Coyotes (Full Version)

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sirsholly -> Coyotes (7/20/2009 7:40:22 AM)

We live in a very rural area..farms, cattle etc. For about the past week, at all hours, there has been deafening howls and yapping sounds from a densely wooded area. And i mean LOUD!

The yaps are puppy-like, possible indicative of a den of little ones, but the howls are definitely adult Coyotes and quite a few of them. We are not talking about a small pack from the sound of the howling.

We have a Game Commission that will not intervene unless the damage from the pack gets out of control (ie multiple killing of livestock) but that is not happening as the birthing time of calves is past and the newborn calves are months old and of a good size. Also, the Game Commission has the understandable attitude of "what the hell do you expect?". This situation is something you deal with when you want the GreenAcres life.

So...they are sending info on Coyotes, but i thought i would ask here for anyones experience with these animals.

-Do they attack without provication?
-Will they attack a human adult and/or child?
-Are they known to travel more at night or during the day?

We can buy traps...but then what do we do with the animals aside from the obvious? We cannot get a vehicle into the area they seem to favor, so dragging a trapped Coyote out is not possible. And even placing the traps is dangerous. They would have to be taken in with a quad...no protection.

And the most important question i have...we have a three year old little boy. He is a big kid, the size of a five year old, so physically he may not be a target. When he goes outside, i have a gun (small revolver) in a case on a secure belt clip. I can take care of one Coyote, but do they attack in a pack? If i am busy shooting one, what do you think the rest of the pack will do?

Any help, advice, etc will be very much appriciated.



GreedyTop -> RE: Coyotes (7/20/2009 7:58:57 AM)

http://www.desertusa.com/june96/du_cycot.html

my personal experiences with them (in CA) has been that they are actually quite timid...



Musicmystery -> RE: Coyotes (7/20/2009 8:07:12 AM)

Hello holly,

I also live in a rural area, lots of forest, farms, cows, horses, sheep--and coyotes.

For the most part, they are no trouble at all. Since yours came up suddenly, they may have a den there this year. They move around though--the sounds change location all the time.

They go where the food is, and with lots of forest, there's lots of food. No problem. They will go after a roaming cat or small dog. I've never seen them coming around the homes, though. The closest I've ever seen is when I was walking far into the woods with my then husky puppy (six months or so) who apparently ran into a den--and got her ass chased back hard, unharmed. The coyote was right on her tail, but took off the minute it saw me.

I have heard of coyotes going into yards in suburbia, but this all tends to be where the forest has been sharply reduced.

Be reasonably cautious. Don't leave food/garbage accessible outside. Don't let your cat or chihuahua roam around. Don't leave your kid outside at night (heh). But don't worry about it other than that. Chances are, you'll only see one or two ever, and then only briefly and at a distance. Plenty of rodents and small game around for dinner. (You don't keep chickens, ducks or geese do you? Keep 'em well fenced.)

They aren't going to attack you without provocation unless rabid, but even here, I wouldn't worry. We don't know why, but rabies is not common among coyotes (according to my vet). And no, a pack isn't going to come swarming into your yard. The main risk is the cat.

They are mosly nocturnal, but can be seen in the day. They live in pairs (plus pups), rather than hunting in packs. Even the rare pack is around six coyotes.

In short, in the 22 years I've lived here, other than keeping the cats inside, I haven't seen any problems. Here's a page with several encyclopedia articles on coyotes.

Rurally yours,

Tim




DesFIP -> RE: Coyotes (7/20/2009 8:11:32 AM)

Around here, they just eat mice and rabbits. Maybe the occasional outside cat if they can catch one. No known cases here of them attacking a child however in the canyons near Los Angeles, this has happened.

But game here is in abundance this year because lots of rain means lots of grass which means lots of mice, rabbits and such. We don't see them near the house except in drought years, same with bears.

The one thing I will say is that the sound is deceptive, you can't pinpoint where it's coming from and three can sound like ten. And yes, they den in different areas from year to year.



LaTigresse -> RE: Coyotes (7/20/2009 8:13:24 AM)

Holly, I live literally surrounded by them and worry more about the marauding skunk, or attitudinal buck, than I do dozens of coyotes. We've several dens nearby, every year.

If you child went running towards them, they would run. Even in a pack they are quite afraid of people.

I have gone outside at night with my spotlight flashlight and seen dozens of pairs of eye illuminated, staring at me, from just over the yard fence.

As MM said, unless you've got a wandering cat (although Quigley, Superrrrrrrr Cat has survived them for 8 years now), outside dogs (I have known a pack of coyotes to kill male dogs, even large ones) or chickens running about, they will not cause you any trouble at all.

And yes, as Des said, two or three can sound like twenty, and they are often much further away than they sound.

If you have a non spayed female dog. Keep her inside or penned up or you could end up with coydogs.....a much bigger problem than the coyotes.



sirsholly -> RE: Coyotes (7/20/2009 8:30:22 AM)

Greedy, Tim, Celeste and LeeAnn...

Thank you all so much for responding. You have no idea how relieved i am to read your words and how much you have put me at ease!!

I will still be hyper-vigilant with the LoudOne out there (he is no more than a few feet from me at all times, so it is safe to say no one wants the Coyotes gone more than he does!!)

And Tim...we do have chickens and they have not been bothered. They are out during the day but penned at sundown. The fact that they are not missing a feather is a comfort. Thanks for pointing that out!





GreedyTop -> RE: Coyotes (7/20/2009 8:39:08 AM)

*smooches Holly*



LaTigresse -> RE: Coyotes (7/20/2009 8:46:44 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: sirsholly

Greedy, Tim, Celeste and LeeAnn...

Thank you all so much for responding. You have no idea how relieved i am to read your words and how much you have put me at ease!!

I will still be hyper-vigilant with the LoudOne out there (he is no more than a few feet from me at all times, so it is safe to say no one wants the Coyotes gone more than he does!!)

And Tim...we do have chickens and they have not been bothered. They are out during the day but penned at sundown. The fact that they are not missing a feather is a comfort. Thanks for pointing that out!



Just so that you know you can ease up a bit on little Mr. Loud. We've always had the coyotes and I take my two grand louds out hiking in the fields and pretty much let them run where ever, as long as that is not near the horse pasture. Because seriously, they would be in much more danger around the horses than out trying to find coyotes. They TRY to find the coyotes and still haven't seen a hair except with grandma's spot light, at night.



Loki45 -> RE: Coyotes (7/20/2009 8:52:57 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: sirsholly
If i am busy shooting one, what do you think the rest of the pack will do?


Two pieces of info:

First, don't carry a revolver for wild animals. Carry a Glock -- easy trigger pulls and you can fire off 17 rounds very quickly (depending on caliber).

Secondly, if you're firing a loud gun at one animal, unless we're talking a pack of bears (which don't run in packs) the loud noise will scare most of them or make them think think twice about attacking. Also, although coyotes run in packs, they typically only hunt in pairs. So as long as you can handle 2, you're fine.



LaTigresse -> RE: Coyotes (7/20/2009 8:54:40 AM)

Overkill. For coyotes she's already got all the ammo she needs........Mr Loud.



Loki45 -> RE: Coyotes (7/20/2009 8:56:48 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

Overkill. For coyotes she's already got all the ammo she needs........Mr Loud.


What is overkill for one danger may be just adequate for another. This is one fucked up world we live in. There's no greater danger to humans than other humans (well that and carnies.....nomads you know..small hands...smell like cabbage).



begmeformore -> RE: Coyotes (7/20/2009 9:04:12 AM)

we live in NC , we have coyotes also ,as many have said keep the cat inside at night ,,the bigger problem here is black bear walking into town looking for a handout from the trash cans,,,,



GreedyTop -> RE: Coyotes (7/20/2009 9:53:21 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Loki45

quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

Overkill. For coyotes she's already got all the ammo she needs........Mr Loud.


What is overkill for one danger may be just adequate for another. This is one fucked up world we live in. There's no greater danger to humans than other humans (well that and carnies.....nomads you know..small hands...smell like cabbage).


Loki..honey.. she's asking about COYOTES of the 4 legged variety.



ThatDamnedPanda -> RE: Coyotes (7/20/2009 10:13:06 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

And yes, as Des said, two or three can sound like twenty, and they are often much further away than they sound.


I don't know for sure, but I think that's actually an evolutionary adaptation. I know that wolves, howling in a pack, will immediately change pitch if another wolf is howling at the same pitch. It's believed that this is intended to make the pack sound as large as possible. I've never heard this about coyotes, but having lived most of my life listening to them, my educated guess is they're doing the same thing.



slaveboyforyou -> RE: Coyotes (7/20/2009 10:24:58 AM)

I'm more scared of the raccoons around here than I am of coyotes. I see coyotes from time to time, but I've never surprised one raiding my garbage can. Scary experience, considering they are the animal most likely to be rabid in this part of the country. I'd rather not have to go through the rabies vaccination process if I can help it.



Loki45 -> RE: Coyotes (7/20/2009 10:26:10 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: GreedyTop
Loki..honey.. she's asking about COYOTES of the 4 legged variety.


I know that, but they're still not scarier than CARNIES!! Just ask Austin Powers. [:D]



sirsholly -> RE: Coyotes (7/20/2009 10:27:06 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: begmeformore

we live in NC , we have coyotes also ,as many have said keep the cat inside at night ,,the bigger problem here is black bear walking into town looking for a handout from the trash cans,,,,
we have a few of those too. Surprisingly tiny little things.



sirsholly -> RE: Coyotes (7/20/2009 10:40:57 AM)

quote:

Scary experience, considering they are the animal most likely to be rabid in this part of the country. I'd rather not have to go through the vaccination process
i had to, and damnit it hurt. Needles..ugh.

Here too. We always seem to have a few raccoons that show themselves in the day time and as heart breaking as it is, you have to put them out of its misery and try  to stop the disease.

As to the vaccination...a pair of them got into our mudroom because some genius (me) left the door opened. While they were in there the door blew closed. I went out there the next morning, completely oblivious, and opened the door. They ran out and one ran across my bare foot, leaving a tiny scratch. [8|]



sirsholly -> RE: Coyotes (7/20/2009 10:43:38 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: ThatDamnedPanda

quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

And yes, as Des said, two or three can sound like twenty, and they are often much further away than they sound.


I don't know for sure, but I think that's actually an evolutionary adaptation. I know that wolves, howling in a pack, will immediately change pitch if another wolf is howling at the same pitch. It's believed that this is intended to make the pack sound as large as possible. I've never heard this about coyotes, but having lived most of my life listening to them, my educated guess is they're doing the same thing.

I am sure Celeste is right. It is amazing how animals have ways to protect themselves. Even a domestic cat will arch its back and stiffen its fur to make itself seem larger. Of course, when a kitten does it, i laugh myself stoopid...who is it trying to kid?



sirsholly -> RE: Coyotes (7/20/2009 10:46:09 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Loki45

quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

Overkill. For coyotes she's already got all the ammo she needs........Mr Loud.


What is overkill for one danger may be just adequate for another. This is one fucked up world we live in. There's no greater danger to humans than other humans (well that and carnies.....nomads you know..small hands...smell like cabbage).
Carnival workers smell like cabbage? I would have thought hot dogs and popcorn.



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