Obamacare sparking 10th Amendment rebellion, action in seven states (Full Version)

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pahunkboy -> Obamacare sparking 10th Amendment rebellion, action in seven states (12/26/2009 3:43:44 AM)

Looks like the steadily growing list of constitutional, ethical and political outrages that constitute the Harry Reid version of Obamacare is sparking a rebellion in the states, as AP reports South Carolina’s attorney general plans to investigate the vote-buying that surrounded the proposal in the Senate majority leader’s office. According to AP, South Carolina’s Henry McMaster is being joined by the attorneys general of Michigan and Washington state in a suit to determine the constitutionality of the Obamacare proposal. Their initiative was prompted by a request from South Carolina’s two senators, Lindsay Graham and Jim DeMint, both Republicans. Attorneys-general in at least four other states are also considering joining McMasters, according to AP. A move by a group of states to challenge the constitutionality of Obamacare could reinvigorate the efficacy of the 10th Amendment, which reserves  to the states or the people all rights not specifically granted to the federal government. Graham has been all over cable news today visibly angry about the vote-buying by Reid that secured the votes of Senators Mary Landrieu of Louisiana, Ben Nelson of Nebraska, and Bernie Sanders of Vermont, as well as possibly other senators as yet unknown. DeMint has also been active, especially on the issue of the Reid amendment’s provision seeking to bar future congresses from changing even a single word of Section 3403 on the Independent Medicare Advisory Board (IMAB). The IMAB will become the federal health care ground zero under Obamacare if it becomes law. Ed Morrissey at Hot Air has a link to DeMint’s floor speech on the issue and additional information, analyses, and links. Nelson’s deal with Reid has attracted the most attention because it exempts Nebraska from paying its share of Medicaid expenses in perpetuity. Medicaid expenditures are among the most expensive federal mandates on state governments, and the Obamacare bill will significantly increase costs for all other states that don’t somehow wangle a similar deal. It also raises a/snip

http://dprogram.net/2009/12/24/obamacare-sparking-10th-amendment-rebellion-action-in-seven-states/




mefisto69 -> RE: Obamacare sparking 10th Amendment rebellion, action in seven states (12/26/2009 4:04:39 AM)

the republicants will shoot themselves in the arse if they pursue this




Musicmystery -> RE: Obamacare sparking 10th Amendment rebellion, action in seven states (12/26/2009 9:45:55 AM)

You mean, shoot themselves in the ass again.




Moonhead -> RE: Obamacare sparking 10th Amendment rebellion, action in seven states (12/26/2009 10:29:51 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

You mean, shoot themselves in the ass again.

They like to shoot themselves in the arse as often as possible. They're very kinky like that.




flcouple2009 -> RE: Obamacare sparking 10th Amendment rebellion, action in seven states (12/26/2009 10:46:34 AM)

This is going to go nowhere and they know it.  They just want to be able to later claim to their base, "We did everything we could".

You do understand the reason for the section stating that the independent board can not be changed?  So that it remains independent and later doesn't become a political tool.  So no one like  Cheney can come along later and decide Halliburton should take over the board.




Arpig -> RE: Obamacare sparking 10th Amendment rebellion, action in seven states (12/26/2009 11:19:27 AM)

It is just this question of constitutionality why I have always proposed that the Feds pass the law that establishes minimum requirements the funding formula and have each state set up & run its own single-payer system, much as was done in Canada to deal with a similar constitutional division of powers issue.
I suspect that the bill will pass any SCOTUS review pretty much as is, but they have surprised us before, so we shall see.




Musicmystery -> RE: Obamacare sparking 10th Amendment rebellion, action in seven states (12/26/2009 11:24:43 AM)

OK, look, guys..........

Barack Obama is a Constitutional Law scholar.

Whatever this thing is, isn't, should be, shouldn't be, tries to do, fails to do...I'm certain it will pass constitutional scrutiny.

I'm also certain Republicans will throw everything they can think of at it, true or false. It's what they've always done, it's what they're doing now, and it's what they'll do through November.





willbeurdaddy -> RE: Obamacare sparking 10th Amendment rebellion, action in seven states (12/26/2009 1:03:03 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

OK, look, guys..........

Barack Obama is a Constitutional Law scholar.

Whatever this thing is, isn't, should be, shouldn't be, tries to do, fails to do...I'm certain it will pass constitutional scrutiny.

I'm also certain Republicans will throw everything they can think of at it, true or false. It's what they've always done, it's what they're doing now, and it's what they'll do through November.




A Constitutional Law scholar that believes that the Constitution is an impediment to the way things should be. He will try to get anything through the courts that he thinks has a fighting chance.




Musicmystery -> RE: Obamacare sparking 10th Amendment rebellion, action in seven states (12/26/2009 1:06:31 PM)

And in that, he's the same as every President before him, ever since there's been a Constitution.

Perhaps especially Bush/Cheney, who greatly expanded the reach of executive power.





cuckoldmepls -> RE: Obamacare sparking 10th Amendment rebellion, action in seven states (12/26/2009 1:38:31 PM)

Constitutional law scholar my ass. The guy doesn't have the faintest understanding of the 1st, 2nd, and 10th amendments, not to mention the part that specifically requires our government to protect us from invasion 4 different times. You can't be serious.

While i agree that beginning in 1913 with the passage of the 1913 Federal act which essentially created a private agency to coin our money, which is unconstitutional since only the federal government itself has the power to coin money, almost every president has disregarded the U.S. Constitution when it didn't fit their idea of what a republican form of government should be. FDR and the democrats made the second major violation with the passage of Social Security since there is nothing in the constitution about the federal government being required to fund Seniors retirement. Therefore, it is a state responsibility according to the 10th amendment.

Some of the most recent republican abuses are the refusal to secure our borders, and protect American jobs with the everify system which has now resulted in at least 10% unemployment officially, and more like 12% to 15% true unemployment. The Patriot Act is the most unconstitutional law of all, and it can easily be modified to monitor only non citizens without warrants, but they refuse to change it in case something happens and they will get blamed for it. It's the same way with cancelling NAFTA. A lot of politicians would like to cancel NAFTA, but they are afraid if the economy collapses then they will get blamed for it. So instead, they are willing to allow us to slow degenerate into a 3rd world nation.

The difference with Obama and the democrats though, is that they have not only flagrantly violated the Constitution on issues of gun control, borders, free speech, states rights, and our sovereignty by signing treatiesand joining organizations (WTO & UN) that give away our autonomy,  they are also attempting to expand the size of government and give the illusion of creating jobs, instead of providing a conducive environment for private enterprise to create real jobs that provide you with a product or service when they take your money. Government jobs are nothing but a dead weight hanging around our neck, that forces the government to take more and more of your paycheck or borrow money that requires us to pay billions in interest to wealthy people here, abroad, and to foreign countries.

I did the math on it. Soon we will be paying half a trillion in interest on the national debt. Now if we didn't have to pay interest on the national debt, that half a trillion could be divided up among the states, and it would be 10 billion for each state each year. That would easily fund maps projects to build brand new inner city schools, and rehabilitate old crime invested neighborhoods, and provide plenty of money for lots of law enforcement so people in big cities could take pride in their community again, and not feel like they are living in a hell hole every day of their lives. The democrats are flat out wrong on their approach of more taxes on corporations and energy companies who will pass on the costs to us, and more government. Government always works best when you let the most local government handle the problems that directly affect them, states handle the problems that affect the entire state, and the feds handle the problems that a federal government can cover such as national defense, and secure borders.

There's only one reason we are $10 trillion in debt. That's because the feds have exceeded their constitutiona authority on 100's of issues, and created spending programs that should have been left up to the states. My Gosh people, even the national park system is unconsitutional. There's absolutely no reason each state can't run their own national parks, and if they don't make money, then shut them down. It's that simple.

This is a great site exposing liberal mentality who don't have the foggiest understanding of the constitution. http://babelishere.webs.com






pahunkboy -> RE: Obamacare sparking 10th Amendment rebellion, action in seven states (12/26/2009 2:42:48 PM)

Actually many states are looking at seceeding for a variety of reasons.

The first ones that do will be the ones who send more 4 to DC then they get back.




thornhappy -> RE: Obamacare sparking 10th Amendment rebellion, action in seven states (12/26/2009 7:38:19 PM)

Guess they'll turn down disaster aid and such?




tazzygirl -> RE: Obamacare sparking 10th Amendment rebellion, action in seven states (12/26/2009 8:00:39 PM)

Nebraska was such a state... and even they stated they werent really seceeding.

Its a popular threat... one they wont ever carry out.




pahunkboy -> RE: Obamacare sparking 10th Amendment rebellion, action in seven states (12/26/2009 8:23:50 PM)

The states do have to make a statement.   Washington has run amuck.

Leaving tho is not so cut and dry.   Likely the fed will say- you are free to go- just pay your tab on the way out.  Of course no state can actually pay its debt.

On many levels- the govt is shackled by debt.

A number of issues could tip the scale.  Gun control comes to mind.

Alaska and Texas might be able to survive with out the other states.

When you send money to any govt - there is an overhead that can never be regained.

States leaving is not a bad thing.  It is more that the sum of the parts will be greater then the whole.
All the world treaties could also be a impetus for some to leave.

..such as NAFTA, CAFTA, GATT, WTO and the like.




ThatDamnedPanda -> RE: Obamacare sparking 10th Amendment rebellion, action in seven states (12/26/2009 8:33:59 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

Actually many states are looking at seceeding for a variety of reasons.




Which ones?




pahunkboy -> RE: Obamacare sparking 10th Amendment rebellion, action in seven states (12/26/2009 8:45:39 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: ThatDamnedPanda

quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

Actually many states are looking at seceeding for a variety of reasons.




Which ones?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K8bbrXnYJOo

Washington, D.C., has impeded on the powers reserved to the states and the people. This significant transfer of powers from the individual states to the national government came not through revolution, but through ongoing and unchecked encroachments. Now, this federal intrusion on state sovereignty has reached a breaking point.

Below are some examples where national government has or could infringe on state sovereignty: * By collecting taxes from state residents and then using that money to compel sovereign state governments - through the use of "strings" attached to federal funding - to implement programs and provide services in accordance with the desires of federal authorities. * By pushing states toward financial distress by providing financial incentives to implement programs and services without supplying adequate federal funding. * By enacting national laws that go far beyond the federal powers enumerated in the U.S. Constitution. * By potentially providing federal funds to fill state budget deficits, which were created - in part - through over-spending prompted by federal financial incentives to create new programs.

The Answer: Putting Federal Authorities on Notice In an attempt to proclaim and reassert Pennsylvania state government's independence and sovereignty from the federal government, I plan to introduce a House resolution reminding federal authorities about the constitutional limitations on their powers and calling on them to cease and desist with all activities that infringe on the powers reserved to the state of Pennsylvania and its citizens. This is an issue that is currently being addressed by more than 20 other states across our nation. Like our sister states, Pennsylvania must draw a line in the sand and reassert its sovereignty. I am currently circulating the resolution among my peers in the Pennsylvania House of Representatives. Please encourage your family members, friends and acquaintances who live outside our legislative district to contact their House member and urge them to support this measure to protect Pennsylvania's independence. To read a copy of the resolution click the following link:

http://samrohrer.com/uploads/10thAmen...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K8bbrXnYJOo  20 of them




Musicmystery -> RE: Obamacare sparking 10th Amendment rebellion, action in seven states (12/26/2009 8:53:59 PM)

Where has Oregon?
She stole a Newbrasskey;
Too bad that Arkansas,
And so did Tenessee--
If you want Alaska...
she went to pay her Texas,
And so has Michigone.

What did Delaware song




pahunkboy -> RE: Obamacare sparking 10th Amendment rebellion, action in seven states (12/26/2009 9:05:12 PM)

...I don't see it happening.   Why?

Because of the debt owed.   The whole purpose of debt is the control by the multi national banks.  Goldman Saches sends staff the Bush white house and now Obama white house.  




Fellow -> RE: Obamacare sparking 10th Amendment rebellion, action in seven states (12/26/2009 11:18:45 PM)

 American politicians don't want to diminish the profits of the businesses that run up the costs of the medical care. The whole exercise trying to do something in this field is futile. The lobbyists make millions and take a guess where the money comes from. The pro consumer policies will never be implemented even if they will pass some kind of legislation. There will be loopholes, exceptions and so on....




Sanity -> RE: Obamacare sparking 10th Amendment rebellion, action in seven states (12/27/2009 8:54:26 AM)


They sure seem to have their donations to the current power brokers up to date. Maybe thats why Sarah Palin was so popular in Alaska, she tore the good 'ol boy network up there a new one.

Even amongst her own party.


quote:

ORIGINAL: Fellow

American politicians don't want to diminish the profits of the businesses that run up the costs of the medical care. The whole exercise trying to do something in this field is futile. The lobbyists make millions and take a guess where the money comes from. The pro consumer policies will never be implemented even if they will pass some kind of legislation. There will be loopholes, exceptions and so on....




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