RE: Respecting authority (Full Version)

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DesFIP -> RE: Respecting authority (3/14/2009 12:02:55 PM)

By expecting you to present yourself all soft and shy and submissive when he hasn't done any work in training you to submit to him, he's living a porn fantasy. Real people don't do this with people they don't know, and don't trust sufficiently to submit to.

He wants a fully trained slave without earning one or doing the work required. Basically you are domming yourself for his masturbatory pleasure.

It is normal for you not to be all subby when you don't even know him. You don't know if he is the person in the picture he sent you or not. You don't know if he has the job he claimed to have or not. You don't know if he routinely cheated on his last ten partners. I'm sure you can see where I'm going with this. You need to be straightforward and blunt in order to protect yourself until such time as both of you have proved yourself trustworthy in real life. And by that time you will be inspired to submit instead of doing it to fulfill your own needs.



Lockit -> RE: Respecting authority (3/14/2009 12:31:43 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: BlissFound

I am having difficulty in an online relationship.  FYI, we plan on taking it real time, soon, but scheduling will not permit for a few more weeks.  Backround:  I have been looking for a Dominant/Master for approx. one year.  I have had a few internet and/or real-time relationships that have just not panned out, for various reasons.  Recently i've begun talking with a very intelligent.... and let's just add everything positive one can say about a man/Dominant, and you have described Him.  We speak daily... extensively.  Actually let me be more specific, we text/IM extensively.  We do speak on rare occassions, but for both of our world's, it is most 'doable'. 

Problem/Issue:  Approx. once every couple of days i text something that comes off harshly.  Nothing out right negative, but maybe something that sounds directive rather than receptive.  This gentleman sees it as my not being submissive/slave-like in attitude and questions my ability to be a slave real-time.  I should note that he is not the first to have problem of this type with me. 

Note:  I work in a very male dominated field and i hold my own well.  That means that i have to be agressive and competent.  I make decisions quickly and have opinions.  That is a part of who i am. 

I really respect this gentleman.  I see it as a personal failure when these things happen.  I apologize profusely and really try not to give excuses or justification for my behavior (but sometimes i have).  On one front, i fear His loss.  But none of You, Your valued opinions can change that.  Our relationship will play out as it will.  But what i ask for here is more for a sense of self-identity and Your opinions on that level. 

I have felt submissive on a very profound inner level all of my life.  Even in childhood, fantasies i've had finally make sense.  I would not be surprised if i have not lived lifetimes in slavery, because my fantasies/memories are so vivid.  The ache for this lifestyle, to live it real-time is in every cell of my make-up.  So why am i perceived in a different way than what i am feeling, believing inside of me?  Why is the inner not reconciling with the outer? 

Any insight/opinions would be appreciated.  Whether i agree or not.

i thank all of You

c


Whoa... wait a minute.  A newer relationship that is not in person and using a format which is difficult to communicate with and can't talk on the phone very often.  Okay... first of all.. to be a good dominant in my opinion, you must know and understand the person.  If you work in a field like you do, it might be helpful to understand some things, as well as understanding the communication limitations BEFORE one ACCUSES someone of being of a wrong attitude.

This is laid right in your lap... where in my mind it maybe should be laid in his lap!  Let's just blame someone for something that might not actually be... let her feel insecure and doubt herself and make her more loyal or act right through doubt and shame that might be out of place seeing as though the domly one cannot even speak on the phone too often... which I do wonder why that might be... like is he afraid someone will hear him?  Is he taking time from work and an employer to IM with you?  Ahh... now we may have something... in my mind at least!  Dear heart... when you use your work time for play time... you are cheating someone most of the time.. and therefore I decree, you are a bad employee. 

Fair of me to assume that?  If no... then it isn't fair of him to assume your limited communication form is valid proof of something he makes you feel bad about.  Rather than guide you to a new place and submission.. he is brow beating you into it.  Kudo's to his understanding and skill.



CalifChick -> RE: Respecting authority (3/14/2009 2:18:15 PM)

Whenever someone, who has no realtime relationship with me, says, "I doubt your ability to....", my response is, "you're right"... and then I move on.  I don't need those sorts of judgments from someone who has never met me.


Cali



MASTERLIX -> RE: Respecting authority (3/14/2009 7:25:39 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: CalifChick

Whenever someone, who has no realtime relationship with me, says, "I doubt your ability to....", my response is, "you're right"... and then I move on.  I don't need those sorts of judgments from someone who has never met me.


Cali



What if real time people said the same thing as well? Because in reading what she said, this is not the first time she has heard the same about herself.

Sir Lix



RedMagic1 -> RE: Respecting authority (3/14/2009 7:44:02 PM)

Maybe those guys didn't inspire her submission because they were morons or flaming assholes.

Quoting texts off the internet isn't exactly the same as providing common-sense relationship experience.



NewlySingle329 -> RE: Respecting authority (3/14/2009 9:12:23 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: BlissFound

<<snip>>  Problem/Issue:  Approx. once every couple of days i text something that comes off harshly.  Nothing out right negative, but maybe something that sounds directive rather than receptive.  This gentleman sees it as my not being submissive/slave-like in attitude and questions my ability to be a slave real-time.  I should note that he is not the first to have problem of this type with me. 

Note:  I work in a very male dominated field and i hold my own well.  That means that i have to be agressive and competent.  I make decisions quickly and have opinions.  That is a part of who i am.  

<<snip>>    I see it as a personal failure when these things happen.  I apologize profusely and really try not to give excuses or justification for my behavior (but sometimes i have).  <<snip>>


My comments:  Be true to yourself.  It is deceptive and downright exhausting trying to "be" who you think someone wants you to be.  There are many flavors of dominants and many flavors of submissives, and not all of them are compatible.  I believe that you will regret it later if you are not being yourself with your partner.
 
I, too, work in a male-dominated field.  I've struggled a bit with the same things you describe.  But, if in your communication with him, your intent is to be disrespectful, or sarcastic, or rude, then yes, he has every right to question your motives.  However, if your intent is not to be disrespectful, or sarcastic, or rude, then you just might have a compatibility problem.
 
If you see it as a personal failure of your own, why?



marysdream -> RE: Respecting authority (3/14/2009 10:37:03 PM)

Bliss....i fell into these traps from so called D's please get smart..they know what to say to get us going and will abuse it..so be smart..only do off line..set your standards..remember one thing as a single sub..always protect self!
good luck
ree



Lockit -> RE: Respecting authority (3/15/2009 12:55:44 AM)

From what the op has said, it doesn't sound like she has had much experience in real time.  So from where I am standing... she hasn't had the training or structure, understanding, care or safety that would promote submission, trust or the justification of expectation.  To expect her to act perfect and in an authentic (lol)  form of submission isn't really reasonable.  What is training for if she is supposed to know and understand it all from a few online relationships, some real time and still is struggling?  A struggle can go on for a time, but if you will read her words she talks about feeling this submissive nature to her core.  I would think someone understanding her... taking time with her... being patient... offering something more than some IM's that can be misunderstood and playing on her own struggles if they are there or insecurities or lack of experience, might prove to be very helpful. Clearly something is wrong and I don't believe it is all in her assumed struggle.

I dare say that to train someone, I surely don't expect even in an online capacity that it can be done without hearing the tone of voice, the intake of air... the gasp of shock of self revelations or in learning, or disappointment in her dominant's voice or his intake of breath.  How can you train someone without more than it sounds like is happening?  If she is fearful of his loss... she isn't feeling the safety net that submission can be embraced with.

I don't care how many online dominant's there were... who says they were a good fit or for real or someone that really should be submitted to?  Rather than tell someone how they are doing something wrong... wouldn't it be nice if a correction was made that would provide a way to build her confidence in her submission and trust for her dominant?

Some of this authentic submissive talk is simply a bunch of BS in my opinion.  Let's confuse someone who is feeling insecure with more to feel unworthy with.  That will make a great submissive!  That part about weakness in the submissive... is just wrong.  It takes strength to submit and anyone who belittles what submission or a submissive is about by thinking they are weak.. well... get's my bs call again.

My two cents.



eyesopened -> RE: Respecting authority (3/15/2009 3:37:58 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: NewlySingle329

quote:

ORIGINAL: BlissFound

<<snip>>  Problem/Issue:  Approx. once every couple of days i text something that comes off harshly.  Nothing out right negative, but maybe something that sounds directive rather than receptive.  This gentleman sees it as my not being submissive/slave-like in attitude and questions my ability to be a slave real-time.  I should note that he is not the first to have problem of this type with me. 

Note:  I work in a very male dominated field and i hold my own well.  That means that i have to be agressive and competent.  I make decisions quickly and have opinions.  That is a part of who i am.  

<<snip>>    I see it as a personal failure when these things happen.  I apologize profusely and really try not to give excuses or justification for my behavior (but sometimes i have).  <<snip>>


My comments:  Be true to yourself.  It is deceptive and downright exhausting trying to "be" who you think someone wants you to be.  There are many flavors of dominants and many flavors of submissives, and not all of them are compatible.  I believe that you will regret it later if you are not being yourself with your partner.
 
I, too, work in a male-dominated field.  I've struggled a bit with the same things you describe.  But, if in your communication with him, your intent is to be disrespectful, or sarcastic, or rude, then yes, he has every right to question your motives.  However, if your intent is not to be disrespectful, or sarcastic, or rude, then you just might have a compatibility problem.
 
If you see it as a personal failure of your own, why?


The bolded part, in a nutshell, is the key.

Now, my opinion, not meant to be unkind:  Quit texting and start talking!  Voice inflections, tone and pace communicate better than text.  And I use text on my phone too, but frankly when it comes to more than a two-sentence message, it takes less time to speak the words than to type them and press 'send' no matter how fast your fingers fly on the keypad (as oneserene mentioned).  In my opinion, the reason it is easier for the two of you to text and IM is because deep down neither of you are ready to really connect.  Questioning whether either has the ability to serve or to direct is moot if there is no connection on a real and personal level.

Start finding out of the two of you share the same relationship goals.  That's more important that the occassional "directive-sounding" utterance.



DesFIP -> RE: Respecting authority (3/15/2009 5:25:58 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MASTERLIX
What if real time people said the same thing as well? Because in reading what she said, this is not the first time she has heard the same about herself.
Sir Lix


Did she say she was told this in past relationships? No. She has said she has very limited experience, almost all online or very short term relationships. I don't think that meeting someone twice means you're fully trained, perfectly submissive to them.

If you write subs here and expect them to call you sir when they don't know you, I'm betting you don't get a lot of good (to you) responses. Because that has to be earned. Same thing with her trusting her online dom who can't ever talk to her on the phone for fear his wife will find out. He needs to step up to the plate, meet her, prove he's worth the respect and trust he's demanded. Unfortunately I'm betting he never will.



agirl -> RE: Respecting authority (3/15/2009 5:51:32 AM)

I'd simply suggest that he doesn't know you THAT well as yet. He knows *stuff*, he knows what he knows to date with little real-life interaction......He doesn't KNOW you. You can share all sorts of information about yourself with someone but they rarely KNOW you until they experience you.

agirl



MASTERLIX -> RE: Respecting authority (3/15/2009 7:22:24 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: RedMagic1

Maybe those guys didn't inspire her submission because they were morons or flaming assholes.

Quoting texts off the internet isn't exactly the same as providing common-sense relationship experience.



Inspire her submission? That is interesting. So, are you saying that somone that isn't naturally submissive, that a Dom can inspire her to be submissive? I am not particularly talking about the OP.

So, let's address that first before we come back to this thread. Your response will enable me know which direction to go with this.

Sir Lix



Maya2001 -> RE: Respecting authority (3/15/2009 7:50:45 AM)

quote:

Problem/Issue: Approx. once every couple of days i text something that comes off harshly. Nothing out right negative, but maybe something that sounds directive rather than receptive. This gentleman sees it as my not being submissive/slave-like in attitude and questions my ability to be a slave real-time.


Well the quoted area I have a problem with

Imagine being in a vanilla relation  and every time you say or do something that is not quite to your boyfriends liking ....he would say to you "I guess you are not quite wife material" we would never accept that in a vanilla setting but some seem to think that it acceptable in  a D/s setting.. to me that is a sign of serious communication issues and shows a lacking of respect.  he should be wanting you to further explain, express why it bothers him ,  discuss maybe  how to correct ..   this  is a get to know and learning about each other stage.. which means you not only need to learn  how he expects you to respond but he also need to learn and understand why you respond the way you do and how you think  ..which is important elements for the future...by cutting you off that way  and making you doubt .. he causes a break down in communication which eventually will takes its toll of the relationship as well creates an insecure sub always afraid of being dismissed  and does not help her become secure in the relationship







lronitulstahp -> RE: Respecting authority (3/15/2009 8:08:21 AM)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rIVHNylH1Mk  i think i know this guy....look familiar????



The whole, texting in a disrespectful manner thing, sounds like he's one of those online dudes that gets off on "fixing (his preceived) inadequacies",  instant discipline, and forced conflict. 

How can someone be given the authority to correct your behavior, after only a few days of knowing you even exist?  Stop questioning yourself, you know yourself.  Start questioning the unknown entity in this situation.



RedMagic1 -> RE: Respecting authority (3/15/2009 8:26:32 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MASTERLIX
So, let's address that first before we come back to this thread. Your response will enable me know which direction to go with this.

The topic of this thread is the opening post, posted by the Opening Poster.  You are welcome to start another thread, and posters may comment on it, as they choose.  You are not in a relationship dynamic with me -- nor, I presume, with the site moderators -- and for you to talk as though you are seems, frankly, like bluster.

I'm with the "get to know someone in real life" crowd, not the "insta-knowledge-of-everything from a few lines of chat" crowd.  If you think that someone is a "natural" anything based on how they type, you spend a lot of time in front of a computer.



agirl -> RE: Respecting authority (3/15/2009 8:34:50 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MASTERLIX

quote:

ORIGINAL: RedMagic1

Maybe those guys didn't inspire her submission because they were morons or flaming assholes.

Quoting texts off the internet isn't exactly the same as providing common-sense relationship experience.



Inspire her submission? That is interesting. So, are you saying that somone that isn't naturally submissive, that a Dom can inspire her to be submissive? I am not particularly talking about the OP.

So, let's address that first before we come back to this thread. Your response will enable me know which direction to go with this.

Sir Lix


I'm not submissive but I'm owned. It's not that mystical. I have the ability to follow someone that makes sense and is a great leader. You don't have to be naturally submissive to recognise that when it comes along.

agirl



NorthernGent -> RE: Respecting authority (3/15/2009 10:08:25 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: BlissFound

Problem/Issue:  Approx. once every couple of days i text something that comes off harshly.  Nothing out right negative, but maybe something that sounds directive rather than receptive.  This gentleman sees it as my not being submissive/slave-like in attitude and questions my ability to be a slave real-time.  I should note that he is not the first to have problem of this type with me. 



I suppose it depends on the individual and what exactly you've said. I do think that it helps to act according to that which comes natural in order to understand whether or not the two of you can make a relationship work. It's a matter of personal taste, but I wouldn't be offended by anything sounding 'directive' (well, within reason) in the getting to know you stage. There's plenty of time to mark the boundaries.



CalifChick -> RE: Respecting authority (3/15/2009 10:40:44 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MASTERLIX
quote:

ORIGINAL: CalifChick
Whenever someone, who has no realtime relationship with me, says, "I doubt your ability to....", my response is, "you're right"... and then I move on.  I don't need those sorts of judgments from someone who has never met me.

What if real time people said the same thing as well? Because in reading what she said, this is not the first time she has heard the same about herself.


Someone that I have enormous respect for said to me, "self-proclaimed hard limits are not the limits of ability, but the limits of comfort".  Going along the same general thinking, I would say that someone who knows me in real life, who knows me well, to make a proclamation of my ability would be speaking to the limits of my current comfort level, and not the limits of my ability. Because even I do not know everything I am capable of, and unless that other person was carrying a functioning crystal ball, I would say they don't either.

Cali



Roselaure -> RE: Respecting authority (3/15/2009 10:42:01 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MASTERLIX


Inspire her submission? That is interesting. So, are you saying that somone that isn't naturally submissive, that a Dom can inspire her to be submissive? I am not particularly talking about the OP.



It's actually pretty much the opposite.  I consider myself to be "naturally submissive" if that's the term you like to use.  With the right person in the right circumstances it is the most natural thing in the world for me.  But everyone doesn't trigger or "inspire" that response in me.



MASTERLIX -> RE: Respecting authority (3/15/2009 2:12:17 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP

quote:

ORIGINAL: MASTERLIX
What if real time people said the same thing as well? Because in reading what she said, this is not the first time she has heard the same about herself.
Sir Lix


Did she say she was told this in past relationships? No. She has said she has very limited experience, almost all online or very short term relationships. I don't think that meeting someone twice means you're fully trained, perfectly submissive to them.

If you write subs here and expect them to call you sir when they don't know you, I'm betting you don't get a lot of good (to you) responses. Because that has to be earned. Same thing with her trusting her online dom who can't ever talk to her on the phone for fear his wife will find out. He needs to step up to the plate, meet her, prove he's worth the respect and trust he's demanded. Unfortunately I'm betting he never will.


Your question was "Did she say she was told this in past relationships?" of which you answered, "No".
 
The problem with us sometime is that we half the time only read the first few lines because we already ready to jump on the Dominant or submissive, as the case may be.

This is what she said, just in case you didn't see it, "Problem/Issue:  Approx. once every couple of days i text something that comes off harshly.  Nothing out right negative, but maybe something that sounds directive rather than receptive.  This gentleman sees it as my not being submissive/slave-like in attitude and questions my ability to be a slave real-time.  I should note that he is not the first to have problem of this type with me. 

Note:  I work in a very male dominated field and i hold my own well.  That means that i have to be agressive and competent.  I make decisions quickly and have opinions.  That is a part of who i am."

I am not expecting this to change your views on this matter, but just wanted to let you see where she said this Dom is not the first to have this problem with her.

We should try to read every line...

Sir Lix



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