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RE: When is it cheating? - 3/23/2006 4:38:13 PM   
angelic


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<edited because it just wasn't nice>

< Message edited by angelic -- 3/23/2006 4:39:08 PM >


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RE: When is it cheating? - 3/23/2006 4:52:29 PM   
catize


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quote:

ORIGINAL: angelic

cheating is cheating and there are a billion ways to justify it to ourselves to make us feel it's all ok.


We cannot be honest with another if we are not honest to ourselves.
We cannot honor another unless we honor ourselves.



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RE: When is it cheating? - 3/23/2006 4:58:24 PM   
IrishMist


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I am going to add something here, mainly because of the topic of this thread, and the way the other thread took a turn towards this. When I first married my late husband, I had no idea what BDSM was, or what it entailed. I went into my relationship with him, making all the 'normal' vows that one makes when they marry. At the time of our marriage, he had already been living the lifestyle for many years, but no, it was never brought up with me in any respect. I learned of this through time, and through listening to him express certain desires, wants, and needs to me. I eventually became so curious about what he was describing, that I began to read everything I could, and asked him to help me understand it. One thing though, is that, at the beginning of our marriage, never was it ever brought up about bringing others in, or about him or I having a relationship with another. So yes, I went into my marriage believing that we would have a happy ever after monagamous relationship. Within 3 years of our marriage, things had changed drastically between us. No longer were we equals; he was Master, I was slave. It was not an easy transition for me, despite my curiosity over it, but it is one that I went into with my eyes open, and accepted. It eventually evolved to the point that what he decided, was what happened. No if's, and's, or questions about it. I was able to voice any concerns I had over changes, but in the end, it was his decision. And that included the choice to have other relationships. Never, not once during our marriage, did I EVER feel that he cheated on me, or lied to me, or deceived me in any way. If he brought someone home for the weekend, or the night; it was his decision to make, and one that I welcomed because it made HIM happy. And that, made me happy.

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RE: When is it cheating? - 3/23/2006 5:04:23 PM   
catize


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quote:

ORIGINAL: KnightofMists 

mmmmmmm like more men than you know what to do with?  *G*


*Chuckles*  ........Thumbs through the manual 'catize and the gang'

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RE: When is it cheating? - 3/23/2006 5:06:45 PM   
angelic


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quote:

ORIGINAL: IrishMist

I am going to add something here, mainly because of the topic of this thread, and the way the other thread took a turn towards this. When I first married my late husband, I had no idea what BDSM was, or what it entailed. I went into my relationship with him, making all the 'normal' vows that one makes when they marry. At the time of our marriage, he had already been living the lifestyle for many years, but no, it was never brought up with me in any respect. I learned of this through time, and through listening to him express certain desires, wants, and needs to me. I eventually became so curious about what he was describing, that I began to read everything I could, and asked him to help me understand it. One thing though, is that, at the beginning of our marriage, never was it ever brought up about bringing others in, or about him or I having a relationship with another. So yes, I went into my marriage believing that we would have a happy ever after monagamous relationship. Within 3 years of our marriage, things had changed drastically between us. No longer were we equals; he was Master, I was slave. It was not an easy transition for me, despite my curiosity over it, but it is one that I went into with my eyes open, and accepted. It eventually evolved to the point that what he decided, was what happened. No if's, and's, or questions about it. I was able to voice any concerns I had over changes, but in the end, it was his decision. And that included the choice to have other relationships. Never, not once during our marriage, did I EVER feel that he cheated on me, or lied to me, or deceived me in any way. If he brought someone home for the weekend, or the night; it was his decision to make, and one that I welcomed because it made HIM happy. And that, made me happy.


i am sorry about your loss.

_____________________________

~....and once you have tasted flight, you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been and there you long to return.~ -- Leonardo de Vinci


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RE: When is it cheating? - 3/23/2006 5:36:13 PM   
fastlane


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quote:

ORIGINAL: IrishMist

I am going to add something here, mainly because of the topic of this thread, and the way the other thread took a turn towards this. When I first married my late husband, I had no idea what BDSM was, or what it entailed. I went into my relationship with him, making all the 'normal' vows that one makes when they marry. At the time of our marriage, he had already been living the lifestyle for many years, but no, it was never brought up with me in any respect. I learned of this through time, and through listening to him express certain desires, wants, and needs to me. I eventually became so curious about what he was describing, that I began to read everything I could, and asked him to help me understand it. One thing though, is that, at the beginning of our marriage, never was it ever brought up about bringing others in, or about him or I having a relationship with another. So yes, I went into my marriage believing that we would have a happy ever after monagamous relationship. Within 3 years of our marriage, things had changed drastically between us. No longer were we equals; he was Master, I was slave. It was not an easy transition for me, despite my curiosity over it, but it is one that I went into with my eyes open, and accepted. It eventually evolved to the point that what he decided, was what happened. No if's, and's, or questions about it. I was able to voice any concerns I had over changes, but in the end, it was his decision. And that included the choice to have other relationships. Never, not once during our marriage, did I EVER feel that he cheated on me, or lied to me, or deceived me in any way. If he brought someone home for the weekend, or the night; it was his decision to make, and one that I welcomed because it made HIM happy. And that, made me happy.


When it's not honest..and deception..it's cheating..........NUFF SAID!

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RE: When is it cheating? - 3/23/2006 5:41:12 PM   
MrThorns


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quote:

ORIGINAL: angelic
...In a M/s relationship does the Master/Dom/me EVER cheat? 


Yes, unfortunately there are many people who cheat...regardless of their being master, slave, submissive, switch, etc.  What of the slave who claims no limts on initial negotiations, but then...suddenly... finds that she does have limits?  Isn't that considered cheating?  Or is her discovery...her epiphany...just part of her progress and growth as a slave?

quote:


Or is it simply He/She is Master/Dom/me and His/Her submissive/slave has to bury any misgivings about it? 


That is one option...yes.  Another option would be to try to find acceptance in the situation... or take the opportunity to leave.  (There are many more options of course... these just seem to be the ones that make the most sense to me.)

quote:


Is it not cheating, simply because He/She went to their spouse/significant other and told them they were searching for others?   Or, is it only cheating when He/She does it behind another's back? 
 

If you feel as though you have to hide your actions...you're probably cheating...or just really paranoid.  If the significant other is unhappy with my choices regarding sexual behavior, then they should walk away... just as they would walk if they were unhappy about any of my other choices.

quote:

How do Yyou define cheating?


Cheating is deceptive behavior.

~Thorns


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RE: When is it cheating? - 3/23/2006 5:58:57 PM   
ownedgirlie


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quote:

ORIGINAL: MrDiscipline44

I believe people will always have differing views of what is considered cheating and what is not. It only matters to the one(s) we're in a relationship with though. Some people don't want to know who their S/O is sleeping with. Some actually say "Don't bring home a disease and we'll be alright" and leave it at that.

My S/O wants to at least meet the woman before I give her a "ride" around the block. For her, it's not cheating since she at leasts knows what's going on.

For my slave there is no need to know. There is no it's cheating if it this, it's cheating if it's that. She is a slave, therefore my relationship with her is not a "dating/married to" type of relationship. We don't have a romantic relationship. Do I have to tell her? No and she knows and excepts this. Do I tell her? Not always.


i completely relate to this post in all that You have said.  Thank you for putting it out there.

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RE: When is it cheating? - 3/23/2006 7:13:47 PM   
truesub4u


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I have been reading this post tonight. Commenting, responding, and thinking of others post as well. More and more I see myself understanding others views on IF the other is aware of the others activities. Though I might not agree with stepping out. I really find myself rethinking the whole concept... that if ... and only IF the other IS aware... then no.. I guess you are right... and I am indeed wrong.. it's not really considered cheating.

So far all agree to the fact that if one sneaks, hides, feels guilt, remore, whatever... well yeah.. then it's cheating. But the more I look on into the other side of all this... and the responses... I see where most are coming from on the it's not cheating IF the other is aware of the activities.

I'm not a jealous type person, I don't get mad so much at the cheating as much as I would over the fact of one feeling like they have to. And being a little on the stingy side.. not liking to share on a full time basis... I couldn't be polly 24/7. And yes, i've thought of the other thread as well. And hey hell, if it works for some, more power to them. I know I just couldn't. And I guess because of knowing I couldn't .... my response may have came across more of judging others. That was not my intent. Hell maybe a small part of me is envious of the ones that can. Because I'll tell ya... I read some of the responses to some in polly lifestyle.. and they do appear to be having a shit pot full of fun... LOL Might just need to be something I need to look further into myself... maybe not. I am sorry it I seem to have judged... like I said.. it was not my intent. It was mostly my opinion. But my wording seems to of taken on a new path on their own. If I offended anyone.... for this I am sorry.

Angelic.. didn't mean to steal thread... I just think that my thoughts on cheating and polly have been a little clouded by my own bias thoughts... and less open to others insights. I do have a slight problem speaking without thinking.. my downfall and something I need to work on.

Have a great weekend  all... I'm off to be tortured... 3 day weekend here (I hate teachers work days... why don't they just call it a damn day off... LOL)

< Message edited by truesub4u -- 3/23/2006 7:19:29 PM >


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RE: When is it cheating? - 3/23/2006 7:21:28 PM   
ownedgirlie


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True this is why i adore you so much :)  i know first hand the struggle of not understanding something and placing my judgments on it, because what do i know but my own experiences, and it is on those experiences that i base my opinions.  Humans do that, and it is normal.  But what you have done here is to go a step further, and really see and hear what other people are saying.  That is commendable. You are right - everyone pretty much has said the same thing.  If people are open about it, cool.  If they are not, it's cheating.  And the level of involvement each party wants to have, differs depending on the relationships. 

You know you have never offended me with your opinions, even when we have disagreed.  i wasn't always open to poly either, in fact my Master intentionally waited until he knew i could handle it (meaning i stopped cringing over it, lol) before talking seriously about bringing someone in. 

Big hugssss to you, my friend, and enjoy (ha) i mean good luck this weekend. 

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RE: When is it cheating? - 3/23/2006 9:06:32 PM   
DragonNphoenix


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In my mind, it is cheating when it is done behind the so's back.  If the Master/Mistress is unfront and the feelings/thoughts of the slave/sub have been discussed, then it is not cheating.  If the Master/Mistress does it without any discussion, I believe that it is cheating at that point.

Just my thoughts, though

1st Girl Phoenix

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RE: When is it cheating? - 3/24/2006 6:16:17 AM   
IrishMist


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Angelic, I was not trying to garner sympathy, but rather to show that in any relationship, people change through time. Our desires, our wants, our needs, are constantly changing ( no matter what label you put on yourself ). They may be huge changes that smack you in the face, or they may be small changes that are not noticed; but it happens with everyone. 

The old saying of 'never say never' is actually very good advice. What you may find abhorent now, in 10 years you may find to be extremely beautiful and fullfilling. But by closing your mind to the POSSIBLITY of change, you are destroying the chance for growth. Just something to think about.

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RE: When is it cheating? - 3/24/2006 6:32:55 AM   
angelic


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quote:

ORIGINAL: IrishMist

Angelic, I was not trying to garner sympathy, but rather to show that in any relationship, people change through time. Our desires, our wants, our needs, are constantly changing ( no matter what label you put on yourself ). They may be huge changes that smack you in the face, or they may be small changes that are not noticed; but it happens with everyone. 

The old saying of 'never say never' is actually very good advice. What you may find abhorent now, in 10 years you may find to be extremely beautiful and fullfilling. But by closing your mind to the POSSIBLITY of change, you are destroying the chance for growth. Just something to think about.


Irishmist, i agree 100%.  Had i stayed in my last M/s relationship, i'm sure another would have been brought into it.  i knew it, He told me it would happen and i would have accepted it as i was his slave.  (That btw is NOT the reason he is now my former Master). 

_____________________________

~....and once you have tasted flight, you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been and there you long to return.~ -- Leonardo de Vinci


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RE: When is it cheating? - 3/24/2006 7:47:41 AM   
ownedgirlie


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quote:

ORIGINAL: IrishMist

The old saying of 'never say never' is actually very good advice. What you may find abhorent now, in 10 years you may find to be extremely beautiful and fullfilling. But by closing your mind to the POSSIBLITY of change, you are destroying the chance for growth. Just something to think about.


So well said, and i have learned that first hand. i have also learned that if one can not adapt and evolve with life and life's relationships, one can become stuck and there is no happiness in that.  Great post.

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