RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (Full Version)

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allthatjaz -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/10/2009 8:19:53 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LunaVenus

Being a Domme is a LOT of hard work.. There is heavy equipment, expensive  paraphenalia, expensive outfits, makeup, hair styling, manicures, plastic surgery, Rent for a big space, advertising, maintenace, PHOTOGRAPY, web design, Web Hosting.... add to that regular living expenses!
Gosh I am getting exhausted thinking of all the money I have spent...with very little coming in. It is only fair to have some help with all of that...Being as though, being a good Domme is SO EXPENSIVE...it stands to reason, that you can be a BETTER Domme if you have more financial resources.  I do not think its fair to be expected to pay for all of that myself when I really  WON'T be  the one enjoying it...but rather the subs.  Furthermore, with all of that overhead, everyone must carry their weight and CONTRIBUTE.


Why so little coming in? You mean you spent all this money and then didn't get any business?
I would also like to add to that, that all this shit does not make one a better Domme.... The better Domme comes directly from the person and not all her gear.

I worked in central London and more recently out of town as a pro Mistress (not any more) and like you I spent a lot of money setting up but I made that money back in record time and I was at one point earning a very lucrative living from it.

The thing is, you can spend huge amounts but if you don't know how to work your dungeon you will end up having very little coming in [;)]

Maria



undergroundsea -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/10/2009 8:26:21 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: 4u2spoil

But the question to ask is why men have always preferred women who are attractive. It's not fair to frumpy woman fetishists if we don't reexamine this notion that men like outwardly pretty women.

(sea, that's said in jest. Serious responses in post 409)


I enjoyed that ;-)

But, but......men have always liked women who are attractive. It's just how it is in our culture. Why do some women expect men to be attractive also?

:p

Thank you for the other post. I must run for appointments. I will write at a later time.

Cheers,

Sea



PeonForHer -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/10/2009 8:35:36 AM)

I'm just getting a bit tired of the expectations guys have
 
That's just it, though, Lady C.  That seems to have been the problem with this whole thread: assumptions.  On all sides.  Assumptions about how people should act, assumptions about other people's assumptions  . . . .   I've recognised a few of my own in the past few days.  I've also recognised that they're not going to change very much in the future, either.

One of my own assumptions means that, far from treating dominas as people who'll give me a free tickle to my kink, I don't treat them as dominas at all.  I treat them pretty much as I would all non-dominant women, and will continue to do so.  You might be surprised by just how often that's rankled with self-identifying, "dominant women" who imagine that I'm going to be automatically submissive towards them (while not going so far as to get a jolly-on from talking to them, of course).  That's not by any means directed at your good self, Lady C - it's a general comment.




LadyConstanze -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/10/2009 8:49:02 AM)

I never understood the "instant worship" effect or the "submissively yours" signature.

If I don't know somebody from Adam, why would he be submissive to me or why would I be dominant to him? We're strangers, on the internet, not at a fetish party where we might play.



allthatjaz -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/10/2009 8:53:10 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze


I have yet to find a guy who says "Since it's all about you, I come around and clean your house while you're at work, I want YOU to be happy, that will make me happy!" - now that would be real servitude.




I don't believe that is real servitude until at least that male sub knows his Mistress well enough to be getting the head fuck from it.
Who in there right mind is going to go round and scrub someones house out and not meet the Mistress? If they did then it would be an act of desperation and hope but nothing more.

I once put my sub out on loan to a Mistress I happened to know quite well. I found out afterwards that she sent him shopping with his money for paint and sundries to paint her flat. On arriving back he was told that she was going away for the week and she wanted her entire flat painted and decorated by the time she got back. That is not domination, thats using and I consequently fell out with her over it.

Maria




Nikitaa -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/10/2009 8:54:46 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze

I never understood the "instant worship" effect or the "submissively yours" signature.

If I don't know somebody from Adam, why would he be submissive to me or why would I be dominant to him? We're strangers, on the internet, not at a fetish party where we might play.


Same for me. I not understand. I receive messages from men saying I am Goddess and the man will do anything for me. I think to myself (in Polish) "You do not know me, I could be evil witch and want to make you rob banks." Some men even send worship messages before my first pictures approved. This informs me the men not think I am special, the men want any profile with word female writing on. My friend on CM (kinkyJody) has no pictures and almost no profile and her inbox is receiving messages.
Men? geeeez



PeonForHer -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/10/2009 8:58:10 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze

I never understood the "instant worship" effect or the "submissively yours" signature.

If I don't know somebody from Adam, why would he be submissive to me or why would I be dominant to him? We're strangers, on the internet, not at a fetish party where we might play.


Strewth.  Thank you for saying that - you wouldn't believe how much of a relief it is to hear it. 

Well, well.  This thread's been quite an education for me.  Though apparently in quite different ways to most, if not all, those who've posted on it.



LadyConstanze -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/10/2009 8:58:44 AM)

I would think servitude is about SERVING somebody, serving somebody is different from domination (since you said in another post you were a pro domme, I would have thought you know the difference). Service is an unselfish act, which is about the person who is being served, not the one serving. So in case the guy wants a head fuck from it, he doesn't want to serve, he wants his kinks fulfilled, simple as that.

Now loaning out a sub, isn't that a convenient way of having somebody else keeping your sub busy so you don't have to do it? Why would I want to take on somebody elses sub?

Matter of fact is, guys love to say that it is all about the woman, then their head fuck shouldn't play the major role in it.



MISTRESSKUMA -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/10/2009 9:06:37 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze

I never understood the "instant worship" effect or the "submissively yours" signature.

If I don't know somebody from Adam, why would he be submissive to me or why would I be dominant to him? We're strangers, on the internet, not at a fetish party where we might play.


Exactly.



MISTRESSKUMA -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/10/2009 9:10:10 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: ShaktiSama

Why do you assume that wanting someone who is submissive or masochistic to me is about my "sense of worth"? Domination and sadism of ANY kind gratify my sense of pleasure and my kink, not my self-esteem. I don't need you to submit to me to feel good or "ok" about myself; I need it because it gets me off. If you don't submit to me in ways I enjoy, I will have no interest in you.


So true. It's funny how some "submissive" men with clear chips on their shoulders think all dominant women want their submission. [8|][8|][8|]



GoddessRegina -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/10/2009 9:31:47 AM)

I can only answer from my point of view.
Financially stable means, having a job, being able to take care of your life necessities which is important before you can ever even think about being submissive to anyone.

Why? Simply put. If you can't even pay for your food and rent, how can you concentrate on serving me? It isn't even about the gifts, tributes etc, but about the mental security that you need to be able to have first of all.

I know that when I can't pay my bills for whatever reason, maybe because I have been sick all month and couldn't work, then the last thing I am going to think about is dominating somebody, unless it is a Pro-Session. In that case it helps both of us. You get your stress relieved and I get enjoyment and my bills paid. (Just being honest here).

Likewise, a sub that can not take care of himself is just a liability. I can not, nor will I, pay for my subs livelihood. Sorry. On the other hand I do not fancy staying up all hours of the night worry about my sub. You see no matter what, those that serve me, belong to my Temple etc are part of my family. I worry about them, I care that they are alright and I do not just take their cash and run, but actually put my time, heart and mind into them.

D/s is a two way street. I need to know that my subs can uphold their end of the bargain.





PeonForHer -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/10/2009 9:42:07 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MISTRESSKUMA

quote:

ORIGINAL: ShaktiSama

Why do you assume that wanting someone who is submissive or masochistic to me is about my "sense of worth"? Domination and sadism of ANY kind gratify my sense of pleasure and my kink, not my self-esteem. I don't need you to submit to me to feel good or "ok" about myself; I need it because it gets me off. If you don't submit to me in ways I enjoy, I will have no interest in you.


So true. It's funny how some "submissive" men with clear chips on their shoulders think all dominant women want their submission. [8|][8|][8|]


Oh, but many dominant women definitely do, Mistress K.  I've quite a selection of examples in my inbox - all starting with the words "Hello slut/worm/whore".  That said, I reply as though I'm talking to any non-dominant woman with whom I'm getting acquainted, and most are happy to go along with that.  Actually, for reasons I can completely understand, they often seem quite relieved. 



GoddessRegina -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/10/2009 9:53:51 AM)

With that in your response, or it is just that they do not see the need to address you something you don't present yourself as.

"pet names" come when I am satisfied that you either a. deserve them, b. understand why you receive them or c. I feel like it.

Let me put it this way, I can go just fine without the service or submission of someone not suited to my tastes. As I always say. I am not perfect, but I AM PERFECTLY ME.

Which means I do not need anyone to validate me as fabulous or powerful.



ShaktiSama -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/10/2009 9:56:11 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: RedMagic1

I actually kinda like women in fuzzy slippers.


Pervert.



PeonForHer -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/10/2009 10:15:16 AM)

With that in your response, or it is just that they do not see the need to address you something you don't present yourself as.
 
I don't know, Goddess R.  I've never asked.  All I really know is that it's crucial to me that I know a woman can relate to me as an equal and a friend, partly because that's an essential thing that I'd want from a partner.  Most seem fine with that, some don't. 

"pet names" come when I am satisfied that you either a. deserve them, b. understand why you receive them or c. I feel like it.
 
I like pet names from dominants who've become close enough.  Not otherwise, though.   

Let me put it this way, I can go just fine without the service or submission of someone not suited to my tastes. As I always say. I am not perfect, but I AM PERFECTLY ME.

Which means I do not need anyone to validate me as fabulous or powerful.
 
Good.  I wish all were like you!





MISTRESSKUMA -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/10/2009 10:15:32 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

quote:

ORIGINAL: MISTRESSKUMA

quote:

ORIGINAL: ShaktiSama

Why do you assume that wanting someone who is submissive or masochistic to me is about my "sense of worth"? Domination and sadism of ANY kind gratify my sense of pleasure and my kink, not my self-esteem. I don't need you to submit to me to feel good or "ok" about myself; I need it because it gets me off. If you don't submit to me in ways I enjoy, I will have no interest in you.


So true. It's funny how some "submissive" men with clear chips on their shoulders think all dominant women want their submission. [8|][8|][8|]


Oh, but many dominant women definitely do, Mistress K.  I've quite a selection of examples in my inbox - all starting with the words "Hello slut/worm/whore".  That said, I reply as though I'm talking to any non-dominant woman with whom I'm getting acquainted, and most are happy to go along with that.  Actually, for reasons I can completely understand, they often seem quite relieved. 


Most of the dominant women with substance and maturity and class and authenticity don't bother with that sort of childish "Hey worm" behavior.
It's so confusing why you keep running into those types.[8|][8|][8|]




Perhaps you keep running into "Hey worm" types because the truly authentic alfa females can tell you don't really want to serve their needs, you want your own needs served. There is a big reason why bottoms like you should not call themselves "submissive".

Bottoms want to be dominated, the don't want to serve.



Alfa females (which you seem to not be able to attract) are not consumed on how you treat them, until and only until you become their subby. If they don't know you from Adam.... trust me...they don't care about you or what you think or just how much you "treat them as you do non-dominant" women. You really think dominant women consider you, your opinions or the way you decide to treat them as relevant? They don't. Your opinions are irrelevant. They don't define themselves by your interpretation of them or if you treat them in a certain manner. The don't care about you, what you think or if you treat them submissively or not. A lot dominant women want your submission, huh? [8|][8|][8|] Get over yourself.[8D]



ShaktiSama -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/10/2009 10:27:06 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze
I never understood the "instant worship" effect or the "submissively yours" signature.


No, I don't particularly relate to that either. Nor do I identify with women who write profiles which are immediately dominant to total strangers, or take an instant tone of command or humiliation to all comers. (But I am willing to bet those women DO get a positive response from men who have an erotic reaction to them.)

On the other hand, these attitudes of mine are in part a reflection of who I am in daily life, who I want to be 99% of the time with a submissive partner, and what I am looking for in a relationship.

I am based almost entirely in reality, not fantasy. I exercise my dominance as an extension of my every-day personality; it is a constant in daily life. I cannot separate my BDSM identity from the rest of my life, and confine my role as a dominant to scenes of fantasy with casual partners for very limited periods of time.

Given this fact? I need a person who is compatible and interested in MUCH more than my dominant role or my sexual fantasies or a list of kinks. I approach and deal with potential partners accordingly; I prioritize heavily many non-BDSM features of compatibility.

Other dommes and their compatible submissive partners may not take this approach. This is not a crime, it is not morally or ethically wrong. I have to logically assume that the way these people present their profiles is compatible with their own needs and wants. A person who is instantly and aggressively dominant in her profile is saying "Let's cut through the bullshit and get straight to business", effectively--because she has no interest in relating to submissive men on the vanilla level as people--she wants to objectify and use and abuse them to gratify her dominant urges, not get to know them.

The person who is instantly submissive in his profile and his messages is telling me that he is looking to live out a fantasy, not form a relationship with a real person--I can take this as a rejection if I choose, or I could just recognize his offer of "instant submission" as a compliment of sorts, because he is willing to give his fantasy my form. He's not compatible with my needs and lifestyle, but the fact that he's barking up the wrong tree and not reading my signals very well is its own punishment, because he's wasting his time. I don't need to take it as a personal affront.

To me, "Send me tribute, worm" is a message of instant kink. It is in no way different from a command to perform any other humiliating act in a profile or a message. Men who respond positively to that message are getting exactly what they want--a zero-strings boner and a humiliation fantasy that works for them. No fuss. no muss, no getting to know ya.

I don't do a lot of instant kink myself, but I do think it's possible to take a step back once in a while and consider the appeal of the stranger-on-a-train instant hook-up: instantaneous zero-effort chemistry, zero-strings indulgence of fantasy, no thought of consequences or need to adjust the interaction to make a long-term relationship viable, no unromantic or unsexy moments where lamentably real life intrudes on the perfection of the scene...and the ability to leave your partner BEHIND in fantasy land when you are finished, and return to your cozy real life afterward without consequences.

Sure, I see it. *shrug* Just because it isn't my thing doesn't make it wrong for everyone--it's just wrong for me.



allthatjaz -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/10/2009 10:28:40 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze

I would think servitude is about SERVING somebody, serving somebody is different from domination (since you said in another post you were a pro domme, I would have thought you know the difference). Service is an unselfish act, which is about the person who is being served, not the one serving. So in case the guy wants a head fuck from it, he doesn't want to serve, he wants his kinks fulfilled, simple as that.

Now loaning out a sub, isn't that a convenient way of having somebody else keeping your sub busy so you don't have to do it? Why would I want to take on somebody elses sub?

Matter of fact is, guys love to say that it is all about the woman, then their head fuck shouldn't play the major role in it.


Servitude tends to be very direct and is of course a form of ultimate submission. They look for a Dominant Mistress and so of course it does come under the umbrella of Dominance/submission. I don't believe any of this is unselfish. We are all in this for our own reason and I for one have never met a servitude sub who is not into being dominated in some way or form even if it is only verbal firmness
. All but one of the male subs who have given me servitude (the one being the one that was sent to another Mistress and he was the one that had been with me the longest) were never happy to be around doing the chores unless they thought I was going to give them some serious attention. I found that most don't want to wash the skirtingboards so much as lick them but then I never actually went as far as having them within a relationship and perhaps if I had they would of been happy to of done all the chores properly and thoroughly whilst I was out or away.

When my sub was loaned out I was going through a bereavement and during that time I could offer him nothing.. This is something we spoke about a lot and it was something he very much looked forward to.



PeonForHer -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/10/2009 10:39:55 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MISTRESSKUMA


quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

quote:

ORIGINAL: MISTRESSKUMA

quote:

ORIGINAL: ShaktiSama

Why do you assume that wanting someone who is submissive or masochistic to me is about my "sense of worth"? Domination and sadism of ANY kind gratify my sense of pleasure and my kink, not my self-esteem. I don't need you to submit to me to feel good or "ok" about myself; I need it because it gets me off. If you don't submit to me in ways I enjoy, I will have no interest in you.


So true. It's funny how some "submissive" men with clear chips on their shoulders think all dominant women want their submission. [8|][8|][8|]



Oh, but many dominant women definitely do, Mistress K.  I've quite a selection of examples in my inbox - all starting with the words "Hello slut/worm/whore".  That said, I reply as though I'm talking to any non-dominant woman with whom I'm getting acquainted, and most are happy to go along with that.  Actually, for reasons I can completely understand, they often seem quite relieved. 


Most of the dominant women with substance and maturity and class and authenticity don't bother with that sort of childish "Hey worm" behavior.
It's so confusing why you keep running into those types.[8|][8|][8|]

It is confusing, yes.  Most of the women who've contacted me aren't users of these forums.  All of them have read my profile and, presumably, consider me to be a sub, not a bottom. 

Perhaps you keep running into "Hey worm" types because the truly authentic alfa females can tell you don't really want to serve their needs, you want your own needs served. There is a big reason why bottoms like you should not call themselves "submissive".

Bottoms want to be dominated, the don't want to serve.

. . . Though all of the women who've contacted me have read my profile, you, as far as I can make out, haven't.  So how would you know?  I, on the other hand, have read your profile.  This shows me that you're a female supremacist who believes that female supremacy is genetically determined.  I'd expect you to have a very exacting idea indeed of what constitutes a 'sub' as opposed to a 'bottom'. 

But in the end, I don't really care.  I don't need your, or anyone else's, validation of me as a submissive.  All I need to know is that I give a partner what she wants, and that she do likewise for me.

Alfa females (which you seem to not be able to attract) are not consumed on how you treat them, until and only until you become their subby. If they don't know you from Adam.... trust me...they don't care about you or what you think or just how much you "treat them as you do non-dominant" women. You really think dominant women consider you, your opinions or the way you decide to treat them as relevant? They don't. Your opinions are irrelevant. They don't define themselves by your interpretation of them or if you treat them in a certain manner. The don't care about you, what you think or if you treat them submissively or not. A lot dominant women want your submission, huh?

Some do, Mistress K.  They really do.  Sorry, but there it is.  I know only a little about the sorts of cmails dominants get; you know only a little about the sorts of cmails I get. You're happy with your own self-identification; I'm happy with mine. 

[8|][8|][8|] Get over yourself.[8D]

Thanks for the advice.  [:D]




subtex -> RE: Why is it that most Dommes want subs that are "financially successful"? (2/10/2009 10:56:57 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer
Oh, but many dominant women definitely do, Mistress K.  I've quite a selection of examples in my inbox - all starting with the words "Hello slut/worm/whore".  That said, I reply as though I'm talking to any non-dominant woman with whom I'm getting acquainted, and most are happy to go along with that.  Actually, for reasons I can completely understand, they often seem quite relieved. 


I second that.  I don't receive many emails from dominant women that I don't know but even I have received a couple of of these emails.  No quite as bad as a "Hello worm", but with that sort of  "submit to me" tone.  Like you, I responded as as an equal and they accepted that.  BTW they were all in some remote place.  They seemed to be play a role they thought was appropriate.  One woman said something  like "unfortunately I still have some compassion".  Men and women both seem to get caught up in the role play.  I guess the difference is my inbox isn't overflowing so it's not even an annoyance.

Bill




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