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RE: When slave is ready the master will come - 2/28/2009 7:21:38 AM

KatyLied

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quote:

I think it's more a matter of working on yourself first and being open to a relationship. It is not a matter passivity but of activeness focused on the self first and another second.

Thank you Tammyjo, this is what I was trying to communicate.

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RE: When slave is ready the master will come - 2/28/2009 8:03:14 AM

MarcEsadrian

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP

quote:

ORIGINAL: InTonguesslave

of course the really interesting part of that (que spooky music) is that we dont know what sort of people our experiences will make us ultimately and therefore we cannot possibly know who these people are that we want until the experiences we've had make us open to the people we become attractive to... umm

Not necessarily. We can decide to work on ourselves, to become more self aware, and to table the partner hunting process until we feel better about ourselves.

The value of those words can't be underscored enough, in my opinion. New experiences change us and help us to grow, of course, but a foundation of inward reflection and self-awareness is vital; in short, a collective review of what our experiences have lead us to be and want thus far. Without the ability to measure this with a clear head, we will only be creatures of our environment, one step behind what we glean, or as Dante would probably put it, "chasing an ever shifting banner."

To address the opening post, there is certainly something to the Zen notion of when the student is ready the teacher will come. I would probably modify that idea in some circumstances by saying when the student is ready, the search for the real teacher begins. The student will recognize and react to the teacher more clearly, and the teacher will in turn recognize and react to the student. The premise of this Zen statement is beautifully compatible with those who struggle with the search for authenticity in D/s.

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RE: When slave is ready the master will come - 2/28/2009 8:32:22 AM

KatyLied

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quote:

New experiences change us and help us to grow, of course, but a foundation of inward reflection and self-awareness is vital; in short, a collective review of what our experiences have lead us to be and want thus far.

This is true. I also think that new experiences make us more interesting people.

I think that sometimes people get stuck in reflection. It has happened to me more than I'd like to admit. Instead of celebrating what was good in a past relationship I would make a list (in my head) of every incident where I perceived that I was done wrong or where I was obviously treated with less than respect. This not only reduced my self-esteem but more importantly, it prevented me from seeing the value of who I was at that time and what I offered.

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RE: When slave is ready the master will come - 2/28/2009 8:59:31 AM

VeryNastyDom

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We all have a mental list of what we are looking for, but sometimes we find somebody so exceptional that we wonder how we possibly could have settled for less. However, that discovery only comes from actually meeting people.

If you hide under a blanket and wait to be discovered, you may have a long wait. If you put yourself out there, you will meet some not so great people and will risk being emotionally hurt. The right balance is to expose yourself to the world in a way that works for you, and if you get hurt a few times along the way then just chalk it up to experience. Master will appear when the student is ready, but Master has to know where the student is.

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RE: When slave is ready the master will come - 2/28/2009 9:15:49 AM

NuevaVida

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quote:

ORIGINAL: KatyLied

quote:

New experiences change us and help us to grow, of course, but a foundation of inward reflection and self-awareness is vital; in short, a collective review of what our experiences have lead us to be and want thus far.

This is true. I also think that new experiences make us more interesting people.

I think that sometimes people get stuck in reflection. It has happened to me more than I'd like to admit. Instead of celebrating what was good in a past relationship I would make a list (in my head) of every incident where I perceived that I was done wrong or where I was obviously treated with less than respect. This not only reduced my self-esteem but more importantly, it prevented me from seeing the value of who I was at that time and what I offered.

To piggy back on this, I agree with you, Katy, it's a trap we often fall in - to focus on the negative, on failures, and on doubts, which can so often paralyze us from moving forward.

I personally find that new experiences shape me as a person, and I'm quickly coming to the point of looking at "failed" relationships not so much as failures but as opportunities to learn, grow, and shape my own mind and heart. I am not even close to being the person I was just a few short years ago (thankfully!!) and I have no idea where this current path I'm on will lead, but I am enjoying this new openness of mind I'm experiencing and all the things I am learning these days.

So, rather than "searching" for someone, I find myself simply open to possibilities. When the time is right and all the stars are aligned just so, things will fall into place as they should (that sounds so new-agey, doesn't it?!). Meanwhile, I'm soaking up life and applying lessons learned for the good. Add to that an appreciation for the people who have come and gone in my life (even the not-so-nice ones) and I'm probably more at peace now than I've ever been.

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RE: When slave is ready the master will come - 2/28/2009 9:19:24 AM

ThatDamnedPanda

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Prinsexx
So look I've got to grips with a very simple and yet complex thing... when the slave is ready the right Master appears.
Is this a philosophy you share?

I'm sorry; but no, I don't. People's paths cross when they cross.

I do understand what you're saying, though, and think you have gotten ahold of something. I just don't think it's quite as simple and as linear as that. I think it would be more accurate to say that when the slave is ready, the right master is more likely to notice if he or she happens to be passing at that particular moment. And more likely to stop and look. And less likely to move on again.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Prinsexx

When you were truly ready did the perfect Other come into your life?
What did they teach you?

The person I would consider, at this point, to have been my perfect other came into my life at a moment when I was not ready. What they taught me was, well... among many other things... that I was not ready.

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RE: When slave is ready the master will come - 2/28/2009 9:21:05 AM

subangi

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     Yesterday, I put in a movie for my son to watch....the Iron Giant. Shortly after watching it he was playing with his dinosaurs and talking for them as his imagination astounds me, and he said, " You choose how you want to live". I asked him where he got that and he replied that the robot in the movie said that.   It blew me away.
   I have been in search of my "ideal" Master, but i realize that during the interum i can work on growth within myself, achieving to be opmistic of every realm in life, and making the most of every moment of the day. I find that when i maintain that behavior, the most wonderful things come my way.
   And, I was so happy that my son picked that up, rather than repeating "son of a ..." from cat in the hat or "die sucker" from the Simpsons. lol

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RE: When slave is ready the master will come - 2/28/2009 9:46:51 AM

IrishMist

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quote:

when the slave is ready the right Master appears.
Is this a philosophy you share?

NO. Personally, I think its BS.

quote:

Where are you at right now in feeling it is your responsibility...the dynamic you have?

It's not my responsibility. It's not his responsiblity.
It's OUR responsibility.

quote:

Where are you at in believing it is because of the Other person that you feel the way you do?

100%
I know for a fact, that for myself...I respond only to something in the other person. If he does not have it, I don't feel it.

quote:

When you were truly ready did the perfect Other come into your life?

No. No one is perfect and to think that anyone is, is fantasy; pure and simple.

quote:

What did they teach you?

How to accept myself, faults and all.

quote:

And yet what did you learn?

Peace and serenity.

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RE: When slave is ready the master will come - 2/28/2009 10:10:03 AM

Prinsexx

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quote:

ORIGINAL: KatyLied

quote:

knowing I didn't really want to be doing it.

I think many of us have had those moments. What I do is focus on the positive of the relationship and try not to call up those negative things that are self-defeating to my self-esteem. It is much easier to post-mortem the relationship when you've moved months beyond it than it is to realize exactly what's going on when it's happening.

I rare;y if ever do stuff that I don't want to do. Being assertive like this has gotten me published, two jobs O absolutely adore and three children that I determined to raise the way I wanted to.
What I realised as a bolt out of the nlue was the realisation I was doing it during my 'jobs' as a submissive. I was interating out of a sense of duty. Handing over authority for sure. As far as I could be I was happy with no limits and so I was interpreting this as so far down the line of doing things against my will it pains me to think back on it.
I had gone as far as being dutiful to someone.... more than one...whom I didn't actually want to be with.
That's gotta be crazy.

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RE: When slave is ready the master will come - 2/28/2009 10:22:15 AM

catize

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quote:

There's a well known Zen saying: when the student is ready the teacher will come... <snip> When a slave is ready her Master will come....

I think you’ve missed the point. When we are aware that some knowledge is lacking, we must be ready to be taught that which we need to learn before we can understand.
There is not “a teacher”. We discover our truths from various sources; it may indeed be another person, but it can also be the universe, nature, or even ourselves. When-we-are-ready.
In the same way, there is no “One” master or slave (dominant/submissive) lurking in the weeds waiting for us. When-we-are-ready, and not one moment before, we will find some one who fits, who is good for us,

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RE: When slave is ready the master will come - 2/28/2009 10:23:31 AM

Prinsexx

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quote:

ORIGINAL: sirguym

That is very true. So many on these sites are so desperate for sex or just human contact that they'll lower themselves to be sluts, (of either or trans gender), not realising that most people only want a slut when they desire quick no-frills sex: and are embarrassed by them any other time.

I don't agree that's the only reason why someone wants a slut.
One thing I've found is that there is a certain sense of pride in a D type in bringing the slut out in an intelligent woman (not wanting to exclude other genders here). I've also come to value the slut in me. It's quite a break from intellectualism.

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RE: When slave is ready the master will come - 2/28/2009 10:35:04 AM

Kana

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Is this a philosophy you share?
Nope, sometimes shit happens that has zilch to do with me. The idea that I have to be percetly ready sounds good on paper, but who ever really is? For me, life is experiential. I have to do it. That means going out and taking risks.

Where are you at right now in feeling it is your responsibility...the dynamic you have?
Err, I am a dom, so i think a whole lot has to do with me. But that said, there is something I call zing. It's that feeling you get when you meet that certain someone, the electricity that crackles.
That seems to have a mind of its own.
I have known tremendous women with whom I have had no zing and women who I knew were terrible for me that the Zing was off the charts on.
And I know one thing-I gotta have zing for anything to work.
Where are you at in believing it is because of the Other person that you feel the way you do? Nobody can be responsible for how I feel. Nobody has the power to affect my feelings. That’s a choice I make. I am a grown man. I am responsible for how I feel. I don’t lay that on others-that’s on me.
When you were truly ready did the perfect Other come into your life? Umm, I don’t know that anyone is the “perfect” other-that’s asking a whole lot from a flawed mortal. Good women have always been in my life, it’s been a matter of me choosing the right one.
What did they teach you? I learn something from everyone and everything I learned about bdsm came from slaves.
And yet what did you learn? That my sister was right. She says relationships are like jeans. You have to keep trying them on until you find the one that fits for you.

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RE: When slave is ready the master will come - 2/28/2009 10:35:32 AM

KatyLied

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quote:

I rarely if ever do stuff that I don't want to do.

I need to have that edge. I need the intimacy that comes with doing things that I do not want to do. It's complicated, I guess, I need to know that when someone likes me, he wants to hurt me (just a little), he wants to make me uncomfortable, and he wants me to not necessarily enjoy the experience and possibly not like him (in that particular moment).

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RE: When slave is ready the master will come - 2/28/2009 10:40:01 AM

Prinsexx

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quote:

ORIGINAL: thetammyjo

I think it's more a matter of working on yourself first and being open to a relationship. It is not a matter passivity but of activeness focused on the self first and another second. It is a matter of self-awareness often born of experiences, both unpleasant and pleasant, and the ability to grow with each.

The most important relationship any of us will ever have is never with another person but with ourselves. If we aren't at a place where we can put in the time and energy to a relationship it won't work. Period.

This is similar to the relationship of teacher and student. Both must be ready for their roles and committed to the work required. If one is not, there can be no learning and not teaching.

Just my immediate thoughts.

There's a fine line between reflection and deflection. I was one step outside of most relationships observing what was happening, rather than reflecting on myself. The deflecyion, the needing to be one step detached was raking a great deal of energy. That's a recent realization as well.

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RE: When slave is ready the master will come - 2/28/2009 10:51:31 AM

dreamerdreaming

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No, I wish it would be so easy. My slave was ready and waiting for me for a long time.

I wasn't ready for him. Even now, while I am emotionally more ready for him than before, our life circumstances are not optimal to say the least.

But I can't just not love him, I can't just not take care of him, I can't just not own him, because our timing sucks.

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RE: When slave is ready the master will come - 2/28/2009 11:04:07 AM

MarcEsadrian

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quote:

ORIGINAL: KatyLied

I think that sometimes people get stuck in reflection. It has happened to me more than I'd like to admit. Instead of celebrating what was good in a past relationship I would make a list (in my head) of every incident where I perceived that I was done wrong or where I was obviously treated with less than respect. This not only reduced my self-esteem but more importantly, it prevented me from seeing the value of who I was at that time and what I offered.

I can understand that completely. I think the crux is not to be too negative or even too positive, but objective and honest with ourselves; to rummage around the boiler room of our psyches, so to speak, and come to terms with our desires and our true natures without painting them in this light or that—to find the power to shape our destiny, rather than simply react (and be marked) by the whims of the environment. Autonomous, aware and objective self-therapy, I suppose.

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RE: When slave is ready the master will come - 2/28/2009 11:11:14 AM

Prinsexx

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MarcEsadrian

To address the opening post, there is certainly something to the Zen notion of when the student is ready the teacher will come. I would probably modify that idea in some circumstances by saying when the student is ready, the search for the real teacher begins. The student will recognize and react to the teacher more clearly, and the teacher will in turn recognize and react to the student. The premise of this Zen statement is beautifully compatible with those who struggle with the search for authenticity in D/s.

Yes: I have always loved the Zen saying. In the world of teaching it's the role of students to search for the best teacher. But both sides of the whip search. I have been mistaken in thinking that I could learn from everyone who sought me out. In that I have been sadly disenchanted but always enlightened. Humble: noy saying I am fully enlightened... that is an infinite process. It would be more accurate to say that I have (unwittingly) taught many of those who assured me they were my teachers. It's often felt like that in many aslects of my life. Humble: noy enlightened and not arrogant either. Hope it doesn't come across as that.

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RE: When slave is ready the master will come - 2/28/2009 11:17:58 AM

pdv99

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IMHO there's no such thing as fate, only randomness.

Sure, if you aren't ready for something, then the "perfect" relationship still won't work, even if the "right" person comes along.

But all too often in real life, you can be ready, and nobody remotely suitable comes along. And the perfect person probably shows when you are in the middle of trying to work something out with somebody else, and the perfect one decides you are unavailable and goes off and finds somebody else.

I belong to the camp that says things happen to those who go out and make opportunities for them to happen. However, you can try looking too hard, and then something can turn up out of the blue when you give up looking.

"Life's a bitch".
If you are lucky.

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RE: When slave is ready the master will come - 2/28/2009 11:22:16 AM

Prinsexx

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quote:

ORIGINAL: KatyLied

quote:

I rarely if ever do stuff that I don't want to do.

I need to have that edge. I need the intimacy that comes with doing things that I do not want to do. It's complicated, I guess, I need to know that when someone likes me, he wants to hurt me (just a little), he wants to make me uncomfortable, and he wants me to not necessarily enjoy the experience and possibly not like him (in that particular moment).

That's the distinction I too was drawing between my submissive life and my extremely assertive life in most all other areas.
There's a distinction and a transition between the two. A sort of sub-drop into mother/teacher/therapist/writer mode and a kind of intellectual-drop into submission.
I'm not exactly saying I left my brains behind evrytime I kneeled... but you'd be forgiven for thinking that that's what I did!

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RE: When slave is ready the master will come - 2/28/2009 1:52:47 PM

MasterLark

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Yes, when the slave is ready, the right Master appears.

"Do you have the patience to wait
till your mud settles and the water is clear?
Can you remain unmoving
till the right action arises by itself?"

--Lao-Tzu

When the Master is ready, the right slave appears.

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