RE: Why force poly?

RE: Why force poly? (Full Version)

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Eigenaar -> RE: Why force poly? (4/19/2009 6:24:15 AM)
What is happening here is that the messenger is blamed for the news, or if this would be easier to understand the grey hen is picked on by the whites. I have not read one argument that gives my words less meaning. And YoungBlondSlave, we are not only discussing your one hard limit here. About the definition of ''lesbian'', you can all have a laugh when you want but I took it out of a dictionary and thought it is common knowledge gay people also share beds with those who are not gay. I read books yes, I never heard of a law about not reading books. They can broaden your horizon as real life can.

catize -> RE: Why force poly? (4/19/2009 6:30:14 AM)
quote: . You call yourself a slave. A slave has no choice and no say and no hard limits. Your logic is flawed. If, as you say, a slave has no choice, then she/he must submit to any dominant that comes along. One is poly and the other is monogamous. Do you have any suggestions about how that would possibly be done? quote: The reactions I read astound me. A slave does not decide about poly. Your expectations do not seem to take into account the reality that anyone forced to live unhappily will soon be gone. You don’t seem able to accept that the slave/submissive is a person. How’s that working for you? quote: I even would not call such a person submissive, let alone slave. If one wants to have hard limits as '' no poly'' one should list as submissive and not slave. Whether I identify as submissive or slave is irrelevant. If I am not yet in a relationship, if I have not yet agreed to submit to a dominant or master, I have not only the right, but the responsibility to make thoughtful and wise decisions.

sirsholly -> RE: Why force poly? (4/19/2009 6:33:41 AM)
quote: About the definition of ''lesbian'', you can all have a laugh when you want but I took it out of a dictionary and thought it is common knowledge gay people also share beds with those who are not gay. [8\|] tell ya what, cupcake. You go up to the next Lesbian you meet and tell her the real true definition of her sexuality that you read in a dictionary. If she is not rolling around in the sack with men, you need to pitch a fit, stomp yer feet and tell her she is just plain wrong!! Dictionaries do not lie!! In fact...get yourself one of those little pocket Websters dictionaries so you can pull it out and show her..in black and white..just how misinformed she is!! Then pleeeeeeze report back here. I am dying to know the response you get.

SassySarijane -> RE: Why force poly? (4/19/2009 6:48:55 AM)
~Fast Reply~ Why beat your heads against a brick wall? Oh wait......there are masochists here....nevermind. Eigenaar won't get it until he gets experience offline (if then). Right now it seems he is stuck on the one true way thing and cookie cutter type thing and hasn't learned yet that there is no one true way in this but rather that it is what works for those in the relationship. Not every dominant is a match for every submissive or slave. We are not cookie cutter, one size fits all things. We are individuals with individual needs, wants and desires and we look for those who match best with us. Some like poly some don't. That has nothing to do with whether or not someone is a slave and I dare him to tell a dominant that his/her slave isn't actually a slave because they don't fit his particular beliefs on what a slave is. Online and reading books, porn/erotic and nonfiction are so not the same as r/t experience.

DarkSteven -> RE: Why force poly? (4/19/2009 6:55:22 AM)
Eigenaar, your viewpoint is one I have heard before, at the more extreme end of the spectrum, which is that a slave has only the right to leave his or her Master.Mistress, and no other rights. There is more than one way to view what a slave is, though, as opposed to a sub. The dividing line between them is not set in stone and I suspect may be different for each. I request that you show others tolerance for their views. And I request to all others that you consider - he is new, and he could stand to learn. As indeed all of us could.

sirsholly -> RE: Why force poly? (4/19/2009 6:59:27 AM)
listen hon...try looking at it like this. A Master/slave relationship is a RELATIONSHIP prior to it being anything else. Two people meet. Phone numbers are exchanged. They talk, exchange personal info, talk about their lives, jobs, etc. They meet for dinner and drinks...they are doing the same thing a vanilla couple does. They decide in their own minds if they want to see each other again. They discuss their likes, dislikes, limits, etc. Then....EACH of them decides if they want to enter into a relationship. The slave has as much to say as the Master. He, for his part, enters into the relationship knowing and ACCEPTING that the slave has certain limits. They accept each other...accept each others limits. And those limits WILL be honored and respected throughout the relationship.

RavenMuse -> RE: Why force poly? (4/19/2009 7:02:05 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DarkSteven Eigenaar, your viewpoint is one I have heard before, at the more extreme end of the spectrum, which is that a slave has only the right to leave his or her Master.Mistress, and no other rights. That is actualy MY PoV, the way My household runs and what metalmiss lives under. her ONLY right is to remove submission and walk away. HOWEVER before she submitted that was not the case, if she had not found compatability with what I offer and had not found reason to trust in Me and My decision making then she would have been stupid to submit.... likewise if I had seen and obvious incompatabilitys I'd have been stupid to accept her submission. Don't paint all those with the TPE PoV with the same brush as some fantasist who seems to believe that is a girl doesn't do what any wankstain with a capitalised name says then they are somehow not a slave.

SassySarijane -> RE: Why force poly? (4/19/2009 7:23:13 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DarkSteven And I request to all others that you consider - he is new, and he could stand to learn. As indeed all of us could. I don't think some of the less nice remarks had anything to do with him being new, but rather with the attitude he portrayed especially when others tried to explain to him that it is not all one size fits all, one way only to do this. I recently met a new dominant and instead of spouting from what he'd read and from online and how it was that way only and no other way or beliefs were valid, he talked of what he'd experienced online and read; and asked questions and asked for help in learning more. It's in the attitude, not how much or little experience someone has, as to the replies they will get.

NihilusZero -> RE: Why force poly? (4/19/2009 8:21:18 AM)
The differences between prerequisites and hard limits may be subtle, but there are differences.

YoungBlondeSlave -> RE: Why force poly? (4/19/2009 8:23:04 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Eigenaar You know what, I will not conform to your namecalling logic and will give this thread back to you and let you think about why a dominant person can be so stupid to mention he is poly when contacting a slave. I am too stupid to make a remark on this, obviously. You can stick to that a slave can control the master in his domination and decide for a dissident he is new and has a lot to learn and adept to your opinion instead of argumented facts. What's stupid about mentioning that? Why should it not be mentioned?

lizi -> RE: Why force poly? (4/19/2009 8:29:21 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Eigenaar About the definition of ''lesbian'', you can all have a laugh when you want but I took it out of a dictionary and thought it is common knowledge gay people also share beds with those who are not gay. I read books yes, I never heard of a law about not reading books. They can broaden your horizon as real life can. First of all you did not take this definition for lesbian out of a dictionary. According to Webster's New World College Dictionary a lesbian is "a homosexual woman" or "a native of Lesbos". At no time does the dictionary say that a lesbian "only means one prefers females over males but has sex with both in general" -which is what you said in an earlier post. Webster's goes on to define homosexual as "being characterized by sexual desire for those of the same sex as oneself." Secondly, believing that it is common knowledge that gay people share beds with those who are not gay is very narrow minded. I was not aware of this common knowledge. Thirdly, your comment about reading books being connected somehow to making generalized and false assumptions about the gay community is interesting.

sweetgirlseeks -> RE: Why force poly? (4/19/2009 8:57:00 AM)
I actually kind of agree that a girl coming in with lots of limits should not be calling herself a slave. But I also understand the compatibility issue. So let me ask this.... hypothetically... Girl X lists herself as a submissive with 'poly' limits. Girl Y lists herself as a slave with 'poly' limits. What's the difference between girl x and girl y? Both are trusting the Dom whom they submit to, not to push the poly issue. ~sgs

RavenMuse -> RE: Why force poly? (4/19/2009 9:02:10 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: sweetgirlseeks So let me ask this.... hypothetically... Girl X lists herself as a submissive with 'poly' limits. Girl Y lists herself as a slave with 'poly' limits. What's the difference between girl x and girl y? Both are trusting the Dom whom they submit to, not to push the poly issue. ~sgs Wrong question. The difference is that when each of those two girls finds a compatable Master and submits... the submissive is only giving negotiated parts of herself, anything outside of those areas are not His to control. The slave however seeks a compatable Master and gives ALL of herself, the compatability meaning she needs no limits because she is safe within HIS, there is no part of her life He can't change or control no negotiation, no horse trading, just Ownership.

YoungBlondeSlave -> RE: Why force poly? (4/19/2009 9:47:01 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: sweetgirlseeks I actually kind of agree that a girl coming in with lots of limits should not be calling herself a slave. WTF?!?! When did this become about lots of limits, dammit. This is about one effing limit. Poly. Jeez!!!

sweetgirlseeks -> RE: Why force poly? (4/19/2009 10:00:59 AM)
Hello RavenMuse, okay... i think i get it. The sub with limits holds onto guarding those, she doesn't turn that area over to her dom's control... she keeps the job of being the gatekeeper. The slave with limits, after discussing those with a potential Master, when submitting to Him, let's go of it and doesn't worry about it anymore... she does turn that over to her Master's control... and He becomes the gatekeeper. I think that's it. That makes sense. The slave entrusts all, the sub does not. Thank you ~sgs

sweetgirlseeks -> RE: Why force poly? (4/19/2009 10:03:42 AM)
Hi YoungBlondeSlave, My statement was just a general statement... and had nothing to do with you. Sorry you took it that way. ~sgs

IronBear -> RE: Why force poly? (4/19/2009 10:15:37 AM)
Whilst I'll ne're get into a debate about slaves v submissives or slaves having limits etc, other that to say that those of us (Masters and Mistresses) who are and have been in the M's dynamic 24/7 TPE do have clear prerequisites of what we demand in a slave and know pretty well what a slave expects from us. This is even more so for those like myself have been and are in the extreme category of Masters and Mistresses. However my view regarding these "Masters" who try to force you into poly after you have said NO, is to ask what part of N..O.. do they not understand? Is it the N for No, or is it the O for Ouch when you kick them in their balls for being stupid? Don't waste time with them lass you have read what many haver said. mayhap some time down the track when you meet the Dominant who is better suited for you, you may consider poly if the question arises and then with the right bloke perhaps the matter will, never come up.

Eigenaar -> RE: Why force poly? (4/19/2009 10:25:31 AM)
I looked in a Dutch dictionary and it confirms what Eigenaar says. He did not type that it says lesbians have sex with hetero persons as far as I can see but it is true that all gay people I know had hetero sex partners sooner or later :) And to RavenMuse: Isn't the difference you make between the sub and the slave exactly what Eigenaar typed? S

RavenMuse -> RE: Why force poly? (4/19/2009 10:28:01 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: sweetgirlseeks The slave with limits, after discussing those with a potential Master, when submitting to Him, let's go of it and doesn't worry about it anymore... she does turn that over to her Master's control... and He becomes the gatekeeper. I think that's it. That makes sense. The slave entrusts all, the sub does not. A slave simply seeks a Master who's limits avoid her taking harm. Such as in this case, the girl knows Poly would screw her up emotionaly so see wouldn't be compatable wit a Poly Master, but she is compatable with a Master who is Mono. A sub decides her own limits, which can be anything from it would harm her to she simply dislikes it, she only hands over what she wants to or will horse trade "Well if you want that I guess I could but you don't like this which is something I want, We have both or neither, deal?" Hence I don't bother much with subs, I offer what I offer they are either compatable or not.

RavenMuse -> RE: Why force poly? (4/19/2009 10:30:08 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Eigenaar I looked in a Dutch dictionary and it confirms what Eigenaar says. He did not type that it says lesbians have sex with hetero persons as far as I can see but it is true that all gay people I know had hetero sex partners sooner or later :) And to RavenMuse: Isn't the difference you make between the sub and the slave exactly what Eigenaar typed? S Talking about yourself in the third person? odd boy! And NO it isn't the same but you'd need a brain to see the difference. A non-compatable girl is under no compulsion to submit to Me, nor would I want her to!

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