RE: Britons defend their health care from US criticism

RE: Britons defend their health care from US criticism (Full Version)

All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Dungeon of Political and Religious Discussion

Message

Brain -> RE: Britons defend their health care from US criticism (8/14/2009 3:06:27 PM)
Anti-healthcare lobbyists duped us, say Katie Brickell and Kate Spall Two British women who have become the unwitting stars of a campaign to derail Barack Obama’s healthcare reforms yesterday said that their views on the NHS had been misrepresented. http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article6795466.ece

LillyoftheVally -> RE: Britons defend their health care from US criticism (8/14/2009 3:10:54 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Brain Anti-healthcare lobbyists duped us, say Katie Brickell and Kate Spall Two British women who have become the unwitting stars of a campaign to derail Barack Obama’s healthcare reforms yesterday said that their views on the NHS had been misrepresented. Its pretty worrying that part I think. The fact that it is being used as evidence that we hate the system, the fact they couldn't find someone to say it with all the knowledge speaks volumes.

stella41b -> RE: Britons defend their health care from US criticism (8/14/2009 3:47:47 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Brain Anti-healthcare lobbyists duped us, say Katie Brickell and Kate Spall Two British women who have become the unwitting stars of a campaign to derail Barack Obama’s healthcare reforms yesterday said that their views on the NHS had been misrepresented. http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article6795466.ece Yes, quite. And it's these women who were defending the rights of patients who would also defend the rights of US patients who currently slip through the net and don't have adequate access to healthcare. Kind of proves Obama's point, doesn't it? Sure, you can find people critical of the NHS, but Lord help any politician or anyone who even suggests abolishing it or replacing it. That in the UK would mean political suicide.

LillyoftheVally -> RE: Britons defend their health care from US criticism (8/14/2009 3:50:47 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: stella41b but Lord help any politician or anyone who even suggests abolishing it or replacing it. That in the UK would mean political suicide. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/8200817.stm Already happened, don't think 'Dave' is happy about it though

rulemylife -> RE: Britons defend their health care from US criticism (8/14/2009 3:59:08 PM)
What I find absolutely fascinating is the deafening silence from those who have touted the CPR claims and the various horrors of socialized health care in other countries.

Politesub53 -> RE: Britons defend their health care from US criticism (8/14/2009 4:40:22 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: servantforuse Well, The Brits nave never been known for straight teeth and a nice smile.. More bullshit from you, can you back this up with some facts or is this another mythical assertion ? Here is a question, what is the biggest cause of personal bankruptcies in the US. Housing debts or medical debts ? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medical_debt

Brain -> RE: Britons defend their health care from US criticism (8/15/2009 2:50:29 AM)
http://www.digitaljournal.com/article/277644 Britons Say Health Program Critics 'Jaw-Droppingly Untruthful' Posted Aug 14, 2009 by ■ Carol Forsloff David Owen Anti Socialized Medicine rally in Fort Collins, CO As critics of Obama’s health care program have reported all sorts of things about the British and Canadian systems of health care, some question the veracity of their complaints. American television quotes people from Canada as waiting a long time for care, then having to go to the United States because the Canadian system is so poor. The same criticism is leveled on Britain’s program as well. The Washington Post points out that Hamish Meldrum, the chairman of the British Medical Association, remarked about how dismayed he has been by what he calls "jaw-droppingly untruthful attacks" by some American critics. One of the rumors and untruths most surprising to Meldrum and other Brits was the remark made by Senate Finance Committee Chairman Charles E. Grassley (R-Iowa) about Edward Kennedy and treatment for his brain tumor. Grassley said were Kennedy, age 77, in the United Kingdom, he wouldn’t receive treatment for his cancer because he is too old. Some Canadians out of Toronto have responded vigorously to television advertisements about Canada’s health care program in which a woman discusses the fact she wouldn’t be given treatment for a condition in any timely way and would have to go to the United States for care. A recent television news program recently showed interviews of different Canadians about the United States debate over health care and claims that Canada’s program is insufficient and America’s better. Virtually all agreed that Canada’s program might have a few problems, but for the most part provided good care and gave services better and just as timely without the heavy burden of cost as in the United States. Here is the response of one of those interviewed with respect to those Canadians being shown on United States television summarized by The Real News: “SYLVAIN MEYROUS: I think it's totally shocking. It's not—doesn't reflect reality. I think, from what I gather, most Canadians are very happy with their medical system. As a new Canadian myself, I am very satisfied with the system. And I lived in the US before, and I had medical problems there, and I can appreciate the difference. It doesn't even compare.” While people of Canada and Great Britain respond to America’s claims about the inferior quality of their systems compared to those of the United States, people in the United States wonder about people like Sarah Palin, who brings her child Trigg into the discussion on her Facebook page: “The Democrats promise that a government health care system will reduce the cost of health care, but as the economist Thomas Sowell has pointed out, government health care will not reduce the cost; it will simply refuse to pay the cost. And who will suffer the most when they ration care? The sick, the elderly, and the disabled, of course. The America I know and love is not one in which my parents or my baby with Down Syndrome will have to stand in front of Obama's "death panel" so his bureaucrats can decide, based on a subjective judgment of their "level of productivity in society," whether they are worthy of health care. Such a system is downright evil.” One writer who uses the term “Anonymous Liberal” for postings, provides the illuminating reminder that insurance companies already don’t cover individuals with Down Syndrome, because they have pre-existing conditions. The debate about health care continues in the United States, as more and more people examine claims made by the opposition and wonder, as do the Britons, Canadians and people in the United States, how is it possible to make claims that counter the facts and have so many people repeat them as true all over the country? And how will that impact the lives of people who need health care and look for a change given the untruthfulness of claims that might confuse and make people angry?

Politesub53 -> RE: Britons defend their health care from US criticism (8/15/2009 3:14:12 AM)
Thats the tactic of critics Brain, scare people into thinking public health care sytems are awful, by using untruths, commonly known as lies.

stella41b -> RE: Britons defend their health care from US criticism (8/15/2009 6:25:15 AM)
Sarah Palin bringing her child Trigg into the argument doesn't make much sense because Sarah Palin is rich and can afford the medical cover and treatment. But can she find a mother on a low income or welfare with a child with Down's Syndrome who receives the same or similar standards of care and treatment? Probably not in the States it seems but here in the UK it wouldn't be too difficult. Kind of blows that argument right out of the water, doesn't it?

Sanity -> RE: Britons defend their health care from US criticism (8/15/2009 6:54:22 AM)
quote: Secret NHS plan to ration patient care PATIENTS are being denied appointments with consultants in a systematic attempt to ration care and save the NHS money, The Times has learnt. Leaked documents passed to The Times show that while ministers promise patients choice, a series of barriers are being erected limiting GPs’ rights to refer people to consultants. The documents reveal that health trusts across London have drawn up plans to establish panels that will “monitor” how many patients are referred to hospital by GPs. Local health trusts have been told that they must cut GP referral rates to those of the lowest 10 per cent nationally. This, the document claims, would save £25 million a year in the capital. Consultant-to-consultant referrals are also being limited, in many cases denying patients a second opinion. Patients who use hospital accident and emergency units to obtain care that could be provided by GPs are also targeted. Emergency care practitioners in A&E departments will “redirect” 40-70 per cent of patients back to GPs or walk-in centres. Hospitals that treat people who ought to have been sent to their GPs will not be paid. (Full article here).

Apocalypso -> RE: Britons defend their health care from US criticism (8/15/2009 6:56:43 AM)
But Sanity, it's not like people can't still go private if they want to. In other words, the options you have are still open to us. It's just not our only choice.

LillyoftheVally -> RE: Britons defend their health care from US criticism (8/15/2009 6:58:27 AM)
FR I wonder, I mean I live here, I have always managed to see my GP, and specialists, as have all my family members, sure not perfect but I really do take issue with people who have not experienced our system arguing that we all must hate it

servantforuse -> RE: Britons defend their health care from US criticism (8/15/2009 7:00:31 AM)
If the government takes over health care, the private companies will be put out of business. There will be no other option,,,,

Starbuck09 -> RE: Britons defend their health care from US criticism (8/15/2009 7:00:41 AM)
Sanity in Britain if you are wealthy and wish for private care you are quite at libert to do so in our excellent society. If you are poor and cannot afford it then there is no problem as you can use the n.h..s. with a slight reduction in quality and some lengthy waiting times e.t.c. but completely for free. Our citizens enjoy the health care they choose.

Starbuck09 -> RE: Britons defend their health care from US criticism (8/15/2009 7:01:56 AM)
Servantforuse in Britain we have both private and government run health care. You can check for yourself if you do not believe me.

Apocalypso -> RE: Britons defend their health care from US criticism (8/15/2009 7:02:48 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: servantforuse If the government takes over health care, the private companies will be put out of business. There will be no other option,,,, Google BUPA.

FullCircle -> RE: Britons defend their health care from US criticism (8/15/2009 7:03:51 AM)
The difference is we don't have to pay insurance companies something that may just be money for nothing. People know that every penny they pay to the NHS goes towards either administration of the NHS or the treatment of someone in NHS care. When people pay an insurance company the company takes bets on who is going to actually need treatment; so you have an unnecessary financial layer (of risk games) which for the most part just lines the pockets of the share holders. This is why they pay so much they are paying people for their care who are just giving some of that money to shareholders via dividends.

Lucylastic -> RE: Britons defend their health care from US criticism (8/15/2009 7:06:09 AM)
servantforuse Both the UK and Canada have private insurance companies. Nothing I have seen or read or watched apart from the scare mongers tells me that ALL private insurance will be stamped out, cmon stop grasping at straws and using stereotypes.

FullCircle -> RE: Britons defend their health care from US criticism (8/15/2009 7:09:01 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: servantforuse If the government takes over health care, the private companies will be put out of business. There will be no other option,,,, Since when did human suffering become an ethical business to profit from? I don't care if the NHS has a monopoly they can keep their monopoly.

Sanity -> RE: Britons defend their health care from US criticism (8/15/2009 7:09:39 AM)
Your problems seem indicative of the kind of results one should expect with British dental care: http://www.politicsdaily.com/2009/08/05/when-health-care-rationing-fails-why-the-british-have-bad-teeth/ quote: ORIGINAL: Aneirin Just to point out regards the dental system, I still cannot get an NHS dentist, I have gone down all the channels, done everything and now I await a response. My current application is eight months old, the one before that, twelve months old, a recent phone call to my area primary care trust revealed they had not forgotten about me, I was on the system, but there are no NHS dentists available, simple as that. So now I am reliant on the emergency dental care system, which operates on a first come first served basis with a five minute window of application. The application procedure should be one whole morning, but the demand is so great, if you don't get that phone ringing a minute or two before they open the lines, forget it, for it is a permanent engaged tone after which there are no places left. My teeth are a constant problem, because I brux and have TMD caused by bruxing, gum guards I grind through or spit out at night. No, not proper dental gumguards, but the sports type, hardly the right thing, but the right thing is only available through a dentist, which I cannot get, so have to do my best with what I have and live on a diet of codeine, and clove oil. Getting kind of desperate now, because the codeine seems not to be working as well as it did. So the NHS in general, I did possibly wrongly have high expectations of it, I tend to do that, but in reality, and from experience, aside from the dental servive in my area, I find it is ok, not perfect, but it suits my needs. Yeah, it can be slow, but then I think that is a thing in general with British systems, the law and justice system for example, I jokingly think they must be stopping for a cup of tea between every thought and action, quite possibly the British way, have a cup of tea and think about it.

Page: << < prev 1 [2] 3 4 5 next > >>

Collarchat.com © 2025

Terms of Service

3.100586E-02