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RE: Somali Pirates vow to go after American ships, kill... - 4/15/2009 12:33:15 PM

popeye1250

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quote:

ORIGINAL: scarlethiney

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

Besides, Scarlet, what Popeye describes as 'foreign aid' is no charity. No Western government 'gives' anything away purely for altruistic purposes: they get something back in return BIG time.

I agree kittin. We have created our own issues whether from exclusion, racism and refusal to see what is right in front of us as well as helped to create the same issues in other countries we "support" .

The true victims of these issues are those people who have neither the resources, basic sustenance or opportunity for any education to change those circumstances and so is it any wonder violence is an option? Here or there as you stated?
You and I can have this conversation and understand this. We don't take terrorism lightly nor do we support innocent people being killed for any reason. The solution is charity and help and education and yes it costs. Aid may one day get the people who understand this best into the position to actually do something about these issues.
Beating our chests and posturing and suggesting annihilation will only perpetuate more of the same.

scarlet

Scarlet, but wouldn't that be "interfering" in other countries?
That all sounds very altruistic but again, we're not *paying* the people in our govt to be doing those things.
That's nice that you feel that way but you should do it with your own money.
And, do you think that it's proper to chastise people who (don't) feel as you do? I mean aren't they entitled to an opinion just as you are?

("Michael row the boat ashore, halleluuuyeah.")

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Post #: 41

RE: Somali Pirates vow to go after American ships, kill... - 4/15/2009 12:33:58 PM

Cuffkinks

Posts: 1780
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quote:

ORIGINAL: SteelofUtah

I see the idea of refusing Aide to a country that isn't willing to properly police itself as a good idea.

We stop sending food until they police themselves better. Seems Fair.

Personally I feel that if there are people going hungry in our own country and we give away a single bowl of rice to another country there is something wrong with our country. Period.

I do not like seeing children starve but I find it odd that wer step out over our own to help someone else. Where is the humanity in that?

I believe that Somolia has some problems with Pirates and Drug Trades, if they aren't willing to clean that up and more Americans are harmed then as an American I believe it is our responsibility and our duty to discontinue all aide to that country until that contry agrees to make the practice of Piracy so undesirable that it no longer happens.

Steel

Exactly what I was thinking, almost to the letter.
Dude, get out of my head!

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Post #: 42

RE: Somali Pirates vow to go after American ships, kill... - 4/15/2009 12:36:46 PM

slaveboyforyou

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From: Arkansas, U.S.A.
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quote:

By the way Popeye just when did systematic starvation take root in America,where exactly are these starving Ameican villiages located?

Have you ever been to West Virginia, Mike? How about the Mississippi Delta region? I was born in West Virginia; I spent my summers there as a child. I could take you places in the back of hollows there that would take your breath away. The poverty is rampant; it looks like a third world country in many areas. The Mississippi Delta is a few hours drive from me. Again, the poverty is unbelievable. Jobs are non-existant, medical care is scarce, and I've seen entire families crammed into homes that I wouldn't use as a tool shed.

(in reply to slvemike4u)

Post #: 43

RE: Somali Pirates vow to go after American ships, kill... - 4/15/2009 12:38:11 PM

popeye1250

Posts: 18104
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From: New Hampshire
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quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

Besides, Scarlet, what Popeye describes as 'foreign aid' is no charity. No Western government 'gives' anything away purely for altruistic purposes: they get something back in return BIG time.

Kittin, we do? You're partially right there, we are ten trillion in debt (partially) because of all this foreign aid nonsense.
What have we gotten for fifty years of foreign aid? Most of the world "hates" us, well, I guess that's "something."

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Post #: 44

RE: Somali Pirates vow to go after American ships, kill... - 4/15/2009 12:38:16 PM

slvemike4u

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Where does the idea emanate from that entitled equates to given a pass for.You posted some rather inflammatory suggestions namely carpet bombing and cutting off all humanitarian aid...you had to know some were going to call you on that....didn't you?

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Post #: 45

RE: Somali Pirates vow to go after American ships, kill... - 4/15/2009 12:39:04 PM

mcbride

Posts: 333
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quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

And why are we giving countries like Somalia and Ethiopia "food aid?"
Fuck em, let them starve.

How many miles away do dying children have to be, Popeye, before you allow your government to actually toss them a bag of grain at them, or before you'd "feel good" about feeding them? A thousand? Five? Does this only apply to "foreign" children?

(in reply to popeye1250)

Post #: 46

RE: Somali Pirates vow to go after American ships, kill... - 4/15/2009 12:40:28 PM

kittinSol

Posts: 16926
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quote:

ORIGINAL: N4SDChastity

Every international conflict has a "tipping" point, where the general consensus is: Let's just kill them. Those pirates are moving towards that point, IMHO.

No. Ships can take other routes until a solution is found. But it all boils down to the economics, doesn't it?

< Message edited by kittinSol -- 4/15/2009 12:44:06 PM >

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Post #: 47

RE: Somali Pirates vow to go after American ships, kill... - 4/15/2009 12:42:31 PM

slvemike4u

Posts: 17896
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quote:

ORIGINAL: slaveboyforyou

quote:

By the way Popeye just when did systematic starvation take root in America,where exactly are these starving Ameican villiages located?

Have you ever been to West Virginia, Mike? How about the Mississippi Delta region? I was born in West Virginia; I spent my summers there as a child. I could take you places in the back of hollows there that would take your breath away. The poverty is rampant; it looks like a third world country in many areas. The Mississippi Delta is a few hours drive from me. Again, the poverty is unbelievable. Jobs are non-existant, medical care is scarce, and I've seen entire families crammed into homes that I wouldn't use as a tool shed.

And where did I say poverty doesn't exist in America slaveboy,care to read it again ?....I mentioned systemic starvation,are you claiming this exists in America? I mentioned starving American villiages,are you claiming knowledge of such places? Poverty and hunger are a few steps removed from starvation slaveboy...and the fact that you don't know the difference speaks to its absence.,

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4

(in reply to slaveboyforyou)

Post #: 48

RE: Somali Pirates vow to go after American ships, kill... - 4/15/2009 12:43:41 PM

N4SDChastity

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quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

quote:

ORIGINAL: N4SDChastity

Every international conflict has a "tipping" point, where the general consensus is: Let's just kill them. Those pirates are moving towards that point, IMHO.

No. Ships can take other routes until there a solution is found. But it all boils down to the economics, doesn't it?

And, the economics of the situation dictate that, sooner, rather than later, the general consensus WILL be: Fukit... Killem!!!

(in reply to kittinSol)

Post #: 49

RE: Somali Pirates vow to go after American ships, kill... - 4/15/2009 12:46:36 PM

kittinSol

Posts: 16926
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quote:

ORIGINAL: N4SDChastity

And, the economics of the situation dictate that, sooner, rather than later, the general consensus WILL be: Fukit... Killem!!!

Really? And you have decided that in which capacity?

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Post #: 50

RE: Somali Pirates vow to go after American ships, kill... - 4/15/2009 12:49:13 PM

scarlethiney

Posts: 492
Joined: 8/22/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

quote:

ORIGINAL: scarlethiney

In theory Steel I understand what your saying. We have to do something to stop this terrorism.
The problem is the people who most need this assistance are not the people who are in a position to stop the terrorism or to do anything about it. Penalizing the government by withholding help won't change anything. It will just ensure more who desperately need our help die.
Charity should begin at home and we are doing a poor job of helping our own. That does not mean we should also give up on helping others.

Scarlet, most of the world is poor.
The U.S. is now a poor country, we're $10Trillion in debt.
Our govt. shouldn't be in the "foreign charity" business, it's not their job.
It's funny but many of the people who advocate helping people in foreign countries can't seem to "find their checkbooks" if they're asked for a donation, they expect "the govt" to do it and then the crooks in Washington make billions from it.
The U.S. govt is beholden to The People of this country and *no-one* else.
It doesn't make any sense to feed people in third world countries so that thay can overpopulate and become even more miserable and blame first world countries for their misery and spawn more terrorists and pirates.
At a certain point you can't feed all of them anymore and they'll die anyway.
How is it "humanitarian" to do that to a country?
In the wild when one animal preys on another they say not to interfere with nature.

Popeye, we are not animals and this isn't nature. We are supposed to be human beings with higher intelligence, compassion and a sense of what is right. Actually animals have more of sense of compassion and what is right than we do. They are not wasteful nor are they vindictive.

I know you feel very strongly about what you are stating.
I completely disagree.
We cannot afford to have an attitude that continues to exclude, ignore and fail to support basic human needs here in our own country and abroad. That only promotes poverty.

scarlet

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Post #: 51

RE: Somali Pirates vow to go after American ships, kill... - 4/15/2009 12:50:14 PM

SteelofUtah

Posts: 5307
Joined: 10/2/2007
From: St George Utah
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quote:

ORIGINAL: mcbride

quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

And why are we giving countries like Somalia and Ethiopia "food aid?"
Fuck em, let them starve.

How many miles away do dying children have to be, Popeye, before you allow your government to actually toss them a bag of grain at them, or before you'd "feel good" about feeding them? A thousand? Five? Does this only apply to "foreign" children?

mcbride,

it is this kind of thinking that causes most of the issues. We are not talking a few bags of grain, with monetary help and food help BILLIONS of dollars each and every year are spent to feed mambers of a government that do nothing to properly persecute Piracy. Meanwhile in America they just cut Daily Meal Support for Needy Families from 5 days a week to 4, Most Freshman and Sophmore Sports Programs have been cut, Band and Orchestra Grants are gone so there aren't instruments to be loaned out.

When I see a child in a school cafeteria without a Meal I actually get angry that we are still sending aide to foreign countires and cutting the Budget for what stays here in our own.

Someone Please tell me how this makes even the littlest bit of sense? When was the last Foreign Aide Budget Cut you saw?

Seriously If you are American Open your eyes to your own children and stop looking at the ones that one day could grow up and try to hold you hostage for 2 million dollars? Then say they will start killing Americans as they happen upon them regardless of purpose.

Stop Stepping over your own countrymen to save some third world, we are getting REALLY close Broke, I think you need to bring in the Eyeballs to see what is going on here at home and then if you really wanna help out over there..... Join a Church and go on a Mission.

Steel

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Post #: 52

RE: Somali Pirates vow to go after American ships, kill... - 4/15/2009 12:54:11 PM

kittinSol

Posts: 16926
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Foreign aid isn't a blank check drawn out to a foreign country's bank. If only it were that simple.

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Post #: 53

RE: Somali Pirates vow to go after American ships, kill... - 4/15/2009 12:54:31 PM

popeye1250

Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline

Panda, I'd like to send some "sympathisers" over to Somalia or Ethiopia for a little "vacation."
"Hey! You just won a 30 day trip to Somalia!" "All expenses paid!" "Start packing you leave tommorow afternoon!"
"What! Wait, wait, Ahh, ahh, I dunno."
I bet they'd be singing a differant tune after they *interacted* with the poor and downtrodden then!
Ya Think?

_____________________________

"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

(in reply to slvemike4u)

Post #: 54

RE: Somali Pirates vow to go after American ships, kill... - 4/15/2009 12:57:00 PM

scarlethiney

Posts: 492
Joined: 8/22/2008
Status: offline

Popeye are you feeling chastised? I'm merely stating my view just as you are. I have already stated that I don't agree with you and its obvious you don't agree with or like my sentiments.
Such is life. I think we will both survive this...... that is unless I decide to sunbathe on off the coast of Somalia when you plan to carpet bomb it.

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Post #: 55

RE: Somali Pirates vow to go after American ships, kill... - 4/15/2009 12:58:16 PM

kittinSol

Posts: 16926
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Popeye, you are ignorant: I don't know whether this is deliberate, or accidental, but you can do something about it. I advise you to take a little trip over there to see for yourself: in the meantime, you're just posturing and making a lot of noise for nothing.

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Post #: 56

RE: Somali Pirates vow to go after American ships, kill... - 4/15/2009 1:01:27 PM

popeye1250

Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

Foreign aid isn't a blank check drawn out to a foreign country's bank. If only it were that simple.

Oh? Did you hear about that African "King" last summer and his $2 million birthday party?
Flew his wives to London in a private jet to go shopping to the tune of $500k. (It was on Yahoo News)
And there's dozens of stories like that!
I'm very well aware of how "foreign aid" works. I was in the military for 14 years.
The whole thing stinks to high heaven and it's ***loaded*** with corruption. Many people and cos. have gotten rich off of it.
Congressmen and senators vote for various "projects" and the next month a check for $1m is received by the Democratic or Republican national committees.

< Message edited by popeye1250 -- 4/15/2009 1:02:32 PM >

_____________________________

"But Your Honor, this is not a Jury of my Peers, these people are all decent, honest, law-abiding citizens!"

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Post #: 57

RE: Somali Pirates vow to go after American ships, kill... - 4/15/2009 1:01:41 PM

N4SDChastity

Posts: 327
Joined: 2/27/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

quote:

ORIGINAL: N4SDChastity

And, the economics of the situation dictate that, sooner, rather than later, the general consensus WILL be: Fukit... Killem!!!

Really? And you have decided that in which capacity?

In my capacity as one who pays attention to the world, in general.

Understand, I am not *directing* this; it is NOT MY decision, I am just voicing my OPINION that, sooner rather than later, the powers that be will tire of the situation and escalate the engagements to the point where shooting back, or even FIRST is much cheaper than paying millions in ransom and/or millions in insurance claims to the families of teh merchantmen and/or millions in reparations to the families of the merchantmen.

You would do well to ramp down your righteous indignation toward ME. I ain't your enemy, lady, but I ain't scerrrr'd of you, either. Not in the interwebs, and not in reality. It is an OPEN fourm. I can speak (or type) my mind, as can you. I did nothing to impune YOUR authority to spout your bleeding-heart liberal position. Allow me my left-wing militarism, THANK YOU!

PEOPLE WHO SEEK TO DELIBERATELY HARM OTHERS DESERVE TO HAVE GRIEF VISITED UPON THEM, PERIOD!!! On teh high seas. In teh inner-cities. In the rural backwoods. EVERYWHERE. As long as they leave ME alone, I will do nothing to bring that to them, unless directed to by Presidential authority. Similarly, if their actions bring them harm or ruination, I will not shed a tear. They made their choices in life, I have made mine.

(in reply to kittinSol)

Post #: 58

RE: Somali Pirates vow to go after American ships, kill... - 4/15/2009 1:04:17 PM

Kirata

Posts: 15477
Joined: 2/11/2006
From: USA
Status: offline

Hello kittin,

Maybe this will help...

Somalia: You Are Being Lied to About Pirates

K.

< Message edited by Kirata -- 4/15/2009 1:06:15 PM >

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Post #: 59

RE: Somali Pirates vow to go after American ships, kill... - 4/15/2009 1:05:59 PM

N4SDChastity

Posts: 327
Joined: 2/27/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

Popeye, you are ignorant: I don't know whether this is deliberate, or accidental, but you can do something about it. I advise you to take a little trip over there to see for yourself: in the meantime, you're just posturing and making a lot of noise for nothing.

You, of course, are speaking from the perspective of YOUR many, many trips to Mogadishu and Djibouti. Care to share your pics with us? Name a choice hotel, or two, upon which to center our trip? How far out of your home town, wherever that may happen to be, do you travel, regularly, I ask?

(in reply to kittinSol)

Post #: 60

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