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RE: What submission isn't - 1/26/2006 9:57:04 AM   
HISTOABUSE


Posts: 2
Joined: 1/24/2006
Status: offline 		one other thing....under my name on the side it says vanilla...anyone know how to cahnge that to newbie????

(in reply to HISTOABUSE)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: What submission isn't - 1/26/2006 9:59:04 AM   
MHOO314


Posts: 3628
Joined: 9/26/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: HISTOABUSE

one other thing....under my name on the side it says vanilla...anyone know how to cahnge that to newbie????



It only relates to the number of posts, the more posts the higher the categories and the deeper into Ds terms

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SLUTS: Southern Ladies Under Tremendous Stress...

Mistress Hathor


(in reply to HISTOABUSE)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: What submission isn't - 1/26/2006 10:01:33 AM   
siamsa24


Posts: 2426
Joined: 2/2/2004
Status: offline 		Forum Rankings

God, this should be required reading before a person posts.......

(in reply to HISTOABUSE)
Profile   Post #: 23
RE: What submission isn't - 1/26/2006 10:17:06 AM   
IronBear


Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DragonNphoenix

I am sooooooo tired of people, usually either not in the lifestyle or in the mundane world, thinking that they know what Submission is. Submission DOES NOT mean Mousey and Weak. They dont understand how much strength is takes to be a slave. It took more backbone for me to submit then it did for me to do most anything else. I dont know about other Masters out there, but my husband (who is my Master) wants a strong slave. He would rather have to work harder at training me than to 'break my will'. We are searching for one to bring into our home and one of the things that draws us to a slave is that she has a head on her shoulders and that she can think.

Anyway.. Like I said, I would be interested in hearing what others feel about this.

1st Girl Phoenix


**Pain is just pleasure with a twist**


I agree with you fg Phoenix. Most of the strongest women I know are either subs, or slaves. My regards to your Master too please.


quote:

ORIGINAL: KittenWithaTwist

Why do you call non kinky or non BDSM people "mundane"? It's so...insulting.


Hi KWaT,

From my experience, Mundane generally is used to describe people who are not of the same lifestyle as you are in. I hear it used by the BDSM, Gorean, Pagan, SCA and other Medieval Groups here in Australia. I immagine the OP is doing the same. It is rarely intended as derogatory but rather as a convienent label

_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to DragonNphoenix)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: What submission isn't - 1/26/2006 10:50:05 AM   
MHOO314


Posts: 3628
Joined: 9/26/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: IronBear

I agree with you fg Phoenix. Most of the strongest women I know are either subs, or slaves.



hmm You haven't crossed My path.


_____________________________

SLUTS: Southern Ladies Under Tremendous Stress...

Mistress Hathor


(in reply to IronBear)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: What submission isn't - 1/26/2006 10:53:59 AM   
IronBear


Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline 		Nor you mine Hathor, however I did say Most women....

_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to MHOO314)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: What submission isn't - 1/26/2006 11:11:38 AM   
cloudboy


Posts: 7306
Joined: 12/14/2005
Status: offline
I would comment, but I'm only allowed to do what my Mistress says. I'll get back to you if I get permission.

(in reply to DragonNphoenix)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: What submission isn't - 1/26/2006 11:34:26 AM   
feline


Posts: 1101
Joined: 2/23/2004
From: CA
Status: offline
quote:

Anyway.. Like I said, I would be interested in hearing what others feel about this.


I find it amusing. If you look around here (CM forums) as well as local BDSM groups, I think you will find that you are not alone. Personally the only opinion that matters to me is my Masters. Scr*w everyone else, especially those who don't have a clue as to what they are talking about.

Have a nice day!

feline=^..^=

_____________________________

Variety is the soul of pleasure.
~Aphra Behn~

(in reply to DragonNphoenix)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: What submission isn't - 1/26/2006 12:06:30 PM   
BitaTruble


Posts: 9779
Joined: 1/12/2006
From: Texas
Status: offline
quote:

They dont understand how much strength is takes to be a slave. It took more backbone for me to submit then it did for me to do most anything else.


I think there are going to be a lot of people that don't understand why it can be such a struggle, and why we deem it as 'strength' to submit. The formative years are spent being told to be good, behave, do what we're told yadda, yadda. There comes a point, generally preteen to teen, where we begin to rebel against all that's been comfortable and familiar. We're ready to break out of the boundaries which have been set for us to discover how far we can go. We are grown, we're adults. We're free to be who and what we are ... then we say, ok.. who am I? hehe Well, the problem of course is that we're thrown, full grown into adulthood with zero in the way of life experience as adults to 'be' adults. So we explore and if we're lucky, we finally figure out that submission is what we must do to live to our full potential. So, in a sense, it's a struggle again, because everything we learned during those formative years, against which we spent so much time rebelling, have come full circle and, internally, it seems as if progress has been lost by allowing boundaries set by someone else to come back into our lives. The struggle tends to dissipate as we come to accept that it's not progress which has been lost, but that we have moved forward in life, as we should, and that we have grown into what we needed to be.

Once that happens, submission is no longer a struggle, just a way of life. Being a slave does not take strength, although it certainly may take fortitude, when we are comfortable in our own skin and embrace who we are. The icing, of course, is when we find there are others out there who also embrace who we are and who's own experiences have brought them to the point where they are a Master to our slavery.

mmm.. delicious the way some flavors mix so well together.

In the end, don't sweat the small stuff. If someone doesn't understand what it has taken for you to get to where you are, be grateful that you understand it, because there are plenty out there who are still struggling.

Celeste


_____________________________

"Oh, so it's just like
Rock, paper, scissors."

He laughed. "You are the wisest woman I know."


(in reply to DragonNphoenix)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: What submission isn't - 1/28/2006 9:23:02 AM   
ImpGrrl


Posts: 575
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth

it is this slave's opinion that submission isn't:

...inherently "easy" or "hard"

...all or nothing

...the only way to have a fulfilling relationship

...universally defined in the context of a BDSM relationship

...less than or greater than dominance

...an indicator of weakness, insecurity or mental defect


AMEN!

Slavery/submission isn't inherently *anything* other than what the participants make of it.

So, no - submission isn't inherently about meekness/weakness, but it's not inherently about *strength*, either.

Same with *any* quality.

(in reply to Mercnbeth)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: What submission isn't - 1/28/2006 10:57:39 AM   
Petruchio


Posts: 1615
Joined: 2/6/2005
Status: offline
quote:

God, this should be required reading before a person posts.......


Now siam, be nice, or we'll take one of those 4 paddles to you! (wicked smirk)

(in reply to siamsa24)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: What submission isn't - 1/28/2006 11:05:21 AM   
Petruchio


Posts: 1615
Joined: 2/6/2005
Status: offline
quote:

I think there are going to be a lot of people that don't understand why it can be such a struggle, and why we deem it as 'strength' to submit.


When I'm told how well I understand a noobee sub, I can only understand it as a wolf understands a rabbit… I can't truly internalize it.

I have come to classify subs (and slaves) as either strong and weak.

  • Strong subs/slaves know exactly what they want and deliberately choose their lifestyle.

  • Weak slaves/subs know nothing better. They have been abused and think that's their lot in life.

I love the challenge of a strong sub and I love to fulfill both our fantasies. However, weak subs I feel sorry for. If I can, I help build them up, but so often they see no light at the end of the tunnel.

(in reply to BitaTruble)
Profile   Post #: 32
RE: What submission isn't - 1/28/2006 11:22:48 AM   
KnightofMists


Posts: 7149
Joined: 7/29/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DragonNphoenix

Submission DOES NOT mean Mousey and Weak. They dont understand how much strength is takes to be a slave. It took more backbone for me to submit then it did for me to do most anything else. I dont know about other Masters out there, but my husband (who is my Master) wants a strong slave. He would rather have to work harder at training me than to 'break my will'. We are searching for one to bring into our home and one of the things that draws us to a slave is that she has a head on her shoulders and that she can think.

Anyway.. Like I said, I would be interested in hearing what others feel about this.



It seems that everyone has a different view point on what submission is and what it takes. I would agree with you whole heartedly from what you said that Submission doesn't mean mousey and weak. But, I don't agree that a slave's will is to be broken... just enslaved!

Many Dominants end up with a slave that is seeking to be cared for in all sorts of manners, they seek to have a Dominant that will bring control into their lives. Without the said Dominant, the person is out of control, they are barely functioning, there is disorder and chaos. My first thoughts of individuals like this, if you have no control upon ourself how can you give anything but that same chaos to the Dominant. With inidividuals that in this certain state, I like asking them if they consider submission to be a gift. Usually they have that view point, then I ask them what they are giving then. Chaos and disorder? If you don't have control of your life, how can you give it to anyone else, where is the gift then? For individuals like these, it is a gift of submssion. But it is the Dominant that is giving it them, thru his Dominance upon them. There is Dominants that will establish relationships with such individuals. Their submission is out of neccessity to them, it is not a gift in anyway, you must have it to give it! These same people tend to insist it is a gift, that they give obedience to the Dominant! Well, I question is it obedience? Or just an easier way. It appears to me that the Domiant is opening the door for the person to go thru the wall, without the Dominant, these individuals are intent on banging their heads on the wall to get thru. Is this obedience?, or is it just weak mindlessness following a better way.?

I believe it takes strength of character to be a functioning person. These character strengths are of a great variety from person to person. No matter if the person is Dominant or submssive in nature. Character strength is required to be true to our nature! Whatever, our nature happens to be. I believe that a person with strong character with the nature of a submissive doesn't need to have there will -broken. As a submssive natured person, they are intrinsically motivated towards their inhertant nature. However, it is strength of character involved with the relationship dynamic that will allows such vulnerability to occur. The Dominant must show the appropriate character strenghts that will earn a submissive persons release their authority to the Dominant. He is the key to the door! But, it takes the characater strenghts of the submissive person to open this unlocked door and allow the authority to flow to the Dominant. It is her consent that opens the door that has been unlocked by the Dominant. I do not see the will being broken... I see it as being En-slaved. The lock to this door is not being forced, the submissive is not being tricked or manipulated to open the door. The two come together to allow the dynamics of authority to flow between them.

< Message edited by KnightofMists -- 1/28/2006 11:28:31 AM >

_____________________________

Knight of Mists

An Optimal relationship is achieved when the individuals do what is best for themselves and their relationship.

(in reply to DragonNphoenix)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: What submission isn't - 1/28/2006 11:58:37 AM   
nonuts4thshoney


Posts: 550
Joined: 6/12/2005
From: Southern California
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DragonNphoenix

It just hurts me when people, who dont understand the lifestyle, say those things.

1st girl Phoenix


i went out with Master, Her friend and Her friends date (known as a friend for a while) one night. Now Her friend told Her date of the lifestyle we live. Her date sat in the backseat with me after picking her up at her house. She asked a little about the lifestyle. So i told her a little about it. She said these words "i wont bow down to anyone". i didn't say anything out loud, but inside i was like "i never said those words". Anywho, after dinner we went to a sex shop to look at floggers. She became excited by these. She was very curious as to how they felt. Interesting i thought. Master wanted to play around with one to see how it felt in Her hand and whacked me a couple of times with it. Of course my smile was from ear to ear. So, Masters friends date appears to be having a good time. So then as the date is almost over, all she can say to Masters friend is that she wants to be flogged and she wants a collar too. LMFAO. Yeah, uh huh

So jumping to the next day heres what we hear. Masters friends date states that i am very unhappy and that this type of relationship is abusive. "WTF" is what i'm thinking.

How did she gather that. Is it because i sat in the back seat? Is it because i asked permission to do a couple of things? Is it because Master pulls me by my O ring to smooch me on the lips? LOL!! Or could it be simple that she is ignorant?

She had to option of not going out with us that night after hearing what the events would be. She also was aware of the lifestyle we lived. Now rather than go home and read a little on the subject to gather an understanding, she was just quick to beleive this was abuse and i awas extremely unhappy. People like this arent just this way towards people in the lifestyle. They are like this with everything in their daily lives. They judge everyone and everything before having an understanding.

(in reply to DragonNphoenix)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: What submission isn't - 1/28/2006 12:28:44 PM   
DragonNphoenix


Posts: 617
Joined: 8/2/2005
Status: offline 		Thank you Knightof Mists, Sir. My Dragon helps me in ways that no one else has ever been able to. I have always been the one in control of everything until becoming his. Including being a single mother for most of 15 years. But,,, his structure brought to me an ability to let go and to take care of myself also. See... I have bi-polar disorder and had to fight most of my life to stay balanced. With the structure that he provides, I am at peace for the first time in my adult life.

1st Girl Phoenix
Most Loved of Master Dragon

(in reply to KnightofMists)
Profile   Post #: 35
RE: What submission isn't - 1/28/2006 12:40:11 PM   
DragonNphoenix


Posts: 617
Joined: 8/2/2005
Status: offline 		""So jumping to the next day heres what we hear. Masters friends date states that i am very unhappy and that this type of relationship is abusive. "WTF" is what i'm thinking. ""




I know all about this feeling. I have alot of friends that If I said the word 'slave' to them,,, they would call the police saying the My Dragon is a wife beater or some such other nonsense. Sometimes I wish they would just let us live. We also, here in Washington, we have to worry about 'unlawful imprisonment' laws. I could not stay chained or caged... it would be risking my Dragons freedom.

1st Girl Phoenix


< Message edited by DragonNphoenix -- 1/28/2006 12:42:29 PM >

(in reply to nonuts4thshoney)
Profile   Post #: 36
RE: What submission isn't - 1/28/2006 3:00:47 PM   
Petruchio


Posts: 1615
Joined: 2/6/2005
Status: offline
quote:

They judge everyone and everything before having an understanding.


Let them judge. We show tolerance back when none is shown.


(in reply to nonuts4thshoney)
Profile   Post #: 37
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