, nobody knows and where I'm going, everyone goes. (Jennifer Jones to Joseph Cotten in "A Portrait of Jennie", 1942)

CallaFirestormBW -> RE: How can I give you what is already yours? (12/12/2008 12:59:44 PM)
quote: The OP suggested that a submissive ought to be working to improve the relationship, I agree. That includes going a step further than simply doing something until told not to. It means not only considering what they might do to improve their service... but what they shouldn't do... and in both cases seeking out their dominant's opinion on the matter rather than the advice of online strangers. See, for me, this is what makes the difference between a fair-to-middling servant and a -great- servant. I enjoy protocol, but after the initial training period, most of the protocol becomes internal -- the methods have been learned, and what I start looking for is creative service... that sense of knowing -exactly- who is in charge, and yet being able to be responsive to situational input and be able to adapt on the fly... for the overall benefit of the relationship. It means knowing both what to -do- and what to -avoid doing- in order to provide the most smooth and gracious service to me. I have a real issue with "it's not my job" syndrome... where, just because I didn't -specifically- say that X needed to be taken care of today, regardless of its obvious need to be taken care of, it doesn't get done. Then, when I ask "Didn't you see that X needed to be taken care of?" the servant comes back with "But you didn't TELL me to do X!" Sometimes, I note things in passing, with the understanding that I've already said I like things a certain way -- and that the servant's job, at that point, whether I specifically mention something, is to see to it that things are the way I like them. To me, it seems rather passive-aggressive to have to list out every single thing that I want taken care of. I guess that, for me, if I'm going to have someone in my life, I want it to be a dynamic situation that makes things -more- pleasant and easier to exist within, rather than more difficult, and more nit-picky. I think that where I exist is in a state in between micromanagement and lassaiz-faire management, where I want to address the -global- requirements, while the minutae become a personal expression of meeting those global expectations. Doing that, for me, would require someone who could take initiative in the small ways, while thoroughly understanding that level at which hir initiative ended any my authority began.

tsatske -> RE: How can I give you what is already yours? (12/12/2008 12:59:58 PM)
Hmmm... if I do something I have not been told to do, why am I doing it? well, the fluffy perfect slavey answer would be, 'to please HIM'. and, often times, that is the answer. But, sometimes, the answers are other things. 'cause it needed to get done, and if he doesn't like, trust me, he'll let me know'. (and trust me, if i waited till he asked me to get his underwear washed (which sometimes happens) he does let me know that he isn't all that happy about the fact that he is out of underwear) Cause I like it. I am part of this relationship too. I don't ask about every single thing I do. sometimes, if i have no reason to think he will object, i do something cause I want to - if he does object, he lets me know. cause i want to find out more about him, have us find out more about each other, reveal more about me.... doing can be as much a form of communication as talking, sometimes. cause it makes me feel like a better fill-in-the-blank. serriously - it sounds silly to say doing something he may not like, that at BEST he is going to completely not notice, makes me feel like a better slave. But, often, such things make me feel like a better woman, slut, wife, housekeeper, mother, ect, ect. And all those things, being part of who I am, therefore make me a better slave. If he doesn't like it, i stop. He doesn't like that I scrub the kitchen table with salt, so now i don't. but - he is not in the least moved by the knowledge that baking soda, oxy and vineagar go into EVERY load of laudry. He couldn't care less. But it makes me feel like a better wifey, so I keep doing it. Plus, I think he likes it better than he thinks he does. LOL. that makes no sense, but it is true anyway. For instance, i started ironing his undershirts because it makes ME feel like a better slave. He said, clearly, that he couldn't tell the difference and couldn't care less, but I keep doing it. Then, one week, when I was behind, I didn't do it. And i immedeatly got, 'Slut, how are my undershirts different? what did you do differant? I liked them better the other way?' to which i said, 'oh, you mean - Ironed?' Also, how about, because - I am a whole and complex person and have needs that have nothing to do with him. Why do I read? why do I take a book and take myself out to lunch? why do I start the tea kettle and brew myself tea the moment I walk in from work? It adds to MY serinity and contentment, the feeling of 'home' - and that makes me a better slave. But, I do it, for ME. So, yea, there are a lot of other reasons beside 'Because it pleases him.' If 'because it pleases him' were really, truly the only reason, i guess I really could just wait for an order - each and every time, for everything.

TazDevil -> RE: How can I give you what is already yours? (12/12/2008 1:46:42 PM)
I just love it when some real life assumes thing only happen on-line, so there no one in the HOLE wide world in real life D's who likes sub slaves who have no chose in what happens none zip 0 YA RIGHT!, oh and there or no sub slave in the hole wide world real life who don’t wont to have any chose to make... hum YA RIGHT! give me a brake and look around the freaking world some day ok? now having said that it not for me I don’t like what some call robot slaves, I need some one who has a mind, wall saying that I wont them to use that mind and say, oh Sir give me what you can! why? it just that much better, any one can whip any one for the enjoyment of pain, but to ask for it, to beg for it... now that is something and on one last note why or you a rell lifeer going on line chat rooms any how? dont have anything better to do then go on line and make fun of ciberes?

TheVoiceofOne -> RE: How can I give you what is already yours? (12/12/2008 1:49:56 PM)
I have no idea what you just said... but it sounds fascinating,,,

Padriag -> RE: How can I give you what is already yours? (12/12/2008 1:54:11 PM)
Ya took the words right out of my mouth.

TazDevil -> RE: How can I give you what is already yours? (12/12/2008 1:55:05 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: TheVoiceofOne I have no idea what you just said... but it sounds fascinating,,, I even uesed word p did it fuck up that much?

CalifChick -> RE: How can I give you what is already yours? (12/12/2008 1:57:06 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: TazDevil I even uesed word p did it fuck up that much? Something did, yes. Cali

tsatske -> RE: How can I give you what is already yours? (12/12/2008 2:02:58 PM)
I understood what you said. I do need 'down time', and I enjoy online forums. I don't personally enjoy chat rooms that much, they take too much dedication of my time. For me, online is - go online, do a bit, get up, do something in the house, do a bit online. so, there are moments when I have nothing better to do than be online for a minute. I notice you were here long enough to take note and respond. I have no issue with slaves that want 'no decisions', nor with Masters who wish to find that, if they can just find each other. I have an issue, if you read the OP, with people who ask 'what can I do as a slave', only to hear, 'why would you do anything? you are a slave.' If that is what the slave, and hir Master want, no problem. I just don't get the ongoing attitude that everyone should be that way.

SlaveIndigochild -> RE: How can I give you what is already yours? (12/12/2008 3:20:48 PM)
i'm a slave. i run a household in terms of serving my Master, cooking, cleaning, working for money, raising the kids, ironing, driving, being witty, cleaning, gardening, driving, feeding the animals, cleaning windows. serving food, ....there's no end to the list. i visualise very clearly what i feel the end result should be...i guess pretty much as a fifties household as that is how i was raised. It isn't a role...it's a way of life. i make quick, vital and responsible decisions every day, most of the time. If and when i don't know how, or what or indeed why to do something then i defer to Master. My responsibilities are manifold and ever present and i don't know how it could be otherwise as i would become passive and worthless were it any other way. The dynamic allows my arena of responsibilities to expand rather than contract. Therefore i receive more rather than less. That's my slavery from the inside story anyway........

LuckyAlbatross -> RE: How can I give you what is already yours? (12/12/2008 9:04:40 PM)
Not to sound elitist (though it probably will) this is one of the ways you can tell when you're talking to someone who's really been in healthy and productive Ds type relationships and someone who's just had the idea of it or hasn't had to be in the trenches and doing it on a daily basis. These questions aren't really even questions when you're just living life together.

starshineowned -> RE: How can I give you what is already yours? (12/13/2008 12:36:02 AM)
Greetings.. Really tsatske I think it all boils down to people have their own perceptions of what it means to be submissive or a slave based on their learned experiences be it reading, hands on, whatever. Some come out with a more ridgid ideal of it, and others give it more latitude. If the people involved have found their meanings of these things are the same or very similar then things usually work out for them. My life as a slave is controlled in alot of area's that others might not have, and visa versa but it is that way because of how Master and I view what being Master and slave means, and where we wished to go with it. I can accept that others views are different. I can accept that doing things this way or that works for them. I can also reject it, state so, and walk away knowing that I will never mesh/bond with them because of such. It isn't much different of a process than any of us seeking out that man or woman inwhich we bond with to start a journey. Your not a slave. Your not a Master. Your a fake. Your not a sub. Your not a Mistress because you do or don't do xyz exactly how I do xyz. Okay then..you have a nice day. I've been told such, and have told such. It isn't life shattering..just my view. If your happy..then so be it. starshine

sexisubi -> RE: How can I give you what is already yours? (12/13/2008 1:01:37 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tsatske Why is it 'unslavey' to suggest a rule? To ask to get beaten? I have needs to. He knows he is the Master - he can say no all he wants. In fact, he does, quite often. Another thing he does that is HIGHLY annoying, (must start another thread in ask a peach about how to train him out of that nasy habit) - He tends to give me - something somewhat like what I asked for! i personally don't think it's 'unslavey', i do it all the time, yep He can say no, and i just hope He doesn't, ... i mean it is something to please one's Master but is it not true that sometimes a Master/Mistress wants to please their servent?

MisterMonster -> RE: How can I give you what is already yours? (12/13/2008 1:33:56 AM)
Personally, I would want my slave to be smarter then me, really. 'Cause if I'm the one calling all the shots? We're kind of boned... And plus, as cool as having someone that submissive would be, what if some catastrophe hit? (I'm thinking Zombies. I fully believe we're going to be overrun one of these days, it doesn't make me crazy, it makes me nuts, don't judge.) I don't want my sub sitting in the corner waiting on my command as I'm crying and sniveling about the undead. I want her to put that shit aside, pick up the pump action, and go, "allright dumbass, we're raiding a pawn shop and heading for the mountains!" Like, I dunno...just rambling now...but, in short, slave that thinks for herself, please. But of course, all of this is moot. If I want an outspoken slave, don't I order it? If I want one that doesn't offer any input, don't I order it? Maybe I'm still new, but isn't this how it works?

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