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RE: Have a situation that I don't know what to do with - 6/17/2009 3:44:18 PM

LadyPact

Posts: 32566
Status: offline

And people wonder why folks post one time and never come back. I know I'm not the patron saint of the boards or anything with My opinions from time to time, but geez, a little slack maybe?

It may not be everyone's version of BDSM, but it's BDSM just the same. It became BDSM when that was what the husband asked to explore online in the first place. If the BDSM element was working in the home, there would have been none of this happening to begin with. The question presented was how does someone fix the cluster fuck that this has become.

For those who don't do poly/open/multiple relationships, I do understand the reasons why you don't and in My view, that's ok. However, for those of us who do, we understand that there is a lot of work involved. There really is an investment in doing this. In most cases, it doesn't 'just happen' where someone has a fairytale image and everything is fine from the get-go.

If it did, I'd be Cinderella.

_____________________________

The crowned Diva of Destruction. ~ ExT

Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

Please do not send me email here. Unless I know you, I will delete the email unread

(in reply to dreamerdreaming)

Post #: 61

RE: Have a situation that I don't know what to do with - 6/17/2009 3:46:25 PM

lateralist1

Posts: 886
Joined: 11/22/2006
Status: offline

All my sympathy goes to the other woman.
I'm a married Domme. My husband is aware of where I am and who I am with at all times.
A prospective sub is always made aware of my relationship with my husband before we meet.
When I first started to explore my BDSM sexuality I thought it didn't matter if the sub was cheating on his wife. I thought that was his responsibility. However as I grew as a Domme I realised that it wasn't it was mine as well. I now do everything I can to ensure that a sub is not involved in any other sexual relationship before we meet.
Your in a mess because you and your husband didn't think this through before you involved anyone else.
Lots of marriages go through difficult times but you have children to consider.
There is nothing that you can do about his totally irresponsible behaviour except let him know how you feel about it. I know how I feel about it but you have to work out how you feel about it and then figure out what is right for you and your children.

(in reply to Toppingfrmbottom)

Post #: 62

RE: Have a situation that I don't know what to do with - 6/17/2009 5:07:15 PM

dreamerdreaming

Posts: 2839
Status: offline

I am not against poly (quite the contrary!) - but she's clearly miserable and asking for opinions. I gave mine. I deeply respect and admire you, LadyPact. Maybe more than you know...

As you've said, poly is not for everyone, and takes a good, honest effort from all involved. I don't see a good beginning for a poly relationship here. I see him deceiving another woman. Not caring much about his own wife's misery, or the pain he could cause the other woman. In short I see a very selfish man... And a wife who appears to care more about him than she cares about her own self. That may be one definition of love, but it also can be a definition of low self-esteem. And the fact that she has let herself be treated badly, all the while beating herself up over what she might have done differently, supports the latter definition.

To reiterate: I see a selfish man, a woman who is not acting like she values herself, and a third party who is being actively deceived by him.... And whose deception the wife may be effectively complicit in, by her failure to act. (It is not entirely clear to me if she knows how to get ahold of this woman but, if I were the wife I would find a way).

I just don't see a happy poly ending here. For one thing, this isn't what she signed up for. She has a perfect right to leave. It may be that they could have a happy poly life together someday, but I don't see much chance of it by the way the the two of them have acted so far. Everyone can change, but it takes time and effort. It won't do much good if she changes into the ideal poly wife and he stays a self-involved, deceitful person. And even if he changed, some people just aren't right for poly. It doesn't sound like its her thing, at all. And she has a right to have the kind of relationship that she needs- not just whatever floats his boat.

I call 'em as I see 'em. I'm simply encouraging her to persue her own happiness and fullfillment with the same (or better) care and attention she has given to helping him find his. When you love someone, finding your own fullfillment shouldn't come at the expense of theirs. That's not love. Sometimes true love can best be shown by letting your beloved go, so that they may find the happiness without you that they were missing while with you. He is not showing enough care and concern for her needs and desires, to warrant her continuing on with him, IMHO. She's past the point of diminishing returns, with him. And he's just not being a decent person. His deceit could really hurt the third party. Both women deserve better.

To be clear: I do see a possible poly future, for myself and my boy. But only if and when both my boy and I are ready. And I did discuss this with him from the very start. But, bottom line- it will be done in a way that all parties are comfy with, or not at all.

*tips hat to the wonderful LadyPact*

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(in reply to LadyPact)

Post #: 63

RE: Have a situation that I don't know what to do with - 6/17/2009 5:45:44 PM

LadyPact

Posts: 32566
Status: offline

Dear dreamer,

I don't think we're so far apart here. Unfortunately, the beginning is already established and can't be changed. What gets worked on from here is something else.

I'm sure that not one person who's responded to this thread would argue that the little people in the house should come first. I think we'd both agree that is the first priority. Whatever these three adults do, it effects them and that must be brought into consideration.

That only reaffirms My thought that the grown ups here need to come clean. Poly, in My view, is about many loves and love isn't always happening when people aren't being honest with each other.

Is it hard? Yes. It's incredibly hard. Still, it's harder to fail to do it.

_____________________________

The crowned Diva of Destruction. ~ ExT

Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

Please do not send me email here. Unless I know you, I will delete the email unread

(in reply to dreamerdreaming)

Post #: 64

RE: Have a situation that I don't know what to do with - 6/17/2009 6:01:28 PM

ShiftedJewel

Posts: 2492
Joined: 12/2/2004
Status: offline

quote:

For those who don't do poly/open/multiple relationships, I do understand the reasons why you don't and in My view, that's ok. However, for those of us who do, we understand that there is a lot of work involved. There really is an investment in doing this. In most cases, it doesn't 'just happen' where someone has a fairytale image and everything is fine from the get-go.

LP... you know I love you, right?

And I agree absolutely with you! I understand that there are a lot of people that just aren't into poly and I fully understand that, but my gosh!! Ok, granted, the guy should have been up front with the "other woman" and because he wasn't there is a good chance that he'll regret that. Or if he comes clean and explains everything to her she may be fine with it, particularly knowing that the wife knows all about it.

I get the feeling that she isn't all that terribly opposed to what's going on, she just doesn't know how to deal with the emotions it's caused and that makes perfect sense to me... and it should to others too, (reading comprehension is real big to me... lol) but that's a different thread huh?

I don't see how telling her to kick him to the curb, calling him names and implying that she is endangering the well being of her saplings is doing anyone any good. Ok, maybe it makes the poster doing it feel morally superior, I don't know. Don't get it.

My advice to nillawife is to read through the responses here and pick someone to talk to on the other side. I won't hunt you down if you write to me on the other side, and I'm sure LP wouldn't either and I know there are others as well. Please, don't be worried about taking this to a more private scenerio if that is something you would be more comfy with. And in the mean time... all the luck in the world to you and yours.

Jewel

And yeah, I'm pretty comfy in my asbestos suit.

_____________________________

Don't ask, trust me, you won't like the answer... no one ever does.

(in reply to LadyPact)

Post #: 65

RE: Have a situation that I don't know what to do with - 6/17/2009 7:29:50 PM

LadyPact

Posts: 32566
Status: offline

Hi Jewel. You know I love you, too.

I guess what I'm saying here is that poly isn't just automatically easy. Not for a lot of folks, anyway. People experience a lot of emotions that they didn't expect. It's easy for people to say that they aren't jealous. Until their SO goes off to spend a week with someone else. Suddenly, there are all these feelings and emotions to deal with, not to mention the practical aspects. Just exactly what is that person's home address if signing them in at the hospital after a car wreck?

The point is, stuff comes up. No, people don't always think that it will. I was surprised when jealousy entered this little triad. Time envy? Yep, that's happened here, too. These things aren't resolved when no one talks about them. Getting those feelings out in the open helps. It's not a guarantee that it will never happen again. Sometimes, it's just about progress, not perfection.

I'm certainly not the brain child of poly, nor do I have all of the answers. Heck, I'm still finding My way, all of the time. If something that I did worked, maybe it will work for someone else. Maybe it won't. The best I can do is throw it out there and see if someone else wants to give it a shot.

_____________________________

The crowned Diva of Destruction. ~ ExT

Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

Please do not send me email here. Unless I know you, I will delete the email unread

(in reply to ShiftedJewel)

Post #: 66

RE: Have a situation that I don't know what to do with - 6/17/2009 7:41:48 PM

sleazybutterfly

Posts: 2801
Joined: 5/15/2006
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fp

I don't have a problem w/ poly, triads, or even open relationships..my problem is that the third isn't even aware she is a third. I think she deserves to decide for herself if this is what she wants.

If that gets taken care of, perhaps I can find a bit more sympathy for the plight of the OP.

< Message edited by sleazybutterfly -- 6/17/2009 7:42:52 PM >

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(in reply to LadyPact)

Post #: 67

RE: Have a situation that I don't know what to do with - 6/18/2009 1:25:30 AM

ranja

Posts: 2111
Joined: 11/1/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: dreamerdreaming

To reiterate: I see a selfish man, a woman who is not acting like she values herself, and a third party who is being actively deceived by him.... And whose deception the wife may be effectively complicit in, by her failure to act. (It is not entirely clear to me if she knows how to get ahold of this woman but, if I were the wife I would find a way).

Apparently she sits next to her husband as he makes phone calls to this other woman...i believe she could remember the number...he makes no secret of this...also she could just speak up during the call...unless he gagged her (mmm)
Also she says she does not know where he goes and complains that he does not phone her...but unless i missed something i believe that if she were to phone him about some emergency, he might well respond and come to the resque...he surely would have his mobile on him?

Maybe there really is no other woman...maybe he is deliciously tricking her into jealousy...into loving and wanting him again...oh how hot...

Anyway if there really is another woman...she might not be such an innocent party at all...she might have 3 other lovers for all we know, but i agree she should know that he is married.

I think the wife should put her foot down, open up and get her man back...

I really so do NOT believe in all this divorce stuff...it so often turns out to be the most stupid course of action and what seems to be vengeance and even an easy way out.
In my opinion people should most definitely STOP divorcing willy nilly and accept the fact that life is not all honeymoon and rozes and shit happens and own up to their own shortcomings as well as accepting faults in their partner way more than most seem capable of.

(in reply to dreamerdreaming)

Post #: 68

RE: Have a situation that I don't know what to do with - 6/18/2009 4:06:47 AM

agirl

Posts: 4530
Joined: 6/14/2004
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I didn't read a huge amount of *being jerked around* in what she wrote at all. She's been complicit in the situation, she's condoned it to a large extent, for various reasons.

Neither of them may be doing the things necessary to improve the situation but it's not necessarily a *done deal*, as they say. There's plenty of room for manoeuvre and some kind of new springboard point for them, their relationship and their marriage..... IF they want to and if it's important enough to them both.

As for any example she may or may not set for the little ones...one of those *examples* could be that Mummy AND Daddy contributed to a bad situation and took the time and energy to find out why, and sorted it out.

Maybe I'm too laid back, or seen enough situations of hugely varying kinds where people have been able to move off together in a different direction, with renewed resolve and a lot more understanding of themselves, what they're capable of and what their partner is capable of, good AND bad.

Are you missing the part where NEITHER of them have been honest with each other?

Change the locks, and make sure you are not alone when he comes to get his things. .......You seem to have relegated him to some frightening, dangerous character.......How you've managed that from the OP, I really cannot imagine.

agirl

(in reply to dreamerdreaming)

Post #: 69

RE: Have a situation that I don't know what to do with - 6/18/2009 5:04:48 AM

Firebirdseeking

Posts: 477
Joined: 9/3/2006
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I just want to say this: I really have a problem with some of the disrespect that is expressed on these boards. Perhaps someone got herself or himself in a bad situation, or even a foolish one, but it takes a certain amount of courage and openness to post one's hurt here. This woman should not be called names or put down because she made some mistakes in her life. I dont think there is anyone on the planet who has not made mistakes, especially in matters of the heart..or of the loins. In particular, I find the condemnation and name calling very disturbing.

(in reply to agirl)

Post #: 70

RE: Have a situation that I don't know what to do with - 6/18/2009 5:08:35 AM

DarkSteven

Posts: 28072
Joined: 5/2/2008
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Let's cut to the heart of the matter. Yes, the "other woman" is unaware. Yes, there's D/s involved. But OP's real question is: "I gave my husband permission to cheat and now I want to take it back."

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The small-breasted ones want larger breasts. The large-breasted ones want smaller ones. The straight-haired ones curl their hair, and the curly-haired ones straighten theirs...

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(in reply to agirl)

Post #: 71

RE: Have a situation that I don't know what to do with - 6/18/2009 5:20:03 AM

DesFIP

Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: antipode

quote:

The other woman is an exciting fantasy right now

She isn't. He actually has it going on with her (I love Americanisms) and she may not care whether he is married or not, she has him, the OP does not, she is sitting at home making things up in her head while doing the laundry.

My golden rule: more than one "if", it ain't going to happen, whatever it was.

I think you misinterpreted the usage of the word fantasy. It is a fantasy relationship. His marriage has all the boring things like sick kids, bills to pay, washer isn't working, etc. He visits the third and it's fun time only. She isn't calling him when she runs out of gas, he doesn't have to take her to the doctor when she's too sick to drive.

The normal difference between ldr and living together. LDR you only deal with the fun stuff, when hubby leaves subby, subby is stuck with doing her own laundry, dealing with the mechanic herself. At home hubby has responsibilities. And he's decided he doesn't want them anymore as evidenced by disappearing without leaving a number to call or an address in case of emergency.

Any bets if he actually ever makes it home for longer than to pack up his stuff?

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!

(in reply to antipode)

Post #: 72

RE: Have a situation that I don't know what to do with - 6/18/2009 5:33:06 AM

ScooterTrash

Posts: 1407
Joined: 1/24/2005
From: Indiana
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: VanillaWife666

He's the Dominant, she's the submissive and I'm trying to be His submissive. We have tried BDSM before, with me being the Domme and He being the sub, but neither of us were comfortable in those roles. I've been a submissive before but to a very bad and abusive Dom (not Him) and i'm finding what my limits are.
He kept me apprised of everything that was going on with the two of them, let me read the emails, the texts, and i would sit next to Him as he talked with her on the phone.
But now that He and i are beginning to get close again, i'm extremely jealous of their relationship. He says He loves her but not the same way that He loves me, He says that He doesn't want to leave me ever and that He has no intention of marrying her or anyone else.

Wow...a huge amount of doomdayers and just plain jugemental B types responding to this. In response to your original question, no, you aren't an idiot and no your marraige is certainly not doomed, unless you make it that way. Actually, I only see two things done wrong here, the 3rd should have been made aware of the "married" situation up front. It may or may not have made any difference, but awareness would have been information to know. Actually, I would have taken it a step further and had you and the 3rd meet, who knows, you may have become very good friends which would have lessened the insecurity feelings you are having right now. This can still be remedied actually, if he just comes clean and tell his play partner of the situation and brings her to the house to meet you. When hubby get's home, my suggestion is that you discuss this possibility. The 2nd issue here is communication, which may have been something missed from both sides, even though there was more communication than most posters are giving you (as a couple) credit for. You both need to set some ground rules up on his keeping in touch at home and vice versa for that matter. Whether it's "I got there OK" or daily check ins, something needs to be set up so neither party is just left wondering. I sort of go back to my first point, which would solve all these issues however, if you two (You and the 3rd) would meet and make friends, then I'm thinking her home as well as your home would be in limits and there would not be as much need for away time in the first place. Do watch the advice from the anti-poly crowd, as they look at situations like this with blinders on and see nothing but bad coming from it...it's called prejudging and comes from being being misinformed or just not informed at all. I don't see anything broken here that can't be fixed, it just needs some tweeking to bring it back in line.

< Message edited by ScooterTrash -- 6/18/2009 5:37:15 AM >

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(in reply to VanillaWife666)

Post #: 73

RE: Have a situation that I don't know what to do with - 6/18/2009 6:49:29 AM

agirl

Posts: 4530
Joined: 6/14/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP

quote:

ORIGINAL: antipode

quote:

The other woman is an exciting fantasy right now

She isn't. He actually has it going on with her (I love Americanisms) and she may not care whether he is married or not, she has him, the OP does not, she is sitting at home making things up in her head while doing the laundry.

My golden rule: more than one "if", it ain't going to happen, whatever it was.

I think you misinterpreted the usage of the word fantasy. It is a fantasy relationship. His marriage has all the boring things like sick kids, bills to pay, washer isn't working, etc. He visits the third and it's fun time only. She isn't calling him when she runs out of gas, he doesn't have to take her to the doctor when she's too sick to drive.

The normal difference between ldr and living together. LDR you only deal with the fun stuff, when hubby leaves subby, subby is stuck with doing her own laundry, dealing with the mechanic herself. At home hubby has responsibilities. And he's decided he doesn't want them anymore as evidenced by disappearing without leaving a number to call or an address in case of emergency.

Any bets if he actually ever makes it home for longer than to pack up his stuff?

There wasn't enough in the OP or subsequent posts from her to make any bets. Not from where I'm standing.

Also with ldr, they are as varied as the people IN them. Not all ldr's mean that the sub is *in it* alone. Sure, she might have to cope with mundane crap like a broken washing machine, or any other unexpected, inconvenient crap, but I had to do that in my very conventional marriage. Not all ldr's are devoid of *responsibility*. How much of a stand has this lady made regarding her husband going off for week in the first instance? What was arranged, discussed and so on? All up for assumption without information.

It's as nutty to me that SHE didn't ask, or make arrangements for him to call or express that she'd like or want it, as it is that he hasn't. No-one mentioned whether it was agreed or spoken about. It's no nuttier than the whole scenario that she's been complicit in.

I can't understand why he's being seen as total arse, when she's been encouraging and part of the entire situation. It's a SITUATION that they BOTH played a part in.

Doling out blame and condemnation on either side is pretty futile.

agirl

(in reply to DesFIP)

Post #: 74

RE: Have a situation that I don't know what to do with - 6/18/2009 7:46:52 AM

OsideGirl

Posts: 14441
Joined: 7/1/2005
From: United States
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: sleazybutterfly

my problem is that the third isn't even aware she is a third. I think she deserves to decide for herself if this is what she wants.

That's a sticking point for me as well. Her knowledge of his situation would be the first ground rule that got laid down.

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(in reply to sleazybutterfly)

Post #: 75

RE: Have a situation that I don't know what to do with - 6/18/2009 8:20:43 AM

LadyVillen

Posts: 10
Joined: 4/27/2006
Status: offline

I think his attitude towards you and this other girl stinks.

He has not taken any responsibity on the way that this has made you feel, including your depression and attempt to harm yourself. He has wilfully lied to this other girl, not giving her a choice as to whether she would want a realtionship with a married man.

From what i have read, he has never sat down properly and discussed this with you, or even seen if the D/s could be within your relationship.

The fact that he has gone off for a whole week, leaving you to continue to run the house look after the children, and hasnt even got the most basic common decency to keep in contact with you, quite frankly makes my blood boil.

I would advise that you look within yourself at what you want, and what you do and do not find acceptable that is currently going on in your relationship.

I wish you all the best. Big hugs

< Message edited by LadyVillen -- 6/18/2009 8:22:08 AM >

(in reply to LaTigresse)

Post #: 76

RE: Have a situation that I don't know what to do with - 6/18/2009 8:45:36 AM

agirl

Posts: 4530
Joined: 6/14/2004
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Actually, she's made no mention of why she agreed to his *week away* other than to say he hadn't contacted her. It seems to be assumed that he buggered off with barely a backward glance, when in fact , she's offered no information at ALL about his going and what was or wasn't greed. She's only commented on the fact that he hadn't called her SINCE going.

There's a lot of assumptions rife here...... and frankly, the few posts she's made, hasn't convinced me even slightly that she's some duped, victim of circumstances that HE'S created alone.

agirl

(in reply to LadyVillen)

Post #: 77

RE: Have a situation that I don't know what to do with - 6/18/2009 5:39:57 PM

LookieNoNookie

Posts: 12216
Joined: 8/9/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: VanillaWife666

My husband and i have been married for 13 years and have two children. Over the last 6-7 years, we've stopped having anything to talk about and just got stuck into a rut. About 8 months ago, my husband came to me and asked if he could start a BDSM relationship online with a woman. At the time, I thought that it wouldn't hurt to have him explore the lifestyle and make new friends. However, he and the woman got very close and he started having feelings for her even though he assures me that he could never love her the way he loves me and he would never want to leave me for anyone. The first time he left to go and meet her at a half-way point in between our two cities for a weekend in April, i didn't take it to well. i got severely depressed and cried the entire time and even tried to hurt myself. When he got back and continued talking with her online and on the phone, i started seeing the man that i fell in love with 13 years ago and realized that i missed him immensly. so i sat him down and said that i wanted to be a part of his new lifestyle and find ways to not only save our marriage but to build something new. it's been extremely difficult for me still because he still chats, texts, and calls her daily but he is making attempts to spend more time with me.
He left yesterday to spend a week with her and now i haven't heard a word from him, nothing to say that he arrived alright or anything. i'm also having a lot of thoughts about the two of them together and it has destroyed my heart in ways that i don't know if it can be repaired. he asked me months ago if i wanted him to dump the other woman, who by the way has no knowledge that he's married and has two kids. i told him that she is the reason for making him feel alive again, that she is the innocent party in this situation and it would not be fair to her at all. so i told him that i wouldn't give him an ultimatum because i allowed all of this in the first place.
My question is "am i a complete and utter idiot for letting it get this far or what should i do?" please help me, i assumed this forum would be appropriate for this situation because it does involve BDSM, D/s, and alternate lifestyles.

Two very key points:

1) Paragraphs.

2) Men are not well equipped to handle outside relationships.

I sense you're asking an incredibly sincere question...and I do wish your marriage well.

Fixing your marriage by being a sycophant will never work.

Others in response will say "you haven't told us enough to gauge this....." or some other intrusive crap....here's the deal....

Don't sign off on some bullshit conclusions that people you've never met tell you will fix the problem.

They don't know shit.

(in reply to VanillaWife666)

Post #: 78

RE: Have a situation that I don't know what to do with - 6/19/2009 12:19:18 AM

ranja

Posts: 2111
Joined: 11/1/2007
Status: offline

Is he back yet?
Do you have his mobile number and can you call him to come back?

If you are not into poly and you want him back you have to make him stop his affair...if you allow him to continue it will come across as weak and uncaring and eventually he might prefer her above you...it is much more desirable to be wanted...so rather than being a good but sad girl and allowing him his freedom i think you should show your passion and fight!

< Message edited by ranja -- 6/19/2009 12:27:10 AM >

(in reply to VanillaWife666)

Post #: 79

RE: Have a situation that I don't know what to do with - 6/19/2009 10:14:32 PM

scarlethiney

Posts: 492
Joined: 8/22/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: sweetgirlserves

quote:

ORIGINAL: scarlethiney

quote:

littlewonder...
stop sounding so pathetic.

sweetgirlserves, might want to re-read that Mother Teresa quote on your profile and have someone explain to you what loving kindness means.

I suppose you would think it much more loving and kind to encourage her to maintain a victim mentality. Personally, although tough love is not easy... it can be the most loving and kind thing a person can do for another. Pity is the worse thing you can do for a person. Nothing will bring them down more than that.

~sgs

Don't suppose anything where another is concerned. Try not to ass-ume. I realize this is hard for you. Lets not derail the original post.
You have no first hand knowledge of any of these people but like most are just offering an opinion. Your opinion or "view" isn't more correct or incorrect than any other, it just happens to be unique to your personal perspective nothing more, nothing less.
Sympathy is not the same thing as pity. Sympathy and empathy do not create victims.Sympathy and empathy encourage and support, validate ones worth. Insecurity and blame are the birth- mothers of a victim.

< Message edited by scarlethiney -- 6/19/2009 10:38:00 PM >

_____________________________

"The words 'I am...' are potent words; be careful what you hitch them to. The thing you're claiming has a way of reaching back and claiming you." - A.L. Kitselman.

see my profile masterkspet

(in reply to sweetgirlserves)

Post #: 80

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All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> General BDSM Discussion >> RE: Have a situation that I don't know what to do with

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