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RE: Uncivil War: Conservatives to challenge a dozen GOP... - 11/4/2009 1:08:07 PM   
slvemike4u


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quote:

ORIGINAL: cuckyman

Carl Marx was a loser...and the idea of the collective is a dry hole....this nation was founded on personal and economic FREEDOM...period....either give me liberty, or give me death....and I assure you blood will flow like a river before this nation becomes socialist..... it has happened before, and it will happen again.... and free men and women are armed to the teeth awaiting the time when a Marxist puke is elected by a rigged ACORN type election, and the explosion of violence would begin....   count on it!
By "rigged ACORN type election" do you mean one in which as many eligible voters as possible actually vote?
Where does the "rigged" part come in? Faulty and/or deceptive counting?
Intimidation at voting locations?
Who decides its rigged before the shooting starts?
Didn't we already go down this path...ie: one section of the country rejecting an election and taking arms against another.
How did that work out?


_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4


(in reply to cuckyman)
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RE: Uncivil War: Conservatives to challenge a dozen GOP... - 11/4/2009 1:19:24 PM   
rulemylife


Posts: 14614
Joined: 8/23/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: cuckyman

Carl Marx was a loser...and the idea of the collective is a dry hole....this nation was founded on personal and economic FREEDOM...period....either give me liberty, or give me death....and I assure you blood will flow like a river before this nation becomes socialist..... it has happened before, and it will happen again.... and free men and women are armed to the teeth awaiting the time when a Marxist puke is elected by a rigged ACORN type election, and the explosion of violence would begin....   count on it!


Or maybe you can just send a few nice letters to Congress instead of all that blood flowing like a river.

(in reply to cuckyman)
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RE: Uncivil War: Conservatives to challenge a dozen GOP... - 11/4/2009 1:27:15 PM   
Moonhead


Posts: 16520
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quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

quote:

ORIGINAL: cuckyman

Carl Marx was a loser...and the idea of the collective is a dry hole....this nation was founded on personal and economic FREEDOM...period....either give me liberty, or give me death....and I assure you blood will flow like a river before this nation becomes socialist..... it has happened before, and it will happen again.... and free men and women are armed to the teeth awaiting the time when a Marxist puke is elected by a rigged ACORN type election, and the explosion of violence would begin....   count on it!
By "rigged ACORN type election" do you mean one in which as many eligible voters as possible actually vote?
Where does the "rigged" part come in? Faulty and/or deceptive counting?
Intimidation at voting locations?
Who decides its rigged before the shooting starts?
Didn't we already go down this path...ie: one section of the country rejecting an election and taking arms against another.
How did that work out?


Maybe it's rigged because negroes are voting? I think Enoch Powell promised "rivers of blood" over that on this side of the Atlantic as well.

_____________________________

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RE: Uncivil War: Conservatives to challenge a dozen GOP... - 11/4/2009 1:44:00 PM   
YerGuardianDevil


Posts: 4
Joined: 10/25/2009
Status: offline 		Forgive me for wading into a pretty deep discussion on my first post, but I think that Animus is the only one in this thread who seems to get it.  So long as corporations have more influence over politicians than voters do, our government will not change and will not care about the will of the people.  So long as war is profitable for these corporations, there will be endless war; using up stockpiles of munitions makes it necessary for the government to buy more munitions from these same corporations.  And the Banksters on Wall Street have every bit as much influence; Senator Dick Durbin, from my home state of Illinois, said of the big banks' relationship with Capitol Hill, "They own the place."

Quote here: http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2009/04/29/sen_durbin_banks_own_the_place.html
And here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o9XcT7FuQHw

The "Left vs. Right" battles we see are nothing more than political theater, delivered to us each day by corporate-owned mainstream media.  That doesn't mean that I don't love some of the shows on MSNBC, but TV is sure as hell not my only source of news.  In the footage from the "Tea Parties" people could clearly be seen holding signs with non-partisan slogans such as "End the Federal Reserve" and "Re-elect nobody" but the commentators on TV completely ignored them.

If the emergence of a third party is what it takes to regain control of our government, then so be it.  Americans wouldn't settle for just two choices in most other areas of their lives, would they?  Could you imagine your only choices being Coke vs. Pepsi, Miller vs. Budweiser, Ford vs. Chevy, etc.?  When our country was making crappy cars, Americans imported better ones from Europe and Asia.  As a result, American cars (the ones that survived at least) got better because of the competition.  Competition is what is sorely lacking in our government, our banking industry, and our health care industry.

@Moonhead: Reagan did some pretty dreadful things too, like REX 84. 
This video reference to it sure as hell gives me the creeps: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ug0IL7k3elQ

Peace, everyone!

(in reply to Moonhead)
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RE: Uncivil War: Conservatives to challenge a dozen GOP... - 11/4/2009 1:50:32 PM   
Moonhead


Posts: 16520
Joined: 9/21/2009
Status: offline 		No question that Reagan did a lot of ghastly things. I'm very puzzled by the way the Republicans have all but sanctified the lad over the last twenty years. I was just saying that he wasn't quite as bad as Bush jr, not that he was a good President.

_____________________________

I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to YerGuardianDevil)
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RE: Uncivil War: Conservatives to challenge a dozen GOP... - 11/4/2009 1:52:08 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		no, animus aint the only one who gets it, but slapping a fresh coat of paint on shit and calling it independant isn't anything new either.

and this:

As a result, American cars (the ones that survived at least) got better because of the competition. That ain't what happened at all.

Competition is what is sorely lacking in our government, our banking industry, and our health care industry.
I rather agree with your overall assessment however, big corporations need big revamps in all industries, if we are to thrive in the global economy.

Ron

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RE: Uncivil War: Conservatives to challenge a dozen GOP... - 11/4/2009 2:46:21 PM   
Musicmystery


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quote:

So long as corporations have more influence over politicians than voters do, our government will not change and will not care about the will of the people. 


I'm all for the creation of realistic, effective third parties. But the Palinist oppression the 23rd saw hardly bows to voters.

Hoffman didn't even know basics about local issues. The Palinist regime stepped in because they didn't like the candidate the local Republicans had already chosen--brushing aside the will of the people to force their own national agenda. But people here don't give a shit about gay marriage and ending abortion--they care about unemployment and farm issues. The other candidates understood this well.

Understand--in this district, Democrats get, at best, 33% of the vote in Congressional elections---because we just don't have many Democrats here (that third includes Independents who might vote for the Democrat. Conservatives get, at most, 18%, because that's how many Conservatives there are. It's a Republican district, period.

So when Owens gets over 49% of the vote to win, it's because Republicans, forced to submit to Palinist repression of their will, voted instead for Owens. Lots and lots of them.

A forced Palinist line isn't caring about the will of the people. It's agree or die.

Thankfully, the 23rd's voters saw it for what it is--and rejected it, even in a district that's been Republican almost as long as there's been a Republican party.

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RE: Uncivil War: Conservatives to challenge a dozen GOP... - 11/4/2009 2:50:37 PM   
MarsBonfire


Posts: 1034
Joined: 3/6/2005
Status: offline 		Hoffmann thought all he had to do was waltz in, tell everyone he was on his knees, sucking the cock of Glenn Beck, and all the teabagger nutcases would come out and hand him the job.

Thank God he was sorely mistaken.

(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 48
RE: Uncivil War: Conservatives to challenge a dozen GOP... - 11/4/2009 2:53:45 PM   
Musicmystery


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Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline 		That's a little unfair to Hoffman. People descended on this from outside.

He was clueless other than that outside insurgence, yes.

(in reply to MarsBonfire)
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RE: Uncivil War: Conservatives to challenge a dozen GOP... - 11/4/2009 2:58:15 PM   
MarsBonfire


Posts: 1034
Joined: 3/6/2005
Status: offline 		Nope. I'm basing that on the quotes attributed to him, pre-election. He said that he worshipped Beck and was a firm believer in Becks "9 values and 12 principles" that he hawks on his show. He was playing to the nutbags, bigtime.

(in reply to Musicmystery)
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RE: Uncivil War: Conservatives to challenge a dozen GOP... - 11/4/2009 3:10:14 PM   
Moonhead


Posts: 16520
Joined: 9/21/2009
Status: offline 		He'll know better in future.

_____________________________

I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

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RE: Uncivil War: Conservatives to challenge a dozen GOP... - 11/4/2009 3:25:07 PM   
DomKen


Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: cuckyman

Carl Marx was a loser...and the idea of the collective is a dry hole....this nation was founded on personal and economic FREEDOM...period....either give me liberty, or give me death....and I assure you blood will flow like a river before this nation becomes socialist..... it has happened before, and it will happen again.... and free men and women are armed to the teeth awaiting the time when a Marxist puke is elected by a rigged ACORN type election, and the explosion of violence would begin....   count on it!

This nation, I assume you mean the USA, is a socialist nation. It has been for 70 years. What we're arguing over today is how socialist it will be.

(in reply to cuckyman)
Profile   Post #: 52
RE: Uncivil War: Conservatives to challenge a dozen GOP... - 11/4/2009 3:42:57 PM   
willbeurdaddy


Posts: 11894
Joined: 4/8/2006
Status: offline 		Nonsense. Learn the definition of socialism. The move toward socialism is not close to 70 years old.

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Profile   Post #: 53
RE: Uncivil War: Conservatives to challenge a dozen GOP... - 11/5/2009 6:29:59 PM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline 		The government takeover of industries in WWII wasn't socialist?

Or the freezing of wages? Or rationing?

Wow. What does it take to be socialist, then?





< Message edited by Musicmystery -- 11/5/2009 6:30:40 PM >

(in reply to willbeurdaddy)
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RE: Uncivil War: Conservatives to challenge a dozen GOP... - 11/5/2009 6:43:18 PM   
willbeurdaddy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

The government takeover of industries in WWII wasn't socialist?

Or the freezing of wages? Or rationing?








No, no and no.

(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 55
RE: Uncivil War: Conservatives to challenge a dozen GOP... - 11/5/2009 7:01:55 PM   
Nemesys


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

Actually, Marx predicted violent class wars...

In this case, though, local people who value their freedom made their independent choices, rejecting the Palinists who tried to force their own narrow and unbending nationalist agenda on the district by stealing the seat.

They forced a hard-right or nothing choice, and the Palinists were sent packing.




I'm not sure that what happened in the 23rd is an indication of anything other than the situation was screwed up from its inception and then got worse. If it was deliberately engineered that way from the start, then well done. If it was a comedy of of errors, oops... I don't think it would have been salvageable had Reagan himself showed up at the party to cheerlead. But was it representative of a rejection of conservatism and Palin? Methinks that's just wishful thinking.

Scozzafava was a supporter of partial-birth abortion and massive government spending programs. She was less Republican than John McCain, and Republicans remember how well he worked out. Even Markos Moulitsas of Daily Kos called Scozzafava the most liberal candidate in the race -- which may explain why she was the choice of George Soros' Working Families Party and why she promptly endorsed the Democrat after withdrawing from the race last weekend.

A Democrat won in New York after some back room deals. It's not worth much of a headline. But is it a learning opportunity? I suppose we'll find out if that opportunity was taken about a year from now.



< Message edited by Nemesys -- 11/5/2009 7:09:03 PM >

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http://goreanunity.org

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Profile   Post #: 56
RE: Uncivil War: Conservatives to challenge a dozen GOP... - 11/5/2009 7:11:20 PM   
Nemesys


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Joined: 9/3/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

The government takeover of industries in WWII wasn't socialist?

Or the freezing of wages? Or rationing?



Nixon was a socialist, in his own way, when he instituted wage and price controls.

Just one more thing for his resume, I suppose.

_____________________________

"The knife is no less a knife because it makes no sound." -Tarl Cabot

http://goreanunity.org

(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 57
RE: Uncivil War: Conservatives to challenge a dozen GOP... - 11/5/2009 7:41:14 PM   
Musicmystery


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quote:

Scozzafava was a supporter of partial-birth abortion and massive government spending programs. She was less Republican than John McCain, and Republicans remember how well he worked out.


She was the candidate local leaders of all eleven counties chose.

This is a local election. We get to choose.

That nasty inconvenience of a Constitution says so. Even if Palin doesn't like our candidate.

We get to choose.

(in reply to Nemesys)
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RE: Uncivil War: Conservatives to challenge a dozen GOP... - 11/5/2009 8:14:58 PM   
Sanity


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From: Nampa, Idaho USA
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How do you feel about all the heavy campaigning and fund raisers that Obama does on the behalf of his local favorites?


quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

quote:

Scozzafava was a supporter of partial-birth abortion and massive government spending programs. She was less Republican than John McCain, and Republicans remember how well he worked out.


She was the candidate local leaders of all eleven counties chose.

This is a local election. We get to choose.

That nasty inconvenience of a Constitution says so. Even if Palin doesn't like our candidate.

We get to choose.


_____________________________

Inside Every Liberal Is A Totalitarian Screaming To Get Out

(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 59
RE: Uncivil War: Conservatives to challenge a dozen GOP... - 11/5/2009 8:32:03 PM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline 		Campaigning is fine. If that's all she did, fair game.

Obama didn't come in and say "Your candidate isn't the right kind of Democrat--you have to take this one instead." He certainly would have had ground--Owens is a newcomer and an Independent. Instead, local Democrats made their choice, and Obama supported it.

He didn't campaign by lying about the Republican having connections to ACORN either, or the many other bizarre attacks on the party's choice.

It's a large difference.

Separate issue, btw, but Obama's campaigning helped no one, here or in NJ or VA. Voters decided races on local issues--left between Hoffmann and Owens, that left Owens.

(in reply to Sanity)
Profile   Post #: 60
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