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RE: ACORN pimp gets busted! - 1/31/2010 1:22:01 PM   
rulemylife


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quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

Tazzy, understood but everytime you hear that name "Acorn" it brings to mind dirty tricks, dead people voting, corruption etc.
Why would anyone want to be associated with it in the first place?


Popeye, what the hell are you talking about?

This guy was arrested for a dirty trick.

The same nonsense he used on ACORN.  How many different ACORN offices did he visit before he found one where an employee was gullible enough to buy into his fraud? 

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RE: ACORN pimp gets busted! - 1/31/2010 2:02:31 PM   
Thadius


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quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

Tazzy, understood but everytime you hear that name "Acorn" it brings to mind dirty tricks, dead people voting, corruption etc.
Why would anyone want to be associated with it in the first place?


Popeye, what the hell are you talking about?

This guy was arrested for a dirty trick.

The same nonsense he used on ACORN.  How many different ACORN offices did he visit before he found one where an employee was gullible enough to buy into his fraud? 


Just curious, weren't there 4 or 5 different offices that had "gullible" employees?

For the record, if the kid has broken the law, I hope they prosecute him to the full extent of it. That being said, I wish some of the partisans around here would apply these same standards to members of their own political preference, when they break the law (or several of them).

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RE: ACORN pimp gets busted! - 1/31/2010 3:55:11 PM   
juliaoceania


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity


He takes his playbook pages directly from leftist radicals so don't think of it as illegal activities, think of it as civil disobedience.


quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

Or he did a wondeful job editing his footage to make ACORN look bad.. which is what ACORN has claimed.. so I do not know who is telling the truth about that. I will tell you  this, if this pimp dude breaks and enters then what ACORN claims maybe true after all




Please site examples with which you are comparing this behavior with so-called liberal behavior... thank you


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RE: ACORN pimp gets busted! - 1/31/2010 4:14:59 PM   
kittinSol


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It's hilarious how a bloke who's in his mid-twenties is being described as 'a kid' by the people that reside on the same side of the political aisle as him, in a very obvious and sad attempt at diminishing his level of responsibility  .

< Message edited by kittinSol -- 1/31/2010 4:15:34 PM >


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RE: ACORN pimp gets busted! - 1/31/2010 6:17:58 PM   
AnimusRex


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Especially considering the zeal Trace Gallagher at Fox news has with torturing 15 year olds.

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RE: ACORN pimp gets busted! - 1/31/2010 7:54:40 PM   
Lucylastic


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UGH

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RE: ACORN pimp gets busted! - 1/31/2010 8:36:09 PM   
willbeurdaddy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: AnimusRex

Especially considering the zeal Trace Gallagher at Fox news has with torturing 15 year olds.


You have an odd definition of "zeal". You want zeal? Waterboard the little fucker till he chokes on his own vomit.

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RE: ACORN pimp gets busted! - 1/31/2010 8:48:18 PM   
kdsub


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It is a shame that of the 400,000 members of ACRON and 1,200 chapters that a few assholes can destroy the hard work of hundreds of thousands out to help the less fortunate.

It is despicable that, for political reasons only, the Republican Party would paint all 4000,000 people as pimp sympathizers and voter fraud enablers. This when there is more corruption in Congress than ACORN.

I am all for weeding out the crooks from any organization that accepts our tax payer money but lets condemn the crooks not the organizations unless they fail to try and control corruption. I believe ACRON has and it serves a good purpose in areas of our country that our high and mighty conservatives would be afraid to enter.

No one should break the law to find a lawbreaker… They are putting themselves above the law, that means you and me, and thinking they can justify their means to advance their political agenda…they could give a shit less about the poor and destitute.

What a bunch of fanatical assholes.

Butch


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RE: ACORN pimp gets busted! - 1/31/2010 9:07:18 PM   
willbeurdaddy


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they are a corrupt organization from the top down. Any Congressman who votes to fund them for anything will have a hard time getting reelected.

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RE: ACORN pimp gets busted! - 1/31/2010 10:42:13 PM   
AnimusRex


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quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy
You have an odd definition of "zeal". You want zeal? Waterboard the little fucker till he chokes on his own vomit.



Amen.



wait, you're talking about James O'Keefe, right?

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RE: ACORN pimp gets busted! - 1/31/2010 10:54:23 PM   
DomKen


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quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

they are a corrupt organization from the top down.

Prove it.

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RE: ACORN pimp gets busted! - 2/1/2010 1:07:58 AM   
popeye1250


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quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: popeye1250

Tazzy, understood but everytime you hear that name "Acorn" it brings to mind dirty tricks, dead people voting, corruption etc.
Why would anyone want to be associated with it in the first place?


Popeye, what the hell are you talking about?

This guy was arrested for a dirty trick.

The same nonsense he used on ACORN.  How many different ACORN offices did he visit before he found one where an employee was gullible enough to buy into his fraud? 



Rule, I wasn't talking about this guy.

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RE: ACORN pimp gets busted! - 2/1/2010 6:30:44 AM   
Thadius


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen


quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

they are a corrupt organization from the top down.

Prove it.


Which part do you want proven? That the top is corrupt or that it runs from top to bottom?

If it's the top, you can start with the Rathke brothers and the few executives that helped cover up the embezzlement (even from their own board). If you doubt the center and bottom, I would suggest looking at the numerous criminal cases facing them in various states.

Does that mean that everybody that works there is corrupt? Hell no. It does suggest that there is something corrupt going on in the organization from top to bottom. I would guess there are some pretty good things going on there as well. It sorta reminds me of the old Italian Americans Club back home, they put on great holiday events for all of the kids in the neighborhood and did other charity work; however you could never forget what the social club was really a front for.

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RE: ACORN pimp gets busted! - 2/1/2010 7:24:36 AM   
juliaoceania


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quote:

If it's the top, you can start with the Rathke brothers and the few executives that helped cover up the embezzlement (even from their own board). If you doubt the center and bottom, I would suggest looking at the numerous criminal cases facing them in various states.



Any convictions? Or are these political prosecutions?


_____________________________

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Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

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RE: ACORN pimp gets busted! - 2/1/2010 8:15:50 AM   
Thadius


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quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

quote:

If it's the top, you can start with the Rathke brothers and the few executives that helped cover up the embezzlement (even from their own board). If you doubt the center and bottom, I would suggest looking at the numerous criminal cases facing them in various states.



Any convictions? Or are these political prosecutions?


Very interesting question, and way to look at things. If that is the standard to use... has there been any convictions related to the original topic of this thread?

Is it a political persecution?

quote:

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/09/us/09embezzle.html
Wade Rathke said he learned of the problem when an employee of Citizens Consulting alerted him about suspicious credit card transactions. An internal investigation uncovered inappropriate charges on the cards that led back to his brother.

“Clearly, this was an uncomfortable, conflicting and humiliating situation as far as my family and I were concerned,” he said, “and so the real decisions on how to handle it had to be made by others.”

The executive director of New York Acorn, Bertha Lewis, who has been named director of an interim management committee set up to run the national group’s day-to-day operations, said Dale Rathke was paid about $38,000 a year but that none of that money was used to pay back Acorn.

Instead, she said, the Rathke family has paid Acorn $30,000 a year in restitution since 2001, or a total of $210,000.

A donor has offered to give Acorn the rest of what the Rathkes owe, and an agreement to that effect should be finalized in coming days, Ms. Lewis said.



Sounds like a hell of a deal, get to collect a $38k a year salary and pay back $30k a year. This was also under the original admission that it was only $1Million embezzled, turns out it was closer to $5Million. The stated reason for the "confidentiality" (read: coverup),
quote:

He said the decision to keep the matter secret was not made to protect his brother but because word of the embezzlement would have put a “weapon” into the hands of enemies of Acorn
. Obviously, laws and regulations relating to non-profits and federally funded organizations are only to be applied to groups other than ACORN?

Oh and for their internal investigations and how they are worth...

quote:


http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/11/13/acorn.investigation/
ACORN fires 2 who were probing embezzlement allegations


CNN) -- Community organizing group ACORN, investigated this year for filing fraudulent voter registration forms, has fired two board members it had asked to investigate allegations that an ACORN founder's brother embezzled nearly $1 million.

An internal document from the ACORN executive board, obtained by CNN, shows that members Karen Inman and Marcel Reid were "removed from any office or committee position you may have held."

A separate document says that "the memberships of Karen Inman and Marcel Reid in ACORN is canceled, and they are removed from the Association Board."

The documents, dated November 11, are signed by Maude Hurd, president of the ACORN Association Board.

Hurd was not immediately available for comment Thursday afternoon, an ACORN receptionist said.

But ACORN member Gloria Brown, speaking from the group's main office in New Orleans, Louisiana, said in response to a CNN request for comment that Inman and Reid were removed because "they've been saying from the beginning things that were not true."




Sounds like quite the organization to emulate ethically.

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RE: ACORN pimp gets busted! - 2/1/2010 9:13:28 AM   
DomKen


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Thadius


quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen


quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

they are a corrupt organization from the top down.

Prove it.


Which part do you want proven? That the top is corrupt or that it runs from top to bottom?

If it's the top, you can start with the Rathke brothers and the few executives that helped cover up the embezzlement (even from their own board). If you doubt the center and bottom, I would suggest looking at the numerous criminal cases facing them in various states.

Does that mean that everybody that works there is corrupt? Hell no. It does suggest that there is something corrupt going on in the organization from top to bottom. I would guess there are some pretty good things going on there as well. It sorta reminds me of the old Italian Americans Club back home, they put on great holiday events for all of the kids in the neighborhood and did other charity work; however you could never forget what the social club was really a front for.

I asked for proof of the statement that ACORN is corrupt from the top down. Not that there has been some isolated bad actors but that it is corrupt from the top down. By your rationale I would be justified in calling the GOP corrupt from the top down.

< Message edited by DomKen -- 2/1/2010 9:14:06 AM >

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RE: ACORN pimp gets busted! - 2/1/2010 9:17:48 AM   
kdsub


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quote:

ORIGINAL: willbeurdaddy

they are a corrupt organization from the top down. Any Congressman who votes to fund them for anything will have a hard time getting reelected.




Edited because DomKen already said it .

< Message edited by kdsub -- 2/1/2010 9:21:15 AM >


_____________________________

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RE: ACORN pimp gets busted! - 2/1/2010 9:41:38 AM   
kdsub


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So lets see… Acorn organizes hundreds of thousands to reach out to help the poor…In that many people you will always find a few that are out to take advantage of the situation for personal gain…. but it is still worth the effort to ease the pain of the less fortunate. With their problems in the last year there should have been an oversight committee to be sure they were righting the ship…NOT a broadside that hurts the poor for political gain.

Then we have the Republican Party…. They organize, at the behest of a radio entertainer. The Tea Party…thousands of people sent to town hall meetings to shout down honest politicians trying to explain Healthcare with the likes of Sieg Heil…blocking doors so those interested could not enter.

Rather than engage in meaningful conversation or debate they just shout down others trying to speak in almost religious fervor.

I am an independent but I would rather be a member of ACRON then a Tea Party member thinking of only themselves.

Butch


_____________________________

Mark Twain:

I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

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RE: ACORN pimp gets busted! - 2/1/2010 9:42:46 AM   
juliaoceania


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quote:

Very interesting question, and way to look at things. If that is the standard to use... has there been any convictions related to the original topic of this thread?

Is it a political persecution?


I asked questions and I asked for substantiation.. If you state something you shouldn't resent finding proof of your assertion... I mentioned that there could be a political motivation because ACORN helps poor people...

What is it they say? When the  tree is poisoned, all the fruit from the tree is poisoned too... and that is the reality, Jack, this okeefe dude is the poison, and all the fruit he has provided is poisoned too. Including with the footage that he may have tampered with (as the employees of ACORN claim).

Oh, btw, as domken pointed out, there is a difference between bad actors and a bad organization...





_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

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RE: ACORN pimp gets busted! - 2/1/2010 12:02:14 PM   
Thadius


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quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

quote:

Very interesting question, and way to look at things. If that is the standard to use... has there been any convictions related to the original topic of this thread?

Is it a political persecution?


I asked questions and I asked for substantiation.. If you state something you shouldn't resent finding proof of your assertion... I mentioned that there could be a political motivation because ACORN helps poor people...

What is it they say? When the  tree is poisoned, all the fruit from the tree is poisoned too... and that is the reality, Jack, this okeefe dude is the poison, and all the fruit he has provided is poisoned too. Including with the footage that he may have tampered with (as the employees of ACORN claim).

Oh, btw, as domken pointed out, there is a difference between bad actors and a bad organization...






My issue is that you are asking for the conviction standard when judging ACORN, but dismiss it when it comes to this O'Keef (spelling). It would seem that you are the one accusing critics of ACORN of having a political motive against "poor people". I answered your question as honestly as could be answered.

There have been at least 12 convictions of ACORN members for voter fraud, and 6 others that plead guilty for numerous other election violations (all of which occured in 1 state and over a couple of election cycles - See ACORN Missouri). Well just to be certain, I looked it up, in addition to the ones already mentioned: in 2007 4 ACORN employees were indicted for fraud, and in 2008 eight more plead guilty to federal election fraud. (Again, these are just the ones in Missouri).

Want more from the top.... Christopher Edwards a former field director in Nevada plead guilty and testified against 2 others in higher management (their trials are still pending). Then look over to Pennsylvania who was running the same type of quota and registration scheme..... and on and on. It is really easy to seperate each one into individual incidents, but this is something occurring across the nation via one organization. Could simply be coincidence, or perhaps as you suggest "the whole tree is poisoned".

P.S. I noticed that both you and Ken glassed over the embezzlement and the coverup that occured by the founder and his brother. I would point out that I provided non partisan evidence of that.

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When the character of a man is not clear to you, look at his friends." ~ Japanese Proverb

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