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Am I being manipulative? - 8/5/2009 12:39:35 PM   
faithfulraven


Posts: 6
Joined: 8/5/2009
Status: offline 		This is my first post. I have been talking to some "vanilla" friends of mine, but I was hoping to get some advice from folks in the lifestyle. I have been speaking to a Dom for 2 months, we have an amazing connection. I know it is easy to share things online, but it seems like we fit so well. Anyway, he has a gf. It is difficult only talking to him 9-5. He said he is waiting for his relationship to die a natural death.

Well, I can't do it. I was becoming increasingly emotional. On nights and weekends I would be so sad and during the day I would be happy. I mean, he even asked me if I was bi-polar and that was my reality check. So, I told him i couldn't do it. I deserve more and so does he. I have told him that if he things end between he and his girlfriend, I will be here and to be honest, I will, but I can't condone his behavior.

Is this manipulation on my part?

Thank you very much for reading this and letting me share.
Profile   Post #: 1
RE: Am I being manipulative? - 8/5/2009 12:42:48 PM   
wantyourassgirl


Posts: 1
Joined: 8/5/2009
Status: offline 		You might be able to consider it manipulative but one way or the other it sounds like your doing the right thing.  At least you are making yourself available if he wants to take the plunge. I just cant imagine someone staying in a situation like that when there are so many of us guys that are willing and able...lol.

(in reply to faithfulraven)
Profile   Post #: 2
RE: Am I being manipulative? - 8/5/2009 12:45:38 PM   
SteelofUtah


Posts: 5307
Joined: 10/2/2007
From: St George Utah
Status: offline 		Nope Common sense.

I am actually impressed as this is the first time someone came on here and had already done what needed to be done and asked for advice about if it was the right thing to do rather than ask for reasons to stay with someone who was making them unhappy.

He is CHEATING and you were his Dirty lil Secret. This is why it was a 9 to 5 he could not chance having her find out about you. If he really wanted the relationship to end with her a VERY easy way of doing that would be to bring you into the open.

Now I am USUALLY an advocate for giving someone the benifit of the doubt before assuming they are a lying cheating bastard, but in this case I think that is the most likely reality of it.

I think you are better off without him, also the best advice I ever heard given to a sub....

Don't make someone your Priority while you forever remain their option.

Steel

_____________________________

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(in reply to faithfulraven)
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RE: Am I being manipulative? - 8/5/2009 12:48:22 PM   
sirsholly


Posts: 42360
Joined: 9/7/2007
From: Quietville
Status: offline 		i suspect he is married.

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RE: Am I being manipulative? - 8/5/2009 12:57:05 PM   
DemonKia


Posts: 5521
Joined: 10/13/2007
From: Chico, Nor-Cali
Status: offline 		As you've presented it, no. It sounds like you're exploring yourself & your boundaries, & you've discovered a boundary for you. Boundaries are healthy, in my book; it's possible to have too many, but I don't get any of that from what you've stated . . . . . .

For me, whether it's BDSM or vanilla, having some significant other in the background of someone I'm exploring intimate partnership of whatever sort, especially an s.o. I've never met & am not going to get to meet (& ascertain for myself that this s.o. is okay with what's going on) is a 'red flag' & / or a hard limit . . ..

I expect, from both BDSM & vanilla intimate relationships, a rather intense level of honesty & full disclosure; others' mileage may vary, but I need to know what's going on, I don't do well with secrets & hidden stuff, & those kinda things are serious trust-busters in my little corner of the universe . . . . . . . Not to mention that I focus a lot of energy & time & emotion on my intimate partnerships & want & expect similar back; the other becomes a major focus for me, & I prefer to be a major focus of theirs, too . . . . . .

The question that always seems key to me is: Is this what you want? Are you 'settling' for less than what you'd prefer? Would you seek out, or tolerate, this in your 'vanilla' dating life?

_____________________________

Snarko ergo sum.



The Verbossinator

(in reply to faithfulraven)
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RE: Am I being manipulative? - 8/5/2009 1:01:51 PM   
lovingpet


Posts: 4270
Joined: 6/19/2005
Status: offline 		I don't even know where to begin. I guess just go through things one by one. This man is passively allowing an intimate relationship to die rather than A. doing the hard work to save it if it can be saved or B. being stand up enough to just end things and allow them both to move on. I view this as weak and emotionally immature. Keep in mind, even though the two of you never met, he was cheating on this girl at least on an emotional level. I can only assume this because you did not mention if he was poly or not or whether the girlfriend knew and consented. I would say by the hours you were allowed to speak with him, this is a fair assessment. If he cheats on her, do you really think he can be trusted to not cheat on you?

Emotional subfrenzy coupled with perhaps a gut feeling that there was something wrong in the whole thing? I miss talking to my partner when he has to be at work or away on a trip and I can get a bit emotional depending on what's going on in our relationship or my life at the time. This man couldn't recognize that you cared for him enough to miss him terribly in his absence nor that his situation may be causing you some level of discomfort so attempted to label you as mentally ill. What a winner!

Yes, you do deserve more. Glad you finally woke up and recognized that. I am not sure what he deserves, however. Winding up alone since he can't manage to be satisfied in a relationship nor make the determination of what he really wants sounds fitting, but maybe I am being cruel. You are going to put your life on hold for this guy why? It doesn't seem like you are getting more by doing so. Just the opposite, you are settling for even less. Please get yourself a healthy dose of self esteem and self respect and move on. There are good dominant men out there. These men are decisive, patient, and have priorities in life. They have integrity and can be trusted. You can do better. I wish you all the best!

lovingpet

(in reply to wantyourassgirl)
Profile   Post #: 6
RE: Am I being manipulative? - 8/5/2009 2:06:16 PM   
kiwisub12


Posts: 4742
Joined: 1/11/2006
Status: offline 		Realising that you have already ended the relationship - would you really hang around waiting for a man whom you hadn't met yet, investing time and emotional energy in something that may end up a chimara?  Of course, if you weren't planning on meeting, that would be a different situation, but do you have so much time in your life that you would wait indefinitely for someone who may not brush his teeth regularly? (one of those little things you can't tell from email or phone)

(in reply to lovingpet)
Profile   Post #: 7
RE: Am I being manipulative? - 8/5/2009 2:08:19 PM   
IronBear


Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: faithfulraven

This is my first post. I have been talking to some "vanilla" friends of mine, but I was hoping to get some advice from folks in the lifestyle. I have been speaking to a Dom for 2 months, we have an amazing connection. I know it is easy to share things online, but it seems like we fit so well. Anyway, he has a gf. It is difficult only talking to him 9-5. He said he is waiting for his relationship to die a natural death.

Well, I can't do it. I was becoming increasingly emotional. On nights and weekends I would be so sad and during the day I would be happy. I mean, he even asked me if I was bi-polar and that was my reality check. So, I told him i couldn't do it. I deserve more and so does he. I have told him that if he things end between he and his girlfriend, I will be here and to be honest, I will, but I can't condone his behavior.

Is this manipulation on my part?

Thank you very much for reading this and letting me share.


I agree with Steel here. However, does it matter if we think you were manipulative or not? The question is: Do you think you are being manipulative? Honestly it matters little if I, anyone on this board or even Dr Phil thinks you are being manipulative, if you don't think so then you are only being manipulative in the eyes and by the definition of someone else who can not put your head on their shoulders to see things as you see/saw them. 


_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to faithfulraven)
Profile   Post #: 8
RE: Am I being manipulative? - 8/5/2009 2:14:34 PM   
lovingpet


Posts: 4270
Joined: 6/19/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kiwisub12

Realising that you have already ended the relationship - would you really hang around waiting for a man whom you hadn't met yet, investing time and emotional energy in something that may end up a chimara? 



That's where I run into an issue here. I don't see it as an ended relationship when OP is still waiting on him for some unlikely future. I really think the ties need to be cut. If she still sees a possible future with this man, then how can she properly move on?

Oh, and as for being manipulative. No, I don't think so. I think OP was being human and realistic. I just hope she can follow through on the whole thing.

lovingpet

(in reply to kiwisub12)
Profile   Post #: 9
RE: Am I being manipulative? - 8/5/2009 2:36:28 PM   
aldompdx


Posts: 538
Joined: 10/24/2004
Status: offline 		You are manipulating yourself, and denying the choice to do what you know is right for you.

You are crying over milk that has not yet been spilled.

Release your desire and expectation for some hot romance, and accept the reality that you can interact with him and his girlfriend as just friends. You imply that you are closed to a polyamorous interaction. Accept your reality, that you have a boundary against the situation you describe.

Acceptance and respect is one aspect of surrender. If you cannot respect and accept your own limits and boundaries, how can you ever surrender to another person?



< Message edited by aldompdx -- 8/5/2009 2:37:02 PM >

(in reply to lovingpet)
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RE: Am I being manipulative? - 8/5/2009 2:46:14 PM   
littlewonder


Posts: 15659
Status: offline 		No it's not.

It's following your morals and values and sticking to them.

I say good for you!

I personally wouldn't even be involved with him after the other relationship ends simply because it would tell me that he condones cheating...unless his current gf knows all about you...and what's to stop him from cheating on you? But that's me and not something I could be a party to.

(in reply to aldompdx)
Profile   Post #: 11
RE: Am I being manipulative? - 8/5/2009 3:10:56 PM   
Leonidas


Posts: 2078
Joined: 2/16/2004
Status: offline 		Rule 1:  You don't know who you're dealing with online.  Someone you've never met is still someone you've never met, regardless of how well his online persona gets along with your online persona.  They may exactly as they represent themselves, but you don't know, and you won't know, until you meet them.

Rule 2: If you think your online friend is an exception, refer to Rule 1.

I agree with someone who posted higher up.  The liklihood that the "girlfriend" is actually a wife with two kids and one on the way is not too bad.  Beyond that, though, would you really want to be around someone who is so confrontation averse that he'd be willing to just try to ignore a "girlfriend" until she literally goes away?  I'd say you can do better than that, but then I have to refer to Rule 1, and say I dunno, maybe you can't?

_____________________________

Take care of yourself

Leonidas

(in reply to faithfulraven)
Profile   Post #: 12
RE: Am I being manipulative? - 8/5/2009 3:55:52 PM   
DesFIP


Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline 		Stating what you need to be happy and well and not being willing to do things that make you unhappy is not being manipulative. It is instead, you having healthy boundaries and a high degree of self awareness. And these are things you need in all areas of your life. Good for you.

Stick to your guns. But don't hold your breath waiting for him because he isn't going to break off with her. Unfortunately there are men who think women who like kinky sex are all skanky hos, they're happy to have sex with them, but they wouldn't ever have a relationship with one. Sounds like he thinks like this. His loss.

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Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!


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Profile   Post #: 13
RE: Am I being manipulative? - 8/5/2009 4:37:10 PM   
KneelforAnne


Posts: 1011
Joined: 6/14/2006
Status: offline 		I think you did well. You have needs that are not being met.  He has a gf/wife that knows nothing about you or your relationship with him.  He's stringing you along, hoping to keep you on the line while living his life. 

He wasn't upset and wringing his hands because you didn't call him.  He was out living his life with his gf/wife. 



Did he call you manipulative?

I just don't see it. 

_____________________________

~Posting now as ForgetMeKnots~

BDSM is what two people at the moment decide it should be...
--CatdeMedici

Member of the Subbie Mafia
Pimpette
Member of MoGa's IN crowd

(in reply to DesFIP)
Profile   Post #: 14
RE: Am I being manipulative? - 8/5/2009 5:04:22 PM   
DarkSteven


Posts: 28072
Joined: 5/2/2008
Status: offline 		As a Dom, I resent you calling this turkey one.

He's cheating on his gf/wife with you.
He's cheating on his employer by talking to you when he's supposed to be at work.
He's cheating on you by misrepresenting the level of commitment he has at home.

He ain't no Dom.  Kick his loser ass to the curb and find a real one.

Yes, you are being manipulative, but it's not your fault.  You told the alleged Dom up front that the relationship was not fulfilling your needs.  And he ignored you.  When a Dom twiddles instead of taking control, the sub will.  And it's not her fault.



_____________________________

"You women....

The small-breasted ones want larger breasts. The large-breasted ones want smaller ones. The straight-haired ones curl their hair, and the curly-haired ones straighten theirs...

Quit fretting. We men love you."

(in reply to KneelforAnne)
Profile   Post #: 15
RE: Am I being manipulative? - 8/5/2009 5:33:24 PM   
TreasureKY


Posts: 3032
Joined: 4/10/2007
From: Kentucky
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: faithfulraven

Is this manipulation on my part?


I suspect you already know the answer, but let me help you realize it....

Would it be manipulative if you told your husband that he either stopped beating you or you would leave?

Would it be manipulative if you told your child to do his homework or he won't be able to go to the movies?

Would it be manipulative if you told your employee that if they didn't start showing up for work on time everyday, that you would fire them?

Would it be manipulative if the government told you to pay your taxes or you go to jail?

To manipulate is the influence or control using devious or deceptive methods. 

For example, had you never called things off and explained to him why... but simply behaved in a pouty manner or taken other steps to "punish" him in an attempt to maneuver him into doing what you wanted... then that would have been manipulative.

(in reply to faithfulraven)
Profile   Post #: 16
RE: Am I being manipulative? - 8/5/2009 5:44:06 PM   
lilgirl2008


Posts: 73
Joined: 1/4/2008
Status: offline 		I love it when someone puts an idea in our head, and we question ourselves...
Is it manipulative to want and desire more then you are given. No it is not. You did the right thing for you. Actually you have been manipulated by him. Anyone who keeps a wife or girlfriend and has a submissive on the side, and all parties are not involved, is not a dom in my book. So he manipulated you into thinking he was actually a dom. Your part in this is that you believed him. You wised up and made a good choice for yourself.

Good job and good luck. Stay away from people already involved with girl friends or wives, unless of course they are openly poly. No good can come of it.

(in reply to faithfulraven)
Profile   Post #: 17
RE: Am I being manipulative? - 8/5/2009 6:24:42 PM   
slavegirlbc


Posts: 22
Joined: 6/23/2009
Status: offline 		You did the right thing. The first thing you know about him is that he has an amazing connection with you.. but will passively cheat on his girlfriend talking to you and not to anything so you can be together.

that is crazy making behavoir. no wonder you were being emotional.

i can so relate. my ex Master was stringing me along with something similar, and every time he would say the relationship he was in was going to end naturally soon, and then we would be together, i would think 'and what is the timeline you give for our relationship to fail if we ever get together'.

i finally gathered together my self respect and logic and told him i was takign back my independance and seeing a new Master. it was so hard for me to face how flawed he was and how dishonest the situation was because of the incredible emotional connection and love i had for him... i couldn't beleive that this amount of love could be here and things could not work out. it was extremely hard. but i will never go against my priniciples and morality for anyone again, no matter how i feel about him.

(in reply to lilgirl2008)
Profile   Post #: 18
RE: Am I being manipulative? - 8/5/2009 7:25:28 PM   
leadership527


Posts: 5026
Joined: 6/2/2008
Status: offline 		"Manipulative" is a tricky word. It is not possible to utter a word, strike a pose, or glance in a direction without, in some way, effecting those around you. So if you want to get all wrapped up around it, being human is manipulative. For me, especially, because I tend to have a really good idea how people work, it's almost impossible not to manipulate. I mean seriously, if you know a button exists and what it does, then whether your press it or not, you have made a choice that affects the other person. So for me, I got it down to just two issues:

a) Was my intent good or bad?
b) Was I covert or overt?

In this case, you're being very overt with him. He knows what's going on. Sure, you're emotions are running around and dragging both of you along with for the ride... but welcome to being human.

"No" is my answer.

_____________________________

~Jeff

I didn't so much "enslave" Carol as I did "enlove" her. - Me
I want a joyous, loving, respectful relationship where the male is in charge and deserves to be. - DavanKael

(in reply to faithfulraven)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: Am I being manipulative? - 8/5/2009 8:05:21 PM   
Joseff


Posts: 505
Joined: 6/2/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SteelofUtah

Don't make someone your Priority while you forever remain their option.

Steel


Steel, that's brilliant, mind if I steal it?


_____________________________

This is gonna hurt...

Joseff

(in reply to SteelofUtah)
Profile   Post #: 20
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