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RE: Shocking Admission regarding Fox News. - 3/25/2009 12:29:05 PM   
kdsub


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quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsu

Stating the truth is not bias... I can see you not liking the style but unless they are altering facts then it is up to them how to present them.

Butch


And yes, in reality they are altering facts by injecting editorial comment into someone's speech.

The Governor's statements should have been air unedited, with any editorial comment to follow, and be clearly defined as editorial comment.


Editorializing is free speech...remember that little part of the Constitution...As long as they do not alter the facts then they and you have the right to editorialize all you want.

If you don’t like their take don’t watch or start your own television station…others have done it.

As you have stated there are other stations that suit your political bent...so watch them.

Butch

(in reply to rulemylife)
Profile   Post #: 81
RE: Shocking Admission regarding Fox News. - 3/25/2009 12:52:00 PM   
domiguy


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Joined: 5/2/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol
quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth
I appreciate there are many who NEED to believe all that, making FOX the cause of the current effect. It must be because a more logical direction for placing blame just isn't palatable.
Either you're delusional, or just plain annoyed that people express the same amount of cynicism towards Fox that you exhibit towards the current administration. I haven't seen anybody 'blame' Fox for the crisis. Anyone with an ounce of sense knows that all these buffoons can do is sell lies to a naive (at best) audience - and now that Fox' interests are no longer represented in government, they're having a huge tantrum, that's all.

kittin,
I appreciate your need to have delusions but I have none regarding FOX for the simple reason - I don't watch it.



Then you really have nop place engaging in the debate....It would be like giving a restaurant review on a thai place that you have never been to.

_____________________________



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Profile   Post #: 82
RE: Shocking Admission regarding Fox News. - 3/25/2009 12:53:30 PM   
philosophy


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Joined: 2/15/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: zenny

No. The dial reads 25. There is 25 of whatever the dial is measuring. There is nothing subjective about that or a statement of "The dial reads 25".


...how do you know? Because your senses tell you so. A dyslexic person may see '52'. Are you seriously trying to suggest that your senses report objective reality? Do two people ever see the same rainbow? Philosophers have wrestled with this idea for a long time. None have ever really improved on 'i think therefore i am'......your sense are not particulary accurate. Why do you think eye witness testimony is so well known to be unreliable?

quote:

As to human reporting being subjective.... well... Have you ever taken or had to report about an object? Did you comprehend my previous example that proves your argument not only unsound but invalid? Many humans do not report things objectively and you are assuming we cannot be objective. It's extremely easy to report facts. Try it sometime.


....i've given many reports in my life. Reports that often have extremely serious consequences. therefore i try to be as objective as possible. However, i also never lose sight of the fact that i can only ever report facts as i see them. If i were to try and claim that i were the final arbiter of what constitutes reality, i'd be wrong as well as arrogant.


(in reply to zenny)
Profile   Post #: 83
RE: Shocking Admission regarding Fox News. - 3/25/2009 1:07:54 PM   
domiguy


Posts: 12952
Joined: 5/2/2006
Status: offline 		I remember watching the way that "our" networks report the news...many times they create it.  They use tight shots to amplify the thought of there being a larger crowd on hand than what is actually present.

Love the BBC.  Saw a show where they filmed the same shots that U.S. networks were subsequently filming. It was the Iranina hostage crisis during the Carter admin.  The networks informed the protestors when they, the cameras, would be present...They made it appear that the square was full of people protesting America when in fact just around fifty people showed up and crammed into one end of the square.

Laughable.

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Profile   Post #: 84
RE: Shocking Admission regarding Fox News. - 3/25/2009 1:49:23 PM   
Mercnbeth


Posts: 11766
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quote:

ORIGINAL: domiguy

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol
quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth
I appreciate there are many who NEED to believe all that, making FOX the cause of the current effect. It must be because a more logical direction for placing blame just isn't palatable.
Either you're delusional, or just plain annoyed that people express the same amount of cynicism toward Fox that you exhibit toward the current administration. I haven't seen anybody 'blame' Fox for the crisis. Anyone with an ounce of sense knows that all these buffoons can do is sell lies to a naive (at best) audience - and now that Fox' interests are no longer represented in government, they're having a huge tantrum, that's all.

kittin,
I appreciate your need to have delusions but I have none regarding FOX for the simple reason - I don't watch it.


Then you really have nop place engaging in the debate....It would be like giving a restaurant review on a thai place that you have never been to.


In that case, I'm not qualified for any posting, since I don't watch, I read. I know reading and developing your own opinion is a lost art, but I didn't know it had become completely worthless?

I'm not "reviewing" FOX. I'm reviewing those who would like to distract from the facts by discrediting the source in this instance FOX. I apply the same credibility to any source and try to read from all of them. I don't listen or watch any of them.

Like any post from a source you don't like - don't read it. Why worry if there is any editorial slant if you have the ability to process the basic facts and generate your own slant?

I'm still waiting to be "enlightened" how the facts as presented by FOX shouldn't warrant the same vetting as if coming from any source. It's not necessary to have watched FOX to pose that question. Since there hasn't been a response to that, obviously the problem isn't with FOX its in their chosen programming rights, and marketing, that they tend to focus on being a voice of the opposition.

A free thinking unprejudiced individual willing to form his own opinion shouldn't have any problem with doing the same. All the better to become more knowledgeable and confident if in doing so - you're forced to respond to a  challenge of your position.

Watching FOX isn't required to state what I feel should be obvious. Disliking the flavor of curry I could give a 'bad restaurant review' based on my prejudicial taste; "The food sucks!" Those thinking that FOX's announcement is anything other than a marketing effort can apply the same 'review' based upon personal prejudice.

Apparently those against FOX watch it more than me. I'm not as masochistic; and wouldn't keep going to the 'Curry House' hoping for them to serve a great spaghetti sauce. It just seems silly - doesn't it? Even if I wanted it to close - I'd be better served by just ignoring it. Don't you think the same should hold for FOX?

(in reply to domiguy)
Profile   Post #: 85
RE: Shocking Admission regarding Fox News. - 3/25/2009 8:50:40 PM   
zenny


Posts: 275
Joined: 2/13/2008
Status: offline 		Look up the definition of subjective and objective. You might learn something. Then again, you'll probably question whether you can read.

Your second portion makes little sense unless you're trying to be subtle about something. Either way, it is very off base and is thusly invalid.

(in reply to philosophy)
Profile   Post #: 86
RE: Shocking Admission regarding Fox News. - 3/26/2009 12:26:48 AM   
philosophy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: zenny

Look up the definition of subjective and objective. You might learn something. Then again, you'll probably question whether you can read.

Your second portion makes little sense unless you're trying to be subtle about something. Either way, it is very off base and is thusly invalid.



.....i'm fairly sure i know the definitions of objective and subjective. Perhaps you'd like to illuminate me and other readers with whatever definition you're using.

i'm afraid i can't be held to account for your failure to understand the second portion of what i wrote earlier. Though i am curious as to why you consider subtlety to be off-base and invalid.

You may find the following article useful.....
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reality


(in reply to zenny)
Profile   Post #: 87
RE: Shocking Admission regarding Fox News. - 3/26/2009 5:19:49 AM   
rulemylife


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Joined: 8/23/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

And yes, in reality they are altering facts by injecting editorial comment into someone's speech.

The Governor's statements should have been aired unedited, with any editorial comment to follow, and be clearly defined as editorial comment.


Editorializing is free speech...remember that little part of the Constitution...As long as they do not alter the facts then they and you have the right to editorialize all you want.

If you don’t like their take don’t watch or start your own television station…others have done it.

As you have stated there are other stations that suit your political bent...so watch them.

Butch


Except there is something called journalistic integrity which, to borrow a phrase, is supposed to be fair and balanced.

News is supposed to be reported factually.

Editorials are opinions on the news.



< Message edited by rulemylife -- 3/26/2009 5:22:28 AM >

(in reply to kdsub)
Profile   Post #: 88
RE: Shocking Admission regarding Fox News. - 3/26/2009 8:14:58 AM   
kdsub


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Joined: 8/16/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

Except there is something called journalistic integrity which, to borrow a phrase, is supposed to be fair and balanced.

News is supposed to be reported factually.

Editorials are opinions on the news.




They are fair and balanced from their point of view just not yours... Damn I would hate to live in a sterile world you desire.

Enjoy the differences they make the world interesting.

Butch

< Message edited by kdsub -- 3/26/2009 8:16:10 AM >

(in reply to rulemylife)
Profile   Post #: 89
RE: Shocking Admission regarding Fox News. - 3/26/2009 10:24:49 AM   
philosophy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

They are fair and balanced from their point of view just not yours...


...you realise you've just argued against the idea that Fox is an objective news outlet?

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Profile   Post #: 90
RE: Shocking Admission regarding Fox News. - 3/26/2009 11:02:47 AM   
kdsub


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Joined: 8/16/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: philosophy

quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

They are fair and balanced from their point of view just not yours...


...you realise you've just argued against the idea that Fox is an objective news outlet?

I never said it was... I don't believe any outlet is truly objective...and that includes the BBC. All I care about… are the facts presented. I think Fox and most others do present the facts even if they editorialize them.

Why complain about one outlet when they all editorialize the news. Just because their editorializing does not match your personal viewpoint is no reason to say they are more or less objective than any other.

There has never been a time when news has been presented strictly objectively… never will be. It is up to the individual to decide what they think and believe.

I’ll guarantee you we could both pick up microphones in front of a camera and report a news story that was unfolding before our eyes and we would see things differently. Even though we would both swear we were being objective.

News outlets are no different.

Butch

(in reply to philosophy)
Profile   Post #: 91
RE: Shocking Admission regarding Fox News. - 3/26/2009 11:17:50 AM   
RealSub58


Posts: 1073
Status: offline 		Though Fox News is widely known to be biased in favor of conservatism, the network likes to claim that is “fair and balanced” and that the objectivity of the “hard news” they do is “is not in question.”

What about the other news networks claiming they are totally unbiased, fair, balanced and totally objective?  
If you believe that and can pounce on FOX for admissions it has made for years ........  then I got 18 tits that all milk chocolate. 
 
Obama is not God.  He has no redemptive abilities on our economy, he is not all powerful, all seeing and everywhere present as most seem to believe.

(in reply to VanessaChaland)
Profile   Post #: 92
RE: Shocking Admission regarding Fox News. - 3/26/2009 3:04:45 PM   
rulemylife


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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

I never said it was... I don't believe any outlet is truly objective...and that includes the BBC. All I care about… are the facts presented.



That in itself is a contradiction.

If you don't believe a news source is objective then how do you determine that what they say are facts?

(in reply to kdsub)
Profile   Post #: 93
RE: Shocking Admission regarding Fox News. - 3/26/2009 3:08:34 PM   
rulemylife


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quote:

ORIGINAL: RealSub58

Though Fox News is widely known to be biased in favor of conservatism, the network likes to claim that is “fair and balanced” and that the objectivity of the “hard news” they do is “is not in question.”

What about the other news networks claiming they are totally unbiased, fair, balanced and totally objective?  
If you believe that and can pounce on FOX for admissions it has made for years ........  then I got 18 tits that all milk chocolate. 
 
Obama is not God.  He has no redemptive abilities on our economy, he is not all powerful, all seeing and everywhere present as most seem to believe.


What does Obama have to do with Fox News or your eighteen tits?

By the way, have any pics, especially squirting that chocolate milk?

(in reply to RealSub58)
Profile   Post #: 94
RE: Shocking Admission regarding Fox News. - 3/26/2009 5:07:38 PM   
RealSub58


Posts: 1073
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: RealSub58

Though Fox News is widely known to be biased in favor of conservatism, the network likes to claim that is “fair and balanced” and that the objectivity of the “hard news” they do is “is not in question.”

What about the other news networks claiming they are totally unbiased, fair, balanced and totally objective?  
If you believe that and can pounce on FOX for admissions it has made for years ........  then I got 18 tits that all milk chocolate. 
 
Obama is not God.  He has no redemptive abilities on our economy, he is not all powerful, all seeing and everywhere present as most seem to believe.


What does Obama have to do with Fox News or your eighteen tits?

By the way, have any pics, especially squirting that chocolate milk?



But in an interview with NPR, Fox News’ Senior Vice President for Programming, Bill Shine, admitted that the network is consciously aiming to be “the voice of opposition” to the Obama administration

Obviously you did not read a word of the opening paragraph of the link that this thread is based on. 

(in reply to rulemylife)
Profile   Post #: 95
RE: Shocking Admission regarding Fox News. - 3/26/2009 5:29:49 PM   
rulemylife


Posts: 14614
Joined: 8/23/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: RealSub58

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: RealSub58

Though Fox News is widely known to be biased in favor of conservatism, the network likes to claim that is “fair and balanced” and that the objectivity of the “hard news” they do is “is not in question.”

What about the other news networks claiming they are totally unbiased, fair, balanced and totally objective?  
If you believe that and can pounce on FOX for admissions it has made for years ........  then I got 18 tits that all milk chocolate. 
 
Obama is not God.  He has no redemptive abilities on our economy, he is not all powerful, all seeing and everywhere present as most seem to believe.


What does Obama have to do with Fox News or your eighteen tits?

By the way, have any pics, especially squirting that chocolate milk?



But in an interview with NPR, Fox News’ Senior Vice President for Programming, Bill Shine, admitted that the network is consciously aiming to be “the voice of opposition” to the Obama administration

Obviously you did not read a word of the opening paragraph of the link that this thread is based on. 


No. I read it.

Just like I read your response to it.

I understood the former but was confused by the latter.

And I still want to know about the eighteen tits and chocolate milk.


(in reply to RealSub58)
Profile   Post #: 96
RE: Shocking Admission regarding Fox News. - 3/26/2009 5:35:14 PM   
subrob1967


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quote:

ORIGINAL: RealSub58
But in an interview with NPR, Fox News’ Senior Vice President for Programming, Bill Shine, admitted that the network is consciously aiming to be “the voice of opposition” to the Obama administration

Obviously you did not read a word of the opening paragraph of the link that this thread is based on. 


Why not use the full quote Ms Disingenuous?
quote:

"With this particular group of people in power right now, and the honeymoon they've had from other members of the media, does it make it a little bit easier for us to be the "voice of opposition on some issues?"


Context is everything.

(in reply to RealSub58)
Profile   Post #: 97
RE: Shocking Admission regarding Fox News. - 3/26/2009 6:10:16 PM   
kdsub


Posts: 12180
Joined: 8/16/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

I never said it was... I don't believe any outlet is truly objective...and that includes the BBC. All I care about… are the facts presented.



That in itself is a contradiction.

If you don't believe a news source is objective then how do you determine that what they say are facts?



An example;
The fact... the market crashed... then editorialize till they are blue in the face as to why.. The fact was reported.

The fact...we are spending hundreds of millions of dollars...then editorialize as to how much is too much and how is should be spent. The facts were reported

The facts... the ice sheets of the world are melting at an accelerating rate...then editorialize as to nature or man at fault. The facts were reported.

On and on…what else do you want or need... It seems you are able to form an opinion when watching the liberal outlets I think conservatives can do the same watching a conservative outlet.

That is how it works.


(in reply to rulemylife)
Profile   Post #: 98
RE: Shocking Admission regarding Fox News. - 3/27/2009 7:38:04 AM   
rulemylife


Posts: 14614
Joined: 8/23/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub


An example;
The fact... the market crashed... then editorialize till they are blue in the face as to why.. The fact was reported.

The fact...we are spending hundreds of millions of dollars...then editorialize as to how much is too much and how is should be spent. The facts were reported

The facts... the ice sheets of the world are melting at an accelerating rate...then editorialize as to nature or man at fault. The facts were reported.

On and on…what else do you want or need... It seems you are able to form an opinion when watching the liberal outlets I think conservatives can do the same watching a conservative outlet.

That is how it works.




That's not how it is supposed to work.

You're co-mingling opinion shows with factual news.

Which isn't hard to do if you watch Fox, since they provide so little factual news without opinion embedded.

(in reply to kdsub)
Profile   Post #: 99
RE: Shocking Admission regarding Fox News. - 3/27/2009 12:35:13 PM   
MasterShake69


Posts: 752
Joined: 11/30/2005
Status: offline 		Just like ABc, Nbc, Cbs, CNN, MSNBC, NYT isn't the voice of the Opposition to the obama administration ;)

Now here are some facts but liberals wouldnt believe it because they dont actually watch FOX they listen to what other liberals say about foxnews.

People like Beck, Hannity and Rush attacked George Bush as much as they supported him.

Thats because Bush wasnt a conservative on spending and supported open boarders.

You can find many articles of Ann Coulter and other conservatives attacking bush.




quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

quote:

ORIGINAL: VanessaChaland

Umm yea, we all know/knew it, they finally admit it. And yet some people still act/pretend that they are an unbiased outlet of news and "facts". :)

http://thinkprogress.org/2009/03/23/fox-vp-opposition/


Isn't it just bizarre how Fox news was NOT the voice of the opposition during the Bush administration  ?

(in reply to kittinSol)
Profile   Post #: 100
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