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RE: If Corrupt Democrats Kill the Public Option, It’s... - 11/28/2009 12:42:03 AM   
luckydawg


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Well you agreed with me. Then asked a question(in which you change what I said, as you are well aware, or maybe you are just stupid and don't), and then made a dumb remark.

But fine. As well as Public transportation not saving fuel or reducing carbon emmissions, laws are optional, and nothing happens if you refuse to comply....

Everyone here can see what a stupid position you are arguing....


So you can pretend you won

Compliance with the law is voluntary....nothing happens if you refuse to obey....according to RML....Idiot trolls would argue that ice is hot if I said it. Pathetic.



Just curious, what happens if you refuse to pay your taxes, in your world?

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(in reply to rulemylife)
Profile   Post #: 101
RE: If Corrupt Democrats Kill the Public Option, It’s... - 11/28/2009 12:45:16 AM   
rulemylife


Posts: 14614
Joined: 8/23/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: FatDomDaddy


I am saying, that is the way the Senate works.

When Bill Frist tried to use reconciliation to force the judical votes Democrats went nuts.

You don't recall the Nuclear Option and how the left howled?


Sometimes it does, but it seems Democrats are far more willing to cross party lines and vote their conscience.

I find it hard to believe that out of the combined Republican membership of the House and Senate that there was only one Representative to vote for the House bill and no Republican Senators who voted to move the Senate bill to debate.

(in reply to FatDomDaddy)
Profile   Post #: 102
RE: If Corrupt Democrats Kill the Public Option, It’s... - 11/28/2009 12:58:17 AM   
rulemylife


Posts: 14614
Joined: 8/23/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: luckydawg

Well you agreed with me. Then asked a question(in which you change what I said, as you are well aware, or maybe you are just stupid and don't), and then made a dumb remark.

But fine. As well as Public transportation not saving fuel or reducing carbon emmissions, laws are optional, and nothing happens if you refuse to comply....

Everyone here can see what a stupid position you are arguing....


So you can pretend you won

Compliance with the law is voluntary....nothing happens if you refuse to obey....according to RML....Idiot trolls would argue that ice is hot if I said it. Pathetic.



Just curious, what happens if you refuse to pay your taxes, in your world?



Let's not try to backpedal and change the parameters, your ridiculous statement was that all laws are backed by state-sanctioned violence.

Now you are trying to change the discussion by saying I said compliance with laws should be voluntary.

Care to offer more lies?

(in reply to luckydawg)
Profile   Post #: 103
RE: If Corrupt Democrats Kill the Public Option, It’s... - 11/28/2009 8:54:00 AM   
luckydawg


Posts: 2448
Joined: 9/2/2009
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Look troll, this is my statement,

"Tazzy, eventuall violence is the basis of every law. If you refuse to obey, you will be forced, if you resist, violence will be used against you, if you fight back you will either be subdued or killed, (or a small chance you get away and live in hiding with a fake name).

Thats what laws are. All laws.... "


post 24.


And its true.

You ar a ridiculous little troll, who apperantly has no life. So sad for you...

_____________________________

I was posting as Right Wing Hippie, but that account got messed up.

(in reply to rulemylife)
Profile   Post #: 104
RE: If Corrupt Democrats Kill the Public Option, It’s... - 11/28/2009 8:58:06 AM   
willbeurdaddy


Posts: 11894
Joined: 4/8/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: FatDomDaddy


I am saying, that is the way the Senate works.

When Bill Frist tried to use reconciliation to force the judical votes Democrats went nuts.

You don't recall the Nuclear Option and how the left howled?


Sometimes it does, but it seems Democrats are far more willing to cross party lines and vote their conscience.

I find it hard to believe that out of the combined Republican membership of the House and Senate that there was only one Representative to vote for the House bill and no Republican Senators who voted to move the Senate bill to debate.



Why dont you provide some evidence of that willingness during the GWB administration on issues of such importance?

It is the Dems who are refusing to cross party lines in voting for such a horrendous piece of crap that these bills represent.

(in reply to rulemylife)
Profile   Post #: 105
RE: If Corrupt Democrats Kill the Public Option, It’s... - 11/30/2009 12:15:17 PM   
SpinnerofTales


Posts: 1586
Joined: 5/30/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy


Why dont you provide some evidence of that willingness during the GWB administration on issues of such importance?

It is the Dems who are refusing to cross party lines in voting for such a horrendous piece of crap that these bills represent.


Try this:

http://www.cnn.com/2003/ALLPOLITICS/12/08/elec04.medicare/

According to this article, 10 democratic senators voted for the GWB Medicare reform bill. That seems to make it 10-0 for Dems crossing party lines. That could be statisticaly significant.

Anything else you want evidence of?

(in reply to willbeurdaddy)
Profile   Post #: 106
RE: If Corrupt Democrats Kill the Public Option, It’s... - 11/30/2009 1:13:37 PM   
Moonhead


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Sadly, you're on the money with that. The Dems were voting for all sorts of ridiculous crap under the chimp, up to an including the Patriot Act. Grim days, really. (Not that owt has changed, of course...)

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(in reply to SpinnerofTales)
Profile   Post #: 107
RE: If Corrupt Democrats Kill the Public Option, It’s... - 11/30/2009 3:29:31 PM   
willbeurdaddy


Posts: 11894
Joined: 4/8/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: SpinnerofTales

quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy


Why dont you provide some evidence of that willingness during the GWB administration on issues of such importance?

It is the Dems who are refusing to cross party lines in voting for such a horrendous piece of crap that these bills represent.


Try this:

http://www.cnn.com/2003/ALLPOLITICS/12/08/elec04.medicare/

According to this article, 10 democratic senators voted for the GWB Medicare reform bill. That seems to make it 10-0 for Dems crossing party lines. That could be statisticaly significant.

Anything else you want evidence of?



LMAO. You pick a bill that expands the role of government as evidence of Dems willingness to cross party lines? Try something a little less smack dab in the middle of the liberal agenda. If anything the fact that only 10 Dem Senators voted for it supports my point that they were a bunch of whining babies who would do anything to be obstructionist to anything with a GOP imprimatur.

(in reply to SpinnerofTales)
Profile   Post #: 108
RE: If Corrupt Democrats Kill the Public Option, It’s... - 11/30/2009 3:33:31 PM   
Moonhead


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Quite. It isn't like the GOP have ever voted along party lines to block a Democrat bill, is it?

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(in reply to willbeurdaddy)
Profile   Post #: 109
RE: If Corrupt Democrats Kill the Public Option, It’s... - 11/30/2009 5:15:20 PM   
willbeurdaddy


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Joined: 4/8/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

Quite. It isn't like the GOP have ever voted along party lines to block a Democrat bill, is it?


I think you meant "have never voted"? Of course they have, but they have done in it in keeping with precedent, unlike the Dems, who for example, upped the requirement for a judicial appointment to 60 votes for the first time.

(in reply to Moonhead)
Profile   Post #: 110
RE: If Corrupt Democrats Kill the Public Option, It’s... - 11/30/2009 6:25:16 PM   
SpinnerofTales


Posts: 1586
Joined: 5/30/2006
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quote:



LMAO. You pick a bill that expands the role of government as evidence of Dems willingness to cross party lines? Try something a little less smack dab in the middle of the liberal agenda. If anything the fact that only 10 Dem Senators voted for it supports my point that they were a bunch of whining babies who would do anything to be obstructionist to anything with a GOP imprimatur.


I forgot. GWB wasn't a "Twue Conservative"....well I showed my point...you show me one bill that passed the republican controlled senate that didn't have democrats crossing party lines to vote for, no matter how much in the "conservative agenda" it was. I haven't done the research so I'd be glad to see what you come up with.



(in reply to willbeurdaddy)
Profile   Post #: 111
RE: If Corrupt Democrats Kill the Public Option, It’s... - 11/30/2009 6:56:55 PM   
liketophoto


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How do we get over being bi-polar as a country?

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Profile   Post #: 112
RE: If Corrupt Democrats Kill the Public Option, It’s... - 11/30/2009 7:31:26 PM   
rulemylife


Posts: 14614
Joined: 8/23/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy


quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

Sometimes it does, but it seems Democrats are far more willing to cross party lines and vote their conscience.

I find it hard to believe that out of the combined Republican membership of the House and Senate that there was only one Representative to vote for the House bill and no Republican Senators who voted to move the Senate bill to debate.



Why dont you provide some evidence of that willingness during the GWB administration on issues of such importance?

It is the Dems who are refusing to cross party lines in voting for such a horrendous piece of crap that these bills represent.


You know Willbeur, I'm getting really tired of providing evidence for you since my requests to you have never been met with the same.

Bush proposals with strong Democratic support in Congress:

Comprehensive Immigration Reform Act of 2007. 

The Authorization for Use of Military Force Against Iraq Resolution of 2002.

Authorization for Use of Military Force Against Terrorism.

The No Child Left Behind Act of 2001.

Emergency Economic Stabilization Act of 2008

I can provide more if you like.






< Message edited by rulemylife -- 11/30/2009 7:33:46 PM >

(in reply to willbeurdaddy)
Profile   Post #: 113
RE: If Corrupt Democrats Kill the Public Option, It’s... - 11/30/2009 7:42:18 PM   
rulemylife


Posts: 14614
Joined: 8/23/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: luckydawg

Look troll, this is my statement,

"Tazzy, eventuall violence is the basis of every law. If you refuse to obey, you will be forced, if you resist, violence will be used against you, if you fight back you will either be subdued or killed, (or a small chance you get away and live in hiding with a fake name).

Thats what laws are. All laws.... "


post 24.


And its true.

You ar a ridiculous little troll, who apperantly has no life. So sad for you...


It is only true in your perception, which is seriously misguided.

The vast majority of laws on the books require only civil penalties and have no criminal penalties.

So, maybe you could take time out from your little temper tantrums and try to put forth a rational explanation for how a law like that results in the use of violence for breaking it.



(in reply to luckydawg)
Profile   Post #: 114
RE: If Corrupt Democrats Kill the Public Option, It’s... - 11/30/2009 7:52:07 PM   
rulemylife


Posts: 14614
Joined: 8/23/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

I think you meant "have never voted"? Of course they have, but they have done in it in keeping with precedent, unlike the Dems, who for example, upped the requirement for a judicial appointment to 60 votes for the first time.


What are you talking about now Willbeur?

(in reply to willbeurdaddy)
Profile   Post #: 115
RE: If Corrupt Democrats Kill the Public Option, It’s... - 11/30/2009 8:01:51 PM   
willbeurdaddy


Posts: 11894
Joined: 4/8/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

I think you meant "have never voted"? Of course they have, but they have done in it in keeping with precedent, unlike the Dems, who for example, upped the requirement for a judicial appointment to 60 votes for the first time.


What are you talking about now Willbeur?



You know damn well what Im talking about.

(in reply to rulemylife)
Profile   Post #: 116
RE: If Corrupt Democrats Kill the Public Option, It’s... - 11/30/2009 8:04:39 PM   
rulemylife


Posts: 14614
Joined: 8/23/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy


quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

I think you meant "have never voted"? Of course they have, but they have done in it in keeping with precedent, unlike the Dems, who for example, upped the requirement for a judicial appointment to 60 votes for the first time.


What are you talking about now Willbeur?



You know damn well what Im talking about.


Nope.  You'll have to enlighten me.

(in reply to willbeurdaddy)
Profile   Post #: 117
RE: If Corrupt Democrats Kill the Public Option, It’s... - 11/30/2009 8:07:48 PM   
willbeurdaddy


Posts: 11894
Joined: 4/8/2006
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy


quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

I think you meant "have never voted"? Of course they have, but they have done in it in keeping with precedent, unlike the Dems, who for example, upped the requirement for a judicial appointment to 60 votes for the first time.


What are you talking about now Willbeur?



You know damn well what Im talking about.


Nope.  You'll have to enlighten me.



"Democrats invented the filibuster of judicial nominees in 2003, when the previous congress was in session, in order to defeat many of President Bush’s conservative nominees to the federal circuit courts. The filibuster strategy developed out of the Democrats' concern for the fact that Republicans commanded a majority in the Senate and were in a position to approve all the president's appellate-level judicial nominees. As a result of the new filibuster tactic employed by the Democrats, President Bush has had the lowest confirmation rate for such appointments in the history of the U. S.

At issue is whether the Democrats have the right to change procedures that have governed the Senate for over 200 years in acting on judicial nominees, providing for what is known as an up-or-down vote on the Senate floor. By universal assent of every Senator, politician and historian of the Senate, never in U. S. history has approval of judicial nominees required anything more than a simple majority of 51 votes in the Senate. Not even those Senate Democrats who are most opposed to President Bush’s allegedly "out-of-the-mainstream onservative nominees" are proposing that the simple majority requirement be upped to a supermajority.
"

As if you really never heard of the Gang of 14.

(in reply to rulemylife)
Profile   Post #: 118
RE: If Corrupt Democrats Kill the Public Option, It’s... - 11/30/2009 9:12:47 PM   
rulemylife


Posts: 14614
Joined: 8/23/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

"Democrats invented the filibuster of judicial nominees in 2003
, when the previous congress was in session, in order to defeat many of President Bush’s conservative nominees to the federal circuit courts. The filibuster strategy developed out of the Democrats' concern for the fact that Republicans commanded a majority in the Senate and were in a position to approve all the president's appellate-level judicial nominees. As a result of the new filibuster tactic employed by the Democrats, President Bush has had the lowest confirmation rate for such appointments in the history of the U. S.

At issue is whether the Democrats have the right to change procedures that have governed the Senate for over 200 years in acting on judicial nominees, providing for what is known as an up-or-down vote on the Senate floor. By universal assent of every Senator, politician and historian of the Senate, never in U. S. history has approval of judicial nominees required anything more than a simple majority of 51 votes in the Senate. Not even those Senate Democrats who are most opposed to President Bush’s allegedly "out-of-the-mainstream onservative nominees" are proposing that the simple majority requirement be upped to a supermajority.
"

As if you really never heard of the Gang of 14.


Oh, I've heard of them, I was just wondering where you were going with this.

Since you did not provide a link I am not sure where your quote is from, but it's not accurate.

Clinton had far more judicial candidates blocked than Bush, by the Republicans refusing to hold hearings on his appointments, some for as long as four years.

In fact, many of Bush's appointments were for judicial positions that Clinton had tried to fill but the Republicans stalled in committee.



NPR: Primer: Judicial Nominees and the Senate Filibuster



Q: How many of President Bush's nominees have been kept waiting? How many have been confirmed?

The president's nominees to the district court level of the federal system have not been blocked. The conflict has come at the next level, the appeals court level, which is the intermediary step between trial courts and the U.S. Supreme Court.

President Bush has had 57 nominees for the U.S. Court of Appeals. Five never received hearings. Of the 52 who did, 42 have been confirmed, but 10 were blocked by Democrats' use of the filibuster to prevent a floor vote.



Q: But what about the use of the filibuster to stop judicial nominations?


With respect to judicial nominations, the most effective tactic in opposition has been to bottle them up in committee.

In the later years of the Clinton presidency, the Senate Judiciary Committee, which was controlled by Republicans, did not hold hearings for as many as 60 of his nominees, according to Democrats.

They argue that this refusal to even consider President Clinton's nominees was just as effective in blocking them as a filibuster.



Edited for a correction:

I didn't realize the article was dated until I posted.  The Clinton numbers are accurate but the final Bush total was 39 nominees never approved, still far less than Clinton.












< Message edited by rulemylife -- 11/30/2009 9:27:07 PM >

(in reply to willbeurdaddy)
Profile   Post #: 119
RE: If Corrupt Democrats Kill the Public Option, It’s... - 12/1/2009 10:25:53 AM   
luckydawg


Posts: 2448
Joined: 9/2/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: luckydawg

Look troll, this is my statement,

"Tazzy, eventuall violence is the basis of every law. If you refuse to obey, you will be forced, if you resist, violence will be used against you, if you fight back you will either be subdued or killed, (or a small chance you get away and live in hiding with a fake name).

Thats what laws are. All laws.... "


post 24.


And its true.

You ar a ridiculous little troll, who apperantly has no life. So sad for you...


It is only true in your perception, which is seriously misguided.

The vast majority of laws on the books require only civil penalties and have no criminal penalties.

So, maybe you could take time out from your little temper tantrums and try to put forth a rational explanation for how a law like that results in the use of violence for breaking it.






And what happens if you refuse to pay the civil fines?????? You will be forced and if you resist, violence will be used.....this is basic common sense. Laws are not optional.

No where have I ever said that violence is the punishment for all laws. That is what you and panda are saying....using a troll tactic of changing what I said..

I said that if you refuse to comply violence will eventually be used.


Your trolling is just stupid.

_____________________________

I was posting as Right Wing Hippie, but that account got messed up.

(in reply to rulemylife)
Profile   Post #: 120
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