RE: Pushing Boundries

RE: Pushing Boundries (Full Version)

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graceadieu -> RE: Pushing Boundries (3/28/2010 7:42:30 PM)
Are we talking play here, or day-to-day life? For either, I think communication and taking it gradually is key. And sometimes pushing boundaries can turn out to go to a bad place - but sometimes things that you don't expect to be a boundary at all go to a bad place, too. These things happen. The question is, can you talk about them afterwards and figure out where you go from there? Hopefully, your dominant wants you to ultimately be happy and have a good time, and will work with you if something he or she does turns out to be a really bad experience for you.

aldompdx -> RE: Pushing Boundries (3/29/2010 3:15:59 AM)
If something is being pushed, then it really isn't a boundary, is it? One goes too far when either: (1) an established boundary/limit is crossed; (2) a safeword is used and ignored; (3) consent is explicitly withdrawn. The consent aspect of SSC, RACK, SSICK is a fundamental tenet of BDSM. Surrender is by ongoing free choice from self will. Only YOU are ultimately responsible for the outcome of your choices. Make healthy choices. The question is being aware of what is actually being voluntarily shared, not abusively taken. It is only confusing for a narcissist who thinks that they are entitled to everything they want.

jbcurious -> RE: Pushing Boundries (3/29/2010 4:02:16 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: aldompdx If something is being pushed, then it really isn't a boundary, is it? One goes too far when either: (1) an established boundary/limit is crossed; (2) a safeword is used and ignored; (3) consent is explicitly withdrawn. The consent aspect of SSC, RACK, SSICK is a fundamental tenet of BDSM. Surrender is by ongoing free choice from self will. Only YOU are ultimately responsible for the outcome of your choices. Make healthy choices. The question is being aware of what is actually being voluntarily shared, not abusively taken. It is only confusing for a narcissist who thinks that they are entitled to everything they want. If a sub is in "sub space" as Dark Stephen so aptly phrased it... is it still considered voluntarily shared? ...and sorry but I'm new and have no idea what SSC, RACK or SSICK are.

jbcurious -> RE: Pushing Boundries (3/29/2010 4:09:49 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: graceadieu Are we talking play here, or day-to-day life? For either, I think communication and taking it gradually is key. And sometimes pushing boundaries can turn out to go to a bad place - but sometimes things that you don't expect to be a boundary at all go to a bad place, too. These things happen. The question is, can you talk about them afterwards and figure out where you go from there? Hopefully, your dominant wants you to ultimately be happy and have a good time, and will work with you if something he or she does turns out to be a really bad experience for you. Thanks for your response... And for re-enforcing my thoughts that I need to experience this in a relationship that is built on trust.

Level -> RE: Pushing Boundries (3/29/2010 4:17:18 AM)
quote: but I'm new and have no idea what SSC, RACK or SSICK are. Safe Sane Consenual Risk Accepted Consenual Kink Not sure about the SSICK one...

jbcurious -> RE: Pushing Boundries (3/29/2010 4:23:04 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Level quote: but I'm new and have no idea what SSC, RACK or SSICK are. Safe Sane Consenual Risk Accepted Consenual Kink Not sure about the SSICK one... Thanks... Not knowing anything is a very humbling experience... [&o]

Level -> RE: Pushing Boundries (3/29/2010 4:26:00 AM)
No one is born knowing any of this, everyone has to learn, right? Just takes a little time. One of the most important things to learn is yourself; get that part down, and the rest is a piece of cake.

KnightofMists -> RE: Pushing Boundries (3/29/2010 5:58:45 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael Oh SURE summarize seven paragraphs in a single line, BE that way! Hey, got offered to teach in timbucktoo...how far is Sudbery from you? I think it's spelled... Sudbury.... which I think you are closer to me now than you will be when your there. congrats on getting asked... hope you enjoy the experience

DarkSteven -> RE: Pushing Boundries (3/29/2010 6:03:07 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: jbcurious quote: ORIGINAL: aldompdx If something is being pushed, then it really isn't a boundary, is it? One goes too far when either: (1) an established boundary/limit is crossed; (2) a safeword is used and ignored; (3) consent is explicitly withdrawn. The consent aspect of SSC, RACK, SSICK is a fundamental tenet of BDSM. Surrender is by ongoing free choice from self will. Only YOU are ultimately responsible for the outcome of your choices. Make healthy choices. The question is being aware of what is actually being voluntarily shared, not abusively taken. It is only confusing for a narcissist who thinks that they are entitled to everything they want. If a sub is in "sub space" as Dark Stephen so aptly phrased it... is it still considered voluntarily shared? ...and sorry but I'm new and have no idea what SSC, RACK or SSICK are. 1. There are two kinds of boundaries: Soft limits, which are things that can be pushed carefully, and hard limits, which are never to be pushed at all. 2. SSC - Safe, sane, consensual, RACK - Risk Aware Consensual Kink. SSICK - new one on me. But I assume it's Safe, Sane, Informed Consent Kink. The idea is that the sub has an idea what's going on and is at least somewhat on board with it.

UniqueRaven -> RE: Pushing Boundries (3/29/2010 6:13:29 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Shyla quote: ORIGINAL: UniqueRaven And often he does understand - even better than myself - just he doesn't show it in the same way, or the way that i might expect. People are different, and they don't always act in the way that you think that they should. So the reality is, placing so much importance on being understood, and feeling understood, is a waste of energy. Trusting him is much more important than trying to make him understand you. You're going to find that a losing enterprise everytime. You're seeking a feeling to alleviate your fear, and that's not the solution. You have to face the fear, and trust anyway. (first, quote edited, pieces snipped to only portray the parts relevant to the tangent I'm about to indulge in) Raven, Thank you. Thank you SO much. I am writing this statement, made by you, on my forehead. I will reapply it every day for the next three weeks. Perhaps I should get it tattoo'd somewhere (not my forehead, that might be unbecoming). Wow did you just shed a huge spotlight on a stumbling block I've been banging in to for the last 4 or 5 days. It wasn't a pretty spotlight, by the way, neither was the revelation. but you are. so. freaking. right. Thank you for being you and saying this. I'm gonna go get my tattoo gun now. Yup, it's that important. (ok, maybe not the tattoo gun, but I am writing this down and carrying it with me) Aw, thank you. i'm glad you found my words helpful. [:)] To jbcurious - yes, again, it is all about trust. You can have 20 safe words with a cell phone in your hand while you wear your running shoes, and still be hurt by someone in a bad way. So take your time, get to know someone, and develop that trust and comfort level - no need to rush into anything. And have FUN - that's a big part of why we do this stuff, right? [:)]

Jeffff -> RE: Pushing Boundries (3/29/2010 6:26:07 AM)
As soon as people place more value on an activity, than on the person involved, you are fucked. In the negative sense of the word. There is a difference between pushing the envelope and running it through the shredder.

DarkSteven -> RE: Pushing Boundries (3/29/2010 7:39:04 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Jeffff As soon as people place more value on an activity, than on the person involved, you are fucked. Emphatic agreement from me.

jbcurious -> RE: Pushing Boundries (3/29/2010 7:51:24 AM)
Thank You, I'm extremly reassured by what I'm hearing. [:D]

Nslavu -> RE: Pushing Boundries (3/29/2010 8:45:53 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: jbcurious Thank You, I'm extremly reassured by what I'm hearing. [:D] You are now invincible! Invincible http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xEzyib-jDJk

DesFIP -> RE: Pushing Boundries (3/29/2010 8:58:08 AM)
The subspace question, no it isn't ethical to do something when they're in subspace when they made it clear beforehand they didn't want to do. You discuss it the next day, and see if they really have changed their mind. However lots of guys will claim they won't have sex with you, just s & m, and the moment you are spacing, they'll do it anyway claiming you changed your mind. Just like in real life, lots of liars and con artists around. Which is why you have two choices to be sure you're safe. Either you take time to develop a friendship and a knowledge of their character, or you play in public where the DMs can enforce your limits for you.

jbcurious -> RE: Pushing Boundries (3/29/2010 9:37:12 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DesFIP The subspace question, no it isn't ethical to do something when they're in subspace when they made it clear beforehand they didn't want to do. You discuss it the next day, and see if they really have changed their mind. However lots of guys will claim they won't have sex with you, just s & m, and the moment you are spacing, they'll do it anyway claiming you changed your mind. Just like in real life, lots of liars and con artists around. Which is why you have two choices to be sure you're safe. Either you take time to develop a friendship and a knowledge of their character, or you play in public where the DMs can enforce your limits for you. So my question should have been... If a Dom puts a sub into subspace and takes them past their limits, is it correct? Answer no, justification doesn't come into it... he's a wanker and should be kicked to the curb. I think I've got it!

dreamerdreaming -> RE: Pushing Boundries (3/29/2010 9:40:04 AM)
Very good! [sm=applause.gif][sm=applause.gif][sm=applause.gif][sm=applause.gif][sm=applause.gif]

jbcurious -> RE: Pushing Boundries (3/29/2010 9:40:18 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Nslavu quote: ORIGINAL: jbcurious Thank You, I'm extremly reassured by what I'm hearing. [:D] You are now invincible! Invincible http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xEzyib-jDJk I don't want to be invincible... I want to be Dominated! [;)]

leadership527 -> RE: Pushing Boundries (3/29/2010 10:42:22 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Jeffff As soon as people place more value on an activity, than on the person involved, you are fucked. Again, I'm ill-inclined to say what is or is not good for others. It is certainly true that I care WAY more about Carol than I do about Carol-sub or Carol-slave or any other specific variant of Carol.

SimplyMichael -> RE: Pushing Boundries (3/29/2010 11:06:28 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: jbcurious So my question should have been... If a Dom puts a sub into subspace and takes them past their limits, is it correct? You are focused on the acts...forget the acts...I could cut her clit hood off and it could be wonderful for both of us or I could kiss her and violate her boundaries. It isn't the act... Its the motivation BEHIND the act Did I purposely put her in subspace so I could manipulate her into agreeing to do something she will later regret? Or did I put her in subspace so she could be in an emotional space that would make it easier and more enjoyable to enjoy something for the first time knowing that the next day she will be all goey thinking about it. Think of how hot a kiss can be...and think how violated you would feel if someone you didn't like kissed you, it isn't the act, it is the motivation and situation behind the act. As I have said, I love pushing limits, but I do it because it is hot for me and PART of why it is hot is I can get her to lust for something she once hated even when she ISN'T all horny or subspaced out...my motivation isn't just "how do I get what I want and fuck the consequences" but instead "how do I create consequences that allow me to get what I want over and over again"?

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