RE: Cheating spouses

RE: Cheating spouses (Full Version)

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Rhodes85 -> RE: Cheating spouses (11/22/2009 7:29:28 PM)
quote: Is it really the online forum aspect that stops you? Or is it your perception that your interlocutor is closed minded? Just curious. Good question. I hadn't really thought about it. I was thinking more due to the fact that I don't see much point to arguing with someone that clearly has his own opinions that are not about to change, and that I don't feel much of a need to start an online argument or fan the flames of one. It achieves nothing and just gets annoying.

RCdc -> RE: Cheating spouses (11/23/2009 12:04:19 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Rhodes85 That being said I have no desire to argue with a person in an online forum. Let alone one that makes snap judgements about me from based on a single sentence. Wow, 'people like me' and 'the type of person I am' being a thoughtless bigot? You may want to think that through a second time before calling me a 'thoughtless bigot' After all you don't see me judging you. Again, it says much about a person who sees arguing instead of discussion. People whom claim to assume arguement instead of the intention of discussion are already aware of what they are doing. And really, you are judging simply by responding... besides, you are doing a pretty good job of judging other people. Like I said, I see a huge amount of irony in your postings and yes, I'll make a note of it and comment on it. If you like to name call, and yet insist that when people make you feel indignant, judged or any other emotion by their impression of you due to your posts, that they should 'think twice' shouldn't 'judge' you, then just feel and think about how your own words or rather, name calling, work on another. the.dark.

WyldHrt -> RE: Cheating spouses (11/23/2009 12:56:38 AM)
quote: I hadn't really thought about it. I was thinking more due to the fact that I don't see much point to arguing with someone that clearly has his own opinions that are not about to change, and that I don't feel much of a need to start an online argument or fan the flames of one. It achieves nothing and just gets annoying. I love the irony here. [:D] Clue-by-four: I edited my last post for exactly this reason, Rhodes. It amuses me that you get all offended by .the dark's words, when you have been happily name-calling, and making accusations and assumptions about others based on what is often a singular act, regardless of circumstances. According to you, I'm an untrustworthy coward, selfish, and a moron. I will also apparently cheat on anyone I get involved with in the future. Thanks for that. Pot, meet kettle.... smooches .the dark

RCdc -> RE: Cheating spouses (11/23/2009 1:55:13 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: WyldHrt smooches .the dark smooches ya too wyldthang (by the way this is my favourite version[:)]) the.dark.

Llyren -> RE: Cheating spouses (11/23/2009 2:14:20 AM)
While I am still of the opinion that the OP is looking for permission to do something she knows she shouldn't do, this has gotten way off on a tangent. Each situation is different. You can't cheat on a partner who isn't a partner. A piece of paper doesn't make a marriage. I should know. I had a piece of paper for nine years, but never once did I actually have a husband or a partner. While I didn't cheat on him, and he did cheat on me, I could have, and it wouldn't have been cheating, because he wasn't really my husband. If you're with someone who is physically abusive, then sometimes you're so crushed that you can't just leave on your own. You need a goal, or something tangible, and that something might be another person. Rhodes, I read over your posts, and honestly, I was ready to defend a fellow gamer. But I do feel you're making knee-jerk judgments and not thinking about the people behind the judgments. And when people pounced on you, you felt attacked, and it's been pretty downhill since. The OP asked for our opinions, and we gave them. Though she never said anything about trying to escape a bad situation, and that does effect my own thoughts on the matter. But beyond that, who anyone else is sleeping with doesn't matter, unless it's you, or your partner(s). So let's stop attacking one another, and go back to attacking the furries. (geek joke)

RCdc -> RE: Cheating spouses (11/23/2009 3:48:13 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Llyren But beyond that, who anyone else is sleeping with doesn't matter, unless it's you, or your partner(s). So let's stop attacking one another, and go back to attacking the furries. (geek joke) Having been L4D2ing this weekend with Master, I would have to disagree... attacking zombies is far more fulfilling.[:D] the.dark.

Llyren -> RE: Cheating spouses (11/23/2009 4:20:05 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark quote: ORIGINAL: Llyren But beyond that, who anyone else is sleeping with doesn't matter, unless it's you, or your partner(s). So let's stop attacking one another, and go back to attacking the furries. (geek joke) Having been L4D2ing this weekend with Master, I would have to disagree... attacking zombies is far more fulfilling.[:D] the.dark. True, but then, I"m pretty phobic about zombies.

Mercnbeth -> RE: Cheating spouses (11/23/2009 7:37:18 AM)
~ Fast Hijack ~ quote: ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark quote: ORIGINAL: WyldHrt smooches .the dark smooches ya too wyldthang (by the way this is my favorite version[:)])the.dark. Darcy & the dark, Wyld will be at your 'Welcome to the USA' party when you come to visit! We miss you guys! Hope all is well, can't wait to see you again! PS - The idea of Wyld being dishonest, or without integrity, is too silly a concept to contemplate. When she gets here for the Thanksgiving festivities on Wednesday night more than likely we, being the terrible hosts that we are, will most likely be asleep. The front door will be open and she knows where her 'room' is, the refrigerator, and if she wants, I think she even knows how to switch on the jacuzzi. At this point, the dogs don't even bark, although Yoshi provides a welcoming 'smile'. Yeah, Wyld is an opportunistic home-wrecking cheater! [sm=rofl.gif] PPS - Don't forget my 'tribute' - bitch! [sm=discipline.gif]

sunshinemiss -> RE: Cheating spouses (11/23/2009 10:19:16 AM)
Hey, I want Mr. Merc and Beth to adopt me too!

marcy1980 -> RE: Cheating spouses (11/23/2009 2:38:47 PM)
You think that could work well in a relationship. Especially one where trust is crucial. Who knows. You might as well. You are both useless to anyone else here and proably your spouses also. It might be interesting to see the results of eventually deceiting each other.[image]http://www.collarchat.com/micons/m19.gif[/image]

RCdc -> RE: Cheating spouses (11/23/2009 3:56:13 PM)
This is Darcy We miss you guys too. Seems like way too long that we were showing you the more, ahem, interesting sights of the Capital! When we eventually get over to see you (and we will, just not sure when, though hopefully before you decamp to Italy!) then the more, the merrier (and the Wylder!). Much love and stuff! x

MasterTslave -> RE: Cheating spouses (11/23/2009 5:47:43 PM)
Stay away from any married man! If the wife found out, you'd be in trouble with HER! The man is just a dirt bag if he is going behind his wife's back to screw around...There is just a line that you cannot cross

Rhodes85 -> RE: Cheating spouses (11/23/2009 7:16:02 PM)
quote: Again, it says much about a person who sees arguing instead of discussion. People whom claim to assume arguement instead of the intention of discussion are already aware of what they are doing. Who said anything about asuming? My statement was simple, that I did not want it turning into an argument. I said nothing about it being an argument at that point. quote: And really, you are judging simply by responding... besides, you are doing a pretty good job of judging other people. Like I said, I see a huge amount of irony in your postings and yes, I'll make a note of it and comment on it. Judging by responding....? Thats a rather large leap there. Also if thats the case what are you doing by responding? So you're going to make a note and comment on my supposed 'irony?' Are you attempting to provoke me, start an argument or make yourself look like an asshole by that? Because i'll say now that the whole 'cat and mouse' thing doesn't go over well with me. quote: If you like to name call, and yet insist that when people make you feel indignant, judged or any other emotion by their impression of you due to your posts, that they should 'think twice' shouldn't 'judge' you, then just feel and think about how your own words or rather, name calling, work on another. I never said anyone made me feel indignant, judged or anything else for that matter. I don't know where you are getting that from. All I said was do not claim I am 'judging' people and then imply you are doing the same to me. Frankly I don't care what you think of me. By the way, before you mention the 'moron' comment again, keep in mind that I was not the one that brought that up in the first place. Perhaps you should also take into account that the OP clearly either did not take into account or did not care what effect her cheating would have on the person she cheated on? Its interesting how you come to the defense of a person that is clearly doing something wrong and trying to justify/excuse it and ignore that fact. While trying to tell me to be more considerate of her feelings. Shes a grown woman, if she can't take being called a moron for lying and cheating on a person then maybe she should not have done it to begin with. What would you expect? A 'poor you' statement to her? quote: According to you, I'm an untrustworthy coward, selfish, and a moron. I will also apparently cheat on anyone I get involved with in the future. Thanks for that. I said nothing about you at all. And nowhere did I say that anyone would cheat on anyone they got involved with in the future just because they did so once. Thanks for putting words in my mouth. quote: It amuses me that you get all offended by .the dark's words, when you have been happily name-calling, and making accusations and assumptions about others based on what is often a singular act, regardless of circumstances. I said nothing about being offended. I am not. I do not know what assumptions you are referring to. Accusing someone of trying to justify cheating, when it is clear that that is what they are trying to do is hardly a 'bad' thing to do. Should it be sugarcoated? If a person is a liar they are a liar, if they are a drunk they are a drunk and in this case if they are a cheater they are a cheater. Whether a single act or a thousand, it doesn't change what they did. As for circumstances..oh please. This isn't a case of someone shooing a person in self-defense or rear ending someone in a car because of bad weather. This was intentional and very much willing on her part. The circumstances are irrelevant. quote: If you're with someone who is physically abusive, then sometimes you're so crushed that you can't just leave on your own. You need a goal, or something tangible, and that something might be another person. No offense intended but that is an excuse. If you are being abused there is nothing stopping you from leaving and nothing forcing you to cheat. If anything, if the person is so abusive he is more likely to get more abusive if he were to find out the person cheated on him. Do you know how many people kill their spouses in a fit of rage over just such a situation? Its more common than alot of people realize. quote: Each situation is different. You can't cheat on a partner who isn't a partner. A piece of paper doesn't make a marriage. I should know. I had a piece of paper for nine years, but never once did I actually have a husband or a partner. While I didn't cheat on him, and he did cheat on me, I could have, and it wouldn't have been cheating, because he wasn't really my husband. I don't see how you can not see it as cheating. Sure, he (or she as the situation may be) may ignore you, may not be a good partner, may be abusive or may be a hundred other things. If it isn't as relationship and doesn't mean anything, why would you still be there? Leave. It can't be all that bad or you wouldn't still be there in such a situation. quote: While I am still of the opinion that the OP is looking for permission to do something she knows she shouldn't do, this has gotten way off on a tangent. I agree. quote: Rhodes, I read over your posts, and honestly, I was ready to defend a fellow gamer. But I do feel you're making knee-jerk judgments and not thinking about the people behind the judgments. And when people pounced on you, you felt attacked, and it's been pretty downhill since. I never said anything about feeling attacked. I don't. Though I would like to make one thing clear. This isn't directed at anyone in particular, though obviously I am using this thread as an example. For anyone to make a post and obviously ask for justification or permission to do something that they clearly know is wrong (if they don't why are they posting such a question?) they should expect a certain amount of criticism for such an act. As was mention in a different post awhile back, when you start a post and ask a potentially controversial question, don't expect to be told 'just what you want to hear.' This isn't a case of 'if you don't agree with it keep it to yourself' the OP asked what people thought and I told her what I thought. If she didn't like the idea of getting a negative comment she shouldn't have posted about doing something thats wrong. Just something to think about.

RCdc -> RE: Cheating spouses (11/24/2009 1:51:19 AM)
quote: Who said anything about asuming? My statement was simple, that I did not want it turning into an argument. I said nothing about it being an argument at that point. I never said you assumed that there was an arguement, but that you assume argument over discussion, regardless of when it would happen. You did claim you were here to argue(if you could) and it was not about discussing, which is what I was attempting to do. Fair enough, I am the first to admit you cannot have a reasonable discussion with a person intent on causing an argument. I am editing to add - because I do not wish to be told I took your words out of context - that your words clearly state that you were not in the mind of starting an argument or fanning the flames with someone whom you consider has opinions that would not change. However, this implies that had you thought it would make a difference, that you would have chosen arguement over discussion. I will highlight - implies. I have not seen you mention discussing the topic. quote: I was thinking more due to the fact that I don't see much point to arguing with someone that clearly has his own opinions that are not about to change, I would also like to add. I am not a he.[;)] quote: Judging by responding....? Thats a rather large leap there. Also if thats the case what are you doing by responding? So you're going to make a note and comment on my supposed 'irony?' Are you attempting to provoke me, start an argument or make yourself look like an asshole by that? Because i'll say now that the whole 'cat and mouse' thing doesn't go over well with me. I am not going to deny that I am trying to provoke a discussion because I love discourse, which as you have said, is not on your agenda. Just name calling (moron/asshole/coward etc) and as you say, arguing. Which is fine, just so long as we know where we all stand. I would ask however(first question), if you are able to hold a conversation without degenerating into namecalling or an attack that takes things personal? quote: I never said anyone made me feel indignant, judged or anything else for that matter. I don't know where you are getting that from. Example - quote: You may want to think that through a second time before calling me a 'thoughtless bigot' After all you don't see me judging you. Ergo - you see me judging you. I would also like to point out that you have judged me countless times during our discourse. Again, I can post links and quotes where you have, all in context. quote: All I said was do not claim I am 'judging' people and then imply you are doing the same to me. First, I never implied that I didn't judge you - please show me where I did say that. In fact my post that sparked this off was an ironic statement that merely brought out your hypocrasy. Meh. I don't believe judging is a bad thing so heyho. I do believe that people who make judgements on others and then who say 'I didn't say that' when quite clearly it's there in black and white, to be pretty disingenuous. quote: Frankly I don't care what you think of me You wouldn't be on a forum if you thought your words had zero effect on somone and you wouldn't be answering and responding to me if you felt my words showed no validity or had no baring on how I think of you. You know they have an impact, just as much as you are aware that your own have an impact. Take responsibility. I do. quote: By the way, before you mention the 'moron' comment again, keep in mind that I was not the one that brought that up in the first place. I wasn't going to mention that atrocious word. But as you have, no you didn't, but you support it and you are continuing to support it - which is cool - but that's like saying 'well I'm not the one who started it' but still supporting the BNP or the KKK or Peta.(extreme examples but you get the point). quote: Perhaps you should also take into account that the OP clearly either did not take into account or did not care what effect her cheating would have on the person she cheated on? I did take that into account in my very first post. My next question to you would then be, do you even bother reading the thread or what people write at all? quote: Its interesting how you come to the defense of a person that is clearly doing something wrong and trying to justify/excuse it and ignore that fact. While trying to tell me to be more considerate of her feelings. Shes a grown woman, if she can't take being called a moron for lying and cheating on a person then maybe she should not have done it to begin with. What would you expect? A 'poor you' statement to her? Show me where I defended anyone other than say that I see people who name call being devoid of any capacity of intellect? Unless you can offer up quotes where I have done anything that you have claimed, like I have produced quotes of your words for you, in context, then your simply digging yourself a bigger hole. Look it's this simple. Me: Takes responsibility for what I say. Does do irony. Does do discussion with factual information placed before me and has repeatedly tried to do so, without arguing. Doesn't like the use of a word and finds it disgusting. Does find name calling to be a sign of a lack of ability to be intelligent and a lack of maturity. Does have an invite to the states.(Thats totally irrelevant but so bloody cool!)[;)] Does have a sense of humour. You: You supported name calling. You have also name called an entire subsection of peoples based on nothing other than an action without taking into consideration any real factual information - in this case the action is cheating. You then continue to name call others different names, including myself, based on ad hom. You admit to assessing whether an arguement should take place(whether it's worth it), rather than discussing a topic. You cannot understand signatures. You have shown you don't really read what people have written, unless it's all about you(and then you get it wrong). You have double standards. You don't get irony. You can really dig a hole. At least I can sleep comfortably, knowing that I haven't name called, renounced my responsibilty or used ad hom attacks on a subject which one wouldn't have all the information about and instead I simply stuck to the facts as presented to me in black and white (well, it's kind of black and grey really) on the thread itself. the.dark.

WyldHrt -> RE: Cheating spouses (11/24/2009 2:11:48 AM)
quote: I said nothing about you at all. Actually, you did. You have said more than once on this thread that there is no excuse for cheating, under any circumstances: quote: if they are a cheater they are a cheater. Whether a single act or a thousand, it doesn't change what they did. By that logic, anyone who has ever done so (myself included) is a cheater, and you have had plenty of nasty things to say about cheaters, have you not? So... how were your insults and nastiness not directed at me? quote: And nowhere did I say that anyone would cheat on anyone they got involved with in the future just because they did so once. Thanks for putting words in my mouth. Oh? quote: Hence he is lying to her, hiding things from her and cheating on her. If he will do this to her, he WILL do this to you as well. Did you mean just this one guy? Or just married guys on the make? If so, I apologize. It seemed to be your opinion that if someone will cheat on their spouse, they will also cheat on anyone else they get involved with, too. I just read the rest of your last post, and I give up. If you really think that leaving a years long relationship, or worse, a decade(s) long marriage, is a simple as packing your bags and walking out the door, you just don't get it.

Elizabeth666 -> RE: Cheating spouses (11/24/2009 4:12:24 AM)
There are many reasons people cheat, does it make it right? Not in my opinion. But after all, it is their lives, not ours. Once a cheater, always a cheater? Not really. I will admit, yes, I cheated on a partner years ago. What happened? They found out, the other person found out and it all blew up in my face. Have i done it again? Hell no, i learned my lesson. i know people always say, if you're going to cheat, just leave before you do. But, i have to agree with WyldHrt quote: If you really think that leaving a years long relationship, or worse, a decade(s) long marriage, is a simple as packing your bags and walking out the door, you just don't get it. It isn't as easy as that. But, if they jump into a situation with both eyes open and they know what they are doing, then they need to be ready to accept responsibility and face any consequences that arise.

PainfullyCurious -> RE: Cheating spouses (11/24/2009 7:55:49 PM)
I had the desire to point a few trends that might be relevant here. (They are not my opinions, just what I learned in a psych class and since then, when I look around the world, I see these situations occur often. That's not to say they apply to every man or woman, and quite obviously these studies focused on straight people): Men and women often cheat for different reasons. - Men often cheat because they sexually desire the woman that they cheat with, and find the impulse hard to control. - Women often cheat because they are feeling unfulfilled and neglected in their current relationship. - Serial cheaters cheat with many different people over time and do so for the reassurance they get form being wanted. Serial cheating usually has more to do with the cheater's need for reassurance, and less to do with problems stemming from within the relationship. It's funny too because women also tend to place more importance on relationships and internalize failures more often than men. Thus, they more often feel a sense of personal failure when a relationship fails. Yet, the data suggests that more often than not, if a woman gets cheated on, there was very little that she could have done differently to prevent the situation. Another interesting fact: - Women are more likely to be depressed while they are in a relationship, and less often depressed after it ends. - Men are less likely to be depressed while in a relationship and more likely to be depressed afterwords. - Men are more likely to stay in a love-less relationship for practical reasons. (They'll stick around, for example, because dividing the assets would be difficult.) - Women are more likely to leave a relationship because they are emotionally unfulfilled. Feel free to disagree with the statistics. My hope is simply that by pointing out why people cheat, it might help some people who think it is unforgivable to be a little more understanding... and it might help the rest understand why some of the people who have been cheated on often do find it to be so unforgivable.

Kirata -> RE: Cheating spouses (11/24/2009 7:56:37 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark Look it's this simple. Me: Takes responsibility for what I say. Does do irony. Does do discussion with factual information placed before me and has repeatedly tried to do so, without arguing. Doesn't like the use of a word and finds it disgusting. Does find name calling to be a sign of a lack of ability to be intelligent and a lack of maturity. Does have an invite to the states.(Thats totally irrelevant but so bloody cool!)[;)] Does have a sense of humour. And, you're modest too. K.

Elisabella -> RE: Cheating spouses (11/24/2009 8:16:50 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark quote: ORIGINAL: Rhodes85 That being said I have no desire to argue with a person in an online forum. Let alone one that makes snap judgements about me from based on a single sentence. Wow, 'people like me' and 'the type of person I am' being a thoughtless bigot? You may want to think that through a second time before calling me a 'thoughtless bigot' After all you don't see me judging you. Again, it says much about a person who sees arguing instead of discussion. People whom claim to assume arguement instead of the intention of discussion are already aware of what they are doing. the.dark. Actually I think that when someone is called a "thoughtless bigot," told they have a "lack of intelligence," sees the old "people like you" tossed in, is told the person they're talking to "wouldn't bother having a friendship with" them, it's a rare person who will see that as still being a discussion. Personal attacks tend to elevate any discussion to argument status. You can't go around calling people every name for stupid other than 'moron,' because they used a word you didn't like, and expect them to view it as a civilized difference of opinion. I agree with Rhodes and Kirata about the term 'moron' - it hasn't been used diagnostically for decades and it also has another colloquial meaning now. Basically your argument sounds a lot like saying "you shouldn't use the word gay to mean homosexuals, gay means happy and joyous and you're USING IT WRONG." That being said, I think you have every right to be offended by a person using a word. What you don't seem to realize is that you're also being incredibly offensive and tossing out insults left and right, which gives you absolutely no moral high ground and IMO it looks kind of ridiculous to say someone has a lack of intelligence because he called someone a moron. "You're stupid because you call people stupid" isn't exactly the best argument, unless you're willing to accept the logical conclusion [;)]

Elisabella -> RE: Cheating spouses (11/24/2009 8:20:32 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Darcyandthedark At least I can sleep comfortably, knowing that I haven't name called, renounced my responsibilty or used ad hom attacks on a subject which one wouldn't have all the information about and instead I simply stuck to the facts as presented to me in black and white (well, it's kind of black and grey really) on the thread itself. the.dark. Actually you have. "Thoughtless bigot" is name calling. You might believe that the insult is applicable (as I'm sure Rhodes did when he referred to cheaters as morons), but regardless you used a negative slur in noun form to describe a person you disagreed with. I don't mind the pot calling the kettle black, so long as the pot realizes it's black too.

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