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RE: Playboy's nude Virgin Mary - 12/17/2008 12:40:06 PM   
HunterS


Posts: 553
Joined: 10/21/2008
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quote:

So the vatican takes a mortal, elevates him/her to sainthood and tells you that to speed things up, you go through them. I cannot help but wonder how God feels about this one.


I had the same problem when I was still a Catholic.  Kinda like trying to "hustle" god by getting one of his "buddies" to put in a good word for you.  It kinda goes contrary to the concept of omniscience.
I can almost hear it now:
 
Saint Homer: God you may not know that my ol buddie Hunter is a pretty good dude and could use a little of your help just now.

God: Thanks for reminding me Homer. I had forgotten what a stellar bloke ol Hunter is.
 
Or possibly:
God: Homer,when I wan your opinion I will ask for, it in the mean time why don't you STFU.

 
H.

< Message edited by HunterS -- 12/17/2008 12:49:13 PM >

(in reply to sirsholly)
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RE: Playboy's nude Virgin Mary - 12/17/2008 12:50:19 PM   
sirsholly


Posts: 42360
Joined: 9/7/2007
From: Quietville
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quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

Sooo, the view is that perhaps God won't think your request is worth listening to so you suck up to a saint, get the saint to plead your case to God, and voila', maybe you will get what you want?

I don't know why but that concept never dawned on my and now that I've read it, I am laughing unreasonably hard here. Saints are nothing more than customer service reps for a company called "God".


you are not the only one laughing. The entire concept makes me think of sleeping with the human resources guy to get your job app to the top of the pile.




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RE: Playboy's nude Virgin Mary - 12/17/2008 12:56:04 PM   
HunterS


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quote:

The entire concept makes me think of sleeping with the human resources guy to get your job app to the top of the pile.


You may not know this but I am the human resources guy...and yes I am open to an "arrangement"
 
H.

(in reply to sirsholly)
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RE: Playboy's nude Virgin Mary - 12/17/2008 1:03:18 PM   
LaTigresse


Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
Status: offline 		"God? God, are you listening?"

_____________________________

My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

(in reply to HunterS)
Profile   Post #: 124
RE: Playboy's nude Virgin Mary - 12/17/2008 1:05:49 PM   
philosophy


Posts: 5284
Joined: 2/15/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

"God? God, are you listening?"


"sorry God's out right now. Just popped down the shops for sommat. I'll take a message, I know I have a pen round here somewhere......"

(in reply to LaTigresse)
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RE: Playboy's nude Virgin Mary - 12/17/2008 1:06:24 PM   
Emperor1956


Posts: 2370
Joined: 11/7/2005
Status: offline 		FR:  I'm coming to this one late, but explain this to me, please?

If I see The Virgin Mary in a grease stain on my garage floor, its a miracle.

If see The Virgin Mary in a photograph of an attractive young woman wearing a headscarf and standing in front of a stained glass window, its heresy?

E.

_____________________________

"When you wake up, Pooh," said Piglet, "what's the first thing you say?"
"What's for breakfast? What do you say, Piglet?"
"I say, I wonder what's going to happen exciting today?"
Pooh nodded thoughtfully.
"It's the same thing," he said.

(in reply to came4U)
Profile   Post #: 126
RE: Playboy's nude Virgin Mary - 12/17/2008 1:23:17 PM   
Emperor1956


Posts: 2370
Joined: 11/7/2005
Status: offline 		FR II:  to the religious fanatic(s) who found this so horribly offensive.  A small point.  You cite as one of the many wrongs against Catholicism "the cross in pee".  I'm betting that you have NEVER ACTUALLY SEEN THE ART WORK TO WHICH YOU REFER.  I'm betting you are quoting from one of the many right-wing Catholic spew blogs (and maybe they even put up a picture which supposedly represented the art work -- but it doesn't.)  Don't you feel like an idiot complaining about something you have never even seen?  'Cause you sound like an idiot.

And...if the pictures of the "Shechina" bother you -- ever read shir hashirim?  I think your church calls it "the Song of Songs" or the "Psalm of Solomon" and tells you its a metaphor for Jesus' love for the church.   It ain't, bucko.

Cant 5:4
My beloved put in his hand by the hole of the door, and my bowels
were moved for him.

Cant 5:5
I rose up to open to my beloved; and my hands dropped with myrrh, and
my fingers with sweet smelling myrrh, upon the handles of the lock.

Cant 5:6
I opened to my beloved; but my beloved had withdrawn himself, and was
gone: my soul failed when he spake: I sought him, but I could not
find him; I called him, but he gave me no answer.
 
(I use KJV because it is the best example in English of the verses, obscure language notwithstanding -- its actually sexier in Hebrew)



_____________________________

"When you wake up, Pooh," said Piglet, "what's the first thing you say?"
"What's for breakfast? What do you say, Piglet?"
"I say, I wonder what's going to happen exciting today?"
Pooh nodded thoughtfully.
"It's the same thing," he said.

(in reply to Aneirin)
Profile   Post #: 127
RE: Playboy's nude Virgin Mary - 12/17/2008 1:56:23 PM   
came4U


Posts: 3572
Joined: 1/23/2007
From: London, Ontario
Status: offline
quote:

If I see The Virgin Mary in a grease stain on my garage floor, its a miracle.


To some nuts, maybe.  I don't advocate looking for any religious figures in a potato chip or a carpet stain either. (I don't even believe in the Portugese fable of Mary apparition of Fatima coming to the 3 c's in 1917).

quote:

If see The Virgin Mary in a photograph of an attractive young woman wearing a headscarf and standing in front of a stained glass window, its heresy?


No and yes.  Heresy would imply a decision of action, thus purchase of such is what I consider heresy.  How one views it is no different than if it were a bias by putting a black woman in a slave-like photog setting, it either upsets you morally or via it (the context of placement) being a distinctive cultural taboo as 'art'.  It may be 'art' if in a gallery, but not likely more than a marketting ploy in this context of media. A money grabber, exploiting the enjoyment of use of a religious icon to those that may be angry at the church, God or the general premise of religion. aka gratifying or disassociative/indifference only if 1. you don't believe (Mary as Mother of Christ) and 2. you haven't been in that situation (Southern American slave) and assume it is a romantic ideal.

I would contain as much objection and offense by an objectification if a menorah candle (ie: dripping the wax on nipples) were used in some means in a sexual-based photog or published subscription of some kind (and I am not even Jewish).

If someone else is not offended or even would enjoy such activity, not my business.  If I choose to be offended, I will be, without having to explain it to death.

< Message edited by came4U -- 12/17/2008 2:05:35 PM >

(in reply to Emperor1956)
Profile   Post #: 128
RE: Playboy's nude Virgin Mary - 12/17/2008 1:58:18 PM   
sirsholly


Posts: 42360
Joined: 9/7/2007
From: Quietville
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quote:

ORIGINAL: philosophy

quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

"God? God, are you listening?"


"sorry God's out right now. Just popped down the shops for sommat. I'll take a message, I know I have a pen round here somewhere......"

aww...what a saint!


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Profile   Post #: 129
RE: Playboy's nude Virgin Mary - 12/17/2008 3:15:16 PM   
tsatske


Posts: 2037
Joined: 3/9/2007
From: Louisville, KY
Status: offline
quote:

(I use KJV because it is the best example in English of the verses, obscure language notwithstanding -- its actually sexier in Hebrew)


Well, uh, yea, - just about anything woulda been sexier than that part about the bowel movement.

Actually, MY church tells me that it is a tremedously erotic love poetry between two people deeply in love, and, ALSO, a metaphor for Jesus's love of the church and of His flock.
Since MY church tells me that marriage overall is a metaphore for Jesus's love of humanity, and me in particular, this makes perfectly good sense.

_____________________________

“If you never did you should. These things are fun and fun is good”
~Dr. Seuss quote

(in reply to Emperor1956)
Profile   Post #: 130
RE: Playboy's nude Virgin Mary - 12/17/2008 3:23:45 PM   
kittinSol


Posts: 16926
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Emperor1956
If I see The Virgin Mary in a grease stain on my garage floor, its a miracle.

If see The Virgin Mary in a photograph of an attractive young woman wearing a headscarf and standing in front of a stained glass window, its heresy?


HA!

The proof is in the pudding.

_____________________________



(in reply to Emperor1956)
Profile   Post #: 131
RE: Playboy's nude Virgin Mary - 12/17/2008 3:31:31 PM   
Aynne88


Posts: 3873
Joined: 8/29/2008
Status: offline 		Damn it! I have tried to avoid this thread for days now.....but....and this is from a non-believer, just to preface it, I find this kind of thing distasteful. Perhaps because I was brought up a Catholic and have remnants of that dratted Catholic guilt, but I truly believe unless you were born and raised a Catholic you cannot quite understand why this is wrong. It bothers me, and I apologize that I don't have the words to express why. I just think that it is one of those things that is better left alone. Why poke it with a stick I guess? Just my opinion, but I find it unnecessary and trying to hard to be confrontational. Like it just seems to me to reek of running out of ideas.

_____________________________

As long as people will shed the blood of innocent creatures there can be no peace, no liberty, no harmony between people. Slaughter and justice cannot dwell together.
—Isaac Bashevis Singer, writer and Nobel laureate (1902–1991)



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Profile   Post #: 132
RE: Playboy's nude Virgin Mary - 12/17/2008 3:33:17 PM   
kittinSol


Posts: 16926
Status: offline 		The world is a more interesting place because it is such a rich tapestry :-) .

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Profile   Post #: 133
RE: Playboy's nude Virgin Mary - 12/19/2008 3:06:45 PM   
Emperor1956


Posts: 2370
Joined: 11/7/2005
Status: offline 		fr:  tsaske, as your handle is a Hebrew/Yiddish word, I wonder do you speak Hebrew?  The KJV "bowels were moved for him" does NOT mean a bowel movement.  In 17th C. England, "bowels" were equivalent to "heart" -- not the organ so much as the center, the fundament.  So you might read that famous passage as "he put his hand by my keyhole (another common translation) and I was moved to my deepest core".  Even the notes on the actual KJV translation cite that the Greek phrase (remember, KJV is Greek to English, losing a ton of meaning by ignoring the Aramaic/Hebrew original text) may be "He put his hand inside of me".  A tortured reading will find this to be another Christian metaphor (go on Biblios.com, you'll find dozens).  Any thinking rational human with a bit of adult experience will realize that this love poem includes an erotic rememberance of how a woman orgasmed when her lover put his fingers or hand inside of her.

E.

_____________________________

"When you wake up, Pooh," said Piglet, "what's the first thing you say?"
"What's for breakfast? What do you say, Piglet?"
"I say, I wonder what's going to happen exciting today?"
Pooh nodded thoughtfully.
"It's the same thing," he said.

(in reply to kittinSol)
Profile   Post #: 134
RE: Playboy's nude Virgin Mary - 12/19/2008 3:18:01 PM   
kittinSol


Posts: 16926
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Emperor1956
Any thinking rational human with a bit of adult experience will realize that this love poem includes an erotic rememberance of how a woman orgasmed when her lover put his fingers or hand inside of her.


Guilty as charged.

_____________________________



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Profile   Post #: 135
RE: Playboy's nude Virgin Mary - 12/19/2008 3:24:46 PM   
Raechard


Posts: 3513
Joined: 3/10/2007
From: S.E. London U.K.
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Emperor1956
Cant 5:4
My beloved put in his hand by the hole of the door, and my bowels
were moved for him.

Surgeons also put their hands in people and wiggle their innards about, hardly pleasurable though.

Could this be what this text meant???
 

< Message edited by Raechard -- 12/19/2008 3:25:29 PM >

_____________________________

えへまにんへえや
Nobody wants to listen to the same song over and over again!

(in reply to Emperor1956)
Profile   Post #: 136
RE: Playboy's nude Virgin Mary - 12/19/2008 3:31:30 PM   
Raechard


Posts: 3513
Joined: 3/10/2007
From: S.E. London U.K.
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Emperor1956
Cant 5:6
I sought him, but I could not
find him; I called him, but he gave me no answer.


Translation: the pussy was large it ate him whole.

_____________________________

えへまにんへえや
Nobody wants to listen to the same song over and over again!

(in reply to Emperor1956)
Profile   Post #: 137
RE: Playboy's nude Virgin Mary - 12/19/2008 3:38:52 PM   
sirsholly


Posts: 42360
Joined: 9/7/2007
From: Quietville
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Raechard

quote:

ORIGINAL: Emperor1956
Cant 5:6
I sought him, but I could not
find him; I called him, but he gave me no answer.


Translation: the pussy was large it ate him whole.

thanks Raechard...that resulted in spilled coffee.


_____________________________

PICKED UPON
TECHNO-DOLT
MEMBER OF THE SUBBIE MAFIA
GRACEFULLY CHALLENGED :::::splat:::::
BOOT WHORE
VAA/S FAN

GIVES GOOD HEART (Lushy)

CREATOR OF MAYHEM (practice)


(in reply to Raechard)
Profile   Post #: 138
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