RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"?

RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (Full Version)

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VanessaChaland -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/9/2009 2:29:42 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: rulemylife I wasn't aware animals had nuptials. Now, when they pick a best man and maid-of-honor do they have to be within the same species, or say, can a cat act as best man for a dog? I wasn't even aware they gave gifts. I know my mutt goes over and fucks the neighbor's dog every chance he gets, but I have yet to see him carrying over a milkbone to give her. Lol. Nice reply. :)

strangedesire -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/9/2009 2:32:05 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: AAkasha quote: ORIGINAL: strangedesire quote: ORIGINAL: MistressDolly quote: ORIGINAL: strangedesire I have no problem with women who want to be spoiled, and I have no problems with pros or financial dommes. I do have a problem with anyone who suggests, even in such vague terms, that I am less of a woman for not wanting tangible gifts. Hate to press your buttons and then burst your bubble, but this is all you. When you say that gift-giving is the natural order of things, you insinuate that those of us who don't want gifts are, well, unnatural. Now, I'm unnatural in a lot of ways, but my distaste for men trying to buy my affection isn't one of them. I am a woman who doesn't want or need gifts and has always paid for courting; I enjoy being the pursuer. That said, my point is different. It's not that women WANT gifts. If a guy is totally broke and he cannot afford anything but he's sweet and sincere and has all other said qualities desired, that's fine. What I am talking about is when a man has the means, but DELIBERATELY keeps his wallet locked up tight using the "reasoning" that he is afraid he will be taken advantage of, so he will ONLY offer gestures of courtship when he deems the woman is worthy of it. It's like some sub men are using the excuse of the fact that yes, there are unscrupulous women out there (admit it guys, you can SEE them coming a mile away) to be cheap with other women who are legitimately used to having a man show some gestures of appreciation when he is courting her. I am not talking about "Buy me gifts or I won't talk to you," I am talking about a man following the traditional roles of courtship, NOT extreme demands for money or gifts. Go back and read Shatki's post - she sums it up quite nicely. Again, if a guy simply has no money, that's another story. It's when a guy is perfectly capable of paying or doing small things but he won't, because he wants to make sure FIRST that it's 'equal' effort, or gestures, or whatever. That just seems like he is using an excuse to be cheap. I think it stinks. Akasha My point was addressed towards MistressDolly's post, and in no way meant as an attack against you. I don't have a lot of use for traditional courtship roles in my personal life, but I respect those who like them - and that includes you. I simply dislike the implication that I am somehow unnatural for not wanting to do things that way.

MistressDolly -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/9/2009 3:43:17 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: rulemylife quote: ORIGINAL: MistressDolly It's more than cultural conditioning or a simple value handed down to us; it is biological in origin. We see nuptial gifts given to Females by males throughout the animal world. Biological in origin huh? I sure would love to see the proof of that. Care to provide a resource? I wasn't aware animals had nuptials. Now, when they pick a best man and maid-of-honor do they have to be within the same species, or say, can a cat act as best man for a dog? I wasn't even aware they gave gifts. Nuptial is a zoological term related to breeding behavior and characteristics. It's not simply a 'matrimonial' term. As for biological and behavioral studies, feel free to take the examples of numerous insects, spiders and avians. Human models aside, one needn't look too far to see male competition (and even combat) to earn the access of a female in the mammal world, either. Among Gazzels, males will often allow females to graze upon areas they protect. Male penguins will acquire and offer nest-building rocks to females they've mated with or hope to mate with. Darwin once explained that sexual selection in terms of survival value can often be explained through ornaments and nuptial gifts for attracting mates. You would be well served in doing a little reading rather than attempting to pass off sarcasm as intellectual discourse. http://books.google.com/books?id=tKPIUpsc-5kC http://research.calacademy.org/calwild/2004spring/stories/materialgirls.html http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2005/01/050111114618.htm http://www.springerlink.com/content/t841h3l635938n31/

PeonForHer -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/9/2009 4:01:08 PM)
I'm sure that in some species the male will present some kind of "gift" as part of "courtship". However, in a lot of other species, the males fight each other for females. Since that's also natural, and is more common (I think) amongst apes than gifting during courtship, shouldn't we men be doing that instead of presenting gifts to women? There'd be no need for a gift, because the competition would have been seen off . . . I don't think this "what's natural with other animals is what we humans should do" argument is all that helpful, Mistress Dolly.

LadyConstanze -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/9/2009 4:11:41 PM)
Wrong there... http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1700821,00.html http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5gUTyYpPmEHzLP5a_rDsPDkGv8aXA

MistressDolly -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/9/2009 4:15:49 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze Wrong there... http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1700821,00.html http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5gUTyYpPmEHzLP5a_rDsPDkGv8aXA Now let's sit back and wait for the inevitable punts.

LadyConstanze -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/9/2009 4:21:13 PM)
And I haven't even mentioned the Bonobo apes... http://www.geocities.com/RainForest/Vines/4451/BonobosLikeHumans.html

Lockit -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/9/2009 4:30:19 PM)
LOL... okay my man beast better pick up his banana peels, poop where he ought to, better not bring bugs and I'll forgo the bridal gifts!

undergroundsea -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/9/2009 4:47:35 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MistressDolly Sincerely chivalrous, generous and respectful acts by men honor Women. Males who understand this will earn our interest, and always will. It doesn't mean you are inferior; it means you are doing what's in your nature to do, and like it or not, we Woman are doing what's in our nature to do by accepting, or at least pausing to consider. There are different scenarios or relationship levels that fall under this discussion. If a profile or a relationship dynamic requires some form of monetary tribute to initiate or maintain contact, it is then I feel a suggestion of inferiority that bothers me. I feel I am interesting enough with what I bring in my person and if one does not agree, I am willing to recognize incompatibility. Where a conversation or dynamic has begun, I have trouble with two issues. I avoid financial submission and my response about this matter is based on what is appropriate in ordinary relationships--if it is odd to have such an expectation of a friend, a dating partner, or boyfriend based on level of relationship, it is odd for me. One example was that when I suggested to a woman a conversation to become more acquainted and learn her expectations, she wanted that I meet her at her work place (she was a dancer) and pay her house fee (and that it would be no different than if I were to take her out somewhere). It seemed odd to me and I passed. Another was a houseboy scenario where (after seeing that I had purchased items for cleaning or organization) there was an attempt to shift items off the grocery list to me, and tests to see what else I might take on. I felt as if I were being hustled, which I resented. The broader dynamics--versus the two service scenarios described above--have generally had what I consider social appropriateness. And I have had difficulty when I felt taken for granted, which lessens my motivation to give of myself in all ways: time, energy, service, gifts. I have no worries about my ability to be thoughtful in a romantic relationship. In general, however, gestures of affection and energy must flow both ways. Cheers, Sea

SimplyIsaac -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/9/2009 5:01:22 PM)
quote: One example was that when I suggested to a woman a conversation to become more acquainted and learn her expectations, she wanted that I meet her at her work place (she was a dancer) and pay her house fee (and that it would be no different than if I were to take her out somewhere). I passed. Whoa whoa whoa...back up there. You passed in paying a dancer (who showed interest in your servitude) her house fee? Wow, it's only money, dude. Lighten up and don't be so stingy! You might have blown a huge opportunity there. Now you'll never know. Just sayin'.

undergroundsea -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/9/2009 5:24:24 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SimplyIsaac Whoa whoa whoa...back up there. You passed in paying a dancer (who showed interest in your servitude) her house fee? Wow, it's only money, dude. Lighten up and don't be so stingy! You might have blown a huge opportunity there. Now you'll never know. Dude, you should get out some. I have befriended and dated/subbed to multiple women who were then or in the past dancers. Some like to hustle as a sport at work but don't hustle those whom they regard to be in their social circle, which is why I see an attempt to hustle as a social rejection. If I am trying to get to know a woman and she says that I have to pay her house fee to have a conversation with her, I find it socially odd and, perhaps, to set a precedent I do not wish to set. I had suggested a meal or drinks. Incidentally, we ran into each other again and she was interested enough in what I am as a submissive to have me over. You never know what you'll never know and what you will. Cheers, Sea

SimplyIsaac -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/9/2009 5:32:33 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: undergroundsea quote: ORIGINAL: SimplyIsaac Whoa whoa whoa...back up there. You passed in paying a dancer (who showed interest in your servitude) her house fee? Wow, it's only money, dude. Lighten up and don't be so stingy! You might have blown a huge opportunity there. Now you'll never know. You should get out some. I have befriended and dated/subbed to multiple women who were then or in the past dancers. Some like to hustle as a sport at work but don't hustle those whom they regard to be in their social circle. If I am trying to get to know a woman and she says that I have to pay her house fee to have a conversation with her, I find it socially odd and, perhaps, to set a precedent I do not wish to set. I had suggested a meal or drinks. Incidentally, we ran into each other again and she was interested enough in what I am as a submissive to have me over. You never know what you'll never know and what you will. Cheers, Sea You keep editing the phrasing in your posts like you're trying to cover up holes in a contract. [:D] Of course you date strippers all the time. Of course she ran into you and was interested again. How did I know you'd come back with those lines? [8\|]

undergroundsea -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/9/2009 5:36:49 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SimplyIsaac You keep editing the phrasing in your posts like you're trying to cover up holes in a contract. [:D] Of course you date strippers all the time. Of course she ran into you and was interested again. How did I know you'd come back with those lines? [8\|] I am particular about my expression and will edit my post as many times as I wish to. If you wish to entertain yourself, why don't you play that game they used to have in the papers and find all the differences between what you captured and the edited version. You asked a question. I answered. I am uninterested to prove anything to you. Cheers, Sea

SimplyIsaac -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/9/2009 5:52:13 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: undergroundsea quote: ORIGINAL: SimplyIsaac You keep editing the phrasing in your posts like you're trying to cover up holes in a contract. [:D] Of course you date strippers all the time. Of course she ran into you and was interested again. How did I know you'd come back with those lines? [8\|] I am particular about my expression and will edit my post as many times as I wish to. Oh, I know...I see that. You seem to be on a mission in what you're trying to say on this board. Despite your claims of a fast life of torrid Dommes and interested strippers wised up, you manage to spend a great deal of time living vicariously on CM, in fact, pining away about the death of romance and equality and tit for tat for "submissive" men.

PeonForHer -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/9/2009 5:52:15 PM)
Well I didn't have to pay a penny the last time I had sex with a mo . . . Er . . . [:D][:D]

PeonForHer -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/9/2009 5:56:25 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze And I haven't even mentioned the Bonobo apes... http://www.geocities.com/RainForest/Vines/4451/BonobosLikeHumans.html I saw a David Attenborough programme once about gorillas. They regularly eat their own dung. Sir Dave said no-one knew why. Anyway, the males were often seen giving presents of their dung to the females . . . . Perhaps I spoke too hastily earlier! [;)]

undergroundsea -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/9/2009 5:57:17 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SimplyIsaac Oh, I know...I see that. You seem to be on a mission in what you're trying to say on this board. Despite your claims of a fast life of torrid Dommes and interested strippers wised up, you manage to spend a great deal of time living vicariously on CM, in fact, pining away about the death of romance and equality and tit for tat for "submissive" men. I am flattered you think my experiences are too good to be true. Cheers, Sea

SimplyIsaac -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/9/2009 5:59:05 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: PeonForHer quote: ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze And I haven't even mentioned the Bonobo apes... http://www.geocities.com/RainForest/Vines/4451/BonobosLikeHumans.html I saw an Attenborough programme once about gorillas. They regularly eat their own dung. Sir Dave said no-one knew why. Anyway, the males were often seen giving presents of their dung to the females . . . . Perhaps I spoke too hastily earlier! [;)] Perfectly easy to see the human correlation there with a lot of men. What category of giver do you fit in? [8D]

came4U -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/9/2009 5:59:11 PM)
Wealth is the product of (wo)man's capacity to think. Ayn Rand meaning? who wants to be with a dummy?

SimplyIsaac -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/9/2009 6:01:12 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: undergroundsea quote: ORIGINAL: SimplyIsaac Oh, I know...I see that. You seem to be on a mission in what you're trying to say on this board. Despite your claims of a fast life of torrid Dommes and interested strippers wised up, you manage to spend a great deal of time living vicariously on CM, in fact, pining away about the death of romance and equality and tit for tat for "submissive" men. I am flattered you think my experiences are too good to be true. Cheers, Sea I think what you say is pretty much written in water, Seaman.

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