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RE: Believer(s) of god are plague to this world. - 10/17/2009 8:47:40 PM   
Rule


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quote:

ORIGINAL: ThatDamnedPanda
If you were one of my students, I'd flunk you for that!!!!

lol

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RE: Believer(s) of god are plague to this world. - 10/17/2009 8:48:54 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		Will do as soon as you let me know you have pulled your nose back into the area of sunshine

~smiles

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Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

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RE: Believer(s) of god are plague to this world. - 10/17/2009 10:10:20 PM   
HatesParisHilton


Posts: 3513
Joined: 12/27/2006
Status: offline 		I believe that Dog Whores and Foodies are the modern equivalent of Idol Worshippers  They just worship crap that doesn't matter.

So, OP, does that mean that they fall into the category of your initial post?

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RE: Believer(s) of god are plague to this world. - 10/17/2009 10:27:31 PM   
ThatDamnedPanda


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quote:

ORIGINAL: SpinnerofTales

quote:

I absolutely, unequivocally believe in a god, but hate organized religion. So I am constantly lumped in with "atheists" and lectured to about the importance of faith and the emptiness of my existence. It becomes quite tiring after a point. ORIGINAL: ThatDamnedPanda


As one of those atheists, I fully agree there is a difference between a belief in God and a belief in religion. Religion is the belief that God has come down and given a set of rules for his favorites to obey. Mostly it's used like a little bully uses a big brother, as a weapon. "Do what I say or God will punish you."




I agree completely. To me, religion is what gives god a bad name. The god I believe in has only one bumper sticker on his car - "Shit Happens." I'd like to think god has much more important things to contemplate than  whether Steel cheats on his taxes or Mars paid for that candy bar he ate while shopping with his wife the other day.


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In the forest of the night
What immortal hand or eye
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RE: Believer(s) of god are plague to this world. - 10/17/2009 11:28:55 PM   
Kirata


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quote:

ORIGINAL: ThatDamnedPanda

I'd like to think god has much more important things to contemplate than whether Steel cheats on his taxes or Mars paid for that candy bar he ate while shopping with his wife the other day.

I don't think Deity would need to prioritize its time like that. It doesn't make sense to me that anything could be separate from God. "Raw materials" existing independently to play around building universes with? Where'd they come from? Creation ex nihilo? I think there would have to be an awareness in the mind of God of even the pettiest of cheating and stealing, and of every small kindness too, not because "God is watching us" but because we would not be separate from That, nor It separate from us.

This post, however, may be "separate" from the topic.

K.




< Message edited by Kirata -- 10/17/2009 11:48:31 PM >

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RE: Believer(s) of god are plague to this world. - 10/17/2009 11:44:01 PM   
ThatDamnedPanda


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: ThatDamnedPanda

I'd like to think god has much more important things to contemplate than whether Steel cheats on his taxes or Mars paid for that candy bar he ate while shopping with his wife the other day.

I don't think Deity would need to prioritize its time like that. It doesn't make sense to me that anything could be separate from God. "Raw materials" existing independently to play around building universes with? Where'd they come from? Creation ex nihilo? I think there would have to be an awareness in the mind of God of even the pettiest of cheating and stealing, and of every small kindness too, not because "God is watching us" but because we would not be separate from That, nor It separate from us.

This post, however, may be "separate" from the topic.

K.





Yeah, but it might fit rather comfortably in another thread I was thinking of starting, because I think it's got the potential to be a fascinating discussion. I might start it tomorrow, if I'm not too busy. Sunday's my birthday, and I've got lots of plans. Might not have time to shepherd a thread.


_____________________________

Panda, panda, burning bright
In the forest of the night
What immortal hand or eye
Made you all black and white and roly-poly like that?


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RE: Believer(s) of god are plague to this world. - 10/17/2009 11:50:30 PM   
Kirata


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quote:

ORIGINAL: ThatDamnedPanda

Sunday's my birthday, and I've got lots of plans.

Hey! Happy Birthday, Panda!!

K.

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RE: Believer(s) of god are plague to this world. - 10/18/2009 4:27:35 AM   
thishereboi


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Status: offline 		  Happy Birthday

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RE: Believer(s) of god are plague to this world. - 10/18/2009 5:24:54 AM   
Acer49


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Brain

'We Few, We Happy Few, We Band of Brothers' by Dr. Andy Thomson, AAI 2007

Dr. Andy Thomson gives a talk on the motives behind suicide terrorism at the Atheist Alliance International 2007 Conference in Washington, D.C. This video is available on DVD as part of the 'AAI 2...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FpImeYCZKBk&feature=sub


A plague? Well I guess not big enough because there are stil indivduals who feel compelled to kill themselves and others.

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RE: Believer(s) of god are plague to this world. - 10/18/2009 5:40:14 AM   
DarkSteven


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quote:

ORIGINAL: ThatDamnedPanda

quote:

ORIGINAL: SpinnerofTales

quote:

I absolutely, unequivocally believe in a god, but hate organized religion. So I am constantly lumped in with "atheists" and lectured to about the importance of faith and the emptiness of my existence. It becomes quite tiring after a point. ORIGINAL: ThatDamnedPanda


As one of those atheists, I fully agree there is a difference between a belief in God and a belief in religion. Religion is the belief that God has come down and given a set of rules for his favorites to obey. Mostly it's used like a little bully uses a big brother, as a weapon. "Do what I say or God will punish you."



I agree completely. To me, religion is what gives god a bad name. The god I believe in has only one bumper sticker on his car - "Shit Happens." I'd like to think god has much more important things to contemplate than  whether Steel cheats on his taxes or Mars paid for that candy bar he ate while shopping with his wife the other day.



I believe in God.  I also believe in free will.

Every single person, whether a saint or ethically challenged, knows what is right and what is wrong.  Hell, even a dog knows what it's not supposed to do.

I feel when we do the right thing, that that's beautiful.  I'm not going to say that God had no hand in creating the system under which we have moral compasses and follow them.  Not 100% of the time, but we do for the most part.



_____________________________

"You women....

The small-breasted ones want larger breasts. The large-breasted ones want smaller ones. The straight-haired ones curl their hair, and the curly-haired ones straighten theirs...

Quit fretting. We men love you."

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RE: Believer(s) of god are plague to this world. - 10/18/2009 5:56:45 AM   
Rule


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DarkSteven
Every single person, whether a saint or ethically challenged, knows what is right and what is wrong.

That is not true. Some people have to be told. And even if such told people know, it does not matter one whit if they do not care for it - and they don't.

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RE: Believer(s) of god are plague to this world. - 10/18/2009 6:06:58 AM   
Wolf2Bear


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Rule

quote:

ORIGINAL: Wolf2Bear
Seems to me that an infant's psychology isn't set at that early age enough that would cause a psychological effect later in life. Granted there are some cases where certain psychological harm at a very early age does have noticeable repercussions later on, but the removal of a piece of skin?

How about the removal of the tail or ears of a puppy? Or one of them tiny toes? Or the genitalia of a girl?
Circumcision is a violation of the integrity of the child, of the sanctity of his body. It is an act of extreme aggression.

As for me: my memory goes back to when I was suckled by my mom, who always stopped at six months and I do recall that I had many months of memories before that, perhaps up to or even before my birth. (I cannot remember being born and suspect that I was asleep at the time.)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Wolf2Bear
most of us who are circumcised as an infant, don't recall having it done thus our mindset is of indifference based upon the fact that it happened at such an earlier age that we dismiss it as something which is inconsequential.

Pff. There is one part of the mind that hides the memory of trauma's from other parts of the mind. That you do not recall it consciously does not mean that the traumatic memory is not present in your subconscious mind.

Edited to add: my previous posts were not about any psychological trauma caused by circumcision - that is another subject entirely - but about the inevitable evolutionary repercussions on the composition of the gene pool, and on the phenotypes (including cultural behavior) of individuals in the affected population.


Yet if the conscious mind does not remember a past trauma to the body, then why as an adult get bent out of shape over a memory which is deeply repressed and likey never to resurface? Granted my parents could have chosen not to have me circumcised yet they chose to have this done based upon the info they believed at that time.


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Take the pain
Take the pleasure
I'm the master of both
Close your eyes, not your mind
Let me into your soul
I'm gonna work it 'til your totally blown

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RE: Believer(s) of god are plague to this world. - 10/18/2009 6:35:46 AM   
Rule


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Wolf2Bear
Yet if the conscious mind does not remember a past trauma to the body, then why as an adult get bent out of shape over a memory which is deeply repressed and likely never to resurface?

You are quite right. If there is no conscious memory, there is no reason to be upset about it.
However, it does not negate the fact that a violation of the body occurred and that this violation may have had - in my opinion is likely to have had - an effect on the psyche of the child.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Wolf2Bear
Granted my parents could have chosen not to have me circumcised yet they chose to have this done based upon the info they believed at that time.

It is not the Christian way. Saint Paul has argued brilliantly against the practice of circumcision. The Christian way is to accept suffering, is to accept death as in the best interest of the population and gene pool. If one gets a deadly disease: then die! Do not try to cure it or to prevent it. (In my opinion for that reason vaccinations are as bad as circumcision.) It is rather quaint that people are willing to die for their country, but that they prove to be cowards that want to live forever if there is a disease that might kill them.

Any mainland population that practices circumcision is not Christian.

< Message edited by Rule -- 10/18/2009 6:36:37 AM >

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RE: Believer(s) of god are plague to this world. - 10/18/2009 6:41:05 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		Definition:
The word circumcision means literally "cutting around" and its practice is ancient, although it is not practiced in all cultures. It can, however, be found among the ancient Hebrews, Egyptians, Polynesians, and among various tribes in the Americas. Circumcision, normally part of a ritual, involves the removal of the foreskin either of a man or of a boy. Usually this occurs as part of some sort of initiation or rite of passage.
 
http://atheism.about.com/library/glossary/judaism/bldef_circumcision.htm

Something that has a deeply rooted history among so many cultures is now to be said to be a Jewish tradition and to cause men to develop into criminals.

Please, someone other than Rule cus i think he .. well... someone explain this.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Rule)
Profile   Post #: 174
RE: Believer(s) of god are plague to this world. - 10/18/2009 6:48:41 AM   
SL4V3M4YB3


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Rule
The Christian way is to accept suffering, is to accept death as in the best interest of the population and gene pool. If one gets a deadly disease: then die! Do not try to cure it or to prevent it.

I didn't know that about Christianity, I thought they were a caring bunch.

Should not really be removing the appendix then I suppose or the tonsils.

Also why do we try to prevent god from killing us with cholera by cleaning the drinking water??? I've never understood this...IMHO (as gods representative on earth) we should drink dirty water at least one time a week, to give god the chance to kill us, otherwise we are just preventing gods will and he’ll have to resort to the more expensive measure of lightening bolts


< Message edited by SL4V3M4YB3 -- 10/18/2009 7:08:27 AM >

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RE: Believer(s) of god are plague to this world. - 10/18/2009 7:13:03 AM   
Percoset


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Status: offline 		What an absolutely horrifying title. Also a complete crock of  s***.  Not that I could ever live that lifestyle, but there are men and women who sacrifice their entire lives to do good for the community by going into the consecreated life. I don't think you can say that in terms of the atheist community. I have yet to hear of an atheist cloister, atheist monastery or an atheist Mother Teresa.

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RE: Believer(s) of god are plague to this world. - 10/18/2009 7:21:51 AM   
SL4V3M4YB3


Posts: 3506
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From: S.E. London U.K.
Status: offline 		Very contentious to say atheists don't do charity work or fund charitable movements; we have had a discussion of that argument and found it lacking in reality.

“If you can't feed a hundred people, then feed just one.” Mother Teresa

Good advice and today I will be having….Chicken.


< Message edited by SL4V3M4YB3 -- 10/18/2009 7:24:03 AM >

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RE: Believer(s) of god are plague to this world. - 10/18/2009 7:23:33 AM   
DarkSteven


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Rule

quote:

ORIGINAL: DarkSteven
Every single person, whether a saint or ethically challenged, knows what is right and what is wrong.

That is not true. Some people have to be told. And even if such told people know, it does not matter one whit if they do not care for it - and they don't.



Your first point is good.  I should have said "Everyone over the age of two has an idea of at least some of which is right and which is wrong".

And I disagree with your second point.  Even if their ACTIONS do not follow what they know to be right, I hold that their consciences know, and that they will have the guilt to live with.


_____________________________

"You women....

The small-breasted ones want larger breasts. The large-breasted ones want smaller ones. The straight-haired ones curl their hair, and the curly-haired ones straighten theirs...

Quit fretting. We men love you."

(in reply to Rule)
Profile   Post #: 178
RE: Believer(s) of god are plague to this world. - 10/18/2009 7:31:59 AM   
Rule


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DarkSteven
I disagree with your second point.  Even if their ACTIONS do not follow what they know to be right, I hold that their consciences know, and that they will have the guilt to live with.

Umm, I think that you had better do some research into psychology and to google such words as psychopath and sociopath. There are various types of people that do not have a conscience; they never feel any guilt; it is an emotion utterly alien and incomprehensible to them.

Edited to add: you might as well ask a cactus what it feels like to swim, as a psychopath what guilt feels like.

< Message edited by Rule -- 10/18/2009 7:35:14 AM >

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RE: Believer(s) of god are plague to this world. - 10/18/2009 8:55:27 AM   
Irishknight


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Status: offline 		This thread is extremely amusing to me right now. As one of the very few nonChristians working for the organization that has been my source of income for 16 months, I just got suspended for an incident that was caused by a minister's negligence. They chose to make me the scapegoat because of the fact that I don't share thier religious beliefs. I left a situation in the hands of my coworkers and they dropped the ball. I returned after the fact and I got suspended. Nevermind the fact that the minister was too busy playing his guitar and singing to do his work, its the guy who was actually out doing the job that got suspended.


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Soldiers died for your right to be ungrateful.

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Profile   Post #: 180
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