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RE: Turning the numbers - 5/11/2009 7:41:38 PM   
LadyPact


Posts: 32566
Status: offline 		Stella, I was wondering when you would show up as well.

My question to you would be, wouldn't you, of all people, see the kink of crossdressing much different than being transgendered?


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Profile   Post #: 61
RE: Turning the numbers - 5/11/2009 7:57:10 PM   
SlaveBlutarsky


Posts: 491
Joined: 10/10/2005
From: Upstate, NY
Status: offline 		What a crappy thread. As a single, unattached, submissive male who isn't into cross dressing/feminization this thread is actually giving me hope. The last thing I need :)

Cross dressing/sissy stuff is something I have no interest in. I think it's one of those things I'd do if ordered to and would get enjoyment out of if the woman I was serving was obviously into it, but I could spend the rest of my life never losing my makeup/stocking/dress/heel wearing virginity.

I had an ex who used to threaten dressing me up all the time but never did. I think she just did that to see me roll my eyes so she'd have reason to slap me.


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Profile   Post #: 62
RE: Turning the numbers - 5/11/2009 8:01:57 PM   
LadyPact


Posts: 32566
Status: offline 		Hey there now!  I do not start crappy threads.  Don't you realize that, as a Dominant female, I only provide material that is thought provoking and interesting?  

_____________________________

The crowned Diva of Destruction. ~ ExT

Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

Please do not send me email here. Unless I know you, I will delete the email unread

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Profile   Post #: 63
RE: Turning the numbers - 5/11/2009 8:29:28 PM   
LadyHibiscus


Posts: 27124
Joined: 8/15/2005
From: Island Of Misfit Toys
Status: offline 		Lady C really did answer a lot of the question! 

First of all I want to point out that when I am talking about CD's here, I am NOT referring to anyone in transition, or thinking about it!  Just your garden variety pervs. 

To me, crossdressing has to be the most harmless and common fetish there is.  Because the outsider me thinks that.... it's gotta be subversive as hell!  lol   Because of that, I think that many women dismiss it out of hand as something they are grossed out by.  Who wants their mister to be all prissy, right?  So, the wife is not likely to be all over sharing her lipstick and lingerie.   Also, I think there is some notion that CD = gay, when that is pretty far from the truth.  

Now, I will offer up some Bad Things.  Please note that I am not dissing anyone for their kink, or saying EVERY crossdresser is this way.  Many are not.  But... based on my clientele, my former slave, and the men who frequented the crossdressing salon that  a friend of mine owned, dealing with crossdressers is very labor intensive and not very satisfactory for the dominant.   Really CD = VERY HIGH MAINTENANCE.  There is an awful lot of the "oh I'm so pretty, look at me" going on, and not much going toward the domina---and I am not talking about money, but about attention, energy, and feedback.   Also, more stress on the persona and the outfit---don't mess up my hair!---which makes playing problematic.    Need I mention that many of these guys are NOT in the zone of the pretty?  They sure think they are, though!!  Dressing is some kind of ego thing for them, I guess...  therefore, endless hunts at the thrift stores for stuff that will fit them.    Eeep, there is one over in Ontario that has seen every domina in Detroit, I swear~  he brags about how much he spends on outfits, but do you think he can so much as bring the lady a candy bar?  NOPE!    He has these creeeeepy faux breasts, too...  

Anyway.  That is, honestly, the experience I and many of my have of the heterosexual male crossdressing fetishists.  It's unfortunate, because the amazing ones really ARE amazing.   I met a sissy maid at the Calibirthday last year that is probably the best one I have EVER met.  Just an incredible servant, and NOT all about his clothes!  (He was quite charming, with kind of a marseilles-sailor-in-a-musical look. )   One of my pro clients was a total sweetheart, just wonderful to hang out with, kind of a "Glen or Glenda" type.   Married, of course.   Miss Tannifee, cute as a button, a doting dad in "vanilla" life.  Desiree,  lousy at cleaning, but sincere.   There's more out there.  I have one incredibly kind and patient friend who enjoys working with sissy maids, but she is a rarity. 

As you can see from my earlier paragraph, I don't have fabulous memories of working with CD's.    It's a very deep seated fetish,  and honestly, I think it is one that wants witnessing, rather than participation.  


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Profile   Post #: 64
RE: Turning the numbers - 5/11/2009 8:41:30 PM   
ShaktiSama


Posts: 1674
Joined: 8/13/2007
Status: offline 		I will guiltily admit that LadyH makes a good point; I'm not much interested in photographing t-girls who aren't "attractive" in my eyes.  One of my favorite models was quite the star on the webcam circuit, and had quite a number of "tribute slaves" who sent her specially made lingerie and what-not for her to wear while posing and playing.  The other was a showgirl in a drag club--six foot four without the heels, and quite the tower o' power once you had her in the shoes, corset and wig!

I had no problem playing with their exhibitionism, since I enjoy being a voyeur, but I could not have done that for a man who could not achieve a certain amount of real glamour.  And in the case of Sabrina, the eerie eroticism that only someone simultaneously masculine and feminine can achieve...most of the men I see trying to pull off a female persona here on CM are doing it very badly.  Some of these gentlemen need to go out and invest in a stack of books and magazines directed at younger teenage girls, and read them with both eyes peeled.  It takes real study and effort to be glamourous and femme--this shite doesn't happen by accident! 

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Profile   Post #: 65
RE: Turning the numbers - 5/11/2009 8:47:50 PM   
LadyHibiscus


Posts: 27124
Joined: 8/15/2005
From: Island Of Misfit Toys
Status: offline 		I adore drag queens!  That sense of inner fabulousness and exhibitionism has always appealed to me.

On a parallel topic, I have the greatest respect for transgendered women who are NOT the figure of beauty.  It takes a tremendous amount of courage to be an unattractive woman. 

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Profile   Post #: 66
RE: Turning the numbers - 5/11/2009 9:14:15 PM   
SlaveBlutarsky


Posts: 491
Joined: 10/10/2005
From: Upstate, NY
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

Hey there now!  I do not start crappy threads.  Don't you realize that, as a Dominant female, I only provide material that is thought provoking and interesting?  


Yes LadyPact, you only start the most thought provoking of threads, I apologize for suggesting anything other than that

It actually is an interesting thread. It's kind of scary that someone can rationalize a way to cheat on someone by throwing a dress on, but hey, to each their own.


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Profile   Post #: 67
RE: Turning the numbers - 5/11/2009 9:47:35 PM   
stella41b


Posts: 4258
Joined: 10/16/2007
From: SW London (UK)
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

Stella, I was wondering when you would show up as well.

My question to you would be, wouldn't you, of all people, see the kink of crossdressing much different than being transgendered?



There is a difference, it's a different gender for one, totally different motivation and thinking, but it still falls under the umbrella of transgendered. However crossdressers share one characteristic with transsexual females in that they are highly individual and also one need and that is a need for acceptance of them as their whole person.

Crossdressers accept themselves as male, but often perceive themselves as having a feminine side or even a feminine nature which they feel they need to express to some degree.

It is different, but crossdressers (together with transvestites) carry the same stigma socially and face the same issues as people like me, with the same lack of acceptance and understanding from a lot of people.

However I can empathize and see things from their perspective, and my input into this thread is hopefully to provide some opportunity for those who aren't transgendered and who don't crossdress to maybe understand and see things from a different perspective. It's not just about the clothes and make up, wigs and heels, but it's also about feelings, thoughts, mindsets and a fair amount of psychology.

However the people I just cannot for the life of me get my head around or even begin to understand are the guys who clearly aren't crossdressers who will offer to crossdress for you. I mean, why? They will even advertise themselves as crossdressers or 'panty wearers' in the mistaken belief it will win them favour, when all it actually communicates is a really desperate guy.

< Message edited by stella41b -- 5/11/2009 9:48:39 PM >

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Profile   Post #: 68
RE: Turning the numbers - 5/11/2009 10:01:59 PM   
LadyPact


Posts: 32566
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SlaveBlutarsky

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

Hey there now!  I do not start crappy threads.  Don't you realize that, as a Dominant female, I only provide material that is thought provoking and interesting?  


Yes LadyPact, you only start the most thought provoking of threads, I apologize for suggesting anything other than that

It actually is an interesting thread. It's kind of scary that someone can rationalize a way to cheat on someone by throwing a dress on, but hey, to each their own.



Eye rolling?  At Me????  I know you're kidding. 


_____________________________

The crowned Diva of Destruction. ~ ExT

Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

Please do not send me email here. Unless I know you, I will delete the email unread

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Profile   Post #: 69
RE: Turning the numbers - 5/11/2009 10:07:52 PM   
SlaveBlutarsky


Posts: 491
Joined: 10/10/2005
From: Upstate, NY
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact

Eye rolling?  At Me????  I know you're kidding. 



Sometimes a man's just got to live on the edge a bit.

For the last 5 hours I've been watching my two favorite hockey teams in very close playoff games in very close playoff series' so I'm basically ready to drop the gloves at any moment. I'd be a really bad slave tonight.


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Profile   Post #: 70
RE: Turning the numbers - 5/11/2009 10:26:13 PM   
pinnipedster


Posts: 217
Joined: 4/17/2008
Status: offline 		Sooooo....should I gather from the way the conversation went completely past my post that my hopes in this regard are futile?  Or was it just dull?

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Profile   Post #: 71
RE: Turning the numbers - 5/11/2009 10:30:11 PM   
MidnightKat5000


Posts: 97
Joined: 1/10/2009
Status: offline 		I know that I basically just quit looking because EVERY male sub I come across is looking for that crap.  Most of the time they aren't really even into BDSM, they just want someone who's going to be cool with them dressing and assume that a trans dominant is going to indulge that fantasy for them.

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Profile   Post #: 72
RE: Turning the numbers - 5/11/2009 11:20:05 PM   
PeonForHer


Posts: 19612
Joined: 9/27/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze
I quite enjoy men in skirts, even if some cultures prefer to call them kilts (Mel Gibson in Braveheart, anybody?)



*Wince*  Never, ever, go up to Scotland and call a kilt a skirt, Lady C. 

And kilts have an entirely non-sissy function.  Cf the old line:

"Join a Highland regiment, me boy. The kilt is an unrivalled garment for fornication and diarrhoea".

John Masters, (1914 - 1983)

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RE: Turning the numbers - 5/12/2009 12:31:07 AM   
allthatjaz


Posts: 2878
Joined: 8/20/2008
Status: offline 		I know this topic has gone right off course from LP's original question but with topics like this I think that is fairly predictable. I also think it is a very good and interesting if not enlightening post and possibly the best I have read in a long time.... so ty Lady Pact
When I worked as a pro Mistress I specialized in very specific things (mainly medical) and bitching a guy up to humiliate was not something on my list, though I still had T-girls that happened to like medical and believe me, its amazing what you can do medically to a T-girl !

pinni.... If I was to have a relationship with a T-girl then it would have to be with someone like you who is happy to express both sides. I have never had an ongoing relationship with a T-girl but I have had sex buddy who always femmed up before the fun began and that was hot but then she was always much cuter as a girl than as a bloke
I have two friends that are married to T-girls and who are scene related and I often drop in at after clubs such as Stunners in London to catch up with a few friends and it never surprises me to see a number of T-girls, XD and TG's with young and very attractive female partners. I think the younger generation especially are becoming far more open minded.


Stella, your post was touching and informative. I still have an awful lot to understand and its hard to comprehend what you have been through but then I don't think you want pity but embracing for the person you are. I think the percentage of dominant or even vanilla women that would deliberately go out and look to form a relationship with any of the above mentioned is still very low because most bi women don't want to have a full on relationship with a woman and a lesbian is just out of the equation. Its a needle in a haystack scenario and much harder to find.


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Profile   Post #: 74
RE: Turning the numbers - 5/12/2009 3:55:35 AM   
MissIsis


Posts: 473
Joined: 1/1/2005
Status: offline 		Stella, I am very sorry for all you have had to go through & deal with on your journey.  I may not have had to go through the same things you did, & I may not have gender issues to deal with.   Believe it or not, my heart goes out to you & to the many others who have had to go through what you have.  That being said, I think I can safely say, I, & many others have had to deal with issues of acceptance of who we are.  That is not something that only happens to people with gender issues.  I won't go into all the details, but spending a lifetime struggling over finding self is something many, many people have to face. 

I would love to live in a world where people are accepting of who & what each & every one of us is.  All any of us can do is be honest about who we are & what we want. Young ones know when something isn't right with people.  They can sense it.  To stay in a relationship where one has to hide who they are for the sake of anyone is not doing anyone any favors.  Young ones know something isn't right, but since things are hidden & secret, they learn to disregard what they are sensing, & in turn learn how to not trust their instincts, & their gut reactions.  They also learn to perpetuate secrets in their own lives.  I don't believe that is healthy for anyone.

Life is very often, just hard sometimes.  We all do the best we can with the hand we have been dealt, & with what we know.  Sometimes our best is just to be honest with ourselves with who we are & with those who love & care about us.   If they are conditional in their love towards us, is that relationship something, any of us really wants to stay in?

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Profile   Post #: 75
RE: Turning the numbers - 5/12/2009 6:21:00 AM   
Venatrix


Posts: 2238
Joined: 11/28/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SlaveBlutarsky

I had an ex who used to threaten dressing me up all the time but never did. I think she just did that to see me roll my eyes so she'd have reason to slap me.



If she needed a reason, it must have been difficult choosing which one to use.

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Profile   Post #: 76
RE: Turning the numbers - 5/12/2009 7:22:46 AM   
LadyConstanze


Posts: 9722
Joined: 2/18/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus

Really CD = VERY HIGH MAINTENANCE.  There is an awful lot of the "oh I'm so pretty, look at me" going on, and not much going toward the domina---and I am not talking about money, but about attention, energy, and feedback.   Also, more stress on the persona and the outfit---don't mess up my hair!---which makes playing problematic.    Need I mention that many of these guys are NOT in the zone of the pretty?  They sure think they are, though!!  Dressing is some kind of ego thing for them, I guess...  therefore, endless hunts at the thrift stores for stuff that will fit them.    Eeep, there is one over in Ontario that has seen every domina in Detroit, I swear~  he brags about how much he spends on outfits, but do you think he can so much as bring the lady a candy bar?  NOPE!    He has these creeeeepy faux breasts, too...  

.......

As you can see from my earlier paragraph, I don't have fabulous memories of working with CD's.    It's a very deep seated fetish,  and honestly, I think it is one that wants witnessing, rather than participation.  



LOL, I think we all have fond or not so fond memories of CDs that are very unconvincing and high maintenance, admiring some of them as "oh so pretty" with a straight face can be actually hard work (do not look at the beard, the hairy chest, the muscular arms with biker tattoos, the bow legs... oddly enough those are the ones going for the most frilly feminine outfits), I often think they only go to professional dungeons to get the whole make-over experience and they can act like perfect little divas. Most (not all of them) would be perfectly well served with just a beauty salon or costume shop that caters to them and provides the experience, though for some of them it possibly becomes more fulfilling and powerful if they can pretend they are "forced" to be feminine, but that could be a guilt issue.

With quite a lot of them the experience isn't very BDSM, but then again, with a lot of foot fetishists everything is also focused on that particular fetish.

Though I do have rather fond memories of a guy who was well into his 70's and who used to show up in full bridal regalia (lovely silk wedding dress, tiara and all) and his/her whole thing was basically playing a blushing victorian bride who had a prep talk about what to expect in her wedding night. I quite enjoyed it because it was so surreal, but after the 5th time or so, it did become a bit tedious to pretend to be mother to somebody who was the age of my grandparents and explain the "facts of life" and that "a woman should never refuse her husband" (went a bit against the grain though) and that it will be a painful and unpleasant experience, but she must be brave... I actually liked it more because of the comedy value than anything else, oh yeah, and that I had the chance to dress up in Victorian finery and play "mother of the blushing bride". I'm still patting myself on the back for getting out lines with a straight face like "Now my dear, you are a pretty young thing, let me explain a few facts of life, like what will happen in your wedding night..."

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Profile   Post #: 77
RE: Turning the numbers - 5/12/2009 7:46:19 AM   
OttersSwim


Posts: 2860
Joined: 9/1/2008
Status: offline 		So I want to re-enter here and say that I -do- think that there are femme boy and CD subs out there that are quite serious about BDSM, service, and being the best submissive they can to a very wonderful Lady.

The evaluation and ferreting out the difference I think, is not hard - the fetishist or wanker or priss will show their lack of quality intent fairly early in the evaluation process.

For the right Lady, we can be hard to beat! 

Well...not "hard to beat"...actually quite easy to beat...where "beating" is like hitting and stuff...yea... 

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Profile   Post #: 78
RE: Turning the numbers - 5/12/2009 7:59:41 AM   
LadyConstanze


Posts: 9722
Joined: 2/18/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: OttersSwim

So I want to re-enter here and say that I -do- think that there are femme boy and CD subs out there that are quite serious about BDSM, service, and being the best submissive they can to a very wonderful Lady.

The evaluation and ferreting out the difference I think, is not hard - the fetishist or wanker or priss will show their lack of quality intent fairly early in the evaluation process.

For the right Lady, we can be hard to beat! 

Well...not "hard to beat"...actually quite easy to beat...where "beating" is like hitting and stuff...yea... 


No doubt about that, it depends all on the motivation and the person.

I'm not saying that the guys who are doing it only for the experience of dressing up and feeling feminine are less than genuine, they are just not subs and unfortunately our society doesn't give the much of an outlet for their particular fetish or desire, hence they are driven to BDSM. They are driven by a need within themselves that is not less genuine than the need of a submissive or a dominant, it's just different, would they have another outlet, most of them would most likely use it, nothing wrong with fetishists and the good thing is, most CDs are well aware that they are not service orientated at all, so they want their kink fulfilled and they take it to a dungeon - a bit like a woman will go to a beauty salon to get a make-over.

Then of course you have people who are CDs and subs, some are even masochists as well (ha, especially if high heels are part of their fetish, any woman knows that), there's enough room for almost every kink or leaning. Most of us have encountered prejudices because of the way we are wired, why on earth judge men who do want to live out their feminine side? That's a bit like the pot calling the kettle black.

_____________________________

There are 10 kinds of people who understand binary
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Profile   Post #: 79
RE: Turning the numbers - 5/12/2009 10:40:30 AM   
LadyPact


Posts: 32566
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyConstanze

Most of us have encountered prejudices because of the way we are wired, why on earth judge men who do want to live out their feminine side? That's a bit like the pot calling the kettle black.

I'm not so sure about that last part, LadyC.  There's a difference when it comes to personal preference and compatibility.  Otherwise, anybody and everybody who's kinky would be a perfect match for each other, at least in play.  We know that's not the case.


_____________________________

The crowned Diva of Destruction. ~ ExT

Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

Please do not send me email here. Unless I know you, I will delete the email unread

(in reply to LadyConstanze)
Profile   Post #: 80
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