"Between Barack and a hard place" the politics of fear!

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corysub -> "Between Barack and a hard place" the politics of fear! (2/10/2009 7:15:27 AM)
How many times have we had to bear the liberals among us so full of sound and fury over George Bush and the "politics of fear". Yet, today we see the media having an orgasmic reaction to Barack Obama visiting Elkhart, Indiana! Elkhart Indiana, the RV capital of the world which has been attacked by "greenies" for years because of the way they guzzle gas...Obama goes to Elkhart and I don't see anything in the Recovery Act of 2009 that will stimulate RV sales, unless we have a secret weapon being developed of micro windmills that can be place on the roof of these homes on wheels to power them along the open road. Just so happens that Elkhart has the highest unemployment rate in the country....Why didn't the President just take the train to near by Norther Virginia where the unemployment rate is 2% under the national average. Could it be the politics of fear? Now the President is going to Ft. Myers, Florida, the city suffering the greatest deterioration in home values in the nation. Why didn't he visit say...Chappaqua, New York where Bill and Hillary live...or Arlington..where Obama's cabinet lives...? Could it be the politics of fear? Nah...only republicans use fear as a weapon for political arguement. Obama is "changing" all that with his selling of his spending plan for job creation. We welcome the change with all those new people now in charge like Panetta, Hillary Biden, Emanuel, et al...and the ever popular "Mr. Gibbs goes to Washington" press secretary. Jobs..Job creation from these Keynes disciples...As the President said so knowingly with a smirk about "spending in the Bill", echoed by that statesman from Mass. Barney Frank who said...all spending creates jobs! and that's what we need! Barney is really doing what Keynes said jokingly when he said something like "burying bottles of money is also a "job" for someone" and that's what a great part of this sham of a stimulus program does for Americans. http://trailblazersblog.dallasnews.com/archives/2009/02/obama-in-elkhart-ind-today-whi.html http://www.news-press.com/section/NEWS01 My proposal for Presidentail usage of Air Force One to sell the "Stimulus Bill" Detroit, Michigan Camden, New Jersey Stockton, California Memphis, Tennessee (Mainly because Obama possibly can help the "Grizzlies" with some moves.) Nairobi, Kenya Peckham London, U.K.

DarkSteven -> RE: "Between Barack and a hard place" the politics of fear! (2/10/2009 7:20:13 AM)
I'm pretty much disgusted. Bush's administration had the bright idea of government bailouts for miscreant criminals who wore suits. Both Republicans and Dems lined up like sheep behind him while their constituents were over 95% against the proposal, and for very sound ideas. Now Obama is pushing the same crap as Bush. The GOP who went along with Bush are tryiong to disavow the last eight years. The Dems think that bailouts are a great idea. I want indictments and prison terms.

SilverMark -> RE: "Between Barack and a hard place" the politics of fear! (2/10/2009 7:51:58 AM)
I guess if he went somewhere else that the problems in Elkhart and Ft. Meyers wouldn't exist anymore cory?.... Manufacturing in Elkhart....Manufacturing you remember that don't you cory? it is what the USA used to do....the thing that made us the Dominant world economy...and housing....hmmm...seems I read something about housing lately....oh yes...I remember...there aren't any houses sellling...none being built....damn....imagine that!

Coldwarrior57 -> RE: "Between Barack and a hard place" the politics of fear! (2/10/2009 8:51:54 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SilverMark I guess if he went somewhere else that the problems in Elkhart and Ft. Meyers wouldn't exist anymore cory?.... Manufacturing in Elkhart....Manufacturing you remember that don't you cory? it is what the USA used to do....the thing that made us the Dominant world economy...and housing....hmmm...seems I read something about housing lately....oh yes...I remember...there aren't any houses sellling...none being built....damn....imagine that! Perhaps you need to check the facts. http://www.realtor.org/research/research/ecoindicator Existing home sales. Sales jumped up 6.5 % in december Pending home sales index went up 5.2 to 87.7, OK thats an interesting number. The press would have us beleive that NO ONE IS BUYING. Housing starts 550,000 units

SilverMark -> RE: "Between Barack and a hard place" the politics of fear! (2/10/2009 8:58:46 AM)
New home sales in December Down 14.7% from November...housing starts down 15% down from November off 45% for the year....now YOU do your homework....same sight...

Cagey18 -> RE: "Between Barack and a hard place" the politics of fear! (2/10/2009 11:08:04 AM)
Let's evaluate these two "fear" scenarios, shall we? Chances of terrorism affecting you or your loved ones: Damn near zero Chances of current economy affecting you or your loved ones: Pretty damn high Bush's was a "created" fear to make you vote for him and Republicans. Obama's is a genuine fear that if we don't do something, the economy will get worse. A rational person would choose to respond to the genuine fear every time.

E2Sweet -> RE: "Between Barack and a hard place" the politics of fear! (2/10/2009 11:23:30 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Cagey18 Let's evaluate these two "fear" scenarios, shall we? Chances of terrorism affecting you or your loved ones: Damn near zero Chances of current economy affecting you or your loved ones: Pretty damn high Bush's was a "created" fear to make you vote for him and Republicans. Obama's is a genuine fear that if we don't do something, the economy will get worse. A rational person would choose to respond to the genuine fear every time. Indeed. ...and while plastic and duct tape are totally useless in a domestic terrorist attack, you could actually use it this time around to kidnap a banking industry CEO in an effort to re-distribute his wealth... [;)]

ArizonaSunSwitch -> RE: "Between Barack and a hard place" the politics of fear! (2/10/2009 11:26:11 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Cagey18 Let's evaluate these two "fear" scenarios, shall we? Chances of terrorism affecting you or your loved ones: Damn near zero Oh bullshit, I knew two people that were supposed to be in the WTC that day. One called in sick. One was supposed to be on the top floor of the first tower hit at 8am. His habitual 2 hour lateness saved his life. You might want to visit Manhattan sometime, there's still a big hole there, it's not a figment of W's imagination. quote: Chances of current economy affecting you or your loved ones: Pretty damn high Bush's was a "created" fear to make you vote for him and Republicans. Obama's is a genuine fear that if we don't do something, the economy will get worse. A rational person would choose to respond to the genuine fear every time. Since his stimulus plan is designed to destroy the free market he needs to rely on the fear of "doing nothing" so the sheeple will hand their freedom over to the same people that created the credit bubble in the first place.

ArizonaSunSwitch -> RE: "Between Barack and a hard place" the politics of fear! (2/10/2009 11:36:46 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Coldwarrior57 quote: ORIGINAL: SilverMark I guess if he went somewhere else that the problems in Elkhart and Ft. Meyers wouldn't exist anymore cory?.... Manufacturing in Elkhart....Manufacturing you remember that don't you cory? it is what the USA used to do....the thing that made us the Dominant world economy...and housing....hmmm...seems I read something about housing lately....oh yes...I remember...there aren't any houses sellling...none being built....damn....imagine that! Perhaps you need to check the facts. http://www.realtor.org/research/research/ecoindicator Existing home sales. Sales jumped up 6.5 % in december Pending home sales index went up 5.2 to 87.7, OK thats an interesting number. The press would have us beleive that NO ONE IS BUYING. Housing starts 550,000 units Yes if you have cash right now, you have an opportunity to buy investment property that will cash flow significantly even with 70-80 percent financing (if you can find it) from day one. There are houses you can buy in west or south phoenix for $25-50k that rent out for $800 a month (and no you probably wouldn't, yourself, want to live there).

slvemike4u -> RE: "Between Barack and a hard place" the politics of fear! (2/10/2009 11:39:20 AM)
So those that approve of President Obama's stimulus plan are "sheeple"....while those that silently stood by while Bush shredded the Constitution are what.....patriots? Give me a break.....[8\|]

ArizonaSunSwitch -> RE: "Between Barack and a hard place" the politics of fear! (2/10/2009 12:18:05 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: slvemike4u So those that approve of President Obama's stimulus plan are "sheeple"....while those that silently stood by while Bush shreddied the Constitution are what.....patriots? Give me a break.....[8\|] Since Bush did no such thing, yes, you're a sheeple. When you eagerly give up your freedom and long term economic security so the central government can increase it's control of the credit market which is the exact cause of the credit bubble in the first place, yes, you're a sheeple. When the democrats proudly trot out Christopher Dodd as someone that is going to help solve the problem and you don't know he's one of the handful of people directly responsible for the regulations that created the real estate bubble that has destroyed the credit markets (which is causing our economic problems), yes, you're a sheeple. With the exception of the minor tax cuts during his term Bush's economic policies sucked. But, hey, keeping the terrorists running and ducking enough to prevent them from striking the United States was a higher priority. When congressional republicans tried to fix fannie and freddie mae they were called racists. If you think banks should make mortgage loans decisions on anything other than the recipients ability to pay, yes, you're a sheeple. Assuming you believe Obama's estimation of jobs created by this stimulus plan and that if you divide that number by the cost of the bill, about $300k or so and you think creating that kind of debt obligation will not cause a more than one to one job loss in the private sector, yes, you're a sheeple. You're particularly a sheeple if you haven't noticed that when ever Obama speaks about the subject he says "X number of jobs created or saved" and don't understand that means Obama himself knows he's talking smack. Or in other words, the coming economic hardship isn't going to be a mistake it's being done on purpose.

ModeratorEleven -> RE: "Between Barack and a hard place" the politics of fear! (2/10/2009 12:20:49 PM)
Folks, lose the namecalling. XI

slvemike4u -> RE: "Between Barack and a hard place" the politics of fear! (2/10/2009 12:28:47 PM)
Yeah,what we as a people should have done was elect McCain,that way Mr."country of whiners" Gramm...could be setting policy right about now.....that would of been the way to go huh Arizona. sheeple my ass.

Coldwarrior57 -> RE: "Between Barack and a hard place" the politics of fear! (2/10/2009 12:30:40 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SilverMark New home sales in December Down 14.7% from November...housing starts down 15% down from November off 45% for the year....now YOU do your homework....same sight... Yes same sight, still proves your statement as wrong, you said and I quote NO ONE IS BUYING. if sales of existing homes are up 6 % and pending sales are up 5.X %, then that means the some one is buying? and your statement is false.

ArizonaSunSwitch -> RE: "Between Barack and a hard place" the politics of fear! (2/10/2009 12:35:10 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: slvemike4u Yeah,what we as a people should have done was elect McCain,that way Mr."country of whiners" Gramm...could be setting policy right about now.....that would of been the way to go huh Arizona. sheeple my ass. No, McCain wouldn't of been any better on the economy. But he wouldn't be mouthing off about mandatory public service and talking about creating a 2-3 million member "civil defense force" (brown shirts) either. He wouldn't be using the economic crisis as an opportunity to attempt to create a one party system in this country either. And if he won, at least his sorry ass wouldn't be able to hurt Arizona as much.

slvemike4u -> RE: "Between Barack and a hard place" the politics of fear! (2/10/2009 12:38:05 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Coldwarrior57 quote: ORIGINAL: SilverMark New home sales in December Down 14.7% from November...housing starts down 15% down from November off 45% for the year....now YOU do your homework....same sight... Yes same sight, still proves your statement as wrong, you said and I quote NO ONE IS BUYING. if sales of existing homes are up 6 % and pending sales are up 5.X %, then that means the some one is buying? and your statement is false. Any idea what those homes are selling for in relationship to former value. I have no doubt some who are entering the housing market as new homeowners(when they can get the credit) are enjoying a buyers market. Buying and selling of units is not and has never been as reliable an indicator of the health of the housing market as new housing starts.

ArizonaSunSwitch -> RE: "Between Barack and a hard place" the politics of fear! (2/10/2009 12:46:01 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: slvemike4u quote: ORIGINAL: Coldwarrior57 quote: ORIGINAL: SilverMark New home sales in December Down 14.7% from November...housing starts down 15% down from November off 45% for the year....now YOU do your homework....same sight... Yes same sight, still proves your statement as wrong, you said and I quote NO ONE IS BUYING. if sales of existing homes are up 6 % and pending sales are up 5.X %, then that means the some one is buying? and your statement is false. Any idea what those homes are selling for in relationship to former value. Do you have any idea on what homes are selling for in relationship to actual value as opposed to the inflated prices a few years ago ? quote: I have no doubt some who are entering the housing market as new homeowners(when they can get the credit) are enjoying a buyers market. Buying and selling of units is not and has never been as reliable an indicator of the health of the housing market as new housing starts. Yes, those closed out by artificially inflated prices are now not locked out of the market. Such a tragedy. And yes, I'm underwater on my house. My mistake and problem to fix not my neighbours. All bubbles are created by government interference in the free market. Put the blame where it belongs.

Gwynvyd -> RE: "Between Barack and a hard place" the politics of fear! (2/10/2009 12:50:13 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Cagey18 Let's evaluate these two "fear" scenarios, shall we? Chances of terrorism affecting you or your loved ones: Damn near zero Chances of current economy affecting you or your loved ones: Pretty damn high Bush's was a "created" fear to make you vote for him and Republicans. Obama's is a genuine fear that if we don't do something, the economy will get worse. A rational person would choose to respond to the genuine fear every time. [sm=goodpost.gif] Oh but dont you know they will line up and spend tons and tons of money on war mongering to keep us safe from those Sand Devils ( some I have heard called Sand N words ) but when it comes to helpping out the little guy at home who can't pay for his kid's childcare, or food.. oh no! We simply cant do any more spending. Who wants to pay for someones poor Aunt Pearl's operation, or for her to eat for this month! We can and should of course do more corporate bail outs... you have all seen how many jobs that creates.... or at least for the resorts they go party at after they get the bail out money. Trickle down economics didnt work in the 80's ( remember all of the greed? That is where these multi million dollar CEO's sprung up from) and it sure as shit is not going to work now. We should all "realize" that we are in a pickle. Our economy is fragile, as is the worlds. That is not fear mongering.. that is just the simple truth. Hazim shooting you at the mall... well that is just damn far fetched. Gwyn

slvemike4u -> RE: "Between Barack and a hard place" the politics of fear! (2/10/2009 12:51:10 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ArizonaSunSwitch quote: ORIGINAL: slvemike4u Yeah,what we as a people should have done was elect McCain,that way Mr."country of whiners" Gramm...could be setting policy right about now.....that would of been the way to go huh Arizona. sheeple my ass. No, McCain wouldn't of been any better on the economy. But he wouldn't be mouthing off about mandatory public service and talking about creating a 2-3 million member "civil defense force" (brown shirts) either. He wouldn't be using the economic crisis as an opportunity to attempt to create a one party system in this country either. And if he won, at least his sorry ass wouldn't be able to hurt Arizona as much. An attempt to create a one-party system.....wouldn't that be a Karl Rove function Arizona. As for how much damage Sen.McCain does or doesn't do to the great state of Arizona.....well just as in the case of Sarah Palin and Alaska,thats sort of your problem ...not ours.

ArizonaSunSwitch -> RE: "Between Barack and a hard place" the politics of fear! (2/10/2009 1:02:35 PM)
quote: Oh but dont you know they will line up and spend tons and tons of money on war mongering to keep us safe from those Sand Devils ( some I have heard called Sand N words ) but when it comes to helpping out the little guy at home who can't pay for his kid's childcare, or food.. oh no! We simply cant do any Yeah I know, I'm a racist for being happy we haven't been hit again. Whatever. quote: more spending. Who wants to pay for someones poor Aunt Pearl's operation, or for her to eat for this month! We can and should of course do more corporate bail outs... you have all seen how many jobs that creates.... or at least for the resorts they go party at after they get the bail out money. The "warmongering" protects everyone in this country, including Aunt Pearl. When you say "help" Aunt Pearl you mean other people should pay for a service that's to her benefit only. Aunt Pearl should of bought health insurance or gotten a job. If you want to help Pearl, it's a free country, feel free to open your purse and hand her whatever you want. Please stay the hell out of my wallet, it's challenged enough keeping myself and my family financially solvent so we don't end up being a parasite on the rest of the taxpayer base ourselves. quote: Trickle down economics didnt work in the 80's ( remember all of the greed? That is where these multi million dollar CEO's sprung up from) and it sure as shit is not going to work now. I know things where so much worse for the working man during several years of uninterrupted growth after Carter's stagflation and before Congressional Democrats credit crunch in 2005 and soon to be Obama's intentional destruction of the private credit system. quote: We should all "realize" that we are in a pickle. Our economy is fragile, as is the worlds. That is not fear mongering.. that is just the simple truth. Hazim shooting you at the mall... well that is just damn far fetched. Gwyn Yeah I know and Hazim flying a 737 into the world trade center is unimaginably far fetched. Oh wait I forgot, that's already happened. And as far as him shooting up the mall, it's coming, and i hope to god that's as successful as they get. Funny thing is, that doesn't scare me at all.

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