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Baggage - 4/1/2009 1:15:21 AM   
WyldHrt


Posts: 6412
Joined: 6/5/2008
Status: offline 		I often read in profiles here things like "don't bring any baggage", "want a sub with no baggage", or "deal with your own baggage".
Okies, on one level I can understand this, as it often means, "Don't contact me if you are too damaged/ disfunctional/ not ready to move on from a past relationship". I really do get that.

On another level, I have to wonder. It seems that some folks expect that potential partners have been wrapped in a sterile coating like the plastic cups you get in hotel rooms. They want a clean slate and will have nothing to do with the experiences that have made someone who they are today, but are still interested in that person... which leads me to ask....

Is baggage always a bad thing?

My own "baggage" contains the sum total of my experiences, both positive and negative. While I strive to overcome the negative stuff, it is still something I went through and part of my personal history. Does getting past it mean it no longer exists and never happened? No. Does my experience in this area color my perceptions as regards new relationships? Hell yes, but I'm working on it.

That said, a good look into my baggage also reveals acceptance, love, friendship, and a whole lot of other goodies. I cherish each and every one of these, as they also have made me who I am today. The "no baggage" folks are seriously missing out, IMO, as you really can't know someone without looking at everything they are, warts included.



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RE: Baggage - 4/1/2009 1:28:59 AM   
antipode


Posts: 1787
Joined: 4/19/2004
Status: offline
quote:

The "no baggage" folks are seriously missing out


Honestly, I am quite capable of deciding for myself where I draw the line. Or, in keeping with your theme, I could say: "Quit whining, woman, and get that divorce done". That is one of the more classical pieces of baggage, the divorce that will happen "real soon now". Not trusting me to be able to determine what I will and will not invite into my life is a serious lack of respect.

(in reply to WyldHrt)
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RE: Baggage - 4/1/2009 3:11:59 AM   
HalloweenWhite


Posts: 1028
Joined: 6/20/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: WyldHrt

I often read in profiles here things like "don't bring any baggage", "want a sub with no baggage", or "deal with your own baggage".
Okies, on one level I can understand this, as it often means, "Don't contact me if you are too damaged/ disfunctional/ not ready to move on from a past relationship". I really do get that.

On another level, I have to wonder. It seems that some folks expect that potential partners have been wrapped in a sterile coating like the plastic cups you get in hotel rooms. They want a clean slate and will have nothing to do with the experiences that have made someone who they are today, but are still interested in that person... which leads me to ask....

Is baggage always a bad thing?

My own "baggage" contains the sum total of my experiences, both positive and negative. While I strive to overcome the negative stuff, it is still something I went through and part of my personal history. Does getting past it mean it no longer exists and never happened? No. Does my experience in this area color my perceptions as regards new relationships? Hell yes, but I'm working on it.

That said, a good look into my baggage also reveals acceptance, love, friendship, and a whole lot of other goodies. I cherish each and every one of these, as they also have made me who I am today. The "no baggage" folks are seriously missing out, IMO, as you really can't know someone without looking at everything they are, warts included.




The Ones who say things like "no baggage" are unrealistic-if you've lived a life you have experiences. Some bad, some good and hey presto! thats your baggage. Sadly if you feel you've had more bad/sad things happen to you, that may have a negative impact on your interactions with other people, or you may be more cautious in another area of your life.

The reverse may be true if you remember good/happy/positive experiences.Baggage is a part of who and what W/we are upto where W/we are in O/our lives right now.

< Message edited by HalloweenWhite -- 4/1/2009 3:44:44 AM >

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RE: Baggage - 4/1/2009 3:34:32 AM   
InTonguesslave


Posts: 342
Joined: 2/6/2009
Status: offline 		baggage is an interesting thing - certainly for me i thought i had a hold on all of my baggage issues until i entered the process of Ms where all emotions are explored as you open everything up - i discovered to my horror that i have insecurities and brick walls and blockages and all sorts of stuff that have made this process something of a sky dive.

my parachute is Sir - and i have to wonder if these people are prepared to be 'there' in any capacity for their sub or slave or if what theyre looking for is uncomplicated kinky fun - thats fine of course - but i believe they should be aware that if theyre looking for deeper levels of control and a stronger understanding of their partner then in that process there is the chance that they will unearth some baggage.

few people are so fortunate that they went through an absolutely perfect childhood, adolescence and subsequent decades of interraction with every type of person that they havent at some point picked up one or two gremlins.

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RE: Baggage - 4/1/2009 4:09:57 AM   
eyesopened


Posts: 2798
Joined: 6/12/2006
From: Tampa, FL
Status: offline 		Well what do the "no baggage" folks really mean?  I think in popular context it really means "Don't come to me expecting me to fix you."  There are people so negative that they enter each relationship with the attitude of "I'm going to be as contrary and difficult as I can be unless you can, in spite of all this, break through all my barriers!"  Some folks know their limitations and do not want to step up to a challenge that is highly weighted towards failure.  It is really unfair to expect the Knight in Shining Armor to keep slaying the same dragons over and over and over again.

Interesting people have lived a full life outside a bubble and each scar has a story, some actually pretty funny.  If only people's issues came in the form of actual luggage that one could open as they were ready to explore its contents!  To me, experience equals interesting.  Open my luggage and of course there's gonna be some dirty laundry mixed among the souvenirs of my travels.

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RE: Baggage - 4/1/2009 5:15:01 AM   
ExKat


Posts: 300
Joined: 8/25/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: eyesopened

Well what do the "no baggage" folks really mean?  I think in popular context it really means "Don't come to me expecting me to fix you." 


If you take a peek at some of the submissive's profiles instead of just the dominants, you'll see a LOT of baggage. That's not always a bad thing...all of us drag around a few remnants from the crappier parts of life. However, there are a lot of women here who put forth their baggage as kind of a selling point. "I was abused as a child, so now I want you to 'rape' me, but I'll cry when you do it, so I need you to force me!" Or, of course, the ever popular, "My life is so fucked up right now. I need a dominant to lock me up in the basement so I can get away from all the bad things in my life, and oh yeah, support me financially."

Some of it is just men wanting a perfect, sterile submissive. A girl who will never cry nor form those pesky emotional attachments. However, some of it is men putting forth that they happen to be fairly well-adjusted, and they don't want some submissive straight out of the psych ward with two abusive Masters stalking her and 3 or 4 children tagging along.

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RE: Baggage - 4/1/2009 5:22:59 AM   
beargonewild


Posts: 22716
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline 		The thing is every single person has baggage. This baggage is a combination of both positive and negative experiences we all had from birth to present day. Anyone who says they are totally free of baggage is full of bullshit. It's how we have dealt with the negative baggage and learned that makes us who we are and hopefully appealing to a potential partner. Especially when we do not allow those negative experiences cloud the dynamics of a present day or future relationship. 

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RE: Baggage - 4/1/2009 5:51:59 AM   
SassySarijane


Posts: 1558
Joined: 12/20/2007
From: KC Area Missouri
Status: offline 		I usually read the "no baggage" as unrealistic in general initially, as in getting to know some of them a bit that comes out pretty strongly. They want a convenience not a relationship or person. Perfection only, good only, no bad or negatives to deal with.

That said, there are those who say "no baggage" who actually mean the baggage you haven't, don't or won't deal with and just let it control you and overwhelm you. Those who work and fight to overcome the baggage, learn lessons from what caused it, and use it to better themselves aren't included in the blanket statement to them.

As said before, everyone has baggage of one sort or another and expecting to find someone baggage-free is highly unrealistic in my opinion and experience.

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RE: Baggage - 4/1/2009 5:59:07 AM   
DomImus


Posts: 2004
Joined: 3/17/2009
Status: offline 		Experiences - good or bad - do not constitute baggage. Baggage is the lingering negative hangover from those experiences. That's why people want no part of it. If someone can't live and learn from their experiences and then put it away sometimes it's better to let them pass.

(in reply to WyldHrt)
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RE: Baggage - 4/1/2009 6:02:14 AM   
ChampagneMojito


Posts: 77
Joined: 4/8/2008
From: UK
Status: offline 		I think I'd be very boring without my baggage, both good and bad. Strenghts, insecurities and experiences make us who we are, so really we all carry something with us.

In a relationship I can't imagine not really wanting to get to know someone elses "baggage". Knowing who they are and the sum of their experiences has almost always left me with more admiration and respect for them. And from my own perspective being accepted unconditionally has given me the greatest sense of happiness and security i've ever known.

t

_____________________________

I, with a deeper instinct, choose a man who compels my strength, who makes enormous demands on me, who does not doubt my courage or my toughness, who does not believe me naïve or innocent, who has the courage to treat me like a woman. ~Anaïs Nin

(in reply to WyldHrt)
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RE: Baggage - 4/1/2009 6:02:47 AM   
OmegaG


Posts: 1474
Joined: 10/23/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: WyldHrt

I often read in profiles here things like "don't bring any baggage", "want a sub with no baggage", or "deal with your own baggage".
Okies, on one level I can understand this, as it often means, "Don't contact me if you are too damaged/ disfunctional/ not ready to move on from a past relationship". I really do get that.

On another level, I have to wonder. It seems that some folks expect that potential partners have been wrapped in a sterile coating like the plastic cups you get in hotel rooms. They want a clean slate and will have nothing to do with the experiences that have made someone who they are today, but are still interested in that person... which leads me to ask....

Is baggage always a bad thing?

My own "baggage" contains the sum total of my experiences, both positive and negative. While I strive to overcome the negative stuff, it is still something I went through and part of my personal history. Does getting past it mean it no longer exists and never happened? No. Does my experience in this area color my perceptions as regards new relationships? Hell yes, but I'm working on it.

That said, a good look into my baggage also reveals acceptance, love, friendship, and a whole lot of other goodies. I cherish each and every one of these, as they also have made me who I am today. The "no baggage" folks are seriously missing out, IMO, as you really can't know someone without looking at everything they are, warts included.




For me, it's not about having baggage, it's if the people involved have coordinating baggage.

Something I heard years ago:  Imagine that you are on your path of life and your problems are stones that you encounter along the way, you have 3 options on how to handle them, you can pick them up and throw them further down the path in front of you,- causing you to deal with them later and possible at the same time as you have to deal with others, you can pick them up and carry them, making your journey painful and hard, or you can pick  them up, examine and deal with them and chuck them off the path.

We've all had problems in our lives, we all need problems to gain expereince and become multi-deminsional.  Personally I think that if I'd had a perfect life I'd be a far less interesting person and would have less to talk and think about.  So the right baggage can enhance a person but the wrong baggage can make a person far more unattrative or combatible as a partner. (and of course what is wrong baggage to me is the right baggage for someone else.)

_____________________________


Regret for the things we did can be tempered by time; it is regret for the things we did not do that is inconsolable. Sydney J. Harris

Sex without pain is like food without taste.
- de Sade

(in reply to WyldHrt)
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RE: Baggage - 4/1/2009 6:24:28 AM   
DarkSteven


Posts: 28072
Joined: 5/2/2008
Status: offline 		Airlines limit the baggage you can take.  So why not Doms?

The more baggage she carries the more effort I must put in.  Expecting no baggage is ridiculous.  But there's a limit to how much I will accommodate.

That said, I make the decision during phone calls, chat, etc.  I have to wonder at someone who feels the need to put this in a profile.


_____________________________

"You women....

The small-breasted ones want larger breasts. The large-breasted ones want smaller ones. The straight-haired ones curl their hair, and the curly-haired ones straighten theirs...

Quit fretting. We men love you."

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RE: Baggage - 4/1/2009 6:30:00 AM   
Rainfire


Posts: 4047
Joined: 1/5/2009
Status: offline 		  "Baggage" is in the eye of the beholder. What's baggage to you might just be an experience to others. For myself, if anyone ever said "no baggage allowed", I just kept on going since I'd discovered that a lot of men considered divorced and 3 mostly grown monsters as "baggage", let alone the ex and his issues.

I knew when we got together that Lumus had what some people would call serious baggage, he calls it "drama". At times, it's massive drama but he claims it's really slowed down since he's been with me. (I joke that I'm boring and dull.) However, things keep cropping up and to me, that's just a part of life. When you care for someone, you accept all of them, baggage, drama, warts and all. Thank goodness he accepts mine!


_____________________________

"I have sold my soul to the devil for You, will You still love me when I am soiled, stained and souless in my love for You?
Or is this the beginning of the end?"
Proud member of the Clan Scarlett O'Hair

(in reply to OmegaG)
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RE: Baggage - 4/1/2009 6:37:50 AM   
DesFIP


Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline 		They're looking for barbie dolls, no limit slaves, no areas that need to be avoided or handled with care.
Doesn't matter how good your psychiatrist and therapists are, you still will have scarring from past traumatic experiences.

So expecting someone to not have any baggage means they don't want a relationship, just a booty call.

If you lost a leg in a car accident, doesn't matter how good your prosthetic is, how much you have come to grips with the situation, you still will have baggage if you're in a car with someone who drives too fast or recklessly for your comfort level. That's baggage and so is the leftover from past emotional trauma.

Besides, doesn't it really say that the person who demands their partner have no baggage actually hasn't dealt with his or her own from their past relationships? Because if they had dealt with their own baggage, they would be realistic that people don't come fresh out of the box, all blank slates.

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RE: Baggage - 4/1/2009 6:43:13 AM   
OmegaG


Posts: 1474
Joined: 10/23/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Rainfire

  "Baggage" is in the eye of the beholder. What's baggage to you might just be an experience to others. For myself, if anyone ever said "no baggage allowed", I just kept on going since I'd discovered that a lot of men considered divorced and 3 mostly grown monsters as "baggage", let alone the ex and his issues.

I knew when we got together that Lumus had what some people would call serious baggage, he calls it "drama". At times, it's massive drama but he claims it's really slowed down since he's been with me. (I joke that I'm boring and dull.) However, things keep cropping up and to me, that's just a part of life. When you care for someone, you accept all of them, baggage, drama, warts and all. Thank goodness he accepts mine!



I have learned that one cannot know the extent of anothers drama until one has been exposed to extended family and exes (especially when there are dependents).

I have dated men who despised drama but their exes and families reveled in it.  Sometimes the exes seem to look daily for reasons to call, some times they cannot accept the paradigm that their relationship is over.  I dated one guy who's mother thought that their famile structure was matriarcle(sp) and she would keep tabs on him and try to weigh in on his decision making process.  She was very beuddled at my attitude, that he could be a grown man who could tie his own shoes and everything.

_____________________________


Regret for the things we did can be tempered by time; it is regret for the things we did not do that is inconsolable. Sydney J. Harris

Sex without pain is like food without taste.
- de Sade

(in reply to Rainfire)
Profile   Post #: 15
RE: Baggage - 4/1/2009 6:53:23 AM   
GoddessTeaze


Posts: 1125
Joined: 10/14/2006
From: The Netherlands
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: WyldHrt

I often read in profiles here things like "don't bring any baggage", "want a sub with no baggage", or "deal with your own baggage".



I Yet have to run into First person who didn't have baggage,
So those people who are waiting on that green leaf? They
will become very lonely, simply because it's unrealistic.

We all have Our baggage, and it made us Into
what We are today.

No one is perfect, nor would I want someone
who is perfect, when I like the person, and thinks
that person is worth My time Love & Effort,
then I will deal with whatever comes..

Yes I've broken up with a sub,
because her baggage was too heavy for Me.
Being severe traumatised, was which made Me decide it wasn't
time for D/s she should first go into counseling.

So to Me it's an unrealistic expectation.

I wish you enough.

GoddezzT`


_____________________________

~* The only disability in life is a bad attitude. ~Scott Hamilton*~

~*Beauty is not in the face; beauty is a light in the heart. ~Kahlil Gibran*~

(in reply to WyldHrt)
Profile   Post #: 16
RE: Baggage - 4/1/2009 7:04:07 AM   
chiaThePet


Posts: 2694
Joined: 2/4/2007
Status: offline 		Well, Puff Puff, if I arrive on the doorstep and plop down my $60,1304.00 Louis Vuitton
trademark monogrammed canvas armoire trunk set, "Je suis ici ou est la toilette", I prefer
not to sense any attitude from the working class with their 'We Made Too Much.com'
mix and match clearance gone wild, complete with patch kit ensemble.

And if you let me in under fifty questions, "Oops, I ont fait pipi sur le plancher", I might
just let you peek into my $64,800 Hermes Birkin carry all for a delicious taste of my life.

Puff Puff

chia* (L'animal familier)

< Message edited by chiaThePet -- 4/1/2009 7:39:11 AM >

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You can stick me in the corner, but I'll probably just end up coloring on the walls.

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RE: Baggage - 4/1/2009 7:05:49 AM   
pixidustpet


Posts: 857
Joined: 6/4/2008
Status: offline 		~~fast reply~~

last night, TheEngineer was having a LOUD discussion on the phone with the cell phone company.  i cant deal with raised voices very well, in my experience non-consentual pain has followed.  i reacted badly....

and chose to go into another room and shut the door behind me.  i knew my reaction wasnt to him, and it was OLD BAGGAGE.  but.  i didnt whine or cry or be upset *at him* because his anger was highly justified and not directed at me or at anything i had done.  he noticed my action and acknowledged it, asked if i was ok, and we discussed it after he was off the phone.

its not so much that i have baggage.  he does too.  its how we handle it.  normally its something we think has been shrunk to shaving-kit sized and stored on a shelf in the closet, but occasionally something happens, and that PODS unit falls off the shelf and smacks us in the head, you know? 

we've tried taking it to Explosive Harry's Baggage Service (where you get a ticket when you take in your baggage, but he blows it up and you cant claim it again....this was an alt.polyamory injoke) but occasionally that stuff boomerangs instead of exploding and you keep rediscovering it.

be honest about your baggage.  try to deal with it.  old memories, and past abuse is sometimes gonna kick your ass.  "i feel sad because X reminded me of something, can i have a hug" is a much healthier response than to pick a fight and give yourself a replay of those emotions.

but that's my

kitten

(in reply to GoddessTeaze)
Profile   Post #: 18
RE: Baggage - 4/1/2009 7:29:17 AM   
CreativeDominant


Posts: 11032
Joined: 3/11/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: WyldHrt

I often read in profiles here things like "don't bring any baggage", "want a sub with no baggage", or "deal with your own baggage".
Okies, on one level I can understand this, as it often means, "Don't contact me if you are too damaged/ disfunctional/ not ready to move on from a past relationship". I really do get that.

On another level, I have to wonder. It seems that some folks expect that potential partners have been wrapped in a sterile coating like the plastic cups you get in hotel rooms. They want a clean slate and will have nothing to do with the experiences that have made someone who they are today, but are still interested in that person... which leads me to ask....

Is baggage always a bad thing? 

Interesting discussion here...it reminds me of a discussion I've had with others, including you, in that the views expressed on this vary in their qualifications as to what constitutes baggage and how much is a bad thing and how realistic is the expectation of "no baggage" and can the statement be made without qualifiers? 

On the one hand, some people want a "firm line" as to where a dominant stands on something.  Too many qualifiers regarding a statement such as "no baggage" in his/her profile comes across to some as the dominant being double-sided,, wishy-washy, etc..  A straight-forward statement of "no baggage" with no qualifiers or explanation of what that means comes across as just right to some and unrealistic to others, including myself. 

But...that baggage has to be manageable.  For me, it has to be baggage that has been dealt with in a manner that can be shown to be having a positive effect.  As someone else noted on here, there are many submissives who have extreme amounts of baggage and want someone to fix it or, as another poster who used to be on here a lot was fond of saying, "just deal with it whenever it comes out and recognize that I have "hot buttons". (more later on this point)
I have had the tendency in the past to play "white knight" and it has taken me a long time to see just how draining of myself that was...how the relationship ended up being not about us nor, in the case of D/s, about serving me but rather about serving her past.  Given that D/s can mean opening up cans of worms, any dominant who has any sense at all and who wants to delve into the inside of a submissive knows he is going to run into these worms in the form of barriers, hidden traps, etc..  How the dominant deals with it is up to each individual dominant but for me, it means giving support to the submissive if they are small issues and being supportive of her while helping her to find the more expert therapy for her issues.  I am not a therapist in my personal life...my professional life requires me to have to deal with some issues on a higher level than I care to maintain at home and even there, I have sent patients to other, more experienced and qualified professionals that I work with.

Now to get back to the buttons.  I said earlier that how the submissive has dealt with her baggage means a lot to me when considering someone.  Someone who has dealt with, or is dealing with, their baggage in a positive way means that while they may still have buttons, those buttons are there and can be pushed but it would take a pretty dumb dominant to do so.  To me...and I refer to me only here...buttons that are still "hot" years after the occurrence are areas that haveo not been dealt with OR, if dealt with were not dealt with in a positive manner.  Rocks that block the way have not been examined, analyzed and tossed to the side or behind but instead have been left in their raw, cutting, blocking state and have been carried along.  I don't want to deal with those rocks...I've dealt with my own and have either tossed them aside or have polished them and taken the sharp edges off and know them.

< Message edited by CreativeDominant -- 4/1/2009 7:31:40 AM >

(in reply to WyldHrt)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: Baggage - 4/1/2009 7:30:18 AM   
Rainfire


Posts: 4047
Joined: 1/5/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: OmegaG

I have learned that one cannot know the extent of anothers drama until one has been exposed to extended family and exes (especially when there are dependents).

I have dated men who despised drama but their exes and families reveled in it.  Sometimes the exes seem to look daily for reasons to call, some times they cannot accept the paradigm that their relationship is over.  I dated one guy who's mother thought that their famile structure was matriarcle(sp) and she would keep tabs on him and try to weigh in on his decision making process.  She was very beuddled at my attitude, that he could be a grown man who could tie his own shoes and everything.


This is very true for us, OmegaG. He warned me about situations with exes and I witnessed some of it before moving up here. One area he warned me about was his family but that's turned out to be very positive. They like me more than any of his ex's for which I am thankful. I tease Lumus that he warned me in good faith about crap that happens and I made the concious decision to still move here and be with him. And it's lived up to his warning and surpassed it. I now feel that my "baggage" is nowhere near as bad as I thought it was!

We deal with what happens together and communicate about what happens. He knows how I feel about things and we go from there. Some people might not choose to go through the things we do as too much but it's just life and this too shall pass. (Or I'll beat the crap out of the bitch....) *winks* 




_____________________________

"I have sold my soul to the devil for You, will You still love me when I am soiled, stained and souless in my love for You?
Or is this the beginning of the end?"
Proud member of the Clan Scarlett O'Hair

(in reply to OmegaG)
Profile   Post #: 20
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