RE: Women's Rights!

RE: Women's Rights! (Full Version)

All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Dungeon of Political and Religious Discussion

Message

goldenwyrm1968 -> RE: Women's Rights! (3/18/2010 10:22:51 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LadyAngelika quote: ORIGINAL: slvemike4u Don't sweat it pal...the ones that actually check out your forum posts will think twice after that last "gene pool" comment.Plenty of quality woman have found themselves forced to make tough decisions...whichever way they decided to go,I'm thinking they won't be too appreciative of your views on this.Way to close to the bone...way to close. Smart, smart man. - LA I suppose it's a good thing I'm already taken then ;)

slvemike4u -> RE: Women's Rights! (3/18/2010 10:25:06 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LadyAngelika Oh my. Getting a little rowdy there, aren't you? ;-) - LA Nah,not me...never,imagine me getting rowdy.....you have such a sense of humor;-)

LadyAngelika -> RE: Women's Rights! (3/18/2010 10:28:04 PM)
How is it a better healthcare bill if it isn't dealing with a major issue in your country? Unwanted babies are being born every day from women who couldn't afford an abortion, so how on earth are they going to find the cash to raise the kid. You want another 5-10 years of this? Elective abortions are not the same as elective cosmetic surgery. You aren't getting a mole removed. More often than not, women who get an abortion are getting it because an accident happened. It would be like saying if you got burned in a house fire, any surgery to try to repair the burn scars would be elective because it happened as a result of an accident. I live in a country where this kind of segmenting of who deserves and abortion and who doesn't was dealt with a few decades ago. We don't have an abuse of the system. And to be honest, most women who can afford the private clinics go there for the comfort and discretion. And birth control is not a luxury. It is a preventative essential. - LA edited as my English gets sloppy when I'm tired...

LadyAngelika -> RE: Women's Rights! (3/18/2010 10:31:37 PM)
quote: ETA: one thing I want to make clear - this is a national healthcare bill, not a pro-choice or pro-life bill. If this is the issue that stuffs it up I'd say the politicos on both sides are being selfish prats who put their pet causes ahead of this nation's wellbeing. Of course. People are just using the pro-choice angle to filabuster. I can't believe your nation is falling for that. Then again, it fell for the axis of evil smoke and mirrors act! - LA

goldenwyrm1968 -> RE: Women's Rights! (3/18/2010 10:37:37 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Elisabella quote: ORIGINAL: slvemike4u Or,and this is just me spitballin here...the forces of ignorance and control would use the victory in excluding choice to renew their attack on a womans right to choose...Do you care to take that chance? I would rather take the risk that people who are anti-abortion anyway will stay that way, than take the risk that a politically explosive (and not medically necessary) argument like this one will stall a bill that NEEDS to be passed, and that the spectacle of debate will take away from the rest of the bill that will deal with medical emergencies. ETA: one thing I want to make clear - this is a national healthcare bill, not a pro-choice or pro-life bill. If this is the issue that stuffs it up I'd say the politicos on both sides are being selfish prats who put their pet causes ahead of this nation's wellbeing. But, the side that is pushing pro-life is also the side that tends to be anti-NHS to start with. I roll my eyes at the political posturing but at the same time I implore the other side to go public and say fine. No elective abortions. This is about the health of our citizens, not about their right to do what they want with their body. That's a different fight, save it for that one until after this one is won. The answer to the health care issues in the United States are not going to be resolved by the Heath Care Legistation being debated in Congress right now. The problem isn't that health care is expensive. Why health care is expensive is the root of the problem. We live in a for profit, easy money culture. Without tort reform and the elimination of awards for stupidity (www.stellaawards.com), public health care is going to fail us as miserably as private health care has. Then again, that is a debate for a different topic. I believe we are on women's rights? I believe a woman has the right to be barefoot and pregnant. I may even let her off the chain once in a while. ;)

Elisabella -> RE: Women's Rights! (3/18/2010 10:37:38 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LadyAngelika How is it a better healthcare bill if it isn't dealing with a major issue in your country? Unwanted babies are being born every day in families of women who couldn't afford an abortion, so how on earth are they going to find the cash to raise the kid. You want another 5-10 years of this? Because that issue isn't a healthcare issue, it's a social welfare issue. The proper solution for elective abortions would be to make it a welfare benefit, similar to food stamps or medicaid, or to offer government funding to clinics who provide a sliding scale of fees based on income. Not to put it as part of a NHS bill. quote: Elective abortions are not the same as elective cosmetic surgery. You aren't getting a mole removed. More often than not, women who get an abortion are getting it because an accident happened. It would be like saying if you got burned in a house fire, any surgery to try to repair the burn scars would be elective because it happened as a result of an accident. Living in Australia, my husband has private insurance, even though there's a public option. The public option is the bare-bones insurance plan, it's not meant to be the best plan, it's just meant to ensure that everyone has an adequate minimum level of healthcare. quote: I live in a country where this kind of segmenting who deserves and abortion and who doesn't was deal with a few decades ago. We don't have an abuse of the system. And to be honest, most women who can afford the private clinics go there for the comfort and discretion. I'm still iffy on the abortion issue...I realize it's in the country's best interest to have it legal but I'm not sure I like it...that might influence my thinking here. But anyway I think the issue isn't that the system might be abused (and if so, I'd be glad it's there, because someone who abuses the abortion system will abuse the welfare system tenfold if they had a child) but that it would be covering procedures that are entirely elective as well as those that are medically necessary. quote: And birth control is not a luxury. It is a preventative essential. I agree that it's not a luxury but at the same time it's not a medical necessity (for most people...for me it actually is, PCOS and all, but I digress) and I think that in this case it's one of those "for the greater good" things - you want people to prevent unwanted pregnancy so you make it easier to do so. And I think the same case could be made for abortion, actually, but it's such a loaded issue that while I'd be okay with it on a NHS bill and wouldn't really have an issue with that, I do think that it's going to be used to distract from pushing the bill through. Either that or it was a diversion to start with and it's going to be scrapped as a public display of compromise. Sometimes I regret having studied politics at university, it's made me so cynical.

slvemike4u -> RE: Women's Rights! (3/18/2010 10:37:58 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Elisabella quote: ORIGINAL: slvemike4u Or,and this is just me spitballin here...the forces of ignorance and control would use the victory in excluding choice to renew their attack on a womans right to choose...Do you care to take that chance? I would rather take the risk that people who are anti-abortion anyway will stay that way, than take the risk that a politically explosive (and not medically necessary) argument like this one will stall a bill that NEEDS to be passed, and that the spectacle of debate will take away from the rest of the bill that will deal with medical emergencies. ETA: one thing I want to make clear - this is a national healthcare bill, not a pro-choice or pro-life bill. If this is the issue that stuffs it up I'd say the politicos on both sides are being selfish prats who put their pet causes ahead of this nation's wellbeing. But, the side that is pushing pro-life is also the side that tends to be anti-NHS to start with. I roll my eyes at the political posturing but at the same time I implore the other side to go public and say fine. No elective abortions. This is about the health of our citizens, not about their right to do what they want with their body. That's a different fight, save it for that one until after this one is won. Listen I'm not looking to argue with you...but are you really willing to table,indefinitely,an issue of such importance to so many.This is Health Care Reform....if you allow those who would make abortion the litmus test to get a bill passed you allow them to set the agenda.Are there not times and condition where abortion is a viable health issue while falling short of being a medical necessity?Make no mistake about it..once tabled and a bill is cobbled together....this will not be revisited for 20 or 30 years.How many woman will have their choices curtailed at the alter of political expediancy.Not sure if I ,in your position in other words being a female,would be comfortable with that . And if we remove "elective" procedures do we also cave to these folks on reproductive counciling....birth control,perhaps Federal funds could be curtailed or withheld from facilities that perform non critical abortions....let the camel get iys nose under the tent...and you wind up sleeping with a camel.

BoiJen -> RE: Women's Rights! (3/18/2010 10:39:20 PM)
My rant before this posted to the wrong topic but I feel this is still important. Besides, I thought we had evolved as a law making society to stop morally based legislation. This is about health care not religious beliefs. There are various different reason a woman may want an abortion, some insurance companies even cover them, there's no reason that a government run program would not need to stay comparable to privately owned insurance plans. We need health care reform...and not this bullshit being put on the table by the government right now. Single-payer, public option, subsidized and regulated (meaning no more of this lobbying, wallet raping, insurance anti-trust law exceptions!) health care for all God-damnit! And the current legislation does NOT need to be passed. It's bullshit and government cop out from not getting their pretty little pockets padded by those scum bag lobbyists. boi

LadyAngelika -> RE: Women's Rights! (3/18/2010 10:40:35 PM)
quote: I'm still iffy on the abortion issue...I realize it's in the country's best interest to have it legal but I'm not sure I like it...that might influence my thinking here. But anyway I think the issue isn't that the system might be abused (and if so, I'd be glad it's there, because someone who abuses the abortion system will abuse the welfare system tenfold if they had a child) but that it would be covering procedures that are entirely elective as well as those that are medically necessary. This is an excellent point. - LA

Kirata -> RE: Women's Rights! (3/18/2010 10:43:38 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Elisabella ETA: one thing I want to make clear - this is a national healthcare bill, not a pro-choice or pro-life bill. If this is the issue that stuffs it up I'd say the politicos on both sides are being selfish prats who put their pet causes ahead of this nation's wellbeing. I don't think it's a "pet cause" like, say, a bridge to nowhere. I think they're scared. They're scared of what God's wrath will be, or else they know that enough of their constituents are that they'd be run out of town on a rail. Either way, you might as well be asking Cotton Mather to legalize witchcraft. K.

belladevine -> RE: Women's Rights! (3/18/2010 10:43:44 PM)
Many religious people feel guilt over abortion because they think God told them to breed and populate the Earth. What happened to the notion of pro-creating? Morally it is not wrong to have an abortion if you are degenerating the species. Children that are born into debt and violence are essentially being born into slavery.

slvemike4u -> RE: Women's Rights! (3/18/2010 10:46:35 PM)
This is the first woman who has seriously made me wonder why I kneel.....okay there was my ex-wife...and now this wing nut,so thats two ;-)

goldenwyrm1968 -> RE: Women's Rights! (3/18/2010 10:50:37 PM)
The legislation being debated in congress is BS. It isn't going to accomplish what it's proponents are saying it will and if we are lucky, it will only cost us what the naysayers are saying the final bill is going to be. And Again, wrong forum for this discussion. Ultimately, this healthcare bill is not going to affect women's rights/priveledges. Period. We are discussing a woman's rights/priveledges regarding her body (in particular, abortion as an option) and the obligations/rights/priveledges of her chosen mate (whether it's life partner or one night stand).

domiguy -> RE: Women's Rights! (3/18/2010 10:50:40 PM)
I do not think it is time to even risk such a monumental bill get held up or tied down because of the abortion issue. There are very legitimate and respected ways to prevent a pregnancy. The problem is not the people that get pregnant while utilizing them...It is the people that choose not to utilize them at all or do so improperly. Anyone who is demanding that abortions be funded under this legislation is incapable of looking at the big picture. Or more likely is incapable of understanding what it means when a prescription is to be taken "daily." You get knocked up you don't want the kid you go full term/adoption or you and yo baby daddy cough up the funds to eliminate your ordealio. Is it really that hard to comprehend?

Elisabella -> RE: Women's Rights! (3/18/2010 10:52:28 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Kirata I don't think it's a "pet cause" like, say, a bridge to nowhere. I think they're scared. They're scared of what God's wrath will be, or else they know that enough of their consituents are that they'd be run out of town on a rail. Either way, you might as well be asking Cotton Mather to legalize witchcraft. K. Ohh... Look, I really do respect other people's religious beliefs, and I know I'm a bitch for saying this but it really does scare me to think that someone who lets fear of God's wrath determine their political agenda might ever possibly become Commander in Chief of the most powerful army in the world. Really, people can live their lives however they want, and pray to whatever God or Goddess they want, but secular laws should be firmly grounded in secular policy.

BoiJen -> RE: Women's Rights! (3/18/2010 10:58:59 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: domiguy I do not think it is time to even risk such a monumental bill get held up or tied down because of the abortion issue. There are very legitimate and respected ways to prevent a pregnancy. The problem is not the people that get pregnant while utilizing them...It is the people that choose not to utilize them at all or do so improperly. Anyone who is demanding that abortions be funded under this legislation is incapable of looking at the big picture. Or more likely is incapable of understanding what it means when a prescription is to be taken "daily." You get knocked up you don't want the kid you go full term/adoption or you and yo baby daddy cough up the funds to eliminate your ordealio. Is it really that hard to comprehend? If the bill didn't do anything but give insurance companies a great way to make money, I'd agree with you. But elimination of the public option in and of itself fucked the entire legislation and made it useless. I may as well be wiping my ass with it, for all it's good for. Abortion is the least of the issues here, in my opinion, in terms of the health care bill. I also think preventative care should be mandatory to be covered by private insurance companies and government funded ones because, after all, that's what Mr. Obama said one of the benefits would be and my grandmother always told me an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. When have actual change being proposed through a health care reform bill, I'll get behind it. But the two states this household represents has already contacted our senators and representatives asking them to support health care reform....just not this bill...with detailed reasons why. Let's not get into the reasons why impoverished people have a hard time accessing birth control options. (I got stopries about 15 Mexicans living next door in a two bedroom apartment that only prove my points around that) Hitting the sack...will read responses in the morning. Good night (yes, I know you're in my dreams, raping my ass) boi

domiguy -> RE: Women's Rights! (3/18/2010 11:01:37 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: BoiJen Good night (yes, I know you're in my dreams, raping my ass) boi If this is the only thing that comes out of this legislation than I think the country would call it a monumental success. I will be gentle with you.

LadyAngelika -> RE: Women's Rights! (3/18/2010 11:01:53 PM)
quote: Really, people can live their lives however they want, and pray to whatever God or Goddess they want, but secular laws should be firmly grounded in secular policy. I agree with this as well. A few years ago, when the pope told then Canadian Prime Minister Chrétien that as a Catholic he could not let the gay marriage bill pass, he said that as a Canadian Prime Minister he was serving more than just Catholics. He said his first duty was as the Canadian PM serving the interests of his people and then to his church second. And that is the way it should be. - LA

MadamesezSTFU -> RE: Women's Rights! (3/18/2010 11:02:54 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: slvemike4u [:D][:D][:D][:D][:D][:D]...I'm not even going to say anything......oh shit,I can't help myself... I am circumcised....allow me to make this public offer (open to most any of the ladies...other than belladevine...I'm a slut,not fucking crazy)I am niether infected nor impotent..and am willing to prove both at any time and at most any place..... come one ...come all.[:D] was going to sacrifice for the good of the site, then saw you were located far far away,.,,,ah well

MadamesezSTFU -> RE: Women's Rights! (3/18/2010 11:05:42 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: KenDckey quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl In tricare (champus) case, they could not deny you, they could not cancel, they could not raise your rates... tell me, what did you work so hard for? Something that was guarenteed you for just doing your job? hehehehe why do you think I chose the military lol Let's be glad that you do not represent the majority of the military , I might have to move.

Page: << < prev 12 13 [14] 15 16 next > >>

Collarchat.com © 2025

Terms of Service

0.046875