RE: MI militia raided by FBI

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Real0ne -> RE: MI militia raided by FBI (3/28/2010 4:08:51 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: takemeforyourown I understand that there are militia "hate" groups. I continue to support the 2nd Amendment, however. Although I am a peace-loving, bleeding-heart liberal, I believe that an organized non-governmental militia could be the last stand and protection against a government that turns against its citizens. At least, I think that's what the Founders had in mind. Edited to add that I also believe that those who seek to overthrow the government are traitors. food for thought: if you agreed to be governed then the constitution trust covenant limits the authority of government OVER you. However what if you do not consent to be governed? What authority then does the set of rules have OVER you? Does that give the government carte blanche do any damn thing they please to you or does that make you a walking hot potato that they dare not interfere with?

Real0ne -> RE: MI militia raided by FBI (3/28/2010 4:12:37 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Thadius quote: ORIGINAL: pahunkboy quote: ORIGINAL: jlf1961 Panda, realone doesnt think that anything should be against the law, at least as far as I can tell are you an injured party? Does she need to be to comment on it? Unless you are taking depositions for the defense, what does it matter if she has legal standing as an injured party? However, to be exact about the law in the case of threats, it occurs from time to time that even the injured party has no idea that they were threatened or in any danger (look at all the stings into folks hiring hitmen to off their spouses). A threat can be deemed credible and sometimes even the threat can be seen as the actual action if the government can prove there was a showing of intent, and sometimes even without a showing of intent (like calling in a bomb threat). If this is let to go down can you imagine what can be trumped up against people? The ability for government to simply make up any damn thing they want to nail a particular group? This idea of arrest before crime is an attrocity and really only time its used is in war against the enemy, but then I digress when I realize that the USCode depicts the citizens as the enemy. so......

popeye1250 -> RE: MI militia raided by FBI (3/28/2010 4:13:53 PM)
Now I'm wondering if this really was a "Militia" group or did the Press simply misslabel them?

Real0ne -> RE: MI militia raided by FBI (3/28/2010 4:14:32 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: jlf1961 Panda, realone doesnt think that anything should be against the law, at least as far as I can tell well I think I have been pretty clear at the distinction between law and legislated whim, do we really need to go over that again?

Thadius -> RE: MI militia raided by FBI (3/28/2010 4:15:39 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Real0ne quote: ORIGINAL: takemeforyourown I understand that there are militia "hate" groups. I continue to support the 2nd Amendment, however. Although I am a peace-loving, bleeding-heart liberal, I believe that an organized non-governmental militia could be the last stand and protection against a government that turns against its citizens. At least, I think that's what the Founders had in mind. Edited to add that I also believe that those who seek to overthrow the government are traitors. food for thought: if you agreed to be governed then the constitution trust covenant limits the authority of government OVER you. However what if you do not consent to be governed? What authority then does the set of rules have OVER you? Does that give the government carte blanche do any damn thing they please to you or does that make you a walking hot potato that they dare not interfere with? Let me take a stab at answering this one. If one chooses not to be governed by the rules of any society, one also chooses to find themselves in a dark prison cell or a bullet in their own head. Don't get me wrong I am definitely for getting the government out of as much of my life as possible, but I also know that there are certain laws that must be enforced lest we turn civilization over to the uncivil. I would just as soon defend my home from a tyrannical government as I would from an anarchist looking for some easy loot. Make no mistake, after the initial warning to cease and desist the result will be the same, somebody will be leaving my property in a body bag (possibly myself).

pahunkboy -> RE: MI militia raided by FBI (3/28/2010 4:16:27 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Real0ne quote: ORIGINAL: takemeforyourown I understand that there are militia "hate" groups. I continue to support the 2nd Amendment, however. Although I am a peace-loving, bleeding-heart liberal, I believe that an organized non-governmental militia could be the last stand and protection against a government that turns against its citizens. At least, I think that's what the Founders had in mind. Edited to add that I also believe that those who seek to overthrow the government are traitors. food for thought: if you agreed to be governed then the constitution trust covenant limits the authority of government OVER you. However what if you do not consent to be governed? What authority then does the set of rules have OVER you? Does that give the government carte blanche do any damn thing they please to you or does that make you a walking hot potato that they dare not interfere with? Yes- how do you terminate the plan? It is like being stuck in a bad cell phone plan. They keep billing- but ya want to cancel it. So what happens when you no longer consent? What form do you fill out and where do you send it? Not all of us lick goldman sachs toes.

pahunkboy -> RE: MI militia raided by FBI (3/28/2010 4:19:44 PM)
Thad- a few guys posting on a board is not a threat. Check points are a sign of martial law. But then some here claim there is no FEMA camps and there is no continuity of govt plans. But don't worry. The govt will unleash a bio germ on us when it totally collapses. Sick people cant riot- so that is how they will handle it. A bio germ.

ThatDamnedPanda -> RE: MI militia raided by FBI (3/28/2010 4:20:19 PM)
Maybe if we just started another 9/11 thread, that'd keep RealOne busy for a few weeks....

pahunkboy -> RE: MI militia raided by FBI (3/28/2010 4:20:45 PM)
http://www.continuityofgovernment.org/

Real0ne -> RE: MI militia raided by FBI (3/28/2010 4:25:13 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ThatDamnedPanda Maybe if we just started another 9/11 thread, that'd keep RealOne busy for a few weeks.... Not really. that shit is so obvious and I have to laugh that even on the 911 omission report they picked a damn picture that shows a bright flash as they are blowing it all to hell and everyone is to stooopid to call the black kettle black. They make a mockery out of you and so do I.

pahunkboy -> RE: MI militia raided by FBI (3/28/2010 4:25:31 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ThatDamnedPanda Maybe if we just started another 9/11 thread, that'd keep RealOne busy for a few weeks.... I have the luxury of knowing a few things about RO- off the board. I can tell you- that he puts his money where his mouth is. With out- going into details- he has his stuff together way more then you might guess. So much so- that many would be envious. I would not estimate his brain- his potential. He has been very gracious thus far. Likely too gracious.

Thadius -> RE: MI militia raided by FBI (3/28/2010 4:26:41 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: pahunkboy Thad- a few guys posting on a board is not a threat. Check points are a sign of martial law. But then some here claim there is no FEMA camps and there is no continuity of govt plans. But don't worry. The govt will unleash a bio germ on us when it totally collapses. Sick people cant riot- so that is how they will handle it. A bio germ. I agree that a few guys discussing something on a board is not a threat, however is that the full extent of the group in the OP? I don't know. Check points are also sometimes a necessity for safety reasons, and not necessarily a sign of martial law. I still remember the claims years ago about the colored and different shapes appearing on the backs of road signs... I cannot comfirm or deny the existance of those camps or whether there is a continuity of plans regarding them. Who will be vaccinated against it? Afterall, there will have to be some force that isn't sick to help clean up after the release of something like that for quelling riots. This seems more like fantasy than reality, but who knows.

Real0ne -> RE: MI militia raided by FBI (3/28/2010 4:28:07 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: popeye1250 Now I'm wondering if this really was a "Militia" group or did the Press simply misslabel them? well I posted the the definition out of bouviers and they are not a militia until called into service. It amounts to a group of men presumably armed. That is not to say they do not identify as a militia. The function of the militia is to uphold the laws of the constitution and protect it from anyone literally including the government unfortunately. We have left behind the 4th brach of government which are the "peoples" grand juries, not the ones we have now in the employment of the government receiving government checks and the same with the judges, the peoples grand juries and judges get no money and have no affiliation with any corporate entity or government enterprise. These courts we have do not even have jurisdiction over the people and you can read that right out of the federal register and senate notes from the judiciary act and later the APA et al. Its all freaking fraud man just like that post I made about the ficticious plaintif... thats what ALL government agencies are and to bring a suit in the name of a ficticious plaintif is fraud and contempt of court but they are all in collusion so their retiremnt funds get fat.

ThatDamnedPanda -> RE: MI militia raided by FBI (3/28/2010 4:31:54 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: pahunkboy quote: ORIGINAL: ThatDamnedPanda Maybe if we just started another 9/11 thread, that'd keep RealOne busy for a few weeks.... I have the luxury of knowing a few things about RO- off the board. I can tell you- that he puts his money where his mouth is. With out- going into details- he has his stuff together way more then you might guess. So he says. I give him credit, then, he's an absolute genius at keeping it a secret. quote: ORIGINAL: pahunkboy He has been very gracious thus far. Likely too gracious. No, he's been an obnoxious, mocking, insulting asshole ever since he came back. Calling everyone who disagrees with him "stooooopid retards" is not gracious, it's being an asshole. You like him, fine. But don't try to convince all the people he's insulted that he's anything but what he appears to be.

wittynamehere -> RE: MI militia raided by FBI (3/28/2010 4:39:21 PM)
I'd like to know more before I comment. Interesting though so far. quote: ORIGINAL: jlf1961 Let me guess, part of an ongoing government conspiracy? Let the rest of us guess - not too bright?

jlf1961 -> RE: MI militia raided by FBI (3/28/2010 4:39:38 PM)
Once more a thread has been turned into a conspiracy soapbox.

Real0ne -> RE: MI militia raided by FBI (3/28/2010 4:42:18 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Thadius quote: ORIGINAL: pahunkboy Thad- a few guys posting on a board is not a threat. Check points are a sign of martial law. But then some here claim there is no FEMA camps and there is no continuity of govt plans. But don't worry. The govt will unleash a bio germ on us when it totally collapses. Sick people cant riot- so that is how they will handle it. A bio germ. I agree that a few guys discussing something on a board is not a threat, however is that the full extent of the group in the OP? I don't know. Check points are also sometimes a necessity for safety reasons, and not necessarily a sign of martial law. I still remember the claims years ago about the colored and different shapes appearing on the backs of road signs... I cannot comfirm or deny the existance of those camps or whether there is a continuity of plans regarding them. Who will be vaccinated against it? Afterall, there will have to be some force that isn't sick to help clean up after the release of something like that for quelling riots. This seems more like fantasy than reality, but who knows. they simply do not at any time have the authority to stop or detain you for ANY reason other than you caused an injury to another or have done some sort of property damage. I cannot stress that strong enough. People allow this to go on and the next thing they will be arresting you for dissent by thinking, thought terrorism. The fact is these government agents are using strong arm tactics to get people into contracts with them. Once you give them your name they can put a lien on you. That is what they do. Charge your account. People who are in jail and I do mean even some of the most intelligent have somehow contracted their way in. All crime today is commercial. You can spend 1/2 your life not understanding the relationships that I freely give here and because I have you at least know the questions to ask to get the right answers. Otherwise if you have ever been in a law library its like looking for a needle in the haystack and you will spend a lifetime and never get the answers. Anyway they do not except through contract have the authority to detain you "except in the case of injury to someone or damaging someones property" and they use strong arm tactics and lies as shown in that traffic stop I posted when they wanted to get that kid for open carry and had to leave him go. Thats how its done thats how we bring out servants into check.,

Real0ne -> RE: MI militia raided by FBI (3/28/2010 4:44:46 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ThatDamnedPanda No, he's been an obnoxious, mocking, insulting asshole ever since he came back. Calling everyone who disagrees with him "stooooopid retards" is not gracious, it's being an asshole. You like him, fine. But don't try to convince all the people he's insulted that he's anything but what he appears to be. never without provocation and I have had so much on this board that I could say somehthing obnoxious in every post for the rest of my life and still not fill the order..

ThatDamnedPanda -> RE: MI militia raided by FBI (3/28/2010 4:47:55 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Real0ne quote: ORIGINAL: ThatDamnedPanda No, he's been an obnoxious, mocking, insulting asshole ever since he came back. Calling everyone who disagrees with him "stooooopid retards" is not gracious, it's being an asshole. You like him, fine. But don't try to convince all the people he's insulted that he's anything but what he appears to be. never without provocation and I have had so much on this board that I could say somehthing obnoxious in every post for the rest of my life and still not fill the order.. Not in my experience. When I first started debating you, I addressed you respectfully and courteously, and you responded by repeatedly ridiculing and insulting me. I've never made any effort to give you the benefit of the doubt or meet you halfway since.

Real0ne -> RE: MI militia raided by FBI (3/28/2010 4:54:48 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ThatDamnedPanda quote: ORIGINAL: Real0ne quote: ORIGINAL: ThatDamnedPanda No, he's been an obnoxious, mocking, insulting asshole ever since he came back. Calling everyone who disagrees with him "stooooopid retards" is not gracious, it's being an asshole. You like him, fine. But don't try to convince all the people he's insulted that he's anything but what he appears to be. never without provocation and I have had so much on this board that I could say somehthing obnoxious in every post for the rest of my life and still not fill the order.. Not in my experience. When I first started debating you, I addressed you respectfully and courteously, and you responded by repeatedly ridiculing and insulting me. I've never made any effort to give you the benefit of the doubt or meet you halfway since. Thats not the way I remember it sorry. You all had a blast with your presumptive physics quoting it as if it were from some bible with snarkey remarks imbedded. You know nutjobs conspiracy theorist whackos all the typical bullshit lines used to shut down real debate. That and when people devolve physics into a level that even a highschool kid knows better in a manner in which to insult well I apologize if I am on to that game.

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