RE: Not Wanted !?! WTF (Full Version)

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sirsholly -> RE: Not Wanted !?! WTF (4/10/2010 4:29:50 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: jbcurious

While I don't like the manner in which it was handled... I think the end result is probably what is best for the child. I would be looking at the agency that placed a child, in what to me is, an unsuitable environment.
The issue is not about the agency...it is about the actions of the adoptive parent.
quote:


How does a young single working woman in a stressful job like nursing give the proper care to a child with special needs...
  There is no guarantee to parents that when we have children there will be no special needs issues. If she could not handle this child there were certainly other avenues she could have taken. What she did was heartless, inhumane, and criminal. And the fact that her MOTHER is the one that took the little one to the airport and put him on the plane is proof that the nut never falls far from the tree.
quote:


The entire adoption process is rift with problems and in an attempt to place kids with special needs into homes, I believe the proper screening and the feasibility of home situations is, at times, overlooked.
I am sure the authorities all agree that this child was permitted to be adopted by someone who should have been deemed as unacceptable. 20/20 is always clear.

However...while i agree there surely are screening methods that are lax with special needs children, and feel the adoptive parent may not have even been aware the special needs existed with this child, this issue is not about the policies of the agency, or even the possible deception in denying the childs needs. The issue is her actions.
quote:


While I understand the immediate reaction to the horrible woman who did such a thing... I believe the child is better off out of her hands.
I agree the child should not be raised by someone of the adoptive mothers character. However...i cannot help what damage she has done to a child who is already emotionally damaged.



barelynangel -> RE: Not Wanted !?! WTF (4/10/2010 5:21:35 AM)

As most of yu know, i am not a bleeding heart in most cases and i usually find logic or rationale on the part most people are bitching about, but this story pisses me off that woman could do this to a child she adopted. If she no longer wanted him, which to me shows she really doesn't and never did want to be a PARENT at all because sorry but to me parents get the good the bad and the ugly and they stick with it because adopted or no that is their child, she should have done her best to see him through the return with as little negativity as possible. Sending a kid back across the world alone with a note is as low as a person can get. I am glad i don't know her otherwise i would give her a piece of my mind. I am glad this boy is out of her hands, and i hope the way this return occured doesn't cause him any more harm and he finds a loving home that will accept him with any issues he has and love hm enough to help him work through them as much as he is capable.

I know in this world and society some people treat their kids a lot worse that this woman treated this boy, but there is something about this that bugs me, it doesn't diminish what others do to kids, but it makes me as angry as when i hear about the other stuff.

angel



sirsholly -> RE: Not Wanted !?! WTF (4/10/2010 5:48:47 AM)

the final act of heartlessness done by this woman was hiring a man via the internet to pick up and drive this child to the orphanage. She arranged for this child to be alone with a total stranger!
I cannot imagine imagine how scared that poor kid had to have been.



divi -> RE: Not Wanted !?! WTF (4/10/2010 5:54:51 AM)

This story sickens me.. the poor little boy. People do suck and I hope this woman can never adopt or have children of her own.



JstAnotherSub -> RE: Not Wanted !?! WTF (4/10/2010 6:03:31 AM)

why a lady that young was allowed to adopt a child with those behavioral issues is beyond me.  i think what she did, sending him back, was probably the best thing she could come up with, under the circumstances.

could she have handled it differently? sure.  maybe calling the agency that handled the adoption and working out something, but considering the grandmother took him to the airport, and reading the article that Kirata linked to, i believe that she acted out of fear and frustration.

if anyone needs to review their practices, it is the agencies that handle adoptions, especially international ones.  the wanting to get rid of the child should not be over ridden by the sense to wait until a good match is found.

all in all, the whole thing sucks though.  a fucked up kid is now fucked up even more.....



kiwisub12 -> RE: Not Wanted !?! WTF (4/10/2010 7:35:40 AM)

Hmm Russia rescinds parental rights for a 6 year old? Be interesting to know what for. And as for the orphanage - beaten with broom sticks? I would posit that this kid is so damaged that it would take a saint to raise him to being a pschologically healthy kid. If if were possible.

People adopt children without any sort of pschological investigation from foreign countries - basically they are taking their chances that the "goods" aren't damaged.

And in this case, it sounds as if the poor kid is damaged goods. And yes, if i was in this womans shoes, i probably would consider sending him back. Kids threatening to kill their care givers is scarey stuff, and doesn't sound like something that is easily treated with a positive result. She thought she was getting a kid to love and raise, instead she got the kid from hell.

I rather think she was desperate. Thats the only thing that i can think of to explain what she did.

And i like that Russia is all indignant about it. They have the society that has so many children without parents and they are going to be all rightous about this one situation?



sirsholly -> RE: Not Wanted !?! WTF (4/10/2010 12:45:30 PM)

With everything i have read/heard about this, the grandmother and mother are defending their actions. Yet at no time did either say the child had a medical evaluation. I am thinking it could be something as manageable as ADD/ADHD.

My feeling is the adoptive mother wanted a perfect child.



barelynangel -> RE: Not Wanted !?! WTF (4/10/2010 1:22:55 PM)

I don't have a problem with her wanting to send him back since she was allowed to legally -- i have a problem with the irresponsibility of how she sent him back and the additional trauma this may have caused this child who was already having issues. So she feared for her life but her mom didn't?

She feared for her life in the open with people about against a 6 year old boy, but she decided to put him on a plane full of people of whom he could have attacked at any time?

I don't buy her fear was that great she couldn't take him or someone from her family couldn't take the child back instead of the way she did it. What it probably was was that she didn't want to spend the money it would have cost for her to take the child back and then fly home.

angel




kiwisub12 -> RE: Not Wanted !?! WTF (4/10/2010 3:26:08 PM)

I raised two kids with ADD - and neither of them threatened to burn our house down, or draw pictures of the house in flames (which for some reason i think is worse than saying it)

I would think a 27 year old nurse would be able to tell the difference between an add kid and a psychopathic kid that scared the family. At least i would hope so.

And really, we haven't got any back story on the kid and the mother and what happened up to the day of putting him on a plane.

For all we know, the kid was going through the "honeymoon" phase where they are as good as gold, then feel a bit more secure and let out a bit of what and who they really are - and scare everyone to death.

I would think dragging any kid out of his country and culture and language would be rough - regardless of the country. Do these adoptions get follow-up of any kind?

edited to add - for what she paid to get this kid, I would think she would have to be at her last straw to give him back.



sirsholly -> RE: Not Wanted !?! WTF (4/10/2010 6:36:04 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: kiwisub12

I raised two kids with ADD - and neither of them threatened to burn our house down, or draw pictures of the house in flames (which for some reason i think is worse than saying it)
All cases of ADD/ADHD are not based on the behavior of your two children.
quote:


I would think a 27 year old nurse would be able to tell the difference between an add kid and a psychopathic kid that scared the family. At least i would hope so.
In that case...why would you have your childrens ADD diagnosed by a doctor? Just get a nurse to do it.[8|]
The fact is, most nurses are not trained to diagnose a psychopath, nor ADD, nor ADHD. If they were, they would not be nurses. They would be doctors.
quote:


And really, we haven't got any back story on the kid and the mother and what happened up to the day of putting him on a plane.
So? I don't give a dead rats ass what happened...you do not put a six yr old on a plane alone and arrange for a total stranger to transport the child to the orphanage who had no clue the child was arriving.
quote:


For all we know, the kid was going through the "honeymoon" phase where they are as good as gold, then feel a bit more secure and let out a bit of what and who they really are - and scare everyone to death.
All the more reason for a medical eval. Very rare is the six yr old that can mask a psychopathic personality. 
quote:


I would think dragging any kid out of his country and culture and language would be rough - regardless of the country. Do these adoptions get follow-up of any kind?
The mother had a visit from a social worker in January and did not state any problems
quote:


edited to add - for what she paid to get this kid, I would think she would have to be at her last straw to give him back.
You must be kidding if you think the cost of the adoption should be a consideration in her defense.



BeingChewsie -> RE: Not Wanted !?! WTF (4/10/2010 7:02:01 PM)

Quick reply:

Before my son was Diagnosed with Asperger's disorder, he often hit, kicked, screamed, threatened to kill his class mates, threatened suicide at age 7 and so on. Once he was diagnosed and we got some solid therapy in place, an IEP and eventually homeschooling, meds to help him control the impulsivity and agitation, he turned around. He rarely has any sort of temper tantrum now. We know how to structure his environment and handle things so he doesn't blow up. He is learning coping skills, making friends, making much better choices and so forth. Having said that, I'm not a single mom trying to do it alone. I'm a psych NP too. We had access to the best care and therapy, money was no obstacle, we were both home all day and could do whatever was required to make him better. I can fully understand a single mother being overwhelmed and not knowing where to go to get help. Frankly help is pretty damn scarce even if you have time and money for kids with serious psychiatric issues. I think what she did was wrong but I understand just how bad it can be. I wish she had chosen a different path. They are not puppies from the pound, you don't get to bring them back when you tire of them or if they piss on your rugs.



JstAnotherSub -> RE: Not Wanted !?! WTF (4/10/2010 7:16:06 PM)

~FR~

i agree there are better ways she could have handled it, but there are worse ways also....we do not have all the facts about what she knew/did not know, who she told, how bad the kid was, etc.

the fact is any time you adopt, you are bringing an alien into your life.  genetics run deep, and adopting a child any length of time after  being born gives opportunity for someone caring (or pretending to care) for them the time to do damage that can not be erased. 

there are reasons we get children as adorable babies.  it is so when they do hit puberty and/or issues like this kid, we dont kill them because we are in love with them.  she did not get the chance to fall in love, and i just can not judge her on having the sense to realize she was in over her head.



slvemike4u -> RE: Not Wanted !?! WTF (4/10/2010 7:26:09 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: sirsholly

quote:

ORIGINAL: kiwisub12

I raised two kids with ADD - and neither of them threatened to burn our house down, or draw pictures of the house in flames (which for some reason i think is worse than saying it)
All cases of ADD/ADHD are not based on the behavior of your two children.
quote:


I would think a 27 year old nurse would be able to tell the difference between an add kid and a psychopathic kid that scared the family. At least i would hope so.
In that case...why would you have your childrens ADD diagnosed by a doctor? Just get a nurse to do it.[8|]
The fact is, most nurses are not trained to diagnose a psychopath, nor ADD, nor ADHD. If they were, they would not be nurses. They would be doctors.
quote:


And really, we haven't got any back story on the kid and the mother and what happened up to the day of putting him on a plane.
So? I don't give a dead rats ass what happened...you do not put a six yr old on a plane alone and arrange for a total stranger to transport the child to the orphanage who had no clue the child was arriving.
quote:


For all we know, the kid was going through the "honeymoon" phase where they are as good as gold, then feel a bit more secure and let out a bit of what and who they really are - and scare everyone to death.
All the more reason for a medical eval. Very rare is the six yr old that can mask a psychopathic personality. 
quote:


I would think dragging any kid out of his country and culture and language would be rough - regardless of the country. Do these adoptions get follow-up of any kind?
The mother had a visit from a social worker in January and did not state any problems
quote:


edited to add - for what she paid to get this kid, I would think she would have to be at her last straw to give him back.
You must be kidding if you think the cost of the adoption should be a consideration in her defense.
Holly,has anyone mentioned  taken the time today to point out just how wonderful you are.....would you mind if I did?

edited because I screwed it up originaly :-(



sirsholly -> RE: Not Wanted !?! WTF (4/11/2010 6:13:39 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: BeingChewsie


Before my son was Diagnosed with Asperger's disorder, he often hit, kicked, screamed, threatened to kill his class mates, threatened suicide at age 7 and so on. Once he was diagnosed and we got some solid therapy in place, an IEP and eventually homeschooling, meds to help him control the impulsivity and agitation, he turned around. He rarely has any sort of temper tantrum now.


I was in the beginning stages of dealing with this. My two yr old was demonstrating a frightening level of violence, threats, etc. The day he picked up a heavy maple chair and threw it at me was the day i started looking for help.
He was diagnosed with Autism Spectrum Disorder. One of the many, many mind boggling suggestions from the Dr was called the Finegold Diet which eliminated dyes, additives, preservatives, etc.
I started with the biggest known problem causer, Red Dye #40. Within two days there was a shocking improvement. Within a week he had the behavior of a typical little boy. I was convinced this kid had severe food allergies and saw a specialist. We waited a few months for another evaluation which proved the Autism was a misdiagnosis.

In the cause of this 6 yr old...the orphanage denied abnormal behavior. The mother/grandmother denied abnormal behavior when he was first adopted. The diet change from the orphanage to his new home had to be massive. Hmmmm....food for thought.



Loki45 -> RE: Not Wanted !?! WTF (4/11/2010 6:18:31 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: WyldHrt

quote:

While I understand the immediate reaction to the horrible woman who did such a thing... I believe the child is better off out of her hands.

I completely agree with the second sentence, JB. That said, the damage this woman caused by her actions is, IMO, unforgivable.



According to the woman, the child was already damaged. I wouldn't want a kid in my home that was threatening to burn it down with me in it either.



zephyroftheNorth -> RE: Not Wanted !?! WTF (4/11/2010 6:31:24 AM)

quote:

In the cause of this 6 yr old...the orphanage denied abnormal behavior. The mother/grandmother denied abnormal behavior when he was first adopted. The diet change from the orphanage to his new home had to be massive. Hmmmm....food for thought.


...and then add culture shock and (possibly) not understanding why he was shipped half way around the world and wala potential for an explosive situation. Add to that being shipped back and the rejection he must feel and now he's in worse shape than he was to begin with.

I hope they prosecute that woman to the full extent of the law possible. That she found it so easy to get rid of that boy instead of seeking help speaks volumes.



zephyroftheNorth -> RE: Not Wanted !?! WTF (4/11/2010 6:33:27 AM)

quote:

According to the woman, the child was already damaged. I wouldn't want a kid in my home that was threatening to burn it down with me in it either.


Yet she was perfectly comfortable allowing her mother to take him to the airport. Obviously she wasn't that worried.



tazzygirl -> RE: Not Wanted !?! WTF (4/11/2010 7:21:26 AM)

~FR

6 years old

Foreign born

sent to the US for adoption to a single parent

parent is a Nurse to boot (high stress)

Did he even speak english?

Imagine being submerged into a culture you know nothing about, with a woman you know nothing about, leaving behind the woman who gave birth to you.. his mother didnt die, she lost custody.

of course he is an angry little boy! i dont believe single people should be allowed to adopt. there is no mutual support system, no one to work through the problems with together. not only was the child further traumatized by the return, the mother has also been traumatized. this was a bad situation all the way around.



domiguy -> RE: Not Wanted !?! WTF (4/11/2010 7:28:29 AM)

I didn't read the article but I am sure he was a very bad little boy....He should just view this whole episode as a big "time out."



sirsholly -> RE: Not Wanted !?! WTF (4/11/2010 8:00:17 AM)

quote:

Holly,has anyone mentioned taken the time today to point out just how wonderful you are.....would you mind if I did?
*blushes*

Thanks Mike...but pot meets kettle [:)][:)][:)][:)][:)]
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