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Humiliation "Help" - 2/23/2009 1:25:29 PM   
SylvereApLeanan


Posts: 8275
Joined: 11/1/2007
From: Hell
Status: offline 		Tons of threads have been started on this topic.  I know, I've checked.  And there are lots of web sites dedicated to it.  So many, in fact, that someone who wants to do a bit of research might feel overwhelmed by the sheer volume.
 
I confess, I don't really "get it" when it comes to humiliation.  It's not my kink but I'm not opposed to it either.  I know it's not for everyone, but it seems like a lot of subs do get off on it.  So, if I wanted to learn about erotic humiliation and how to do it well, where should I start?  Which threads and web sites are the most informative?  I know it's a very personal thing and what works for one won't work for all.  I'm looking for some general information and basic techniques that could be customized depending on the individual.
 
A search of the archives turned up more than five pages of posts and a Google search generated dozens of sites.  Aaack!  My time to devote to research is limited so I want to make the most of it.  That's why I'm asking for help finding a starting point.  Links to favorite threads or sites are great or, if anyone has thoughts to share in this thread, that works too.  Point me in the right direction, I'll do the rest.
 
Thanks!

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RE: Humiliation "Help" - 2/23/2009 1:29:36 PM   
VeryNastyDom


Posts: 403
Joined: 9/23/2006
Status: offline 		This is a very tough topic to cover in a short time.  The bottom line is that what YOU might find humiliating and what another sub might find humiliating, may not be at all for YOUR SUB.  You pretty much need to experiment and see what pushes your sub's hot button.  Then push it frequently.


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RE: Humiliation "Help" - 2/23/2009 1:39:09 PM   
SylvereApLeanan


Posts: 8275
Joined: 11/1/2007
From: Hell
Status: offline 		I know it's not going to have a simple answer.  I'm just looking for a starting point.  I'm the sort of person who likes to learn as much as possible about a topic before I try it out on a live subject.  I practiced swinging a flogger and a riding crop for weeks on pillows and archery targets before I ever used them on a person.  I still test out new toys on myself before I use them.  I can't bring myself to try humiliation on someone without feeling like I have a basic understanding of it first.  Since I currently have no sub to ask, I'm doing what I can on my own.

_____________________________

Sylverë
Dark Muse
30 Fluffy Points
Grumpy Cat is my spirit animal.
Shadow Governess & Mean Girl
"There's something that doesn't make sense. Let's go and poke it with a stick."— The Doctor

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RE: Humiliation "Help" - 2/23/2009 2:35:08 PM   
SailingBum


Posts: 3225
Joined: 12/10/2007
From: Sailin the stormy sea
Status: offline 		Yer way to lazy for me  you just gotta plow thru it.

BadOne

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RE: Humiliation "Help" - 2/23/2009 2:58:02 PM   
porcelain26


Posts: 181
Joined: 11/16/2007
Status: offline 		My simple answer:

Talk to the one you're wanting to humiliate. Humiliation is a tricky thing and is vastly different between different people. What's erotic and wonderful for one person, is awful and traumatic for another. Therefore, in my opinion, the best research you can do is on the person whom you are working with. They are going to be the best source of information on how to work with them specifically. I don't know that there is any "basic platform" that you can follow in order to properly humiliate a person. It's just not possible for it to be generic and work on everyone. But again, this is just my opinion.

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RE: Humiliation "Help" - 2/23/2009 3:04:05 PM   
Maya2001


Posts: 1656
Joined: 8/22/2007
From: Woodstock ONT,CANADA
Status: offline 		to help you  understand you are going to have to break it down  in it various forms

for one person being called a slut , whore in private  may be a turn on , but being used as a urinal, or being made to void in a diaper, in your pants in a public place  isn't




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RE: Humiliation "Help" - 2/23/2009 3:18:53 PM   
FelineFae


Posts: 7756
Joined: 1/23/2009
From: i do wander everywhere...
Status: offline 		Master would never insult my body because He knows it could damage me. But He does "put me in my place". i am very proud of myself in my abilities and knowledge, being reminded that i can be reduced to a moaning private slut at His command... well, to us this is humiliation, being humbled. Pride going to the way side...

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RE: Humiliation "Help" - 2/23/2009 3:25:18 PM   
DiurnalVampire


Posts: 8125
Joined: 1/19/2006
From: Nashville, TN
Status: offline 		Humiliation requires you to know a good deal about the things your submissive holds dear, what would be potentially damaging and what they can recover from outside of scene with aftercare. Many times, the easiest hot button for humiliation is emasculization (for males). Putting them in panties is pretty stereotyped, but its a good jumping off point.
Sometimes it can be reminding them you are better at something than they are. Or telling them they arent as *insert description here* as someone else you know, or as an ex...

Very hot spot, though, you really need to know enough about the boy or girl you are going to be humiliating to tread that ground. I cant do it with Fox, too many emotional drawbacks. But back when I had Angel, it was the fastest route to subspace.

Any other questions, feel free to message me on the other side.

DV

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I will be your Dominate if you will be my submit - Fox

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RE: Humiliation "Help" - 2/23/2009 4:14:12 PM   
feydeplume


Posts: 935
Joined: 12/24/2008
Status: offline 		****warning Pedantic Post*****  (what cha think folks, should i put this warning on more of my posts?)

Humiliation games can be broken down in separate categories but are focused on the re framing or removal of some social trapping or symbol associated with some facet of the person's pride, attainments, of self worth. It is a mental game that is played with a few props and those props are used to reinforce your words and the mind fuck that you are doing.

If you know your sub AT ALL, you know what parts of themselves they are proud of or what skills or attributes they take for granted. Take ONE of these and look at the symbols and associations that it has. Those are what you take away, alter, restrict, redirect, or reverse.

Examples:
Man has great tie collection and takes pride in finding and buying good ties. leave him fully dressed, but fly down and put the tie around his little head and talk about how that head is the one that "deserves" the good tie since it is what he does his thinking with. Make him tie the tie in various styles of tie, but not his usual one. Make him work at rethinking his ties in relation to his body, but preserve his "work knot" so that the game doesn't lessen his love of ties or his ability to get ready and be present for work.

Woman has fantastic skin. strip her down and draw polka dots "freckles" all over her (crayola washables work best for this and come in a range of colors, but adding some of the silver and gold and florescent body paints are great for this). And talk about how much prettier her skin is when it has all these colors (that bleed together almost instantly making a huge smudge) and parade her in front of a mirror. make her draw on herself in her least favorite colors first, working up to colors she likes until you and her have covered her in colors and blobs. Use baby wipes to clear areas so that you can work on them with new patterns or styles. ALL the while keeping up the dialog about how much better her skin looks when it has dots, freckles, orange, what ever. They bathe her gently with yummy scented soap and white towels (to show that all the ink is gone) and bring her back down, loving the beauty of her skin as it is again so that there is

Neither of these is a standard example because those are already present in the head of most that like humiliation and they have already built up internal ways to feel about them. THAT is the key to GREAT humiliation, to something that they haven't read in Beauty, Marketplace, O, or some similar book.

but that is just what has worked for me.


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RE: Humiliation "Help" - 2/23/2009 4:59:55 PM   
Jeptha


Posts: 780
Joined: 9/18/2008
From: Portland, Oregon
Status: offline 		I've like sexuality.org in the past;

http://sexuality.org/authors/henkin/att36.html

I don't think it's a really great article, but it might not be a bad place to start.

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RE: Humiliation "Help" - 2/23/2009 5:40:21 PM   
ylhtm1


Posts: 6
Joined: 11/24/2005
Status: offline 		feydeplume has an excellent point about humiliation falling into different categories.  Some submissives enjoy being told that they are worthless scum, sluts (usually if female), filthy dogs, etc.  As a sub, I have no interest in that.

On the other hand, I very much enjoy being required to demonstrate my subservient status in non-flamboyant ways such as walking three steps behind my domme, having to address her respectfully, having to ask for her permission to order at a restaurant, not speaking until spoken to, etc.  If my domme is into feminization then I enjoy being taken shopping for lingerie which is "obviously" for me.  Some people may not consider those things to be humiliation, but whatever you call it, that brand of humiliation is exciting and attractive to me.

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Stan

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RE: Humiliation "Help" - 2/23/2009 6:02:11 PM   
MsFlutter


Posts: 1305
Joined: 11/12/2008
From: East Coast
Status: offline 		Yayyy - I'm not the only one that has found it mind-boggling at some point.
 
I even went so far as to break it down to questioning the nature of the result  in hopes of 'reverse-engineering' how best to get there without totally shredding some guy's ego.
 
Fortunately I had someone I had known for awhile to experiment on. One day, in a bit of an impatient mood, I abruptly told him to bend over and spread his cheeks. He was dumbfounded and stared at me for a second, then turn beet red and followed orders. I could see evidence that his feelings weren't too hurt. That - to HIM - was humiliation and he later declared it stunning but perfect. I was relieved because it never came close to the whole 'worm'/pencil dick arena. 
 
I find it is far easier to reach into a sub's mind and remind him that I'll turn him into the begging little whore he secretly wants to be than to risk credibility (and possibly a friendship) by painting crosshairs on 'where he lives'
 

< Message edited by MsFlutter -- 2/23/2009 6:17:10 PM >

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RE: Humiliation "Help" - 2/23/2009 6:15:52 PM   
frazzle121


Posts: 116
Joined: 3/28/2007
Status: offline 		FR

I didnt understand humiliation at all til 2 nights ago.        

2 hour after the event i was a crumpled mess of uncontrollable tears.   Not going there again, emotionally way more than i can deal with.  but at least now i understand it.

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RE: Humiliation "Help" - 2/23/2009 6:30:12 PM   
VAcontroldom


Posts: 65
Joined: 6/5/2005
Status: offline 		The Porcelain one did Nebraska proud with an answer that was perfect until she backtracked with "But again, this is just my opinion".  There are many different opinions about humiliation, but I would posit that you must know the person before you know what will humiliate them is a fact.

Of course, if the Bad One's intuition is correct, and I think it usually is based on his posts here, advice that requires hard work may not be helpful

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RE: Humiliation "Help" - 2/23/2009 9:41:29 PM   
purrin


Posts: 1
Joined: 2/4/2009
Status: offline
I found DiurnalVampire, feydeplume, and MsFlutter's responses very informative. Humiliation is something that has puzzled me for quite some time. I loved the examples used it helped me to start to develop an idea of humiliation away from the usual "slut" "whore" "worthless worm" that seems to be the norm.

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RE: Humiliation "Help" - 2/24/2009 1:45:36 AM   
SailingBum


Posts: 3225
Joined: 12/10/2007
From: Sailin the stormy sea
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: VAcontroldom

The Porcelain one did Nebraska proud with an answer that was perfect until she backtracked with "But again, this is just my opinion".  There are many different opinions about humiliation, but I would posit that you must know the person before you know what will humiliate them is a fact.

Of course, if the Bad One's intuition is correct, and I think it usually is based on his posts here, advice that requires hard work may not be helpful



Thanks for the props.  I try to keep it real.  There are no shortcuts in life.  I've looked

BadOne

< Message edited by SailingBum -- 2/24/2009 1:48:28 AM >

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The beatings will continue until morale improves.

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We are all so very lucky to have you with us to impart your great wisdom.

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RE: Humiliation "Help" - 2/24/2009 2:44:08 AM   
Imakemensquirm


Posts: 59
Joined: 12/28/2006
Status: offline 		I'm not sure why you are asking the question, you said yourself that it isn't your kink.  I don't think humiliation play will work for either party if both don't get something from it.  I adore watching a guy squirm with embarrassment, seeing his face go flush with red and watching the confussion in his eyes as the excitement builds within him, making him unable to stop whatever the shameful thing it is that's causing this moment of humiliation for him.  I don't need to understand why the guy is driven beyond control with humiliation, I just have to know what his limits are and I'll take it from there. 

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RE: Humiliation "Help" - 2/24/2009 6:29:53 AM   
antipode


Posts: 1787
Joined: 4/19/2004
Status: offline
quote:

My time to devote to research is limited


That's tough. But I really don't see why, if you do not want to give it the time it deserves, we should do it for you. We don't work for you.

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RE: Humiliation "Help" - 2/24/2009 1:20:17 PM   
SylvereApLeanan


Posts: 8275
Joined: 11/1/2007
From: Hell
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DiurnalVampire

Humiliation requires you to know a good deal about the things your submissive holds dear, what would be potentially damaging and what they can recover from outside of scene with aftercare.

Very hot spot, though, you really need to know enough about the boy or girl you are going to be humiliating to tread that ground. I cant do it with Fox, too many emotional drawbacks. But back when I had Angel, it was the fastest route to subspace.

Any other questions, feel free to message me on the other side.

DV


I'm all about getting into a sub's head and figuring out what makes him/her tick.  I love mindfucks.  The sticking point for me tends to be that, while I can pick out details and make connections that most people miss, I don't always know how to incorporate it into a larger framework.  I'm great at taking a simple scenario and then tailoring it to suit.  But I can't conjure a "suit" out of thin air -- I need a pattern to use on the material.  That's where the resources list and general template comes in handy. 
 
There are just SO MANY different sites and threads.  Instead of slogging through all of them for the one or two gems, I need to study smarter.  I figured asking those who have more experience for some suggestions on where to start would be a good idea.  Thanks for the offer of help on the other side.  If it ever becomes a reality instead of a hypothetical, I'll probably take you up on it.

_____________________________

Sylverë
Dark Muse
30 Fluffy Points
Grumpy Cat is my spirit animal.
Shadow Governess & Mean Girl
"There's something that doesn't make sense. Let's go and poke it with a stick."— The Doctor

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RE: Humiliation "Help" - 2/24/2009 1:27:42 PM   
SylvereApLeanan


Posts: 8275
Joined: 11/1/2007
From: Hell
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: feydeplume

Humiliation games can be broken down in separate categories but are focused on the re framing or removal of some social trapping or symbol associated with some facet of the person's pride, attainments, of self worth. It is a mental game that is played with a few props and those props are used to reinforce your words and the mind fuck that you are doing.

[major snippage]
 
Neither of these is a standard example because those are already present in the head of most that like humiliation and they have already built up internal ways to feel about them. THAT is the key to GREAT humiliation, to something that they haven't read in Beauty, Marketplace, O, or some similar book.


Ooh, thanks for this.  It's really helpful.  I love doing odd, unexpected things and I like how neither of your examples devolve into the truly degrading.  I think that's been one of the sticking points for me when it comes to humiliation.  So many of the subs who like it seem to want things that, to me, cross the line into degredation of the not-fun sort.  That might be why I haven't really been able to wrap my head around its appeal.  Changing my thinking to come at it from a mind-fuck perspective will be helpful if I end up with a sub who enjoys humiliation.
 
Thanks again.

_____________________________

Sylverë
Dark Muse
30 Fluffy Points
Grumpy Cat is my spirit animal.
Shadow Governess & Mean Girl
"There's something that doesn't make sense. Let's go and poke it with a stick."— The Doctor

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