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RE: Total acquiescence, can it really happen? - 12/18/2008 11:39:20 AM   
NuevaVida


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quote:

ORIGINAL: CatdeMedici
so he tells you what to wear, how to vote, what spiritual beliefs to have, who to see, who not to see?


There have been many a long thread on this very subject.  If anyone were to go back and peruse them, they would find this is indeed a practice between many Masters and slaves.  Whether or not others agree that it's a good practice is also debated on those threads, but I assure you, the practice is quite common.

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RE: Total acquiescence, can it really happen? - 12/18/2008 11:54:35 AM   
slavejali


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Fast Reply:

As others have mentioned in one way or another, total submission, obedience etc isnt a problem in itself if the correct partner is chosen to begin with. Personally I feel if the dominant isn't given that authority in a relationship it would all just be a game to play when we feel like it, obedience would be like "scening" rather than embraced as the way we live.

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Different Strokes for Different Folks

"I'll always have a *soft spot* for Sadists"

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RE: Total acquiescence, can it really happen? - 12/18/2008 12:00:44 PM   
CatdeMedici


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quote:

ORIGINAL: starshineowned

quote:

quote:

ORIGINAL: starshineowned

quote:

"where my will doesn't count and my opinion doesn't matter, i simply obey"




The trust is there. I have no need nor desire to pit my will against Masters.

My opinions on matters are of more importance to him to hear than they are of importance to me to share. They like everything else belong to him as well.

starshine



so he tells you what to wear, how to vote, what spiritual beliefs to have, who to see, who not to see?


I'm just really not quite sure where you drew such questions to ask me based on what I wrote.

If he does..thats his choice to do. As to wether he does or doesn't I will not state because your questions seem more of a bating tag line than a real quest for information in understanding.

End for me

starshine


I can assure you, I am not bating at all, I am trying to understand this dynamic and its interesting to Me, its all women who have responded---only here to learn--not judge or antagonize.



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"Let's see-whips, dips, chains, chips, yep sounds like a party to Me!"

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RE: Total acquiescence, can it really happen? - 12/18/2008 12:37:43 PM   
WalterRego


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For those of you  who have answered that it exists and you live it, I am curious. What does it feel like to you inside, when you obey, despite disagreeing? When your feelings or views are weighed but then overridden?

 Does the "good" feeling you get inside because you are obeying despite your disagreement outweigh any negative feelings or misgivings that it is the wrong path or action? Or perhaps, does it feel better to you because you are obeying despite disagreeing? Is obedience when it goes against your grain more fulfilling to you than obedience when you may not care as much?

Is that a feeling or action you crave/desire/like because it highlights or emphasizes your submission? Or is it rather a feeling you accept because of the other good feelings you get from your submission?

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RE: Total acquiescence, can it really happen? - 12/18/2008 12:48:37 PM   
bratnwranglers


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hmm for me, i could not see that total loss of opinion on anything. The fact that i know that Master wants to know, listens, and takes into account what my opinions and thoughts are, is very comforting and enables me to trust Him even more. but that is part of O/our dynamic...doesn't mean i get my way...i just get a "noted" and He decides what is best. i honestly could not be in a position where my opinion wasn't at least heard, would lose the livelyhood of who i am as a person, that is what makes you, your personality, opinions and thoughts.

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RE: Total acquiescence, can it really happen? - 12/18/2008 1:05:39 PM   
slavejali


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I know for me, when I obey and im having contrary feelings I end up with a profound sense of self. When I read posts about people "losing themself in their submission/slavery" I just can't understand it, well actually I can, I think they are coming up against belief systems of identity, which in most cases is all illusion to begin with. We can never lose anything that is real. 

I see the dominant/submissive relationship as a perfect representation of the yinyang cycle of life, its quite spiritual for me. In that relationship, with both people "surrendering" to their role (themself), both end up empowered and something incredibly beautiful is created.

Might sound like a romantic ideal but that is how I have experienced it.

_____________________________

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Different Strokes for Different Folks

"I'll always have a *soft spot* for Sadists"

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RE: Total acquiescence, can it really happen? - 12/18/2008 3:32:28 PM   
greeneyedreamer


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quote:

Would you really see your partner as "better than" you?


Yes... more intelligent and able to know me deeply. If not I have no time for them. I have been there... done that. I will only entertain the idea of a stronger, more intelligent, kind man.... Never again to settle for less... and I am not now...

Dreamer

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I am still learning... Michelangelo, age 87

Maybe some women weren't meant to be tamed. Maybe they are suppose to run wild until they find someone just as wild to run with. Sex and the City

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RE: Total acquiescence, can it really happen? - 12/18/2008 3:50:52 PM   
Aszhrae


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quote:

ORIGINAL: CatdeMedici

..."where my will doesn't count and my opinion doesn't matter, i simply obey"
 
I have heard this from more than a few potential submissives, slaves...
 
Is this really an achieveable state with a submissive, slave? Is it realistic? Do people, can people really blindly put their faith in another human being regardless if they agree with the consequences?
 



Girl asked this once before, being of a certain mindset. Girl stated it once and will do so again. Yes, it is achievable, given the right environment and time to focus on what really matters, their dom/me.
It is possible to allow one self to become overwhelmed, that the world around them is centered upon their dom/me.
It really is a mindset, for the sub/slave to transfer their will into the vassal that is their dom/me.
Just requires a whole lot of trust and encouragement in a positive way where the sub/slave comes to believe that at no time will their dom/me do serious or critical harm to them.


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RE: Total acquiescence, can it really happen? - 12/18/2008 4:00:02 PM   
JRiddle


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This is a profound question with more correct answers than posts given here. There are 2 extremes for submission: full and not. Most people end up somewhere in between. These extremes are partially based upon rules, structure, and trust.

How much do you trust your partner? Did you just meet them in a dark bar, or have you been living and playing together for decades? This is critical information to determine acceptable submission. Of my friends, some of them I have known for years and trust a fair amount. The longest known and the shortest known are currently trusted the same amount. My other friends are trusted less. Time is not the sole determining factor. Trust is a continual process. Those faithful with a little are trusted more. When they have demonstrated complete faithfulness, no more trust may be given. If anything causes doubt, reconsider the level of trust. This process should be constantly adjusting as more information is learned. Once the trust is broken, it is extremely difficult to return to previous levels. Every relationship is built with trust. How much trust your partner and you share factors into every other relationship aspect. Structure is how you interact. Are you the slave, sub, Dom, or Master? Structure determines roles and responsibilities. Who manages the finances, food, and shelter? This is the format of your relationship. This should only change after negotiations of equals. Rules give the structure solid boundaries. How long may the sub be bound? In what manner? Is the Dom permitted to leave bruises? Is the fridge permitted to run out of MT. Dew? In my home, only I am authorized to take the last soda. Rules should be agreed upon before submission occurs. As trust and experience change, so may the rules.

Full submission is entirely possible. As others have mentioned, those with a military background tend to be willing to push the D/s relationship to the extreme with less hesitation. This is most likely due to extensive training and prior experience. Each relationship is based upon some level of rules, structure, and trust. While the levels vary between situations, they are always present. For full submission, the rules are strict, the structure is well defined, and the trust should be very high. Notice that I said trust "should be" instead of "is". Military life has extremely well defined rules and structure. The one with the most rank rules. There is no requirement to discuss or listen expected of the one in charge. When an order is given, those receiving the order simply obey. It does not matter how bad the order is as long as it does not violate any rules. Those obeying know that severe punishment awaits those who disobey lawful orders. A subordinate must first obey the LAWFUL order before being permitted to question LAWFUL orders. It is their right to voice suggestions or objections only after the order is complied with. If you have ever worked under a second lieutenant fresh from the Academy, you will know that the level of trust is not important with solid rules and structure. As the subordinate, if a stupid order is given, a sharp solute and "Yes Sir/Ma'am" is a all that may be given in response. The joy of the subordinate in this situation is knowing that when the order becomes known to the Captain or higher, the problem shall be fixed. Catching a glimpse of the correction is priceless. While military service of either the Dom or sub may help create such full submission, it is not required. Prior experience with such submission levels is beneficial. Full submission may take place without high levels of rules, structure, and trust. Personally, I would not recommend it. If one of the three are lacking, problems may occur. Complete submission without any of those 3 is foolish and dangerous. This is were reality and fantasy meet.

On the other extreme, the sub is not submissive. They do not trust their Dom to follow the rules and refuse to submit. If this is the case, both the Dom and sub should consider mutually ending the relationship. Most likely, one or both are living out their fantasy and fail to notice reality. This statement is not intended to offend anyone. If it is offensive, please carefully consider why it is before replying. I expect that very few subs fall into this category. Again, this falls back to rules, structure, and trust. Rules are hard limits to ensure safety. Structure lets both parties know what is expected. Trust cements it all together. More rules and structure allows for less trust to be required in order for the relationship to work. Higher levels of trust allow the rules and structure to be more vague. Without any trust, the rules and structure no longer matter. If someone is not trusted enough to follow the rules, a rule against something does not protect the other.

BDSM relationships follow very few hard rules: safe, sane, and consensual. We may even stretch a few of those. Hard limits vary. I wear combat boots and my submission may not match yours. I expect submission without questions before obedience. At work, I am accustomed to see orders obeyed without question. If you cannot agree to do the same, you may want to find someone else to be your Dom. "To each his own!" What else can I say?

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This post has been brought to you by an inexperienced amateur. -Jeremiah

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RE: Total acquiescence, can it really happen? - 12/18/2008 5:52:35 PM   
kyraofMists


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How I feel about doing something that I disagree with really depends.  Sometimes it is a feeling of satisfaction, that I have obeyed gracefully despite not wanting to.  Sometimes it is just a feeling of resolve knowing that the moment will pass and there will be many more things that I enjoy about relationship. 

Sometimes, it is really hard and I have to struggle with having a bad attittude.  Usually, those times highlight an area within myself that I need to work on in being his slave.  Many times the bad attitude will show that I am still holding onto unrealistic expectations of his behavior and decisions.  Those times happen less often, but they still do.

I don't crave these moments, but I do need challenges in order to be fulfilled and these moments provide them.  However, there are other things that can provide a challenge as well.

Knight's Kyra

_____________________________

"Passion... it lies in all of us. Sleeping, waiting, and though unbidden, it will stir, open its jaws, and howl. It speaks to us, guides us... passion rules us all. And we obey..." ~Angelus

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RE: Total acquiescence, can it really happen? - 12/18/2008 5:56:29 PM   
DesFIP


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Nobody is going to always obey if the dominant doesn't make good decisions. So you need first to have a high level of compatibility so that a good decision in his view is also a good one in yours. Beyond that, it depends on what kinds of decisions he makes. Meaning what areas he chooses to exercise power in.

Because the odds are higher of total obedience if he doesn't interfere with your job or your offspring by someone else. In a bedroom d/s relationship the odds of total obedience is likely to be much greater.

The other thing that can have an effect here is the longevity of the relationship. If you've been together 30 years you've probably had all necessary discussions and know what each others hot buttons are. So if he is sensitive to what could harm you, and has proved that over the years, then you're more likely to just do it. But if someone is expecting this starting on the first meet, then no that is not realistic. Because nobody in their right mind signs over the deed to their house on day one.

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Cynical and proud of it!


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RE: Total acquiescence, can it really happen? - 12/18/2008 7:31:39 PM   
LuckyAlbatross


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To the OP- of course that state is acheivable.  I even find it quite divine in small portions.

But I don't find it very functional in the long term.  Maybe if I had a whole company of slaves and lots of money and leisure time.

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RE: Total acquiescence, can it really happen? - 12/20/2008 7:39:52 PM   
leadership527


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Well, I was with you all the way up to the word "Total".  Oh wait, that was the first word.  In my experience, absolutes do not apply to humans.  Then again, I think like an engineer, not a poet. 

This is a lot like discussions about TPE.  Depending on the mindset of the person talking (literal or figurative), they either like the concept or don't.

_____________________________

~Jeff

I didn't so much "enslave" Carol as I did "enlove" her. - Me
I want a joyous, loving, respectful relationship where the male is in charge and deserves to be. - DavanKael

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RE: Total acquiescence, can it really happen? - 12/20/2008 9:28:34 PM   
NihilusZero


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quote:

ORIGINAL: leadership527

This is a lot like discussions about TPE.  Depending on the mindset of the person talking (literal or figurative), they either like the concept or don't.

25 points.


_____________________________

"I know it's all a game
I know they're all insane
I know it's all in vain
I know that I'm to blame."
~Siouxsie & the Banshees


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