RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse (Full Version)

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Asherdelampyr -> RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse (2/13/2009 5:36:08 PM)

see, there is the interesting part
when I get angry I pick up a game controller and calm down
however I know that I am the same person no matter which emotion I feel at any given time
and I make the same choices
when discipline is needed and I am angry I do not go any farther than when I am not angry, because I learned to deal with my anger and use it. because I utilize all of my emotions, and dont leave anything out.




QuixoticErrant -> RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse (2/13/2009 5:47:14 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: missturbation

quote:

You want to act out and have a man thrash you for it.  If this turns you on so be it. 

Please show me where i said i wanted to 'act out'?

Well, it is implied.  Unless I have completely missed the points of your other post, which is possible, you seem to be defending the notion of He gets angry and wallops you,  For him to get angry and wallop you, presumably you did something real or imagined to cause this.  If I am missing something in your line of argument, I apologize. 
 
quote:

Honestly that sort of play is not my cup of tea, because it quickly ceases to be play.

Who mentioned play?

OK, so are we saying he just wallops you whenever now?  Just walloping for no reason at all really is abuse.  If he is walloping you outside of the bounds of play, it is abuse. Women who are into that are called battered women.
 
quote:

I do not debate that there are those who like this.  There are also those who like heroin.

What does that have to do with the price of condoms?

The point is that many people like to do all sorts of self destructive things and that just because they like it, it does not necessarily make it a good long term choice. 





QuixoticErrant -> RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse (2/13/2009 5:51:26 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Asherdelampyr

see, there is the interesting part
when I get angry I pick up a game controller and calm down
however I know that I am the same person no matter which emotion I feel at any given time
and I make the same choices
when discipline is needed and I am angry I do not go any farther than when I am not angry, because I learned to deal with my anger and use it. because I utilize all of my emotions, and dont leave anything out.


I am not going to try to argue with you what is in your own mind or heart.  I will say that if you truly do have that capacity, you are very rare.  Most people, which is to say, I am using everyone I have ever met in my life as an example, tend to say and do stupid things when they are pissed off. I would say that the first step of controlling anger is not acting out of it.




missturbation -> RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse (2/13/2009 6:02:22 PM)

quote:

Please show me where i said i wanted to 'act out'?


Well, it is implied.  Unless I have completely missed the points of your other post, which is possible, you seem to be defending the notion of He gets angry and wallops you,  For him to get angry and wallop you, presumably you did something real or imagined to cause this.  If I am missing something in your line of argument, I apologize.

 
For me personally 'act out' implies that i would misbehave on purpose to get punished. If i am punished it will be because of a genuine mistake.
 
quote:

Who mentioned play?

OK, so are we saying he just wallops you whenever now?  Just walloping for no reason at all really is abuse.  Women who are into that are called battered women.


Ok i despise the word play as its not what i do but for the purpose of this discussion ill use it. There is a huge difference between play and punishment for me. Play is about mutual enjoyment, punishment is about my doing something wrong. But as it happens yes i have been walloped because 'he just felt like it' and no it really wasn't abuse.
 
quote:

What does that have to do with the price of condoms?


The point is that many people like to do all sorts of self destructive things and that just because they like it, it does not necessarily make it a good long term choice. 

 
I really don't believe you can equate taking heroine to the subject we are discussing here.





catize -> RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse (2/13/2009 6:07:55 PM)

quote:

  I will say that if you truly do have that capacity, you are very rare. 


I don’t think it is rare at all.  We just take more notice when someone is out of control.




Asherdelampyr -> RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse (2/13/2009 6:12:22 PM)

"It is called discipline, you either have it, or you learn it, or you fail"

That was from the man that trained me

I think it sums it all up
:)






QuixoticErrant -> RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse (2/13/2009 6:16:48 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Asherdelampyr

"It is called discipline, you either have it, or you learn it, or you fail"

That was from the man that trained me

I think it sums it all up
:)



Actually, I just re-read what you wrote.  I am withdrawing the hubris comment.




Asherdelampyr -> RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse (2/13/2009 6:18:46 PM)

It is hubris to think that one can learn discipline?
wow, better not head to many good dojos with that attitude

or maybe it is hubris to expect that anyone with the stones to take a full time slave should be very self disciplined?

go ahead and tell me which, I'll wait




QuixoticErrant -> RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse (2/13/2009 6:23:15 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Asherdelampyr

It is hubris to think that one can learn discipline?
wow, better not head to many good dojos with that attitude

or maybe it is hubris to expect that anyone with the stones to take a full time slave should be very self disciplined?

go ahead and tell me which, I'll wait


No it is not hubris to believe one can learn discipline.  My philosophy is very defined by that notion. After I re-read what you wrote I edited my last comment.  I took it the wrong way the first time I read it.




Asherdelampyr -> RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse (2/13/2009 6:25:25 PM)

fair enough
:)




IrishMist -> RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse (2/14/2009 6:24:22 AM)

quote:

If he is walloping you outside of the bounds of play, it is abuse. Women who are into that are called battered women.

In most cases yes. However, not in all.

I was not then, and am not now a battered woman. I got a kick out of him punching, kicking, throwing me around whenever he felt like it, however he felt like it. Fuck, it was a huge turn on to feel his fist connect with my face or his boots slam into my back or stomach. Nothing got me hotter or made me want more.

Just because YOU view it as abuse and condemn it; does not mean everyone does. You need to start remembering that and quit trying to force your own ideas and morals on everyone else.




missturbation -> RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse (2/14/2009 6:28:41 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: IrishMist

quote:

If he is walloping you outside of the bounds of play, it is abuse. Women who are into that are called battered women.

In most cases yes. However, not in all.

I was not then, and am not now a battered woman. I got a kick out of him punching, kicking, throwing me around whenever he felt like it, however he felt like it. Fuck, it was a huge turn on to feel his fist connect with my face or his boots slam into my back or stomach. Nothing got me hotter or made me want more.

Just because YOU view it as abuse and condemn it; does not mean everyone does. You need to start remembering that and quit trying to force your own ideas and morals on everyone else.


Completely agree. [:D]
My ex (kind of) Sir often spoke of his desire to kill me. There was nothing hotter than that for me. Would he have actually killed me? Nah far too much self control for that. Unless................. they invent something to revive me every time and then maybe, but i'm guessing that would take away some of the 'fantasy' as it wouldn't really be killing me.




IrishMist -> RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse (2/14/2009 6:32:26 AM)

quote:

Completely agree. [:D]
My ex (kind of) Sir often spoke of his desire to kill me. There was nothing hotter than that for me. Would he have actually killed me? Nah far too much self control for that. Unless................. they invent something to revive me every time and then maybe, but i'm guessing that would take away some of the 'fantasy' as it wouldn't really be killing me.


LOL

Hell, I have had a loaded and cocked gun shoved down my throat simply because he wanted to do it...I have had him play roulette with me that way...he got such a huge turn on from watching my reactions...I got a huge turn on from watching his....dayum, I sure do miss men like that [&o]




missturbation -> RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse (2/14/2009 6:39:47 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: IrishMist

quote:

Completely agree. [:D]
My ex (kind of) Sir often spoke of his desire to kill me. There was nothing hotter than that for me. Would he have actually killed me? Nah far too much self control for that. Unless................. they invent something to revive me every time and then maybe, but i'm guessing that would take away some of the 'fantasy' as it wouldn't really be killing me.


LOL

Hell, I have had a loaded and cocked gun shoved down my throat simply because he wanted to do it...I have had him play roulette with me that way...he got such a huge turn on from watching my reactions...I got a huge turn on from watching his....dayum, I sure do miss men like that [&o]


I know what you mean. Although i am in virtually constant contact with my kind of ex sir and we are making plans to see each other again i have missed him horrendously. I haven't served him in over twelve months due to life circumstances and such and it's way too long lol.
I haven't gone to the 'extremes' you mention here or in other threads with him but i can really see where you are coming from. One of my favourite memories of my time with him is being stabbed in the shoulder because i wanted to see what it felt like and i guess he just wanted to do it.
I have no issues with anyone else saying that for them personally it would be abuse. What i take issue with is them saying that it is abuse full stop. Like you i get my 'kicks' from what i do and i consented right from the start, no abused woman here !!




NorthernGent -> RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse (2/14/2009 6:41:58 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: missturbation

Any other thoughts?
 


I suppose you learn to control your emotions in order to get things done. I can't remember being anything remotely approaching an angry individual, so I must have learned that at an early age. From my perspective, I tend to place store in people who are calm and collected, rather than hot heads. I can't understand why anyone would trust the judgement of someone who can't keep his/her emotions in check.




IrishMist -> RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse (2/14/2009 6:42:15 AM)

quote:

One of my favourite memories of my time with him is being stabbed in the shoulder because i wanted to see what it felt like and i guess he just wanted to do it.

LMAO dayum, now that is fucking HOTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT
 




IrishMist -> RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse (2/14/2009 6:56:16 AM)

quote:

I suppose you learn to control your emotions in order to get things done. I can't remember being anything remotely approaching an angry individual, so I must have learned that at an early age. From my perspective, I tend to place store in people who are calm and collected, rather than hot heads. I can't understand why anyone would trust the judgement of someone who can't keep his/her emotions in check.


I am not picking apart anything you wrote here, you just said something that I really wanted to respond to from my own perspective. The part that I bolded is what caught my attention.

I am an extremely violent person. Violent to the point where I used to attack anyone simply because they might have given me what I thought to be a 'wrong look'...naturally, wrong look was defined by me [:)] My temper was so volatile that most who knew me always kept several feet between us as a precaution. Add in the fact that I was street-gang wise and smart in fighting...both with weapons and hand to hand. There were very few who wanted to be on the receiving end of my rage.

My late husband was much the same way. He had a violence in him that you could feel just 'buzzing' beneath the surface. He though...had learned to control it and almost never lost his hold on it.

I attacked him one day...he beat the living shit out of me...that's how we met. How he beat me down was done with such control and precision that he fascinated me. He knew exactly what he was doing, how he was going to do it...and he then proceeded to do it.

It was his ability to actually control himself WHILE in a rage that caught my attention. He was deadly, he was brutal, he had a vicious attitude that he applied to every aspect of his life, including any and all relationships. Yet, even when he was literally beating the living fuck out me...I never actually saw him lose control. I could feel the rage coming off him...I could feel it in the punches and the kicks...but it was a controlled rage that he never let go of.

I wanted to learn that. I wanted to learn how to control the rage and the violence that simmered in me. I needed and outlet for it.

He provided himself as an outlet. Anytime it got too much, all I had to do was take a shot at him.
In return, I gave him the punching bag he needed and wanted. What made it even better was that we found out that I was highly turned on when he did this. He would beat me, I would fight back with everything in me....and in the end, we both got exactly what we needed to survive.

While all this is going on, he taught me how to controll the rage and keep the violence on a leash. If it boils over now, I go to my basement and beat on the bag that is hanging there.
He taught me that trying to contain, restrain, 'erase' or shoving it in a corner is NOT how to handle it. For someone like me, and for someone like him...letting it out is the only answer. Yes, now, it matters how its let out; but as long as it is let out, it can be controlled.





NorthernGent -> RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse (2/14/2009 7:21:04 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: IrishMist

For someone like me, and for someone like him...letting it out is the only answer. Yes, now, it matters how its let out; but as long as it is let out, it can be controlled.



I'd be lying were I to say that I understand this mindset. I can't imagine what is so personal as to cause such anger and rage. A family member being raped or killed? Yes, definitely. Apart from that, I'm scratching my head struggling to come up with something. A boss and work colleagues trying to manipulate and intimidate you on an issue on which you won't budge? I've been there, I'm sure most have, and while keeping a straight face I've laughed my fucking head off inside.




missturbation -> RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse (2/14/2009 7:27:29 AM)

Like any emotion some people feel anger more strongly than other people do. I'm pretty laid back, part of my personality, takes a lot to get me angry, but when you do step back cos i'm gonna explode. I'm not someone who needs to hit out, im a verbal venter.
Everyone has their own way of dealing with emotion, what works best for them.




feydeplume -> RE: Anger, physical, non-physical, consent, abuse (2/14/2009 7:36:59 AM)

I just want to add my little piggy bank to this one.

I too was physically violent. ALOT. There was a ton of violence around me (and to me) when i was a kid. It was "normal" to see people beat the hell out of each other at the bus stop. Some of us came up with violence permeating the very air and, until older, had no idea that everyone didn't act that way all the time.

I have scars, physical and internal, from the violence that i was part of. But that was then and I decided that violence doesn't own me. My M does. I have learned ways of facing down the rage, channeling it into other things, and sometimes just letting loose and beating the hell out of the punching bag with my pads (hands, knees and feet). Some times you just have to let the rage play too.




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