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RE: Why Do Liberals Love Taxes??? - 2/15/2010 6:40:52 PM   
Thadius


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quote:

ORIGINAL: AnimusRex

Conservatives are the ones who shoot out the tires of the automobile of government, rip out the wiring, slash the seats, break the headlights, then complain because government doesn't work.

And they do all this because they don't want to chip in for gas.

You almost got the analogy right. I don't think we need to be driving a Bentley, when a Prius will do just fine.

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RE: Why Do Liberals Love Taxes??? - 2/15/2010 6:41:14 PM   
AnimusRex


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Status: offline 		Can't take credit- I read it in the comments section of a blog, and have since forgotten the link.

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RE: Why Do Liberals Love Taxes??? - 2/15/2010 7:48:27 PM   
AnimusRex


Posts: 2165
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Status: offline 		Why do liberals love taxes?

A friend of mine just returned from Haiti, touring and inspecting the ruined buildings on behalf of the aid agencies.

Hait is a place where the rich run everything, but run it poorly. They build the buildings, roads, the bridges, the power plants, and ports, but they do it poorly, in a mixture of "no-bid" contracts to politically favored cronies, in a totally unregulated marketplace. There are no building regulations, and what little there are are not enforced.
When a natural disaster strikes, the government is paralyzed because they have no revenue, and have never bothered to develop a civil service that is well trained or skilled. The wealth class refuses to tax themselves for these services, preferring instead to spend their wealth on mansions, jewels and cars.

There was a time when America worked. Our buildings, bridges, power plants and ports were the envy of the world, when a disaster struck, the American government sprung into action, with teams of skilled experts in logistics, engineering, emergency preparedness all at the ready.

There was a time when America dreamed big- when we thought nothing of building the world's largest dam across the Colorado, when we thought nothing of instituting a Social Security System to care for the elederly, and a Medicare system to care for the poor; When we dreamed of a nationwide system of high speed highways, and the government made it so.

Today in America the government is withering, even as the wealthy class is growing obscenely fat.
When Katrina hit, the government was parlyzed, headed by a man who was chosen mostly for his political cronyism to the President. Even the agencies that could have helped, were anemic from years of budget cuts and mismanagement.

All over America our public buildings, roads, bridges and ports are falling apart, from years of neglect and public mismanagement.
The State of California University system used to be the envy of the world; it used to offer a college education to everyone, no matter how little they earned. Today the same college is out of reach for all but the upper class.

The mantra of the wealthy class and their right wing supporters is to "starve the beast" of government.
What is not realized is how expensive these cost savings are becoming.

The State of Utah is considering eliminating 12th grade to "save" money. the taxpayers will save pennies by eliminating this, yet pay thousands of dollars in tutors and remedial college education for their sons and daughters. Yet even this will pale to the billions the rest of America will lose in lost wages and income that is not being produced by these poorly educated graduates.
The City of Colorado Springs is reverting to the 19th Century and turning out its streetlights for lack of tax revenue.
How long will it be before packs of wild dogs roam the streets for lack of a public animal control, eating piles of garbage that grow higher for lack of a public waste collection service?

We used to pay pennies in taxes for drivers ed in high school; now we pay hundreds for the privatized version.
We used to pay pennies in taxes for emergency rescue teams to take sick people to the hospital; today we pay hundreds of dollars for an ambulance ride.
We used to pay pennies for taxes that supported nutritious school lunches; today the schools invite fast food corporations onto campus to feed our children garbage, and we spend thousands first on the higher priced lunches, then thousands more for medical care on obesity.

There was a time when "Civil Service" was a thing of pride, when people spoke of "good Government" and meant it, when government officials worked for the public good; Under Bush, the Interior Department spoke of the corporations that it was supposed to regulate as its "customers" and literally had drug fueled orgies with them, ignoring the public trust and responsibility. The government has become the groveling servant of the corporate class, tending to their needs first last and always.

The wealthy used to pay higher taxes, and still remain rich; today the CEO of a Wall Street bank pays the same rate as his limo driver and uses the difference to buy a $600 wastebasket or host a Roman orgy that would shame Caligula, while a single mother dies from lack of chemotherapy she can't afford.

If anyone wants to see what a society with a half-starved governent and parasitic wealthy class that takes everything but repays nothing to its host looks like, look at Haiti.

This is the future of America, unless we choose to pay for the services we used to enjoy.

Ask yourself- is the picture below of Haiti or Katrina? Did you ever think there would be a day when an American couldn't tell the difference between our country and the Third World?

I would gladly pay higher taxes if our government could respond to a disaster; if we could have a health care system as good as Canada; if we could have high speed rail as good as China; if once again our schools could be the envy of the world. If only once again our elected officials were the servants of the people and honored the public trust.

If only once again we could tell America and Haiti apart.




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RE: Why Do Liberals Love Taxes??? - 2/15/2010 7:57:18 PM   
Arpig


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RE: Why Do Liberals Love Taxes??? - 2/15/2010 7:58:30 PM   
slvemike4u


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Status: offline 		What a fucking great post....

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RE: Why Do Liberals Love Taxes??? - 2/15/2010 8:03:12 PM   
Marini


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Status: offline 		Rex!  What a brilliant post!!
I am going to save a copy of this post.
Bravo, on a well thought out and thoughtful post!!
 

Best post of the year on Collarme!!!

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As always, To EACH their Own.
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Life-long Democrat, not happy at all with Democratic Party.
NOT a Republican/Moderate and free agent

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RE: Why Do Liberals Love Taxes??? - 2/15/2010 8:28:31 PM   
Musicmystery


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Status: offline 		What they said.



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RE: Why Do Liberals Love Taxes??? - 2/16/2010 12:48:42 AM   
NeedToUseYou


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Status: offline 		Oh my god, I just threw up a little.

Someone is a little idealistic.... 

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RE: Why Do Liberals Love Taxes??? - 2/16/2010 12:57:48 AM   
EbonyWood


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quote:

ORIGINAL: NeedToUseYou

Oh my god, I just threw up a little.

Someone is a little idealistic.... 



You might want to learn what that actually means.
 
AR's post clearly treads the line between realism and qualified pessimism.
 
"This is the future of America, unless we choose to pay for the services we used to enjoy."
 
Reasonably accurate portrayal. An idealist would be thinking it's going to be easy to do.

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RE: Why Do Liberals Love Taxes??? - 2/16/2010 1:22:52 AM   
NeedToUseYou


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quote:

ORIGINAL: EbonyWood

quote:

ORIGINAL: NeedToUseYou

Oh my god, I just threw up a little.

Someone is a little idealistic.... 



You might want to learn what that actually means.
 
AR's post clearly treads the line between realism and qualified pessimism.
 
"This is the future of America, unless we choose to pay for the services we used to enjoy."
 
Reasonably accurate portrayal. An idealist would be thinking it's going to be easy to do.


Well, his portrayal doesn't fit the reality, like the interstates and our extensive road network, were pushed hard by the automotive industry, while they at the same time were buying up mass transit, and trashing them, or deliberately running them inefficiently to encourage people to buy cars, and drive them on the shiny new interstates. Now, of course some interstates are good, but the extent and fervor was corporate induced.

That's the kind of idealist thing I'm talking about, he views the interstates as an achievement of government, which to some degree they were, but the extent we pushed road travel, was a product of corporations will against mass transit and marketing by them.

Hoover dam was a good thing..

Medicare and Social Security are not successful in my book either, as they will bankrupt us very soon.

Now, everyone wants to blame it on the wealthy, okay, I guess that's easy, the real reason we are failing is this country is lazy, and poorly educated, and our edge over the world has waned as we from the poor to the rich, have visions of leisure flow in our head.

Yawn, the older I get, the more I believe it is not a left or right issue, it is a manifestation of a country full of people with unrealistic expectations. Like the children of pigs in Animal farm.

(((Disclaimer, if the description doesn't fit, then don't get offended, whether you are left or right, you may not be the problem, unfortunately I think we are quickly being outnumbered by the wanting throngs of piglets))

Anyway, the solution, IMO, is for people to simply shut up, and do something about their situation.

I could look back to an idealized view of the past and remember how people were proud and do whatever crap job it required to avoid charity. Hey, that was about the same time period. Maybe, everyone wasn't looking for something for nothing, from the rich to the poor. Maybe we didn't need Social Security, because old people would live with their family members if they didn't prepare for retirement. They still do that in most countries of the world, that solves the 'who will watch my kids while i go to work problem'.

Anyway, I guess I just get tired of this constant blame crap. It's all the rich, it's all the poor, blah, blah, blah.. It's the national mentality




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RE: Why Do Liberals Love Taxes??? - 2/16/2010 1:41:39 AM   
EbonyWood


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Status: offline 		Thanks for the measured response.
 
There's another thread going where the unproductive yet seemingly growing divide between left and right is further discussed.
 
I agree that while blame is the focus, nothing tangible will be achieved. I actually don't blame the 'rich', I just want the conditions and corruption of power that existed for them to become obscenely so at the expense of others, to be removed. Makes me a socialist by intent I guess. It's just a label. Egalitarian, doesn't matter to me.

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RE: Why Do Liberals Love Taxes??? - 2/16/2010 5:48:32 AM   
Moonhead


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Status: offline 		Another +1 for AnimusRex's lovely metaphor and MM's observation.
It isn't so much that liberals luuuurve taxation the way Michael Jackson luuuurved prebuscent boys, it's just that they're a bit more aware that stuff has to be paid for than the current crop of neocons who've run the Republican party since Reagan are. Those guys don't seem to have a clue about where the money for the hugely expensive expansion of Government they're big on is going to come from other than taxes.

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RE: Why Do Liberals Love Taxes??? - 2/16/2010 12:34:42 PM   
cuckoldmepls


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Status: offline 		He left out the part where government borrowed the money to do all those things, and senior citizens didn't pay enough taxes for over 50 years to fund the government. Why you ask? Because senior citizens would have screemed bloody murder if the government had taken 50% of their paycheck. As I said before, all these idealistic liberal ideas would be great if we could afford them. The problem is, that the deeper we go into debt, the more interest is paid to wealthy people, here, and abroad, and to other countries. So in effect, you are actually enriching the very people you so despise. We will soon be paying half a trillion in interest each year. If you divide that up among 50 states, that is 10 billion each year. I don't know how to make it any simpler than that.  The point is, if we going to just start printing up money, and run the debt up by creating more government jobs, then why didn't we support Bush's initiative to go to Mars? The answer is we didn't because we knew we couldn't afford it. America only has two choices under liberals and rino's. Slow degeneration into a third world nation or a complete economic collapse practically overnight. Conservative self sufficient government is the only answer. Government always works best at the lowest level is where the problem needs to be corrected. If it's a local issue, then city government handles it. If it's a state wide issue, then the state government handles it. If it's a federal issue then the federal government handles it, but in this case only if the 10th amendment gives them that power.

Personally, I dislike corporations and the wealthy as well, but this is how America works. We don't punish the wealthy for being successful. If you don't like baseball players making $10 million per year, then don't go to a ballgame. If you don't like wallstreet getting rich, then don't invest in the stock market. If you don't like actors making $100 million per movie, then don't pay to see the movie. We were a superpower before the liberals and rino's opened our borders, passed free trade agreements, and destroyed our chance to be energy independent. I will admit rino's did their damage as well. However, it is because they followed the same game plan as big spending liberals to buy votes.

The problem now is that we already can't afford to maintain the infrastructure we already have such as roads, bridges, schools, and our energy costs are skyrocketing thanks to the democrats blocking all new nuclear power plants over the past 20 years, and purposely allowing almost unlimited immigration. And they want to expand it all??? Are they nuts??? That was a retorical question.



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RE: Why Do Liberals Love Taxes??? - 2/16/2010 12:43:46 PM   
Moonhead


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Status: offline 		You're aware that as a wannabe Texan your boy Bush II was even bigger on letting plutocrats using unregistered illegals as cheap labour than any of the Democrats? That's another neocon economic fix, btw, and there's no more evidence for that one helping the economy than there is for trickledown theory working.
Do you have an answer to that one, or are you just going to post the same boilerplate yet again?

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RE: Why Do Liberals Love Taxes??? - 2/16/2010 12:45:02 PM   
cuckoldmepls


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Status: offline 		Another big difference is that Haiti never was a superpower to begin with. They don't have the natural resources, educational system, and capitilistic system to ever accomplish anything like we do. We can come back if people will just recognize that government is not the answer. We are $10 trillion in debt, and that is the fault of Congress, not hard working Americans who deserve to keep most of what they earn. Comparing us to Haiti is ludicrous. Although I will admit, if we don't get our spending under control, we will end up just like them.

Even the CBO said it wouldn't matter whether you raise or lower taxes, if you don't control spending first. So why not control spending, and keep taxes low forever????  The more you feed the federal government the more they will take. It's that simple. I've also noticed that even local government is starting to get a little crazy. They just tacked on a Hazardous materials pick up fee to everyone's water bill, and you get charged a few bucks every month whether you have a pickup for a tire or battery or not. This is ridiculous.

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RE: Why Do Liberals Love Taxes??? - 2/16/2010 12:48:01 PM   
mnottertail


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Status: offline 		Yanno, I have seen this exact boilerplate before several times and some other bullshit you spout several times, you better start acknowledging the author at least or I am going to ticket you for ubitquious copyright violations. Cuz it damn sure ain't you. It is some wingnut LaRoucher or Cheney cockworshipper blogger.


Ron

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RE: Why Do Liberals Love Taxes??? - 2/16/2010 12:49:17 PM   
slvemike4u


Posts: 17896
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Status: offline 		No cuckold,what is rediculous is your postings.One after the other with the same bullshit message over and over again.Get a life,get a job or get a fucking hobby......please I'm begging you .

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If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

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RE: Why Do Liberals Love Taxes??? - 2/16/2010 12:50:17 PM   
Moonhead


Posts: 16520
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Status: offline 		Nope, no answer then. Wotta surprise.

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I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
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RE: Why Do Liberals Love Taxes??? - 2/16/2010 12:51:58 PM   
mnottertail


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Status: offline 		So, he is a socialist at heart then, living of the work of other morons.


Moon, he is a commie is what he is.


Ron

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RE: Why Do Liberals Love Taxes??? - 2/16/2010 12:54:00 PM   
cuckoldmepls


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Status: offline 		Yes, I was aware of Bush's treasonous behaviour on Immigration, cheap labor, and open borders, and so was half the republican party. Why do you think conservatives turned on him and McCain??? GEEEZE

We turned on our own party, and we got rewarded for it by electing a socialist/communist. The main difference between socialism and communism, is that with socialism you get to vote in the people who take most of your paycheck. To me, socialism is no different from shoplifting. People receive something they didn't have to work for, and it drives up the cost for the rest of us.

The key to government, and your own finances is to live within your means. It doesn't mean that government should take more and more to promote an agenda that will only be for a small percentage of people. High speed rail would be a good idea if we weren't already in debt, and it paid it's own way without government subsidies. The fact is, that most people are not willing to travel 200 MPH on the ground, since any lunatic can derail a train with a crowbar. Therefore, very few people percentage wise would use it. You simply can't argue with that logic.

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