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RE: Christianity Vs. Death Penalty. - 11/12/2009 2:46:22 PM   
mnottertail


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RE: Christianity Vs. Death Penalty. - 11/12/2009 2:47:07 PM   
GoDolphins


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Status: offline 		There is a difference between "reasonable doubt" and "no doubt at all."  That's why that word "reasonable" is there in the first place. 

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RE: Christianity Vs. Death Penalty. - 11/12/2009 2:48:04 PM   
RCdc


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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub
Do you think every person that kills is doomed to hell? Some are of course if they do not repent. Are you and were your ancestors condemned to hell because in your country there was once capital punishment? I really don’t know because I don’t presume to know the mind of God.


I was not asking about what one does for their country, or whether their country sanctions it.  I am asking about personal belief or ethics and reconciling them within this context.

the.dark.

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RE: Christianity Vs. Death Penalty. - 11/12/2009 2:50:26 PM   
SL4V3M4YB3


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quote:

ORIGINAL: GoDolphins
There is a difference between "reasonable doubt" and "no doubt at all."  That's why that word "reasonable" is there in the first place. 

You said realistic doubt which for me is much stronger than reasonable doubt.

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RE: Christianity Vs. Death Penalty. - 11/12/2009 3:05:42 PM   
kdsub


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Status: offline 		Then tell me what belief in Christianity is in conflict with Capital Punishment?

Butch


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RE: Christianity Vs. Death Penalty. - 11/12/2009 3:10:26 PM   
thishereboi


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RE: Christianity Vs. Death Penalty. - 11/12/2009 3:13:12 PM   
mnottertail


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RE: Christianity Vs. Death Penalty. - 11/12/2009 3:13:46 PM   
RCdc


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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

Then tell me what belief in Christianity is in conflict with Capital Punishment?

Butch



Butch, I really do not mean to sound sarcastic - but which part of my initial question do you not get?
If you wish to start a thread asking what belief in christianity is in conflict with CP, be my guest.
However I am not hijacking my own thread nor participating in your attempt.

I posted a question to christians about how they reconcile their belief or faith with supporting the death penalty and whether their ethics play a part.  I am not asking for conjecture.  I am asking for personal belief.  I was not asking for debate - of course that may occur, when I gain personal opinion, but that is all.

Not once did I spectulate conflict.

the.dark.

< Message edited by Darcyandthedark -- 11/12/2009 3:20:56 PM >

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RE: Christianity Vs. Death Penalty. - 11/12/2009 3:14:35 PM   
SL4V3M4YB3


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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub
Then tell me what belief in Christianity is in conflict with Capital Punishment?
Butch

Isn't it mentioned in one of the ten commandments?

If you are a Roman Catholic

"Thou shall not kill."

other Christians are allowed to go around killing willy-nilly as long as it isn't the more specific form of killing i.e. murder.


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RE: Christianity Vs. Death Penalty. - 11/12/2009 3:24:02 PM   
kdsub


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Status: offline 		I don't mean to hijack the thread...just make sense of it. As thishereboi has said the only direct reference is in the Commandment. It does not differentiate between killing for your country or to protect a love one or capital punishment. That is why I asked the question.

When I referenced killing for other reasons you said you were not asking what one does for its country etc. But it is exactly the same…if you justify one you must justify the other.

If you don’t then you must assume God’s commandment must be taken in a context. If it is then there may be no conflict with executing killers. That is why I said it will be up to God to judge me at my reckoning.

Butch


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RE: Christianity Vs. Death Penalty. - 11/12/2009 3:30:50 PM   
GoDolphins


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Status: offline 		The original commandment actually said "Do not murder," not simply "Do not kill." 

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RE: Christianity Vs. Death Penalty. - 11/12/2009 3:34:07 PM   
RCdc


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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

I don't mean to hijack the thread...just make sense of it. As thishereboi has said the only direct reference is in the Commandment. It does not differentiate between killing for your country or to protect a love one or capital punishment. That is why I asked the question.

When I referenced killing for other reasons you said you were not asking what one does for its country etc. But it is exactly the same…if you justify one you must justify the other.

If you don’t then you must assume God’s commandment must be taken in a context. If it is then there may be no conflict with executing killers. That is why I said it will be up to God to judge me at my reckoning.

Butch



I am not asking about killing.  I am not asking about murder.  I am not asking about war.  And I am not asking about terrorism.  I was specific.  I asked about the death penalty.  I am asking specifically.  I don't see what the big issue is?
You believe in it and reconcile it in some way with your faith, or you don't.
I am asking how and why.  I never suggested in my OP there was a conflict... if there is a conflict that shows itself during discussion, then sure we can debate it and I might even question an individuals stance.  But I am not going to willingly take part in some crucification on the conflicts of christianity.  I am not that biased.

the.dark.

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RE: Christianity Vs. Death Penalty. - 11/12/2009 3:40:33 PM   
kdsub


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark

quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

I don't mean to hijack the thread...just make sense of it. As thishereboi has said the only direct reference is in the Commandment. It does not differentiate between killing for your country or to protect a love one or capital punishment. That is why I asked the question.

When I referenced killing for other reasons you said you were not asking what one does for its country etc. But it is exactly the same…if you justify one you must justify the other.

If you don’t then you must assume God’s commandment must be taken in a context. If it is then there may be no conflict with executing killers. That is why I said it will be up to God to judge me at my reckoning.

Butch



I am not asking about killing.  I am not asking about murder.  I am not asking about war.  And I am not asking about terrorism.  I was specific.  I asked about the death penalty.  I am asking specifically.  I don't see what the big issue is?
You believe in it and reconcile it in some way with your faith, or you don't.
I am asking how and why.  I never suggested in my OP there was a conflict... if there is a conflict that shows itself during discussion, then sure we can debate it and I might even question an individuals stance.  But I am not going to willingly take part in some crucification on the conflicts of christianity.  I am not that biased.

the.dark.



Why not then just write the answer you are looking for and be done with it...Or do you want truthful thoughtful answers?

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RE: Christianity Vs. Death Penalty. - 11/12/2009 3:47:40 PM   
RCdc


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Status: offline 		I have recieved some very thoughtful answers butch.  All of them are very different.
Unfortunately, I do not seem to have had one from you?  Which is cool if you don't wish to participate.

But all you have said is that you do not have to reconcile a conflict and then you ask others what the conflict is?

How do we know what your personal conflict is?  If you have some sort of conflict that you have to work out between you and god, it's all good.   I asked for people to share, not conflict, but their personal belief.

the.dark.

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RE: Christianity Vs. Death Penalty. - 11/12/2009 3:53:14 PM   
DomImus


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee

quote:

ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark

This is directed towards christians (obviously).
How do you reconcile supporting the death penalty with your faith and the teachings of Jesus?
If you do not support the death penalty, is it your faith or your ethics that play a part?

the.dark.


*snort*  If someone can be happy dashing babies heads against rocks, what is a little death penalty?



I wish I had said that although I wouldn't have said it as well as you did Aylee.



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RE: Christianity Vs. Death Penalty. - 11/12/2009 3:54:06 PM   
kdsub


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark

I have recieved some very thoughtful answers butch.  All of them are very different.
Unfortunately, I do not seem to have had one from you?  Which is cool if you don't wish to participate.

But all you have said is that you do not have to reconcile a conflict and then you ask others what the conflict is?

How do we know what your personal conflict is?  If you have some sort of conflict that you have to work out between you and god, it's all good.   I asked for people to share, not conflict, but their personal belief.

the.dark.



You asked this…” How do you reconcile supporting the death penalty with your faith and the teachings of Jesus?”

I asked you what teachings of Jesus required reconciliation. Is that not a valid question?

My answer to your question paraphrased was I’m not sure there is a conflict in the first place... And because I’m not sure it will up the God to judge me.

Now how is this not answering your question? To me it is thoughful and honest.

Butch

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RE: Christianity Vs. Death Penalty. - 11/12/2009 3:54:38 PM   
NihilusZero


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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

All I know for sure is true repentance can assure forgiveness of any sin.

It is not that you believe this, but that you choose to revere a deity that espouses this barter system which is most distressing.


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RE: Christianity Vs. Death Penalty. - 11/12/2009 4:02:41 PM   
kdsub


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Status: offline 		That you don't is your personal choice...that I do is mine...we both must live with our choices...Now is there a question to be answered or are you just making a statement of your lack of faith?

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RE: Christianity Vs. Death Penalty. - 11/12/2009 4:03:05 PM   
RCdc


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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

quote:

ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark

I have recieved some very thoughtful answers butch.  All of them are very different.
Unfortunately, I do not seem to have had one from you?  Which is cool if you don't wish to participate.

But all you have said is that you do not have to reconcile a conflict and then you ask others what the conflict is?

How do we know what your personal conflict is?  If you have some sort of conflict that you have to work out between you and god, it's all good.   I asked for people to share, not conflict, but their personal belief.

the.dark.



You asked this…” How do you reconcile supporting the death penalty with your faith and the teachings of Jesus?”

I asked you what teachings of Jesus required reconciliation. Is that not a valid question?

My answer to your question paraphrased was I’m not sure there is a conflict in the first place... And because I’m not sure it will up the God to judge me.

Now how is this not answering your question? To me it is thoughful and honest.

Butch


Butch, are you trying to be deliberately obtuse or do you really not understand that I am not looking for one specific 'answer' (as you put it) but an individuals personal opinion?

Reconciliation does not automatically mean there is conflict - you are the one person sofar who has brought up such an idea - which is cool and your personal opinion, which I was looking for - but you then go on to ask me and others what the conflict is?   I don't know - it's your idea and your conflict!

Is it just me, or am I missing something?

the.dark.

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RE: Christianity Vs. Death Penalty. - 11/12/2009 4:10:54 PM   
RCdc


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Status: offline 		To be honest now butch, I really have no desire to walk this path with you.  You want to create conflict, have at it, I will not be a part of it and allow you to hijack my thread with your attempt to usurp other peoples personal accounts.

To everyone so far, christian and non christian, who have responded, I am really grateful that you took the time to respond to my question.

I do sincerely hope that the thread does not just end here and that some more people may participate.  So I will repost.
How do you reconcile supporting the death penalty with your faith and the teachings of Jesus? (Understanding that reconcile does not automatically assume a conflict - just to be clear).
If you do not support the death penalty, is it your faith or your ethics that play a part?

the.dark.



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