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RE: US accused of 'occupying' Haiti as troops flood in - 1/18/2010 8:44:10 PM   
thornhappy


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Status: offline 		Hell, they had quite a warning with Katrina.  It's earthquakes and tornadoes that make life hell for logistics.

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RE: US accused of 'occupying' Haiti as troops flood in - 1/18/2010 9:20:07 PM   
Marc2b


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Status: offline 		Sanity, you like stirring the pot – admit it. Just bear in mind that when you go tossing red meat to hungry dogs you risk getting bit.

I’m pretty much with LadyEllen on this one. I think people are underestimating the amount of damage as well as the level of chaos that such desperate conditions create. It also makes sense that the United States – due to proximity as well as availability of supplies and personal – should take the lead in relief efforts.

As for people criticizing the effort or trying to make political hay out of it – that’s to be expected. You can’t please all of the people all of the time and some people you can never please – especially if they are already inclined to dislike you (like that blathering idiot, Chavez). It’s a damned if you do or damned if you don’t situation.

Keeping Haiti in my prayers,

Marc2b.


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RE: US accused of 'occupying' Haiti as troops flood in - 1/18/2010 11:41:07 PM   
popeye1250


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Status: offline 		Marc, the U.S. is 650 miles away from Haiti. Not exactly neighbors. What about Cuba? They're right next door.
And what about the Dominican Republic? They're on the very same Island.


Hey! Where's Geraldo in all this? Anyone seen him? You'd a figgured he'd be down there getting in the way trying to load stretchers into helos and dodging bullets! Didn't Hillary take him with her?
I haven't seen him on any of the news shows.

< Message edited by popeye1250 -- 1/18/2010 11:53:59 PM >

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RE: US accused of 'occupying' Haiti as troops flood in - 1/19/2010 4:26:22 AM   
LadyEllen


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From: Stourport-England
Status: offline 		Plenty of Cuban medics over there P, have been for a while. Dont remember which station now (BBC/Ch4) ran into a team.

But overall - this isnt a competition, its a rescue mission. The longer we stand around and debate (as per the OP) who is "in charge" and the more we argue about who did most, the more we start to look like we're there to be seen to be there, like the guys who pray on the street to be seen by others you know?

E

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RE: US accused of 'occupying' Haiti as troops flood in - 1/19/2010 4:35:52 AM   
vincentML


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Status: offline 		Popeye, the US has two rather large Haitian communities and a long history with the island. Much of it not so good unfortunately. If you think 650 miles is a long distance you might wish to get off your ship and try taking a plane for a change.

ETA Cuba has given the US overflight permission.

< Message edited by vincentML -- 1/19/2010 4:38:45 AM >

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RE: US accused of 'occupying' Haiti as troops flood in - 1/19/2010 6:30:15 AM   
Marc2b


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quote:

Marc, the U.S. is 650 miles away from Haiti. Not exactly neighbors. What about Cuba? They're right next door.
And what about the Dominican Republic? They're on the very same Island.


Hey! Where's Geraldo in all this? Anyone seen him? You'd a figgured he'd be down there getting in the way trying to load stretchers into helos and dodging bullets! Didn't Hillary take him with her?
I haven't seen him on any of the news shows.


Yes but do those countries have the neccessary supllies, equipment and personal? They can (and should) certainly help but take the lead? That's a different story.

As for the distance - are you an American or a Brit? Havent you heard the old saying?: Brits think 600 miles is a long distance and 600 years is a short time. Americans think 600 miles is a short distance and 600 years a long time.

650 miles ain't shit.

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RE: US accused of 'occupying' Haiti as troops flood in - 1/19/2010 8:20:48 AM   
Sanity


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I stir the pot just by being me, thats not really the point of contention. What E and company are going on about is that they can't understand that my OP in this thread and my Chavez post were more than slightly tongue-in-cheek.


quote:

ORIGINAL: Marc2b

Sanity, you like stirring the pot – admit it. Just bear in mind that when you go tossing red meat to hungry dogs you risk getting bit.

I’m pretty much with LadyEllen on this one. I think people are underestimating the amount of damage as well as the level of chaos that such desperate conditions create. It also makes sense that the United States – due to proximity as well as availability of supplies and personal – should take the lead in relief efforts.

As for people criticizing the effort or trying to make political hay out of it – that’s to be expected. You can’t please all of the people all of the time and some people you can never please – especially if they are already inclined to dislike you (like that blathering idiot, Chavez). It’s a damned if you do or damned if you don’t situation.

Keeping Haiti in my prayers,

Marc2b.



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RE: US accused of 'occupying' Haiti as troops flood in - 1/19/2010 8:30:44 AM   
Sanity


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quote:

US troops land at Haiti presidential palace


PORT-AU-PRINCE, Haiti – Scores of U.S. troops landed on the lawn of Haiti's shattered presidential palace Tuesday to the cheers of quake victims and the U.N. said it would add 3,500 police and soldiers to the sluggish global effort to aid the devastated country.

The U.N. forces are aimed at helping control the outbursts of looting and violence that have slowed distribution of supplies. The Security Council approved adding 2,000 troops to the 7,000 military peacekeepers already in the country as well as 1,500 more police to the 2,100-strong international force.

Haitians jammed the fence of the palace grounds to gawk and cheer as U.S. troops emerged from six Navy helicopters.

"We are happy that they are coming, because we have so many problems," said Fede Felissaint, a hairdresser.

Given the circumstances, he did not even mind the troops taking up positions at the presidential palace. "If they want, they can stay longer than in 1915," he said, a reference to the start of a 19-year U.S. military presence in Haiti — something U.S. officials have repeatedly insisted they have no intention of repeating.

Full article at http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100119/ap_on_re_la_am_ca/cb_haiti_earthquake


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RE: US accused of 'occupying' Haiti as troops flood in - 1/19/2010 10:20:06 AM   
vincentML


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity


Maybe we should just admit it. We really are the damn Yankee Imperialists everyone keeps saying we are...






Of course we are. You know that, Sanity. We occupied Haiti from what (?) 1925 to 1937 to "quell unrest." I think we should just take the whole half island and put it in the Jersey Meadowlands or the Florida Everglades and rope it off and fugedaboudit.

Naw, I don't mean that. Really feel for the poor fuckers. I guess we don't have it half as bad here as we think we do.

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RE: US accused of 'occupying' Haiti as troops flood in - 1/19/2010 11:56:13 AM   
rulemylife


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quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

Marc, the U.S. is 650 miles away from Haiti. Not exactly neighbors. What about Cuba? They're right next door.
And what about the Dominican Republic? They're on the very same Island.



Cuba is hardly right next door.  The distance from Key West to Port-au-Prince Airport is 736 miles.  The distance from Jose Marti Airport in Cuba to Port-au-Prince is 621 miles.

Distance Calculator

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RE: US accused of 'occupying' Haiti as troops flood in - 1/19/2010 12:29:43 PM   
popeye1250


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Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
Status: offline 		And what happened to the "U.N." taking the lead like they did during the Tsunami disaster and us helping them?
The Red Cross gave them a lot of money if I remember correctly.
They must have 10,000 people sitting in offices in NYC.
Rule, look on a map of Cuba and Haiti, we did a slow overnight sail from GTMO to Port O Prince.

And where's Waldo, I mean Geraldo?

< Message edited by popeye1250 -- 1/19/2010 12:30:57 PM >

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RE: US accused of 'occupying' Haiti as troops flood in - 1/19/2010 12:51:29 PM   
Moonhead


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quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250
And what happened to the "U.N." taking the lead like they did during the Tsunami disaster and us helping them?
The Red Cross gave them a lot of money if I remember correctly.
They must have 10,000 people sitting in offices in NYC.

Aren't those organisations that you thoroughly disapprove of and want to see dissolved? Your complaining that they aren't doing enough seems a little disingenuous given that.
And can you provide a source which states that the UN and Red Cross are doing less about the situation than the Kenyan squatter in the white house?

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RE: US accused of 'occupying' Haiti as troops flood in - 1/19/2010 12:57:16 PM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
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Status: offline 		~FR~

Two bottom line points:

*On the imperialism charge---well duh, of course we are. That news is a century old, especially in regards to Latin America.

*Why so much foreign aid? First, per head, we've giving far less than European nations. Why not help our own citizens? Guess what--we do (it's not either/or). Why are we in Haiti? Because action and a few dollars now is far, far easier and far, far cheaper than hundreds of thousands of desperate refugees mobbing the seas to reach our shores. Why aren't Cuba and the Dominican Republic helping? Guess what--they are.

Coldly, it's in the U.S.'s best interest. The "why are we spending overseas" is a tired knee-jerk reaction.




< Message edited by Musicmystery -- 1/19/2010 12:58:20 PM >

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RE: US accused of 'occupying' Haiti as troops flood in - 1/19/2010 1:01:13 PM   
popeye1250


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From: New Hampshire
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead


quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250
And what happened to the "U.N." taking the lead like they did during the Tsunami disaster and us helping them?
The Red Cross gave them a lot of money if I remember correctly.
They must have 10,000 people sitting in offices in NYC.

Aren't those organisations that you thoroughly disapprove of and want to see dissolved? Your complaining that they aren't doing enough seems a little disingenuous given that.
And can you provide a source which states that the UN and Red Cross are doing less about the situation than the Kenyan squatter in the white house?



Moonhead, yes, I thouroughly despise the teabaggers of the "U.N."
As for a "source" turn on the telly and all you see is U.S. Military, no-one with vests saying "U.N." on them.

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RE: US accused of 'occupying' Haiti as troops flood in - 1/19/2010 1:21:42 PM   
Moonhead


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quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250


quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead


quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250
And what happened to the "U.N." taking the lead like they did during the Tsunami disaster and us helping them?
The Red Cross gave them a lot of money if I remember correctly.
They must have 10,000 people sitting in offices in NYC.

Aren't those organisations that you thoroughly disapprove of and want to see dissolved? Your complaining that they aren't doing enough seems a little disingenuous given that.
And can you provide a source which states that the UN and Red Cross are doing less about the situation than the Kenyan squatter in the white house?



Moonhead, yes, I thouroughly despise the teabaggers of the "U.N."
As for a "source" turn on the telly and all you see is U.S. Military, no-one with vests saying "U.N." on them.

That's US news though: of course they concentrate on the American presence.
MM makes a good point. Would you rather send some relief supplies or have a shitload more refugees turning up in Florida? They're hardly going to go to Cuba or the Dominican Republic, are they?

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RE: US accused of 'occupying' Haiti as troops flood in - 1/19/2010 1:28:15 PM   
Lucylastic


Posts: 40310
Status: offline 		OTTAWA — The federal government announced Tuesday an additional $80 million for international emergency relief efforts in Haiti as Canadian troops began flying into the southern coastal town of Jacmel, bypassing the clogged airport in the devastated capital, Port-au-Prince.

International Co-operation Minister Bev Oda announced the additional funding for emergency food, water, sanitation, medical treatment, shelter and protection of vulnerable people.

That brings the federal commitment to $135 million, including up to $50 million in matching funds for public donations to registered relief organizations. Prime Minister Stephen Harper said public donations exceed $30 million so far.

By midnight Tuesday, he said, 1,000 Canadian Forces personnel and other Canadian officials will be in Haiti to help in the aftermath of the earthquake a week ago that has left tens of thousands of Haitians without homes or basic necessities.


Leslie said Canada is sending a shipload of heavy engineering equipment and heavy vehicles to Haiti on Thursday from Quebec and Canada is working with the U.S. government on getting the deepwater port of Port-au-Prince reopened so the equipment can be brought to shore."The big issue is the port," he said. He said the equipment will be brought ashore somehow. The Americans have amphibious assault craft that can carry heavy equipment but Canadians don't, he said.

From the local newspaper...so there are other countries there, sheesh

< Message edited by Lucylastic -- 1/19/2010 1:29:03 PM >

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RE: US accused of 'occupying' Haiti as troops flood in - 1/19/2010 2:10:54 PM   
rulemylife


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quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

As for a "source" turn on the telly and all you see is U.S. Military, no-one with vests saying "U.N." on them.



A UN peacekeeper from Peru maintains order during food distribution, Port au Prince Haiti.
19 January 2010
© UN Photo/ Marco Dormino






< Message edited by rulemylife -- 1/19/2010 2:12:46 PM >

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RE: US accused of 'occupying' Haiti as troops flood in - 1/19/2010 2:18:15 PM   
popeye1250


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quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

As for a "source" turn on the telly and all you see is U.S. Military, no-one with vests saying "U.N." on them.



A UN peacekeeper from Peru maintains order during food distribution, Port au Prince Haiti.
19 January 2010
© UN Photo/ Marco Dormino


Rule, why isn't the "U.N." taking charge instead of the U.S. Military?




And where the hell is GERALDO?


< Message edited by popeye1250 -- 1/19/2010 2:20:22 PM >

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RE: US accused of 'occupying' Haiti as troops flood in - 1/19/2010 2:22:02 PM   
mnottertail


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Status: offline 		Geraldo never worked for the UN. You can google that.


Ron

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RE: US accused of 'occupying' Haiti as troops flood in - 1/19/2010 2:24:32 PM   
hlen5


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quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

The French were turned away because they didn't bring any Fau Grau with them...


I think you mean  "foie gras"(what the hell, I probably didn't spell it right either)?

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