Collarspace Discussion Forums


Home  Login  Search 

RE: Should a Mistress/Master be a servant boy/girl first


View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
 
All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> General BDSM Discussion >> RE: Should a Mistress/Master be a servant boy/girl first Page: <<   < prev  1 2 [3] 4   next >   >>
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
RE: Should a Mistress/Master be a servant boy/girl first - 12/30/2008 4:52:27 AM   
T1981


Posts: 557
Joined: 12/6/2008
Status: offline 		While I think it's useful for someone to play the other side of the coin, so to speak, at least once, I also think that you shouldn't do something you don't like. The few experiences I've had as a top do help me experience my submission in a much richer vein, but I wouldn't ask my husband to submit, because it does nothing for him. As someone else, the traits of sadist or masochist are already in you, and it's good to explore them, but I don't think that one HAS to experience the other side in order to learn THEIR side properly. It really does depend.

(in reply to LadyPact)
Profile   Post #: 41
RE: Should a Mistress/Master be a servant boy/girl first - 12/30/2008 4:57:50 AM   
RainydayNE


Posts: 978
Joined: 10/21/2008
Status: offline 		i dont think it's necessary at all =p
maybe some people like the idea, but eh

(in reply to lobodomslavery)
Profile   Post #: 42
RE: Should a Mistress/Master be a servant boy/girl first - 12/30/2008 6:17:01 AM   
Lucylastic


Posts: 40310
Status: offline 		No
I learned a lot as a bottom, but I make a lousy submissive, Im a better top because of it, in my opinion. Mostly I think being a bottom or sub first would help "some" of those dominants/Tops who dont have a clue at just how much something can affect a bottom, such as not using lube and forcing things when new at anal. Altho it seems they are the ones who poo poo it( not fromhere,
But it depends on the person and the dynamic but certainly not a "rule".
Lucy who hates rules except for my own:)




_____________________________

(•_•)
<) )╯SUCH
/ \

\(•_•)
( (> A NASTY
/ \

(•_•)
<) )> WOMAN
/ \

Duchess Of Dissent
Dont Hate Love

(in reply to LadyPact)
Profile   Post #: 43
RE: Should a Mistress/Master be a servant boy/girl first - 12/30/2008 7:25:14 AM   
LaTigresse


Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: secretmaster22

quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

quote:

ORIGINAL: secretmaster22

I don't think that is necessarily the case, although I could see the merit for some.  I think it might be a good idea to have a sadist beat on you for a bit if you want to be a sadist, because it would help to understand the pain that your sub is going through.  Where the good places to hit might be how to hit.  That sort of thing.  


The thing is, I didn't "want" to be either a sadist or a dominant. I simply was, before I knew what it was.



So are you a sadist with no knowledge of what you are doing?  Sounds dangerous to me.  If you have knowledge then you understand that it takes more than just being a sadist.  I'm only arguing that the knowledge that can be gained from taking a little pain yourself might be helpful in the process.  I don't think someone who has no submissive tendencies at all will necessarily gain too much knowledge from being submissive for a time. 



Damn, I go to the gym and miss all the fun. That will teach me to have a life away from the computer!

I understand what you are trying to say (I think). However, if I want to play with knives, I don't need to cut myself, or have someone else do it, to know how it feels. I cook and I am sometimes clumsy, so I kinda get it.

Just like, a doctor doesn't need to have had an apendectomy to perform one sucessfully. I don't need to get whipped (though I've done a bang up job of that by myself also as they tend to fly back at you almost as well as they flew away) to be able to use one on someone sucessfully.

However, my own sense of personal responsibility dictates that I be careful, and make myself knowledgable before I pick one up and start flailing it about.

The one area that is too often overlooked, in my opinion, is personal responsibility and looking ahead towards potential consequences. Those are things that cannot be learned by attempting to submit or bottom. They come with maturity. Almost a sense of humbling ourselves to a degree and admitting that we are not perfect and we do not know everything. The strength to ask for help or advice. To find others that know more about a specific issue and ask them to teach us. Again, not something that will be learned by trying to be submissive when it is not our nature to be so.

I am not saying that there are not people that have gained a great deal by do what you suggest, I am just saying it isn't a guarantee of a good, dominant, master or mistress. Although I do see it being bantered about as such. Tends to be in the same breath as the term "old guard". Which only makes it laughable at best.


_____________________________

My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

(in reply to secretmaster22)
Profile   Post #: 44
RE: Should a Mistress/Master be a servant boy/girl first - 12/30/2008 7:44:41 AM   
MsFlutter


Posts: 1305
Joined: 11/12/2008
From: East Coast
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: lobodomslavery

ive heard it said that in order to be a good Mistress, one should be a servant first and work themselves up that way you can sympathise with the servant point of view and empathise with them. is this credible in your opinion, or does it really matter if you have served or not, is this another example of political correctness gone mad or is it only right after all should servants know that those they serve have served others before or does it really matter
kevin



I began as a submissive wayyyyyyyyyyy back long time ago - started there because a) it appealed to me and b) had no idea at the time what the whole world of BDSM was about !  
 
I encountered a LOT of what I came to call 'dogbowl doms' - they wanted their sub to eat from dogbowls and function more as a slave. Oh HAYUL no - wasnt going to happen.  Over time I realized there were other parts of the 'required' mindset that didnt appeal to me either. My mentor at the time said it appeared to be time for me to 'cross the street'.
 
Speaking only for myself, it was a good place to start as the insights have always served me well. Made ME a better domme - no idea what it would do for anybody else.

_____________________________

'Dont torture yourself, Gomez darling. That's my job' Morticia Addams

"The right data, filtered through an idiot, can yield a bad answer." einstien5201

(in reply to lobodomslavery)
Profile   Post #: 45
RE: Should a Mistress/Master be a servant boy/girl first - 12/30/2008 7:46:31 AM   
JustDarkness


Posts: 1461
Joined: 7/25/2008
Status: offline
quote:

Made ME a better domme

but there is no compair to you beeing a Domme with out a sub background.
Perhaps it is just your personality that makes you a good Domme?

< Message edited by JustDarkness -- 12/30/2008 7:47:41 AM >

(in reply to MsFlutter)
Profile   Post #: 46
RE: Should a Mistress/Master be a servant boy/girl first - 12/30/2008 7:57:51 AM   
SomethingCatchy


Posts: 796
Joined: 7/29/2008
Status: offline 		It is credible, but only to people who can handle that sort of thing. Like some have already said, they know they're dominant and they have no desire to be anything different. I'm a switch, so I put myself in a position to be submissive and learn, and it worked to an extent, but I think it's made me very aware of just how much trust it will take for me to ever go into something like that again. My boy (who is also a switch but leans toward sub) and I have talked about him Doming me for a little while later on down the road in our relationship, but that will be later (read much much later) and I will be fully confident of his ability to handle something like that before I give him the reins. He enjoys toying with me now, but it's no where near what I've experienced.

(in reply to lobodomslavery)
Profile   Post #: 47
RE: Should a Mistress/Master be a servant boy/girl first - 12/30/2008 12:02:30 PM   
secretmaster22


Posts: 85
Joined: 12/26/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

quote:

ORIGINAL: secretmaster22

quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

quote:

ORIGINAL: secretmaster22

I don't think that is necessarily the case, although I could see the merit for some.  I think it might be a good idea to have a sadist beat on you for a bit if you want to be a sadist, because it would help to understand the pain that your sub is going through.  Where the good places to hit might be how to hit.  That sort of thing.  


The thing is, I didn't "want" to be either a sadist or a dominant. I simply was, before I knew what it was.



So are you a sadist with no knowledge of what you are doing?  Sounds dangerous to me.  If you have knowledge then you understand that it takes more than just being a sadist.  I'm only arguing that the knowledge that can be gained from taking a little pain yourself might be helpful in the process.  I don't think someone who has no submissive tendencies at all will necessarily gain too much knowledge from being submissive for a time. 



Damn, I go to the gym and miss all the fun. That will teach me to have a life away from the computer!

I understand what you are trying to say (I think). However, if I want to play with knives, I don't need to cut myself, or have someone else do it, to know how it feels. I cook and I am sometimes clumsy, so I kinda get it.

Just like, a doctor doesn't need to have had an apendectomy to perform one sucessfully. I don't need to get whipped (though I've done a bang up job of that by myself also as they tend to fly back at you almost as well as they flew away) to be able to use one on someone sucessfully.

However, my own sense of personal responsibility dictates that I be careful, and make myself knowledgable before I pick one up and start flailing it about.

The one area that is too often overlooked, in my opinion, is personal responsibility and looking ahead towards potential consequences. Those are things that cannot be learned by attempting to submit or bottom. They come with maturity. Almost a sense of humbling ourselves to a degree and admitting that we are not perfect and we do not know everything. The strength to ask for help or advice. To find others that know more about a specific issue and ask them to teach us. Again, not something that will be learned by trying to be submissive when it is not our nature to be so.

I am not saying that there are not people that have gained a great deal by do what you suggest, I am just saying it isn't a guarantee of a good, dominant, master or mistress. Although I do see it being bantered about as such. Tends to be in the same breath as the term "old guard". Which only makes it laughable at best.



Thank you for that very well thought out response, and again I apologize if I offended you.  My guess however, is that you are not easily offended.  I'm sure you have much more knowledge than I do.  And I did here that advice from someone that was "Old Gaurd"  What exactly does that mean anyways?  If it means what I think it means, then my guess is there is good knowledge to be gained from both perspectives, as with anything in life.   

(in reply to LaTigresse)
Profile   Post #: 48
RE: Should a Mistress/Master be a servant boy/girl first - 12/30/2008 12:11:19 PM   
LaTigresse


Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
Status: offline 		No, I am not easily offended. Especially by anything or anyone on here.

As for old guard, you might want to try a search of the forums to get a better idea of the concept. Personally, I only see the term as a fairy tale at best. At least to most people.


_____________________________

My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

(in reply to secretmaster22)
Profile   Post #: 49
RE: Should a Mistress/Master be a servant boy/girl first - 1/3/2009 3:00:44 PM   
AtlantisKing111


Posts: 181
Joined: 1/14/2005
Status: offline 		It might be good for a person to try the other side ... and it might not.  Different people have different needs. 

I personally have never felt the need to go through a sub-side period.  At work I tend to be the "gopher", the "worker bee", whatever you want to call it.  That gives me all the submission to authority I need in my life.  At home *I* want to be the boss.

(in reply to lobodomslavery)
Profile   Post #: 50
RE: Should a Mistress/Master be a servant boy/girl first - 1/3/2009 3:12:39 PM   
came4U


Posts: 3572
Joined: 1/23/2007
From: London, Ontario
Status: offline 		If someone has used submission as some sort of training wheels to gain a knowledge for a future activities in dominating/domination ..that is up to him. I personally don't find it necessary or enlightening as a characteristic that he went through just for that purpose. Some have gone through that stage because of basic youth and confusion but sympathy or empathy cannot be learned as a basic human emotion in just this manner, people either have a conscience or they don't. I have no interest in someone who switches gears of mentality in mid-adulthood, is a preference their innate personality is dominant and they were only subbordinate (not submissive) out of necessity to a parent or an early life occupation/education situations and persons that taught them well enough to be a productive, capable dominant/mentor within society as a whole.

< Message edited by came4U -- 1/3/2009 3:27:11 PM >

(in reply to AtlantisKing111)
Profile   Post #: 51
RE: Should a Mistress/Master be a servant boy/girl first - 1/3/2009 3:40:08 PM   
AppliedRestraint


Posts: 8
Joined: 10/17/2008
Status: offline 		I wouldn't say anyone should have to have subbed before becoming a Dom and Domme..........
                            
                                                ...............but the best ones have. 

(in reply to lobodomslavery)
Profile   Post #: 52
RE: Should a Mistress/Master be a servant boy/girl first - 1/3/2009 3:46:53 PM   
Lynnxz


Posts: 4813
Joined: 10/3/2006
From: Atlanta
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: AppliedRestraint

I wouldn't say anyone should have to have subbed before becoming a Dom and Domme..........
                           
                                               ...............but the best ones have. 





_____________________________

HBIC



(in reply to AppliedRestraint)
Profile   Post #: 53
RE: Should a Mistress/Master be a servant boy/girl first - 1/3/2009 3:52:05 PM   
BIGLOVENJ


Posts: 23
Joined: 7/17/2006
Status: offline 		Were the best cats once dogs?

(in reply to Lynnxz)
Profile   Post #: 54
RE: Should a Mistress/Master be a servant boy/girl first - 1/3/2009 4:34:42 PM   
LaTigresse


Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: AppliedRestraint

I wouldn't say anyone should have to have subbed before becoming a Dom and Domme..........
                           
                                               ...............but the best ones have. 


I believe that is a point of view that will not be popular with everyone.

_____________________________

My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

(in reply to AppliedRestraint)
Profile   Post #: 55
RE: Should a Mistress/Master be a servant boy/girl first - 1/4/2009 9:38:34 AM   
AppliedRestraint


Posts: 8
Joined: 10/17/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: BIGLOVENJ

Were the best cats once dogs?


I'm not saying a person should or can change who they are...... but the best Doms have spent at least a little time on the other side.  This is where ocasional role play works very well.

And to whoever said my post would be unpopular.......  think I give a fuck?  My oppinions and observations of fact and truth will never be altered or swayed in favor of popularity.

(in reply to BIGLOVENJ)
Profile   Post #: 56
RE: Should a Mistress/Master be a servant boy/girl first - 1/4/2009 9:42:26 AM   
Lynnxz


Posts: 4813
Joined: 10/3/2006
From: Atlanta
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: AppliedRestraint

quote:

ORIGINAL: BIGLOVENJ

Were the best cats once dogs?


I'm not saying a person should or can change who they are...... but the best Doms have spent at least a little time on the other side.  This is where ocasional role play works very well.

And to whoever said my post would be unpopular.......  think I give a fuck?  My oppinions and observations of fact and truth will never be altered or swayed in favor of popularity.


You know, 'fact' and 'truth' usually have a little research to back them up, rather than some dude stomping around insisting on random shit.

So, are you going to back up your statement or are we going to watch you continue to pull 'facts' out of your nether region?


< Message edited by Lynnxz -- 1/4/2009 9:43:27 AM >

_____________________________

HBIC



(in reply to AppliedRestraint)
Profile   Post #: 57
RE: Should a Mistress/Master be a servant boy/girl first - 1/7/2009 8:33:34 AM   
SirRussellP


Posts: 107
Joined: 1/10/2006
Status: offline 		Old guard was a group of mainly black gay men returned from Europe after the World War.  In their group they believed you had to earn your vest (become the Dom) by starting as a submissive.  Do not confuse them with Old School that predates them.

It seemed to work for them but for me I would be swinging and fighting long before anyone put a rope or collar on me.  I have a problem with authority over me that I haven't agreed to and I just can't picture myself as a submissive.

I also though have problems with understanding the "switch" person.  To me you either are a natural sub or Dom personality or you are playing with the life not living it.  But that is just my take on it since I can't even imagine trying sub.

(in reply to Lynnxz)
Profile   Post #: 58
RE: Should a Mistress/Master be a servant boy/girl first - 1/7/2009 8:39:41 AM   
colouredin


Posts: 4279
Joined: 2/2/2007
Status: offline 		Hum I have been with both people who have never subbed and people who have true that one of my favorites was indeed a bottom first (weird hes totally dominant now i dont know if id recognise him back then) but generally i think some people are good at it some arent same as anything really.

_____________________________

Resident Lime(y) Tart
There would be no gossip without secrets
I don't want to be anything other than what I've been trying to be lately

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ELvfMJoKDAk

(in reply to SirRussellP)
Profile   Post #: 59
RE: Should a Mistress/Master be a servant boy/girl first - 1/7/2009 8:48:12 AM   
tsatske


Posts: 2037
Joined: 3/9/2007
From: Louisville, KY
Status: offline 		The ONLY problem I have with this is, to be honest, I have an inherent distrust of the 'I would never hit you with anything till I tried it on myself' type of Top. True, some tops do this and use it well and appropriately, but so many seem to use it to do the 'Hell, that doesn't hurt, I've done that/been there/I tried that on my own leg/hand first, what are you whining about?'
Everybody is different. It is not a continuum. I will LOVE LOVE LOVE Toy A which you think is too Too TOO much, and I will scream like a Baby at Toy B which you think is Wussville.
Everyone is different, and EveryDAY is different, every session - Hell, every Minute. The first time, the first hundred times, you use Toy A on me, I LOVE it - then suddenly on one particular day, I can't take that toy, though I'm up for lots of other things.
This does NOT just apply to impact or pain play. Limits are also not on a continuum. One person has a hard limit for something I LOVE, while I can't even IMAGINE doing something they LOVE.
I am very service oriented, but riddled with arthritic joints, I seldom kneel. (though I do sometimes - it's all in the day, who I'm serving, the scene - hell, the weather. EVERYTHING)
If they used service to learn this fact of life, well, then, GREAT. If they use it as a way of saying, 'I did it and so can you!' (as I've seen SO many do) - They are - uhm - not a good fit for me. <grin>

< Message edited by tsatske -- 1/7/2009 8:49:05 AM >

_____________________________

“If you never did you should. These things are fun and fun is good”
~Dr. Seuss quote

(in reply to colouredin)
Profile   Post #: 60
Page:   <<   < prev  1 2 [3] 4   next >   >>
All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> General BDSM Discussion >> RE: Should a Mistress/Master be a servant boy/girl first Page: <<   < prev  1 2 [3] 4   next >   >>
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts




Collarchat.com © 2025
Terms of Service Privacy Policy Spam Policy

0.094