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RE: No wonder there are so many wannabes ... - 2/27/2010 7:42:46 PM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline
quote:

Everyone has always had the choice ... regardless of whether their society approved or not.

That doesn't mean every choice is a healthy one.

Have you looked at the divorce rate? The number of children in single-parent families?

We used to have extended families ... then we had nuclear families ... now we have splintered families.

We used to raise children with a parent in the home. Any idea how many kids are in daycare?

We used to play outside, without adult supervision, until the first street-light came on. Childhood obesity wasn't a problem.

How is that working out in the urban jungles?

Not all choices are healthy ones, and in dispensing with love we dispense with the best, most noble parts of who we are as a species.

And we pay the price.


The sad thing is, you really believe this.. you truly believe that people have choices in other parts of the world... what choice does a woman living in India have to choose her husband? What choice did royalty have to choose their mates in England? What choice did slaves in the South have when they were forced to have sex with their masters? No, people do not always have choices.. sometimes choices are made for them.

The exalted nuclear/extended family that you speak of, well that something that does not exist every where, nor is it necessarily a rational way to live in the modern world where companies outsource work, people have to move their families around, it takes two incomes to make a living.. again, people do not always have choices and they do the best with what they have.

Now I know you are fairly up there in age, and it maybe hard for you to understand that things have changed from your youth, and that the family structure you are nostalgic for is not common for our species, and wasn't long lived past your generation... but those are the facts...

You cannot see past your own narrow view to encompass the rest of the planet... it isn't White, it isn't Canadian, and it isn't mom, dad, a dog with 2.5 kids and a station wagon with grandma babysitting when the parents wanna night out... that ain't the real world, and it was a very narrow portion of it in your generation


_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to BLoved)
Profile   Post #: 281
RE: No wonder there are so many wannabes ... - 2/27/2010 7:42:54 PM   
BLoved


Posts: 642
Joined: 8/5/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: thepillowdreamer
"wannabe" is a throwaway word that has just about as much power as "poser" or "copycat". it's the last bastion of those who refuse to leave their circular logic.


If you've read the OP then you are aware that I was speaking of the women whose profiles complained about "wannabes".

Their term, not mine.

_____________________________

When your bdsm paradigm makes love essential, expect some flack from those for whom love is anathema.

(in reply to thepillowdreamer)
Profile   Post #: 282
RE: No wonder there are so many wannabes ... - 2/27/2010 7:46:27 PM   
KITTYLECTRO


Posts: 261
Joined: 10/26/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: GreedyTop
(btw, if I havent mentioned it, I adore your pic, kitty!!)

Thank you so much, how very kind of you! :)


_____________________________

Meow =^..^=
www.KittyLectro.com

(in reply to GreedyTop)
Profile   Post #: 283
RE: No wonder there are so many wannabes ... - 2/27/2010 7:48:48 PM   
BLoved


Posts: 642
Joined: 8/5/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania
quote:

Everyone has always had the choice ... regardless of whether their society approved or not.
That doesn't mean every choice is a healthy one.

Have you looked at the divorce rate? The number of children in single-parent families?

We used to have extended families ... then we had nuclear families ... now we have splintered families.

We used to raise children with a parent in the home. Any idea how many kids are in daycare?

We used to play outside, without adult supervision, until the first street-light came on. Childhood obesity wasn't a problem.

How is that working out in the urban jungles?

Not all choices are healthy ones, and in dispensing with love we dispense with the best, most noble parts of who we are as a species.

And we pay the price.


The sad thing is, you really believe this.. you truly believe that people have choices in other parts of the world... what choice does a woman living in India have to choose her husband? What choice did royalty have to choose their mates in England? What choice did slaves in the South have when they were forced to have sex with their masters? No, people do not always have choices.. sometimes choices are made for them.


They always have the choice to run away together.

quote:

The exalted nuclear/extended family that you speak of, well that something that does not exist every where, nor is it necessarily a rational way to live in the modern world where companies outsource work, people have to move their families around, it takes two incomes to make a living.. again, people do not always have choices and they do the best with what they have.


Or they rationalize their decision to accept an unhealthy way of life, as you just did.

This is an improvement over love?


_____________________________

When your bdsm paradigm makes love essential, expect some flack from those for whom love is anathema.

(in reply to juliaoceania)
Profile   Post #: 284
RE: No wonder there are so many wannabes ... - 2/27/2010 7:49:24 PM   
susie


Posts: 1699
Joined: 11/21/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: BLoved

quote:

ORIGINAL: susie
I guess I was a wannabe then when I first started. I put up an ad on another site just looking for some nsa bdsm play and possibly sex depending on the person I found. I met someone that at first contact did not seem ideal as he was younger than me and a long way from me, but we met and played and had sex, shock horror all on the first meeting. We both must have liked it a lot as we kept going back for more and 6 years on I am in the best relationship of my life.

So restricting a search to a narrow set of parameters can sometimes shoot you in the foot.

susie
happily owned and madly in love


I will not compromise what I need for what I can get.

Nor would I cheapen the gift I have to give by giving it to those who won't value it.

I suppose those who have not known love have nothing better than cheap thrills on their minds.

I've known love ... cheap thrills mean nothing to me. I'd rather be celibate than cheapen myself.


How very arrogant of you as usual.

As you do not know me you are totally ignorant to suggest that I have not known love. I have, but at the time I placed that ad I was in a place that I could not see myself in any sort of relationship ( a devastating event in my life, which I will not detail, had brought me to that conclusion). What I have found now from my "cheap thrills" ad is a love far deeper than I thought possible.

As for Master he has also known love in the past. Sadly his wife / slave died some 4 years before we met. Something he does not contiunally boast about, unlike some others.

You may see compromise and cheapening yourself. I don't. But then I am the one in a happy solid relationship. Perhaps you should take your head out of your nether regions and consider that.

(in reply to BLoved)
Profile   Post #: 285
RE: No wonder there are so many wannabes ... - 2/27/2010 7:51:27 PM   
thepillowdreamer


Posts: 114
Joined: 2/26/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: BLoved

quote:

ORIGINAL: thepillowdreamer
"wannabe" is a throwaway word that has just about as much power as "poser" or "copycat". it's the last bastion of those who refuse to leave their circular logic.


If you've read the OP then you are aware that I was speaking of the women whose profiles complained about "wannabes".

Their term, not mine.


and i have to ask: did you read the post i wrote here? if not, then i'd be more than happy to message it to you.

aside from that, everybody's gotta admit when they're wrong, and nobody's ever right all the time. no shame in it. ...okay, there's shame in it, but it goes away eventually and in the end you're better off for it.

it'll put you on better terms with the people here, and if you don't want that, then... why ya here?

(in reply to BLoved)
Profile   Post #: 286
RE: No wonder there are so many wannabes ... - 2/27/2010 7:57:46 PM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline
quote:

They always have the choice to run away together.



quote:

Or they rationalize their decision to accept an unhealthy way of life, as you just did.

This is an improvement over love?


You are a very ethnocentric person...you truly think you should be the one that decides everything for everyone... Hat off to you Bob, those women that are being kept down, they should just "run away"... I cannot imagine where they will be running to, perhaps their own stoning.. your arrogance is without peer.

And the part I bolded, what unhealthy way of life have I accepted? Hmmmmm

If I were going to choose the healthiest life I would avoid men altogether, since most women that do so live a lot longer that way... but I like men


_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to BLoved)
Profile   Post #: 287
RE: No wonder there are so many wannabes ... - 2/27/2010 8:05:34 PM   
dreamerdreaming


Posts: 2839
Status: offline 		COOL avatar, pillowdreamer! Welcome!


Bob, is the point of this thread for you to complain? Or was there something you want to discuss?

In the OP, you compain that the Canadian femsubs on CM are all either wannabe's, or they're not compatible with you for other reasons. Got it. So what?

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(in reply to thepillowdreamer)
Profile   Post #: 288
RE: No wonder there are so many wannabes ... - 2/27/2010 8:09:15 PM   
BLoved


Posts: 642
Joined: 8/5/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: dreamerdreaming
Got it.


No, you don't "got it".

_____________________________

When your bdsm paradigm makes love essential, expect some flack from those for whom love is anathema.

(in reply to dreamerdreaming)
Profile   Post #: 289
RE: No wonder there are so many wannabes ... - 2/27/2010 8:44:01 PM   
dreamerdreaming


Posts: 2839
Status: offline 		I'm all in favor of love, Bob. In the beginning I thought all I really needed from my slaveboy was obedience. I knew the love would grow out of that, but I just thought it wasn't the most important thing, for me.

Turns out that maybe it is.

I don't think that most of us have a problem with the idea that love is beautiful, grand, and MAY be necessary to a deeply fulfilling D/s relationship. I think a lot of us here are really in agreement with you about that.

But for me and my slaveboy, I made sure when we started out that he knew that I did place his obedience, and his well-being as my highest priority, and that I expected him to serve me as I would attend to his needs: with an abiding compassion and attentiveness. In short: I put it to him that he would serve me, and I would own him, always with that same obedience, care, compassion and attentiveness, whether or not we were in  love with each other.
 
Love waxes and wanes. It goes through changes over time. I wanted to make sure he knew that I would be devoted to his fulfillment and well-being, and he would be expected to be obedient to me and serve me, whether or not we were in or out of love.
 
What I laid out for him from the start is that we would serve each other's needs till death do us part, regardless of the state of love we are in at any given time. In this way, we assure the permanence of the bond.

We feel safe and secure, because even if we are not "in love" we know we will always take care of one another attentively and lovingly.

If you start with an unshakeable frame of caring and devotion to duty, a laticework where love can grow, and wax and wane and wax again... Your relationship can weather the changes, and come out stronger.

You've got to start somewhere. You don't just jump to love, with nothing for a foundation. So I'm not saying you've got to go play at a dungeon, or have a "scene" in private with someone you just met. But you do have to start somewhere.

For me, I start with the D/s dynamic, and then the love can grow on that foundation.

How do you start?

_____________________________

Download SLAVE LOVER. Explicit BDSM porn, with a plot! A love story, on a FemDom planet! http://www.amazon.com/Slave-Lover-Chronicles-Book-ebook/dp/B0031ERBLI/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1261973416&sr=1

(in reply to BLoved)
Profile   Post #: 290
RE: No wonder there are so many wannabes ... - 2/27/2010 8:46:30 PM   
susie


Posts: 1699
Joined: 11/21/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: BLoved

quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania
human beings need to fuck and make babies




What good is making babies if they don't survive?

How many will survive without love?

What do you think love is for?

Human survival.

Love and sex are intertwined in the human psyche ... in all of us.

Compartmentalizing either is an unhealthy state.



I think perhaps this is the most telling thing I have seen in any of Bobbies posts. I do wonder if all this talk of love stems back to the loss of his child. Wonder if he received counselling during that time.

(in reply to BLoved)
Profile   Post #: 291
RE: No wonder there are so many wannabes ... - 2/27/2010 8:58:41 PM   
BLoved


Posts: 642
Joined: 8/5/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: dreamerdreaming
What I laid out for him from the start is that we would serve each other's needs till death do us part, regardless of the state of love we are in at any given time.


So you do not see love as a "need".

You can be "out of love" and yet meet his need for love, or have you both agreed he has no need for love either?

If I do not inspire the best in a woman, I am not the right man for that woman.

Her best includes her love.

Would I want her to feel bonded to me, even if she didn't love me? Never.

It is her love that bonds her to me, or not at all.

Only if I inspire her best does she have any reason to give to me her love, her trust, her obedience.

And the only way I am going to inspire her best is by giving my own ... my love, my trust, my trustworthiness, my reliability, my sense of responsibility, honour and integrity.

Love is a need we each must meet.


_____________________________

When your bdsm paradigm makes love essential, expect some flack from those for whom love is anathema.

(in reply to dreamerdreaming)
Profile   Post #: 292
RE: No wonder there are so many wannabes ... - 2/27/2010 9:03:28 PM   
NihilusZero


Posts: 4036
Joined: 9/10/2008
From: Nashville, TN
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: BLoved

Why do so many Canadian female submissives set their standards so low?

*chuckles to self*


_____________________________

"I know it's all a game
I know they're all insane
I know it's all in vain
I know that I'm to blame."
~Siouxsie & the Banshees

NihilusZero.com

CM Sex God du Jour
CM Hall Monitor

(in reply to BLoved)
Profile   Post #: 293
RE: No wonder there are so many wannabes ... - 2/27/2010 9:07:33 PM   
LadyAngelika


Posts: 8070
Joined: 7/4/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: NihilusZero

quote:

ORIGINAL: BLoved

Why do so many Canadian female submissives set their standards so low?

*chuckles to self*



Oh I peeked in to ask you how things are going with your fabulous Canadian submissive, NZ? You seem very happy in that picture!

- LA


_____________________________

Une main de fer dans un gant de velours ~ An iron hand in a velvet glove

(in reply to NihilusZero)
Profile   Post #: 294
RE: No wonder there are so many wannabes ... - 2/27/2010 9:07:53 PM   
thepillowdreamer


Posts: 114
Joined: 2/26/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: BLoved
No, you don't "got it".


wow, you're a dick. i'll say it again: you've been given good advice by a lot of people here but ignore all of it so you can  argue or complain about how people bully you here.

quote:

ORIGINAL: dreamerdreaming
COOL avatar, pillowdreamer! Welcome!


thanks :3  nice username, haha. can't place why, but i dig it.

quote:

ORIGINAL: susie
I think perhaps this is the most telling thing I have seen in any of Bobbies posts. I do wonder if all this talk of love stems back to the loss of his child. Wonder if he received counselling during that time.


that's incredibly sad, actually. he's still a dick, but at least we have a motive, i guess. or one of many.

(in reply to BLoved)
Profile   Post #: 295
RE: No wonder there are so many wannabes ... - 2/27/2010 9:09:04 PM   
Thadius


Posts: 5091
Joined: 10/11/2005
Status: offline 		The only problem with you arguing about the need for love with others, is that love is felt and quantified by each of us differently. I think that some would equate that bond and the pleasure that comes from being bonded to their owner as love, if not the pleasure that comes from being bonded to their owner.

Just as my love for a slave is more like the love I have for my television, it is very different than the love I have for my free companion. I guarantee that my definition of what love is varies from what your ideal of love is, as it should.

In that respect, I am not sure that love is necessary, especially when in the consideration of property. Sure it would be nice to love something right off the bat, but it seems like a bit of a fantasy. In my opinion, that is.

_____________________________

When the character of a man is not clear to you, look at his friends." ~ Japanese Proverb

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Profile   Post #: 296
RE: No wonder there are so many wannabes ... - 2/27/2010 9:14:22 PM   
NihilusZero


Posts: 4036
Joined: 9/10/2008
From: Nashville, TN
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyAngelika

quote:

ORIGINAL: NihilusZero

quote:

ORIGINAL: BLoved

Why do so many Canadian female submissives set their standards so low?

*chuckles to self*



Oh I peeked in to ask you how things are going with your fabulous Canadian submissive, NZ? You seem very happy in that picture!

- LA


Oh!

That photo's not actually completely real. Since I've had to deal with the fact that she's a wannabe, I managed to create a cardboard cutout of her and place it beside me in that shot.

Fortunately, I'm serviceable enough at photoshop that I was able to make the lighting believable and nearly completely erase any hints of the cardboard borders.

But thanks for the unintentional compliment on my PS skills!



_____________________________

"I know it's all a game
I know they're all insane
I know it's all in vain
I know that I'm to blame."
~Siouxsie & the Banshees

NihilusZero.com

CM Sex God du Jour
CM Hall Monitor

(in reply to LadyAngelika)
Profile   Post #: 297
RE: No wonder there are so many wannabes ... - 2/27/2010 9:20:51 PM   
LadyAngelika


Posts: 8070
Joined: 7/4/2004
Status: offline 		Can you make me a Canadian male submissive please? And do you know 3D Studio Max? I want a fake boy to grab hold of...

- LA


_____________________________

Une main de fer dans un gant de velours ~ An iron hand in a velvet glove

(in reply to NihilusZero)
Profile   Post #: 298
RE: No wonder there are so many wannabes ... - 2/27/2010 9:21:44 PM   
Dominasola


Posts: 582
Joined: 9/18/2008
From: Ottawa, Canada
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: NihilusZero

Oh!

That photo's not actually completely real. Since I've had to deal with the fact that she's a wannabe, I managed to create a cardboard cutout of her and place it beside me in that shot.

Fortunately, I'm serviceable enough at photoshop that I was able to make the lighting believable and nearly completely erase any hints of the cardboard borders.

But thanks for the unintentional compliment on my PS skills!




*snort*


_____________________________

I have made a ceaseless effort not to ridicule, not to bewail, not to scorn human actions, but to understand them.

—Baruch Spinoza

The measure of a man is what he does with power.

—Pittacus

(in reply to NihilusZero)
Profile   Post #: 299
RE: No wonder there are so many wannabes ... - 2/27/2010 9:24:10 PM   
LadyAngelika


Posts: 8070
Joined: 7/4/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Dominasola

quote:

ORIGINAL: NihilusZero

Oh!

That photo's not actually completely real. Since I've had to deal with the fact that she's a wannabe, I managed to create a cardboard cutout of her and place it beside me in that shot.

Fortunately, I'm serviceable enough at photoshop that I was able to make the lighting believable and nearly completely erase any hints of the cardboard borders.

But thanks for the unintentional compliment on my PS skills!




*snort*



Oh he even made you life like! ;-)

- LA


_____________________________

Une main de fer dans un gant de velours ~ An iron hand in a velvet glove

(in reply to Dominasola)
Profile   Post #: 300
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