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RE: Swine flu affidavit filed by Dr Horowitz MUST re... - 9/24/2009 9:06:04 AM   
SL4V3M4YB3


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Status: offline 		If that is what the thread is about it will be very short lived.

Mind you having said that this is the internet. Some people take that 'the bigger the lie' saying far too literally.

It's sad I even have to point these facts out but the birth-rate in the west is not really fuelling the global population problem as it is. So are the vaccines solely being utilised in the poorest nations with such population problems? Humm seems not humm seems the west is looking after itself first as per usual.


< Message edited by SL4V3M4YB3 -- 9/24/2009 9:20:33 AM >

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RE: Swine flu affidavit filed by Dr Horowitz MUST re... - 9/24/2009 9:21:45 AM   
Rule


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Status: offline 		The objective may be to reduce world population to two hundred million people in 2100.

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RE: Swine flu affidavit filed by Dr Horowitz MUST re... - 9/24/2009 9:30:43 AM   
Termyn8or


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Status: offline 		I dunno, is the thread, or any thread that specific ? I think of it this way, all the shit, discounting any malfeasance or treachery implied or otherwise, has made money.

One could also wonder when one aspires to become a doctor, how much of that desire is impelled by the relatively high earnings versus the desire to truly help people.

Believe me we here at CM can keep any thread alive, but we really hate to see them go on total life support :-)

T

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RE: Swine flu affidavit filed by Dr Horowitz MUST re... - 9/24/2009 9:33:38 AM   
Moonhead


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Status: offline 		There's much faster ways of doing that than tampering with 'flu vaccines, though.

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RE: Swine flu affidavit filed by Dr Horowitz MUST re... - 9/24/2009 9:44:12 AM   
Rule


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Termyn8or
One could also wonder when one aspires to become a doctor, how much of that desire is impelled by the relatively high earnings versus the desire to truly help people.

I did study biology. In the first year there were a lot of people who aspired to become a physician, but who did not make the ballot. All they talked about was how much money they were going to make when they were physicians. I have never heard any of them say that they desired to help people.

Edited to add: most physicians are not scientists. Physicians are trained to make a diagnosis and to prescribe medication or treatment. I guess they will eventually be replaced by a computer.

< Message edited by Rule -- 9/24/2009 9:50:41 AM >

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RE: Swine flu affidavit filed by Dr Horowitz MUST re... - 9/24/2009 9:47:24 AM   
Rule


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead
There's much faster ways of doing that than tampering with 'flu vaccines, though.

Like what? Introducing the HIV virus has not reduced world population. Neither have any wars. In fact I surmise that the opposite effect occurs: "My relatives / friends died. I am going to breed me lots of new relatives / friends."

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RE: Swine flu affidavit filed by Dr Horowitz MUST re... - 9/24/2009 9:55:39 AM   
Missokyst


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Status: offline 		I am not seeing a downside. 

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rule

This thread is not about the benefit or harm of ordinary vaccines, SM. It is about the suspicion that malevolent people have conspired to add antigenic epitopes to globally administered vaccines that will evoke an autoimmune response that causes infertility in all vaccinated people.

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RE: Swine flu affidavit filed by Dr Horowitz MUST re... - 9/24/2009 9:57:00 AM   
MrRodgers


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Status: offline 		Look kinkroids, all of this discussion is mute. There is no grand unified conspiracy to reduce the population. When and if that comes it will be a whole lot more dangerous than any flu. We are talking plague stuff.

Profits will not be the goal as the dead are no longer consumers.

However, with these two 'swine' flues the mission is profits. Novavax stock has taken its big jump it being the major player in vaccines. Profit on the stocks and now profit for Novavax. Mission accomplished.

We are here after all...to make some fucking money. Not caring a whole lot how we go about doing that...means the next question is when do we dump Novavax and get into Merck ?

I keep some money in derivatives knowing full well that it is all...too big to fail.

Capitalism is such fun.

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RE: Swine flu affidavit filed by Dr Horowitz MUST re... - 9/24/2009 10:05:42 AM   
Rule


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Status: offline 		That is okay. I am all in favour of world population reduction too. I do not like the sneaky way they go about it, though.

I favour allowing only one in ten fertile women to have one successful pregnancy, and if resulting in multiple female offspring to have only one of them eligible to have a pregnancy.
I would favour in each community say one in twelve fertile females to be chosen by lot and the remainder having to qualify by winning various contests. That would reduce world population by a factor of twenty; so, if now there are six billion, the reduction would be to 300 million. In a subsequent generation it might be reduced to two hundred million (which is still a huge number).

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RE: Swine flu affidavit filed by Dr Horowitz MUST re... - 9/24/2009 10:34:43 AM   
Moonhead


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Status: offline 		You think that HIV is the result of a conspiracy as well?
A serious outbreak of pneumonic plague (or several of the diseases the vaccines are for, come to that) would drop the population a fair bit.
I was thinking more of wars, starvation and the like, to be honest.

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RE: Swine flu affidavit filed by Dr Horowitz MUST re... - 9/24/2009 10:35:48 AM   
SL4V3M4YB3


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Rule
The objective may be to reduce world population to two hundred million people in 2100.

Now that would be farfetched: any politician caring what happens to the world beyond their lifetime.

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RE: Swine flu affidavit filed by Dr Horowitz MUST re... - 9/24/2009 10:44:57 AM   
DomKen


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Rule

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen
BTW the anti vaxers may have had every right to question the safety of thimerosol but the research has been done and it has no relationship to autism. To continue to push any sort of linkage between vaccines and autism is simply unsupportable. The research has been done and no link exists.

I know quite a lot of immunology. I agree that research has been done and that the investigations yielded no positive results. Nevertheless, autism does appear to be linked to vaccinations and does appear to be caused by an auto-immune reaction triggered by vaccination. We simply have no idea what the connection might be. Perhaps it is an immunological reaction against a marker that is only present in some juveniles. Perhaps it is something generic. If I recall correctly, all vaccines have some molecule from sea urchins in them; perhaps it is linked to that. Or perhaps something in the blood binds to the antigenic epitope in the vaccine, causing an immunological reaction against self, and if that self-antigenic epitope happens to be identical to a brain cell antigenic epitope, then those brain cells would be destroyed.

No. Autism does not appear to be linked to vaccinations. This has been studied to death and there is no link at all. Some people perceived a linkage between vaccinations and the first appearance of autistic symptoms but improvements in uderstanding the early signs of autism have shown it is already happening by the time of the child's first birthday when the vaccines are administered.

The scientific research on this was sufficient to put an end to anti vax litigation in the US.
http://www.slate.com/id/2211156/pagenum/all/#p2

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RE: Swine flu affidavit filed by Dr Horowitz MUST re... - 9/24/2009 11:10:58 AM   
sirsholly


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quote:

Autism does not appear to be linked to vaccinations. This has been studied to death and there is no link at all. Some people perceived a linkage between vaccinations and the first appearance of autistic symptoms but improvements in uderstanding the early signs of autism have shown it is already happening by the time of the child's first birthday when the vaccines are administered.


Vaccines begin at 2 months of age with DPT, Hib, Polio and PCV.

The signs of autism can appear in a child of 12 months, but mostly it appears when the little one is between 3 and 4 yrs of age.

< Message edited by sirsholly -- 9/24/2009 11:11:31 AM >

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RE: Swine flu affidavit filed by Dr Horowitz MUST re... - 9/24/2009 11:11:39 AM   
Rule


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen
improvements in uderstanding the early signs of autism have shown it is already happening by the time of the child's first birthday when the vaccines are administered.

It has been only a couple of decades since eminent 'scientists' made the ridiculous claim that autism was caused by cold mothers.
I do not know that symptoms manifest before the administration of any vaccine. Do you have a reference?

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen
The scientific research on this was sufficient to put an end to anti vax litigation in the US.
http://www.slate.com/id/2211156/pagenum/all/#p2

That particular research answers some hypothesises, but they do not prove that there is no other vaccine related mechanism.

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RE: Swine flu affidavit filed by Dr Horowitz MUST re... - 9/24/2009 11:13:06 AM   
Rule


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quote:

ORIGINAL: sirsholly
Vaccines begin at 2 months of age with DPT, Hib, Polio and PCV.

The signs of autism can appear in a child of 12 months, but mostly it appears when the little one is between 3 and 4 yrs of age.

Ah.

So DomKen, do you have a reference showing that the first symptoms of autism in all such children occurred before they were two months of age?


< Message edited by Rule -- 9/24/2009 11:15:16 AM >

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RE: Swine flu affidavit filed by Dr Horowitz MUST re... - 9/24/2009 11:22:51 AM   
RCdc


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Status: offline 		I am not a nurse.  Not a scientist.  But I do know this from personal observation.
My children had the vaccine and they are unaffected.
But I still remember sitting in the clinic, with children about to have the jabs, or people I know sending their children for the jabs with fevers, sore throats and colds and sickness - EVERYTHING that the doctors and nurses warn you not to bring them with and to wait.  I have heard people tell me, that they didn't want to risk waiting or could not spend(waste) the time booking another appointment and then wondering why their children come down even sicker.
And then the result I see is friends and family with children who now have autism.

the.dark.

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RE: Swine flu affidavit filed by Dr Horowitz MUST re... - 9/24/2009 11:22:58 AM   
thornhappy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: sirsholly
http://www.healing-arts.org/children/autism-overview.htm#MMR%20Vaccine%20and%20Autism
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thiomersal_controversy


However, long after thimerosal was removed, the autism rate's continued to increase...

thornhappy

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RE: Swine flu affidavit filed by Dr Horowitz MUST re... - 9/24/2009 11:23:54 AM   
bluefireeyez


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Status: offline 		The cause of Autism is still highly speculative. The common knowledge is that it is the Mercury in one of the vaccines (I can't remember which one), but they have switched the vaccine from one dose to two and eliminated the Mercury. Is the common knowledge right? There is no scientific data to back it up 100%.

Working in the field, I know that depending on the form (whether it is Autism, PDD, or Aspergers) will highly depend on when the symptoms manifest. Unfortunately, it does tend to show in the middle of the time when children are vaccinated. Hopefully we will make progress in understanding what the causes are and see if it is preventable.

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RE: Swine flu affidavit filed by Dr Horowitz MUST re... - 9/24/2009 11:54:20 AM   
sirsholly


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quote:

ORIGINAL: thornhappy

quote:

ORIGINAL: sirsholly
http://www.healing-arts.org/children/autism-overview.htm#MMR%20Vaccine%20and%20Autism
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thiomersal_controversy


However, long after thimerosal was removed, the autism rate's continued to increase...

thornhappy

true...but the umbrella has widened as well, Thorny. Instead of Autism, it is now Autism Spectrum Disorder, which can include PPD, Aspergers, and i have no idea what else.


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RE: Swine flu affidavit filed by Dr Horowitz MUST re... - 9/24/2009 12:20:23 PM   
Moonhead


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quote:

ORIGINAL: bluefireeyez

The cause of Autism is still highly speculative. The common knowledge is that it is the Mercury in one of the vaccines (I can't remember which one), but they have switched the vaccine from one dose to two and eliminated the Mercury. Is the common knowledge right? There is no scientific data to back it up 100%.

Working in the field, I know that depending on the form (whether it is Autism, PDD, or Aspergers) will highly depend on when the symptoms manifest. Unfortunately, it does tend to show in the middle of the time when children are vaccinated. Hopefully we will make progress in understanding what the causes are and see if it is preventable.

A lot of people in the medical profession are convinced that the common knowledge is barking up the wrong tree. People waiting until they're older to have kids and (as sirsholly says) a widening of what constitutes autism are a lot more likely as causes for the increasing number of diagnoses, along with improvements in screening.

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