RE: Terrorist cell arrested in New York (Full Version)

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whatsupsub -> RE: Terrorist cell arrested in New York (5/21/2009 5:46:46 PM)

She could try Lebanon....



MissSepphora1 -> RE: Terrorist cell arrested in New York (5/21/2009 6:14:28 PM)

i just might.



chiaThePet -> RE: Terrorist cell arrested in New York (5/21/2009 6:28:15 PM)


Due process indeed, we are not a bunch of savages.

I understand Guantanamo Bay is still open.

Though waterboarding has been replaced with jet skiing.

And they've added little umbrellas to the Cuba Libres.

chia* (the pet)



MissSepphora1 -> RE: Terrorist cell arrested in New York (5/21/2009 6:36:59 PM)

Seriously, what will they say... not guilty by reason of...???

Someone tell me what the defense will use to get these guys off.



kittinSol -> RE: Terrorist cell arrested in New York (5/21/2009 6:46:05 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MissSepphora1

i just might.



Be our guest.



OrionTheWolf -> RE: Terrorist cell arrested in New York (5/21/2009 6:53:10 PM)

And? I have stated that I have a problem with some of the things still occuring. This does not mean that we continue down a road that is hypocritical, and does not allow for due process.


quote:

ORIGINAL: chiaThePet


Due process indeed, we are not a bunch of savages.

I understand Guantanamo Bay is still open.

Though waterboarding has been replaced with jet skiing.

And they've added little umbrellas to the Cuba Libres.

chia* (the pet)




OrionTheWolf -> RE: Terrorist cell arrested in New York (5/21/2009 6:56:06 PM)

No one is a mind reader, and they should not pretend to be. The system is set so the most heinous criminal can have a fair hearing, so that it reduces the chances that an innocent is convicted. Allowing these rights to be applied eqitably, allows for justice to be better served in every case, and not just one specific one.

Wouldn't you hate for the law to support your neighbors being able to pull you from your house, and lynch you, because every one of them thought you were guilty of being a murderer.

You claim them to have no respect for the law, yet you are not willing to support the law yourself.

quote:

ORIGINAL: MissSepphora1

Seriously, what will they say... not guilty by reason of...???

Someone tell me what the defense will use to get these guys off.



chiaThePet -> RE: Terrorist cell arrested in New York (5/21/2009 7:02:27 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf

And? I have stated that I have a problem with some of the things still occuring. This does not mean that we continue down a road that is hypocritical, and does not allow for due process.



Okay FINE!

I'll throw in a months worth of Yuca con Mojo and Cerdo Asado.

And three free trips in a 57 Chevy around the town square fountain.

chia* (the pet)



kdsub -> RE: Terrorist cell arrested in New York (5/21/2009 7:05:01 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: chiaThePet

quote:

ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf

And? I have stated that I have a problem with some of the things still occuring. This does not mean that we continue down a road that is hypocritical, and does not allow for due process.



Okay FINE!

I'll throw in a months worth of Yuca con Mojo and Cerdo Asado.

And three free trips in a 57 Chevy around the town square fountain.

chia* (the pet)



Only if it is a convertible...I had one once...black with red interior...sold it for nothing... what a dumbass

Butch



Musicmystery -> RE: Terrorist cell arrested in New York (5/21/2009 7:09:44 PM)

quote:

The system is set so the most heinous criminal can have a fair hearing, so that it reduces the chances that an innocent is convicted.


Agreed, Orion--and also so that the government or some other faction can't steamroll their opposition (or at least have a harder time of it).



chiaThePet -> RE: Terrorist cell arrested in New York (5/21/2009 7:11:44 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

Only if it is a convertible...I had one once...black with red interior...sold it for nothing... what a dumbass

Butch


I dunno, your ass looks pretty good from here.

In a terrorist sort of way.

Ya know, just to keep on topic.

chia* (the pet)



kdsub -> RE: Terrorist cell arrested in New York (5/21/2009 7:14:26 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: chiaThePet

quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

Only if it is a convertible...I had one once...black with red interior...sold it for nothing... what a dumbass

Butch


I dunno, your ass looks pretty good from here.

In a terrorist sort of way.

Ya know, just to keep on topic.

chia* (the pet)



I must admit the 57 Chevy was the black SUV of its day...and my ass was a lot better looking then

Butch



OrionTheWolf -> RE: Terrorist cell arrested in New York (5/21/2009 8:54:13 PM)

Just make sure it is a legal tap. ;)

quote:

ORIGINAL: chiaThePet

I dunno, your ass looks pretty good from here.

In a terrorist sort of way.

Ya know, just to keep on topic.

chia* (the pet)




popeye1250 -> RE: Terrorist cell arrested in New York (5/21/2009 9:36:45 PM)

Orion, it didn't state anywhere in the article that those Deuschbags would be denied due process.
They'll be tried no matter what anyone says.
My only question is how do *I* get on one of those jurys?



MissSepphora1 -> RE: Terrorist cell arrested in New York (5/21/2009 9:50:35 PM)

If they pulled me from my kitchenn and blamed me for a murder they didn't see me do, then yea i might be pissed.
If I went out on the field of the local high school football game and shot the ref with everyone in the stands witnessing me do it, then i don't think i'd have that much to say.  waht do you do... plead not guilty due to bad call?
or if i went to the local mosque on a busy day and shot the imam, could i get away with 9/11 made me do it?

quote:

ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf

No one is a mind reader, and they should not pretend to be. The system is set so the most heinous criminal can have a fair hearing, so that it reduces the chances that an innocent is convicted. Allowing these rights to be applied eqitably, allows for justice to be better served in every case, and not just one specific one.

Wouldn't you hate for the law to support your neighbors being able to pull you from your house, and lynch you, because every one of them thought you were guilty of being a murderer.

You claim them to have no respect for the law, yet you are not willing to support the law yourself.

quote:

ORIGINAL: MissSepphora1

Seriously, what will they say... not guilty by reason of...???

Someone tell me what the defense will use to get these guys off.




MissSepphora1 -> RE: Terrorist cell arrested in New York (5/21/2009 9:53:34 PM)

do you ever have anything more than snarky catty comments to say?  i guess you think it makes you appear witty and intellectually superior to come in in the middle of a discussion and get a cheap shot in.

quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

quote:

ORIGINAL: MissSepphora1

i just might.



Be our guest.



popeye1250 -> RE: Terrorist cell arrested in New York (5/21/2009 9:59:46 PM)

Beware anyone claiming to be, "an intellectual."



whatsupsub -> RE: Terrorist cell arrested in New York (5/21/2009 11:01:18 PM)

I take no credibility in being able to say this, but i am her ex.  Trust me, she's got the brain. She's also got the strength and passion to manipulate any argument to mean anything she wants it to.  Frankly, just like all the rest of us do.  I know it's hard - but stop and think about the possibilities from the left to the right - including hers.  However far fetched they may seem from any "point of reality" (what we as "assimilated Americans usually don't see) - inevidebly some situation, no matter how far fetched, will eventually come true.  The odds are against us.  Unfortunately. 

Look at 9/11.  If she had ranted that could happen days before...months before....we'd have probably have been very critical too.  [our government knew it - they just didn't react quickly enough - perhaps because they weren't taking it seriously enough - it was treated more like a teaser for a hollywood movie] - but then there it happened.
The odds are against us.

And yes, she may hate me, but i still respect her.





NorthernGent -> RE: Terrorist cell arrested in New York (5/22/2009 1:09:07 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf

Not sure which part of the UK you are in, but maybe you could give us a perspective from how the government in your country handles domestic terrorism.



Pretty much in the same way as this: painstaking surveillance and evidence gathering, explosives or ingredients discovered somewhere along the line, spent time in Pakistan or Afghanistan etc etc and then they storm the home of about 4 or 5 people.

They hold them for 30 days or so, and it turns out the painstaking evidence gathering wasn't as painstaking as they'd like us to believe........and they're released without charge.

Assuming the idea is to keep this issue in the public sphere, then they've shot themselves in the foot - these raids are no long taken seriously by the general public (well unless you're a muslim and you're having your door kicked in at 4 in the morning and being held in the nick for 30 days).

quote:

ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf

So far everything I have read in this case, none of the grey area stuff was used, just old fashioned investigative work, combined with legal aquisition of evidence. Heck they even provied fake bombs that these four planted.



I can't open the link today, but yesterday the words "apparently" and "believed to be" caught my eye.



JonnieBoy -> RE: Terrorist cell arrested in New York (5/22/2009 2:25:16 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: OrionTheWolf
Not sure which part of the UK you are in, but maybe you could give us a perspective from how the government in your country handles domestic terrorism.


Accepted, the question was not directed at me, but ...

If it helps, it seems that done "by the book", the phone tapping thing is very similar, surveillance evidence is governed by strict laws, and once obtained and being processed the evidence as well as terms and length of detention of suspects prior to innocence or guilt (on the grounds of terrorism related offences) having been proven in law is/are all subject to a structured process of ongoing review.Historically terrorism has been a concern for most of the adult lives of all in the UK so public awareness  is not having to be "learned" as it is in the US still.
This (in theory) ensures that the guilty are unable to "get off" (for want of a better expression) as a rule and that the rights to privacy of innocent civilians (just like me [sm=evil.gif]) are protected from unscrupulous or inappropriate prying as much as possible.

As with the US ... the public don't get to know everything in the business of "national security" ... obviously

Pirate



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