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Cockiness - 7/25/2009 4:33:26 PM

Ialdabaoth

Posts: 1073
Joined: 5/4/2008
From: Tempe, AZ
Status: offline

Okay. I prefer to be humble. I would rather other people notice my accomplishments, than bring attention to them myself.

It has been coming to my attention, for some time now, that this isn't working out so well for me.

The problem is, I have a natural predilection towards humility.

My first instinct when anything unpleasant happens is to look for what I could have done differently.
My first instinct when anything good happens is to look for other people to thank and compliment.
My first instinct whenever I'm making an important decision is to check with anyone available, to see if there's anything I might be missing.

All of this paints a portrait of me as needy, insecure, and unworthy of being a Dom, regardless of what I actually may be capable of accomplishing. (Indeed, regardless of what I actually have accomplished - I've done some pretty goddamn epic things as a dom.)

The thing is, I know how to toot my own horn; I know how to brag, and boast, and bluster, and I know how to tear other people down in ways that makes me look better... I just don't want to. The process nauseates me. Even when it doesn't hurt anyone, I find it distasteful, but especially when I fear that I might be misrepresenting myself, or hurting someone else's prestige, or even stepping in on someone else's territory... well, I'd rather lose, than win at someone else's expense - you know?

How do I get over this? How do I acquire the balls to "play with the big boys", as it were, and stop trying to be the (and I quote) "pansy little fairy faggot that doesn't want to get his hands bloody"?

How does everyone else maintain the attitude of "If I have to lose, then I'm taking the world down with me"?

< Message edited by Ialdabaoth -- 7/25/2009 4:34:03 PM >

Post #: 1

RE: Cockiness - 7/25/2009 4:40:23 PM

LillyoftheVally

Posts: 1826
Joined: 7/22/2009
Status: offline

You know humility and modesty are pretty ace traits. Sure I have said before a few times arrogance can be a really really really sexy thing, but I think that depends, arrogance and the ability to back it up is yeah nice. Anywho I do not think that 'playing wit the big boys' is a trait needed to be a good dominant, indeed being a good dominant is about the dynamic you have with your partner/s and naff all to do with anyone else. Anyways I am pretty sure you have an ability to be epically arrogant if you want to.

_____________________________

'My doctor says that I have a malformed public-duty gland and a natural deficiency in moral fibre, and that I am therefore excused from saving Universes.'

Nah I am not happy to see you either

(in reply to Ialdabaoth)

Post #: 2

RE: Cockiness - 7/25/2009 4:46:18 PM

SirMIkeSD

Posts: 613
Joined: 3/16/2007
From: San Diego, Ca
Status: offline

There is no rule that says you have to be an ass to be a dom. Sounds more like to me that you have been playing with people that think you have to be a super aggressive
ass to be a Dom and this may be effecting your confidence. Fuck them what works for you, works for you. This is bullshit, I have a very quite laid back style myself (in my mind) I don't need to be aggressive etc to get my point made to my boy. When something fails looking within to find the reason is a good trait, when others are involved and something good happens giving thanks is a good thing. I see nothing wrong with you have said, except that you want to change for others.

Mike

(in reply to Ialdabaoth)

Post #: 3

RE: Cockiness - 7/25/2009 5:03:32 PM

Ialdabaoth

Posts: 1073
Joined: 5/4/2008
From: Tempe, AZ
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SirMIkeSD

There is no rule that says you have to be an ass to be a dom. Sounds more like to me that you have been playing with people that think you have to be a super aggressive
ass to be a Dom and this may be effecting your confidence. Fuck them what works for you, works for you. This is bullshit, I have a very quite laid back style myself (in my mind) I don't need to be aggressive etc to get my point made to my boy. When something fails looking within to find the reason is a good trait, when others are involved and something good happens giving thanks is a good thing. I see nothing wrong with you have said, except that you want to change for others.

Mike

Well, thing is, I'm single. ;) And the lack of cockiness has been seriously interfering with my ability to appear desirable.

(in reply to SirMIkeSD)

Post #: 4

RE: Cockiness - 7/25/2009 5:05:58 PM

LillyoftheVally

Posts: 1826
Joined: 7/22/2009
Status: offline

How do you know that is why?

_____________________________

'My doctor says that I have a malformed public-duty gland and a natural deficiency in moral fibre, and that I am therefore excused from saving Universes.'

Nah I am not happy to see you either

(in reply to Ialdabaoth)

Post #: 5

RE: Cockiness - 7/25/2009 5:18:27 PM

SirMIkeSD

Posts: 613
Joined: 3/16/2007
From: San Diego, Ca
Status: offline

If that is the reason then are you really sure you want them. The one thing to keep in mine is that you really don't want to lose yourself changing for others just to find someone. In the end you will fall back to being you and then there will be problems and you will have wasted a lot of time. Also I can tell you that at times in play I get very cocky and that is what is needed for that moment but to carry that on full time takes way more energy and effort and is exhausting. It is damn hard to be "on" on the time.

I don't know anything about Temple but maybe it would make more sense to relocate somewhere with a larger kink population so there is more to choose from.

Mike

(in reply to LillyoftheVally)

Post #: 6

RE: Cockiness - 7/25/2009 5:27:54 PM

Apocalypso

Posts: 1104
Joined: 4/20/2009
Status: offline

Iald, I'm only saying this because I love you and shit. (In a masculine, heterosexual way, obviously. Beer! Hey, how about that sports team who were in that sporting event with another sports team? Good game! Grr! etc.)

Firstly, there's more than one kind of arrogance. Sorry, but thinking you're worse off than most people because they're twats and you're not qualifies.

Secondly, have you at least considered that the main problem may be that you're currently feeling remarkably misanthropic? And that's coming through in pretty much everything you say, at least on here. I'm not saying hide it, when that's how you feel. But it seems to me that's more likely to be the problem that anything else currently.

_____________________________

If you're going to quote from the Book of Revelation,
Don't keep calling it the "Book of Revelations",
There's no "s", it's the Book of Revelation,
As revealed to Saint John the Divine.

(in reply to LillyoftheVally)

Post #: 7

RE: Cockiness - 7/25/2009 5:30:18 PM

Level

Posts: 25145
Joined: 3/3/2006
Status: offline

Why try to become something you dislike, and have no respect for?

Find someone that fits.

_____________________________

Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

~~ Stone Temple Pilots

(in reply to Ialdabaoth)

Post #: 8

RE: Cockiness - 7/25/2009 5:33:52 PM

leadership527

Posts: 5026
Joined: 6/2/2008
Status: offline

There's something funny in what you're saying Ialdabaoth. The things you mentioned are all very strong attributes of good leadership. The whole idea that these things might be construed as weaknesses is... well... something's not adding up.

Or, put differently, I at least believe that i do all those things also, yet people don't see me as needy, insecure, or unworthy of leading.... in any context.

It would never occur to me to say, "If I have to lose, then I'm taking the world down with me." For me, it would've been an acceptable loss (because I don't allow the other kind) and so I'd have written it off and moved on.

In all my experience, quiet confidence speaks WAY more loudly than bragging.

_____________________________

~Jeff

I didn't so much "enslave" Carol as I did "enlove" her. - Me
I want a joyous, loving, respectful relationship where the male is in charge and deserves to be. - DavanKael

(in reply to Ialdabaoth)

Post #: 9

RE: Cockiness - 7/25/2009 5:38:00 PM

Level

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Joined: 3/3/2006
Status: offline

Also: if you were to say that you want to work on being more confident, then that's fine.

_____________________________

Fake the heat and scratch the itch
Skinned up knees and salty lips
Let go it's harder holding on
One more trip and I'll be gone

~~ Stone Temple Pilots

(in reply to leadership527)

Post #: 10

RE: Cockiness - 7/25/2009 6:07:31 PM

SlyStone

Posts: 398
Joined: 12/23/2006
From: Chicago
Status: offline

quote:

How do I get over this? How do I acquire the balls to "play with the big boys", as it were, and stop trying to be the (and I quote) "pansy little fairy faggot that doesn't want to get his hands bloody"?

For what it is worth, I think you are looking in the wrong direction, your issue is not an abundance of humility, it is rather a lack of self-esteem. Work from the inside, because trying to project an image that you do not believe in is a losing battle for sure.

_____________________________

Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage.

Anais Nin

(in reply to Ialdabaoth)

Post #: 11

RE: Cockiness - 7/25/2009 6:12:41 PM

CaringandReal

Posts: 1397
Joined: 2/15/2008
Status: offline

The instincts you list are signs of carefulness, a trait that's pretty important for dominants, especially when trying to make something work over a long period of time.

In private, around a submissive, do you ever act cocky? Say things just to make them sweat or laugh nervously or cause them to be appalled at your audacity? Sometimes you have to be pretty comfortable around a person do that, I think. For many dominants, it doesn't feel right to lead with that with a stranger.

Because submissives often appreciate cockiness in private with someone they trust, many think they would like a dominant they don't know to lead with it, stone cold, but I've noticed that those who claim they want flash in early courtship often can't handle the flash. They think the dominant is being impossibly rude or pushy or making brash assumptions about them or insulting them, they get all huffy, and stop talking to them. If you can, ask any brassy dominants you know about this. Audacity doesn't always pay off.

You might be surprised at how many people who are quite cocky in public are very careful and even circumscribed at times around their posessions in private. The reverse is also very much so. A dominant who comes across as very polite, careful, studied even, in public can be utterly devestating around their SOs (significant orderees) in private. They open their mouths and "the gutted forest falls to ash." So to speak. ;)

(in reply to Level)

Post #: 12

RE: Cockiness - 7/25/2009 6:17:21 PM

Ialdabaoth

Posts: 1073
Joined: 5/4/2008
From: Tempe, AZ
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SlyStone
your issue is not an abundance of humility, it is rather a lack of self-esteem.

Well, here's the real trick, then: what's self-esteem? Because, as I've mentioned, I know that I can do great things. I know that I have done great things. I just tend to not believe that people are going to believe that I can do great things.

(in reply to SlyStone)

Post #: 13

RE: Cockiness - 7/25/2009 6:21:56 PM

Aileen1968

Posts: 6062
Joined: 12/12/2007
From: I miss Shore, New Jersey
Status: offline

There is a huge difference in cockiness and confidence.

_____________________________

(in reply to Ialdabaoth)

Post #: 14

RE: Cockiness - 7/25/2009 6:37:54 PM

SlyStone

Posts: 398
Joined: 12/23/2006
From: Chicago
Status: offline

quote:

Well, here's the real trick, then: what's self-esteem? Because, as I've mentioned, I know that I can do great things. I know that I have done great things. I just tend to not believe that people are going to believe that I can do great things.

Part of self esteem is believing that you are as good ie worthwhile as the people around you. YOU may believe in your abilities, but it sounds like you don't perceive that others share your belief, because you don't feel worthy of THEIR admiration.

That is what you need to get past, and yes I know, it is easier said then done.

_____________________________

Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage.

Anais Nin

(in reply to Ialdabaoth)

Post #: 15

RE: Cockiness - 7/25/2009 7:03:23 PM

BossyShoeBitch

Posts: 3931
Joined: 1/13/2007
From: South Florida
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ialdabaoth

Okay. I prefer to be humble. I would rather other people notice my accomplishments, than bring attention to them myself.

It has been coming to my attention, for some time now, that this isn't working out so well for me.

The problem is, I have a natural predilection towards humility.

My first instinct when anything unpleasant happens is to look for what I could have done differently.

That's the same thing I do!!
Check!

quote:

My first instinct when anything good happens is to look for other people to thank and compliment.

Check!

quote:

My first instinct whenever I'm making an important decision is to check with anyone available, to see if there's anything I might be missing.

Check!

quote:

All of this paints a portrait of me as needy, insecure, and unworthy of being a Dom,

Bullshit. Says who?

quote:

The thing is, I know how to toot my own horn; I know how to brag, and boast, and bluster, and I know how to tear other people down in ways that makes me look better... I just don't want to. The process nauseates me. Even when it doesn't hurt anyone, I find it distasteful, but especially when I fear that I might be misrepresenting myself, or hurting someone else's prestige, or even stepping in on someone else's territory... well, I'd rather lose, than win at someone else's expense - you know?

Don't know about other women, but people who choose to take the "high road" just as you have desribed it above, gain and maintain my respect and admiration far faster than people who take potshots at others when the opportunity presents itself. Like when someone starts a new job. It's so easy to say, "The person before me did this wrong, and that wrong, and the other wrong too. Look at how much better I am going to do this job. MUCH better than the person before me." Instantly puts a check in my "YUK" column!
When people instead choose to say, "Everyone does things a bit differently and I'm just here to do the best that I can, I wasn't here to see the other person do their job nor do I know the circumstances under which they chose to make the decisions they did before I got here." BIG check in the "YAY" column.

And I'll also add that someone needn't feel they have to boast in order for me to notice they are exceptional. I'm a pretty smart cookie. I will notice that all by myself and in fact am much more likely to come to that determination IF the person isn't already trying to get noticed.

quote:

How do I get over this? How do I acquire the balls to "play with the big boys", as it were, and stop trying to be the (and I quote) "pansy little fairy faggot that doesn't want to get his hands bloody"?

Please dear G-d, leave those balls on the other playground! Don't try and be like that. Why the hell would you have to get your hands bloody anyway?

< Message edited by BossyShoeBitch -- 7/25/2009 7:04:21 PM >

_____________________________

A clever man can get out of situations a wise man never gets into...
A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty.

(in reply to Ialdabaoth)

Post #: 16

RE: Cockiness - 7/25/2009 7:04:36 PM

leadership527

Posts: 5026
Joined: 6/2/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Ialdabaoth
Well, here's the real trick, then: what's self-esteem? Because, as I've mentioned, I know that I can do great things. I know that I have done great things. I just tend to not believe that people are going to believe that I can do great things.

So again I need to point out that in all my experience (for whatever that's worth), people who "do great things" seldom have a hard time with people figuring that out. I don't really expect people to believe that I can or cannot do anything really. I just go ahead and DO things and then those around me see for their own eyes and make their own judgements.

It still feels to me like this whole thread is "not quite right" somehow.

_____________________________

~Jeff

I didn't so much "enslave" Carol as I did "enlove" her. - Me
I want a joyous, loving, respectful relationship where the male is in charge and deserves to be. - DavanKael

(in reply to Ialdabaoth)

Post #: 17

RE: Cockiness - 7/25/2009 7:05:52 PM

leadership527

Posts: 5026
Joined: 6/2/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aileen1968
There is a huge difference in cockiness and confidence.

One time, long ago, I went to my management mentor bent out of shape because people thought I was arrogant. Her response?

You know what the difference between arrogance and self-confidence is? Whether or not you're were actually right."

_____________________________

~Jeff

I didn't so much "enslave" Carol as I did "enlove" her. - Me
I want a joyous, loving, respectful relationship where the male is in charge and deserves to be. - DavanKael

(in reply to Aileen1968)

Post #: 18

RE: Cockiness - 7/25/2009 7:14:00 PM

Loki45

Posts: 2100
Joined: 5/13/2009
Status: offline

" They say I'm cocky, and I say What?
It aint braggin' motherfucker if ya back it up."

-- Kid Rock, Cocky

_____________________________

"'Till the roof comes off, 'till the lights go out
'Till my legs give out, can't shut my mouth."

(in reply to leadership527)

Post #: 19

RE: Cockiness - 7/25/2009 7:22:09 PM

Ialdabaoth

Posts: 1073
Joined: 5/4/2008
From: Tempe, AZ
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: leadership527
It still feels to me like this whole thread is "not quite right" somehow.

That's entirely possible, to be honest - I've been having a bit of emotional turmoil lately, which has left me a little less capable of judging my actual mood and intentions than I usually am. It's possible there's something going on with me subconsciously that's bleeding out into all of this. I definitely appreciate the heads-up.

(in reply to leadership527)

Post #: 20

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