RE: What in the world do you think is appealing about... (Full Version)

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yescando -> RE: What in the world do you think is appealing about... (3/9/2009 8:30:46 PM)

I'm sure that if one put any serious thought into understanding the appeal of it, one could. But why pass up the opportunity to degrade those who obviously seek to be degraded? Like, YOUR particular kink is better somehow? Aacckkkk (as Bill the Cat would say).



Lockit -> RE: What in the world do you think is appealing about... (3/9/2009 8:32:44 PM)

Some of us practice our kink with willing partners... we don't go searching to force ourselves on strangers through email.  That is a judgement! lol



WestBaySlave -> RE: What in the world do you think is appealing about... (3/9/2009 8:44:33 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: yescando

But why pass up the opportunity to degrade those who obviously seek to be degraded?


It's an everyone-wins situation, I suppose...



LadyPact -> RE: What in the world do you think is appealing about... (3/9/2009 8:48:52 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: dreamerdreaming

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

The whole concept makes no sense whatsoever to Me.  I understand that some like humiliation, degradation, objectification, etc.  It's just that, in My mind, those are things played with in an established dynamic or play agreement.

I've said this on a few threads lately.  Considering how many male s types are on the site compared to the number of female D types, isn't it more logical that we are going to seek out the best candidates?  (Actually, I think everyone should do this, regardless of gender and role.)  Unless it's someone's specific kink and that's what they are looking for, doesn't that kind of leave the "lowly, worthless" types in the dust?



Exactly!

Thank you, LadyPact. I'm not worthy!



[sm=bowdown.gif][sm=bowdown.gif][sm=bowdown.gif][sm=bowdown.gif][sm=bowdown.gif][sm=bowdown.gif]

*giggles*

I just can't help myself sometimes...


Unfortunately I doubt if the "lowly, worthless" ones will take your post to heart. It'll either go right over their heads, or they'll ignore the truth of it because the low self-esteem bit is so much a part of their kink. Its a classic self-fulfilling prophecy.


 


Good thing part of this was a joke.  Otherwise, I'd have had to call bullshit on you. 



feydeplume -> RE: What in the world do you think is appealing about... (3/9/2009 8:52:13 PM)

Actually how can you degrade someone that has done all the work for you? There is no place for a second person in the humiliation game if the sub has already reduced themselves to nothing with no boundaries. What is left for the Sadist to do? What can the D or T do? walk over the doormat that is already there? where is the fun, the interaction in that?

I think if you think it through you will see that, just like you can't rape the willing, you can't degrade the degraded.



ignoreme -> RE: What in the world do you think is appealing about... (8/3/2009 4:53:55 AM)

This is just simple newbie behaviour, people new to the scene expect dommes only to talk to them if they approach in the lowliest possible way.



VeeTee -> RE: What in the world do you think is appealing about... (8/3/2009 7:25:14 AM)

I agree, ignoreme.

Before I had the opportunity to really understand the complexity of the lifestyle, I might have thought that type of worthless behavior was the standard. Gaining the understanding that my worthiness adds to a Master's appreciation of my gift of submission...way better. It actually makes me feel more worthy and increases my self-esteem. Makes my subsequent submission more meaningful. I know it doesn't work for all Doms but it certainly does for those with whom I've spoken.



shadowowl -> RE: What in the world do you think is appealing about... (8/3/2009 10:36:52 AM)

I would say there are plenty of D profiles that do the exact same thing,  and as a slave I just ignore Dommes that start or include in their profile something along the lines.  You worthless pieces of S%## Losers, or other things like this.     To me it just seems like they are just bitches and have no idea what BDSM is except a way to fulfill their own fantasy for abusing men or getting money.    Ofcourse that's what some subs look for male and female so I guess to each their own.     I have a high opinion of myself and my worth as a slave so if a Domme doesn't show me respect atleast untill she owns me then she never will.  Of course if she does own me then well I just shut up and take it cause then it's my fault for not asking the right questions before hand. 



ignoreme -> RE: What in the world do you think is appealing about... (8/3/2009 11:18:32 AM)

quote:


Before I had the opportunity to really understand the complexity of the lifestyle, I might have thought that type of worthless behavior was the standard.

Yeah, and as you usually get no reply to those mails anyway, you start to think you have to pretend to be even more pathetic before someone will consider you :) So it goes from bad to worse.



leadership527 -> RE: What in the world do you think is appealing about... (8/3/2009 12:12:21 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact
Unless it's someone's specific kink and that's what they are looking for, doesn't that kind of leave the "lowly, worthless" types in the dust?

Wow, what an interesting thread. I'm definitely in the camp of "repugnant to me, but perfectly understandable as a kink for someone else." I've always assumed that the whole thing as in the realm of kink, not an actual, literal statement of someone's self-assessment.



LafayetteLady -> RE: What in the world do you think is appealing about... (8/3/2009 6:46:30 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: leadership527

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact
Unless it's someone's specific kink and that's what they are looking for, doesn't that kind of leave the "lowly, worthless" types in the dust?

Wow, what an interesting thread. I'm definitely in the camp of "repugnant to me, but perfectly understandable as a kink for someone else." I've always assumed that the whole thing as in the realm of kink, not an actual, literal statement of someone's self-assessment.



I find it interesting that only one male dominant replied to this message to be honest. I realize that CatdeMedici is a women and of course posting from that point of view, but I actually had to go back and check to remember which forum I was in.

On the one hand I understand the concept that a "newbie" might think that is the way to go. I can even see the thought line leadership527 finds with it not being "actual." Problem is that in order to get to "that place," the person has to be feeling that way somewhere in their psyche in my opinion.

We aren't talking about someone saying this within the confines of a relationship, where this is part of a scene. They are LOOKING for someone who thinks they are as worthless as they believe themselves to be. I don't see it as a "not my kink, but whatever" kind of thing. Within an established relationship, on occasion, no problem. But to start out that way, someone already thinks absolutely nothing of themselves and is just looking for others to confirm it rather than help them realize their own worth.

Perhaps it is a phenomenon more common among male s-types, but I don't think so. I've seen too many females s-types posting on these boards who think just that of themselves. Granted the male dominants who go for that rarely post but it's more likely because they know they will get slammed all over the place. Am I passing judgement? Yep. But at some point, it goes beyond the kink and into some people having too many issues to safely be able to seek relationships, not just here, but in the vanilla world as well. The big difference is that here, it is much easier to find someone who is more than delighted to remind you daily what a worthless piece of crap you are and somehow validate your existence by accepting you anyway.

In any case, it always delights me to see that the majority of people here wouldn't seek out someone who starts out saying how worthless they are.



ignoreme -> RE: What in the world do you think is appealing about... (8/3/2009 8:03:10 PM)

quote:


We aren't talking about someone saying this within the confines of a relationship, where this is part of a scene. They are LOOKING for someone who thinks they are as worthless as they believe themselves to be.

Or, they might call themselves worthless not because they really think that of themselves, but because they like to be humiliated and called worthless, as that arouses their kink. In my opinion it is quite harsh to immediately assume they have issues because they address you in the 'wrong way'.




Lockit -> RE: What in the world do you think is appealing about... (8/3/2009 8:27:13 PM)

LOL...Consider me harsh then!  If they are forcing their kink on me... I will not be happy. Most the time I make sure not to dish out some humiliation but I do let them know I don't care for it and block them. If they are stating they are not worthy in a respectable way I may share with them that I don't share that view. If they state it in a way that expects me to go along with them, I ignore them.

I do think it is a problem with many of them whether it comes from forcing their kink on me and manipulating to get kinky or they think that is what is expected or believe it. To do it because they think it is expected is a manipulation of a sort and isn't being honest about who they are. If they believe it.. well, that's a problem.

I have nothing but what they say or do to go on in figuring them out and I will go on what they present. I don't have time for worthless people. I don't have time for manipulators. I don't have time for those who cannot see anything good about themselves and it isn't my kink... so... there it is. I want a man who feels he is worth being with me. I don't need to teach him his worth and prove he is worthy because the focus goes into something far different than the fun I want it on.



petmonkey -> RE: What in the world do you think is appealing about... (8/3/2009 8:40:43 PM)

quote:

But why pass up the opportunity to degrade those who obviously seek to be degraded?
quote:

ORIGINAL: yescando


i interpret this as "lives for: verbal abuse."  Some of the profiles for Dom/mes match this.  We should send hook up suggestions. [8|]



ignoreme -> RE: What in the world do you think is appealing about... (8/3/2009 8:44:37 PM)

quote:

If they are forcing their kink on me... I will not be happy. Most the time I make sure not to dish out some humiliation but I do let them know I don't care for it and block them. If they are stating they are not worthy in a respectable way I may share with them that I don't share that view. If they state it in a way that expects me to go along with them, I ignore them.

Indeed, I agree that is the best thing you can do if someone approaches you and you feel he is forcing something upon you, that's not what a slave or sub should do.



LafayetteLady -> RE: What in the world do you think is appealing about... (8/4/2009 4:46:36 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: ignoreme

quote:

If they are forcing their kink on me... I will not be happy. Most the time I make sure not to dish out some humiliation but I do let them know I don't care for it and block them. If they are stating they are not worthy in a respectable way I may share with them that I don't share that view. If they state it in a way that expects me to go along with them, I ignore them.

Indeed, I agree that is the best thing you can do if someone approaches you and you feel he is forcing something upon you, that's not what a slave or sub should do.


"Forcing" something on someone isn't just what a sub/slave shouldn't do. Dominants shouldn't do it either. You seem to forget that we aren't talking about people who have taken the time to get to know one another and then decide to move forward with a dynamic. This is the "let me introduce myself" part of the process.

Am I harsh about people like that? Yep. Do I think I'm jumping to conclusions? Not one bit. If it is nothing more than your "kink" there are much better ways of introducing yourself and letting them know what you are into. Typically those sentences start with "Some of the things I enjoy are..." As for the Dom/mes who post profiles that would seem to be a perfect match for the ones who see themselves as worthless....well, yep, I see plenty wrong with them as well, typically that their self esteem is just as low as the ones who claim worthlessness. They are just presenting it in a different way.

As nearly everyone here has said, why should they consider the person worthy if that person already is telling them they aren't? Even better was stating that these self proclaimed "worthless" people obviously don't think much of the person they seek either because they don't think they deserve something having worth.

Let's get real here when it comes to humiliation. It's part of a scene, it's role play, it's something two people (or a group if that's your thing) engage in for mutual pleasure. Quite a few subs aren't "into" humiliation and want little to do with dominants who are. Why? Because they get no enjoyment out of it, or worse, they find it hurtful. I don't think many dominants when they engage in humiliation play actually think their sub/slave is a worthless piece of crap who isn't deserving of the littlest of life's luxuries.

It all comes down to REALITY. Are you going to choose the house with the well kept lawn, beautiful landscaping, etc. or the shack next to it with broken windows, dead trees and an overgrown lawn? In general, we all are superficial to some degree when it comes to relationships. If a person can't bother to care about themselves and present how great they can be, then why would anyone choose them?

Why does common sense seem to so quickly go out the window when searching for a partner?



ignoreme -> RE: What in the world do you think is appealing about... (8/4/2009 6:24:34 PM)

LafayetteLady, I know what you mean, and I completely agree. My initial point was that many newbies don't understand many of the subtleties involved yet. Things that you might have known for years and seem like common sense might not be that to someone who first discovers his submissive feelings and finds this site.




LafayetteLady -> RE: What in the world do you think is appealing about... (8/4/2009 8:25:17 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: ignoreme

LafayetteLady, I know what you mean, and I completely agree. My initial point was that many newbies don't understand many of the subtleties involved yet. Things that you might have known for years and seem like common sense might not be that to someone who first discovers his submissive feelings and finds this site.




And my point is that while there may be something to the idea of someone thinking that is the "right" thing to say, more often than not, on some level the people that open with that are not simply lacking knowledge of the lifestyle, they are discovering the lifestyle BECAUSE of their feelings of inadequacy and it is a very dangerous thing considering that predators discover the lifestyle as a means not to really find the dynamic that works for so many but for the sole purpose of finding victims for their abuse, on both the male and female type.

The main thing is that if you watch the boards, you see grown adults who upon discovering this lifestyle suddenly seem to think that common sense, reason and the hope of love is all gone because of this "new" type of relationship they are seeking. Grown women who in their vanilla life would never tolerate a man's dishonesty or cheating are being told that if they want to be a sub/slave, then they have to put up with whatever nonsense some "all knowing" dom is suddenly telling them. It makes no sense. Identifying as a sub/slave doesn't equate to leaving all your values behind and letting someone tell you that this is how it works.

On one hand developing relationships within the lifestyle are very similar to the vanilla world, i.e. contact is made, you talk, discover your likes and dislikes, common interests, etc. On the other hand, there are many activities in the lifestyle that while often exciting, require a little research to discover exactly how it "works." Is there no common sense to thinking, "gee, I enjoy being tied up, but before I let someone do that, maybe I should look into any risks or dangers?" Sure, we all make some mistakes in the beginning, maybe choosing unwisely, but more often than not the ones who ask questions are asking relationship questions, not lifestyle questions.

As Lockit said earlier, the only thing the receiver of the email has to go on is that first impression that the writer gives. Doesn't common sense tell these people that approaching someone (who presumably doesn't have a profile saying they are seeking the lowliest pieces of crap around) that they are not worthy to worship at the feet of any dom/me make them think that perhaps if they don't think they are worthy, neither will anyone else?

So yes, I'm harsh. I have no issues about being unkind or politically incorrect to tell someone that I believe they should seek therapy to resolve their personal psychological issues before trying to look for someone to make things worse.



pyroaquatic -> RE: What in the world do you think is appealing about... (8/4/2009 8:55:43 PM)

If you do decide to take me down a notch you better bring me back up. It is a balance issue for me. I do not care for verbal degrading very much but it is really effective.
Yelling can bring me to tears even if it is not me that is getting yelled at.



DavanKael -> RE: What in the world do you think is appealing about... (8/4/2009 10:36:20 PM)

I despise humiliation and degradation, on either side of the kneel so that sort of thing does not appeal at all. 
  Davan



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