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RE: Submission and Confidence - 4/6/2006 10:10:11 AM   
talltxsub


Posts: 173
Joined: 11/10/2005
Status: offline 		A note of sarcasm, perhaps, MistressLorelei?

(in reply to MistressLorelei)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: Submission and Confidence - 4/6/2006 10:18:37 AM   
MistressLorelei


Posts: 997
Joined: 11/7/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: talltxsub

A note of sarcasm, perhaps, MistressLorelei?


Gee, ya think?  I was considering it playful banter... but sarcasm works for Me

(in reply to talltxsub)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: Jasmyn - 4/6/2006 10:20:51 AM   
Jasmyn


Posts: 1234
Joined: 2/6/2004
From: New Zealand
Status: offline 		It's not as simple to just say I did a, b, c and got a, b, c result.  Generally if a spot a guy and I think I am reading him right I tend not to speak my thoughts or ask leading questions.  Rather I'll create opportunities for his submissive self to surface.  Fairly innocuous things like 'can you hold my coat?' or 'would you be a dear and find my friend for me?' or some such thing.  But then you can ask the question, is it that he is inherently submissive or am I simply laying out the realities of what it might be like to be with me, ergo I'm just simply demanding and by virtue of attraction he does whatever I want in the hope of getting what he wants, a leg over.   But it's more than that, its in how they respond to being made use of, like was their attitude to being of assistance acted upon as a chore or an unquestioned given (that they would do this)?  

Keep in mind two there's always two sides to a fence ... some will be subservient to me like I said in the hope of getting something in return..and yes in the face of a promise of a sensual trip...most men I've dealt with have readily been subjugated for my pleasure but I wouldn't necessarily class them as 'submissive' in the sense you are using the term.  Secondly just because I spot submissive qualities in someone and I create opportunities for them to be useful doesn't necessarily mean I want to have them 'sub' to me, so a lot of the times in vanilla situations it's enough just to note that this person is responding nicely to my uberdom self and appreciating him in that unique way a woman who appreciates acquience can.

quote:

If there is a quality that I can't hide, then there is always that delicious possibility that someone will leverage my own nature and assume control.


And what a delicious possibility it is ;)

_____________________________

quote:

"To learn the art of submission a slave must first give up the desires that drew him to submission in the first place." Mistress Jasmyn Jan 2005.


Visit My Website


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Profile   Post #: 23
RE: Do Dominant Women recognize a submissive male when ... - 4/6/2006 10:27:31 AM   
thetammyjo


Posts: 6322
Joined: 9/8/2005
Status: offline 		Not in a vanilla situation but when Fox entered the local BDSM community where we live everyone else who met him thought he was a top. They even told me "He knows so much about bondage, TammyJo, and he's so nice. He's one of the few decent top men around here. We need to make sure to get him involved."

Now I was taking German at nights that year so I didn't meet him for a few events.

When I did meet him, I just knew, I'm not sure how, but I knew, this young man was not a top.

On the other hand I did sort of convince him that he's a switch -- he can act as a top in bondage scenarios and he's very skilled at mummification and rope bondage. He is not a dominant though in any way.

_____________________________

Love, Peace, Hugs, Kisses, Whips & Chains,

TammyJo

Check out my website at http://www.thetammyjo.com Or www.tammyjoeckhart.com

And my LJ where I post fiction in progress if you "friend" me at http://thetammyjo.livejournal.com/

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Profile   Post #: 24
RE: Submission and Confidence - 4/6/2006 10:32:53 AM   
thetammyjo


Posts: 6322
Joined: 9/8/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: subapplicant

And isn't more enjoyable for the Dominant to "tame" a strong, confident man?



What I define as submissive has nothing to do with being weak or lacking confidence.

When I've notice submissive men they are always confident and well-spoken. The others may well be "submissive" but they do not attract my attention.

But then again, I don't look for submissives so much as potential slaves and then friends. Both sets best be intelligent, well-spoken, confident, have a strong moral/ethical code, and feel self-assured in their sexual interests otherwise they will not last long as either my friend or my slave.

_____________________________

Love, Peace, Hugs, Kisses, Whips & Chains,

TammyJo

Check out my website at http://www.thetammyjo.com Or www.tammyjoeckhart.com

And my LJ where I post fiction in progress if you "friend" me at http://thetammyjo.livejournal.com/

(in reply to subapplicant)
Profile   Post #: 25
For knl4myplz - 4/6/2006 11:33:40 AM   
subapplicant


Posts: 68
Joined: 9/19/2005
Status: offline 		Thank You so much. What a wonderful reply.

I think you have added a wonderful new fantasy image for me (and i always want my fantasies to turn into realities). The idea that a woman in a vanilla situation would take me gently (roughly) by the neck and pull me in closer. What a great rush that would provide - i can feel myself instantly melting just at the the thought...

I also agree that a lot of it has to do with non-verbal cues. The look in the eyes always give it away. Either a soft imploring look - or a strained point to definitely not look her in the eyes. I find that with woman I am most attracted to I tend not to "stare". There is just something that tells me that looking would be inappropriate, that staring would not be welcomed...

Hmmm. Perhaps I do have a bit of "Dominant Woman" radar myself...

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Profile   Post #: 26
RE: For knl4myplz - 4/6/2006 12:12:32 PM   
talltxsub


Posts: 173
Joined: 11/10/2005
Status: offline 		There are other situations that come up in a work context, such as when the female superior (on the org chart) places the male subordinate in a position of being physically subordinate to her, for example by taking his arm to lead him to meet someone, or having him seated while she leans on her desk over him.

The politics of the situation aside, as well as potential legal complications, those are the types of situations in which I have wished the relationship could move beyond the work relationship, though it is very unlikely.

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Profile   Post #: 27
RE: Do Dominant Women recognize a submissive male when ... - 4/6/2006 12:47:42 PM   
Your Queen


Posts: 25
Joined: 1/10/2006
Status: offline
quote:

I've heard it said that some Dominant Women can recognize a submissive when they meet him, even in a vanilla situation,


In a heartbeat, in the same way I can "sense" that my offspring are unhappy from 3000 miles away.
Some call it womans intuition, but I don't think it's mystic, I think it's our inherent skill to read and interpret body language and emotion. That isn't to say we always get it right, all humans make mistakes.

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Profile   Post #: 28
RE: Do Dominant Women recognize a submissive male when ... - 4/6/2006 1:27:24 PM   
Lashra


Posts: 4900
Joined: 2/9/2006
Status: offline 		Sometimes yes its very obvious just as it is with female submissives. Body language has a whole lot to do with it.

~Lashra

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Profile   Post #: 29
RE: Do Dominant Women recognize a submissive male when ... - 4/6/2006 1:32:20 PM   
subapplicant


Posts: 68
Joined: 9/19/2005
Status: offline 		Thank You, Lashra.

I wonder - does how they talk also play a part? If they are quick to agree with you, or to beat themselves for their mistakes, or to quickly apologize - does that reinforce the impression?

How does a man responding verbally provide the signal?

(in reply to Lashra)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: Do Dominant Women recognize a submissive male when ... - 4/6/2006 3:27:32 PM   
GoddessDustyGold


Posts: 2822
Joined: 4/11/2004
From: Arizona
Status: offline 		For Myself, I would say that a sub boy who is too quick to agree with everything and everyone, especially when he turns it into his own platform to share his particular fantasies or explicit experiences, turns Me off.  I see that a lot lately.
It doesn't represent submission to Me, as much as it shows a creative way to get wanking material or a real time hook-up.
 

_____________________________

Dusty
They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety
B Franklin
Don't blame Me ~ I didn't vote for either of them
The Hidden Kingdom


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Profile   Post #: 31
RE: Do Dominant Women recognize a submissive male when ... - 4/6/2006 5:38:08 PM   
Aimtoplease101


Posts: 319
Joined: 2/8/2006
From: San Diego, California
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SuzanneSxySadist

Women (or men with a feminine essence) in general are more intuitive than the masculine is, and can read energy and signals that others would not pick up on. 

For me the first clue is how they carry themselves. Do they have a tendancy to meet your eyes when they talk to you or do they look away.  Confident men will more often meet someone's gaze when they talk to them and you can tell a lot about someone by the way they hold their eyes. :)

There are lots of other slient signals as well but drool on my leather thigh high boots is a pretty strong indicator.   <lol> 


There's an implict assumption here that submissives are not confident.  I don't think that holds true.  Personally, I think it is disrepectful to fail to look someone in the eye when you are speaking with them.

Now, it might be different if the domme has told the sub to keep his eyes fixed on her feet or something ...

Regards,
ATP

_____________________________

Pleasing you pleases me.

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Profile   Post #: 32
RE: Do Dominant Women recognize a submissive male when ... - 4/6/2006 5:42:53 PM   
Aimtoplease101


Posts: 319
Joined: 2/8/2006
From: San Diego, California
Status: offline

Yes, I have frequently just "known" when someone is sub.  If I want confirmation I will do subtle things, such as make direct and forceful eye contact - I'm not looking for him to break first exactly, its something indefinable in the expression for Me.  I will also invade his body space or step into him, especially if I can maneuver him in front of a solid object or wall...I may place My foot between his...his responses (leaning away, intake of breath, breathing in the scent of My hair or perfume, closing his eyes) give the confirmation I'm seeking. 

[/quote]

I'm curious-- how does the reaction of a submissive man differ from a non-submissive man when you do these things?

Regards,
ATP


_____________________________

Pleasing you pleases me.

(in reply to knl4myplzr)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: Do Dominant Women recognize a submissive male when ... - 4/6/2006 6:48:16 PM   
SimplyV


Posts: 351
Joined: 11/5/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: subapplicant

I've heard it said that some Dominant Women can recognize a submissive when they meet him, even in a vanilla situation, even if the man doesn't know she is a Dominant, and even if he is acting "normally". In other words, submissive give out a signal of "whip me, beat me, fuck me" even without trying.

Is this true? Do Dominant Woman see a man and go "yeah, he's probably a bottom." Is there an impression that you make instantly, and that is often confirmed?

Have you ever met a guy in a vanilla situation, recognized a certain quality, and attempted to push his buttons? Is there a "risk-free" strategy that is employed to determine if your guess can be confirmed?


This is a bit tongue in cheek, but it is how things have worked out.

I can't say that they've had 'signs'.. but generally speaking with a couple exceptions..  I know a guy is submissive by one thing.

He's genuinely attracted to me.

Whether he intended on being submissive to me or not, that is how it ends up. Whether he's part of the lifestyle or not, vanilla or not, whatever.. generally if he's attracted to me or attempting to persue a sexual relationship with me, he is or will end up submissive to me.

There are a few exceptions and those ended up being my "masters".. but it is rare.

quote:

ORIGINAL: subapplicant
One Dominant Woman told me that she knew from the first moment she met me that I was a submissive, even though I didn't make my interests known at the start. I have often wondered - did she really recognize this quality, or did she say that to push my buttons and to make my submission "inevitable" to Her?


yes she probably did sense this quality and yes she probably knew which buttons to push in you to enhance it.

(in reply to subapplicant)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: Do Dominant Women recognize a submissive male when ... - 4/6/2006 7:15:11 PM   
MistressSassy66


Posts: 1675
Joined: 11/5/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyMorgynn

oh yeah. not all of 'em of course, but some are practically wearing a neon sign.




LOL...Yes they do....lol

My best friends hubby is submissive,I said to her you know this right,She went home and found out for sure.A few days later she called Me up and said How did you know...lol

_____________________________

Mistress Sassy

http://www.mistresssassy.com

In the Immortal Words of Bob....Fuck the dumb shit.

"I love you not only for what you are,But for what I am when I'm with you."- Opening line from a poem by Roy Croft

(in reply to LadyMorgynn)
Profile   Post #: 35
RE: Do Dominant Women recognize a submissive male when ... - 4/6/2006 11:33:31 PM   
beneathfeet


Posts: 28
Joined: 1/21/2005
From: East Stroudsburg PA, USA
Status: offline 		i just wanted to say congratulations on a superb question. 

Every glimpse into the thoughts and viewpoints of a Dominant Woman is a chance to learn how to be a better submissive.  Needless to say i have learned much from reading the responses, perhaps even been enthralled by some.




_____________________________

**********************************
While i have fought for the liberty of others...
my heart beats beneath the feet of a Woman!

Semper Stomped
-jay-
**********************************

(in reply to MistressSassy66)
Profile   Post #: 36
RE: Do Dominant Women recognize a submissive male when ... - 4/7/2006 4:27:14 AM   
MysticalPhoenix


Posts: 212
Joined: 11/30/2005
From: Kelloggsville, Vanilla County MI
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: subapplicant

Have you ever met a guy in a vanilla situation, recognized a certain quality, and attempted to push his buttons? Is there a "risk-free" strategy that is employed to determine if your guess can be confirmed?

One Dominant Woman told me that she knew from the first moment she met me that I was a submissive, even though I didn't make my interests known at the start. I have often wondered - did she really recognize this quality, or did she say that to push my buttons and to make my submission "inevitable" to Her?



I've recognized a lot of males as being submissive.  Not necessarily in the sense of BDSM.  I work for someone like that, and yes, I do sometimes push his buttons by calling him my boy, and threatening him with 30 minutes in the playroom when he annoys me. He occasionally provokes me to get me to smack him. We think it's funny.

In vanilla social situations, I don't flirt with or attempt to push the buttons of submissive-seeming men.  There usually isn't a chance.as the more aggressive or dominant-seeming men are busy trying to score. 

Although, if I was somewhere and saw the OP, I might just plow through the HOG's (Horny Offline Guys) to push his buttons-he's gorgeous.

Phoenix


_____________________________

---------------------------------------------------------
Every one sees what you appear to be, few really know what you are.

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Profile   Post #: 37
RE: Do Dominant Women recognize a submissive male when ... - 4/7/2006 5:25:16 AM   
knl4myplzr


Posts: 13
Joined: 1/9/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: knl4myplz


Yes, I have frequently just "known" when someone is sub.  If I want confirmation I will do subtle things, such as make direct and forceful eye contact - I'm not looking for him to break first exactly, its something indefinable in the expression for Me.  I will also invade his body space or step into him, especially if I can maneuver him in front of a solid object or wall...I may place My foot between his...his responses (leaning away, intake of breath, breathing in the scent of My hair or perfume, closing his eyes) give the confirmation I'm seeking. 



quote:

ORIGINAL: Aimtoplease101

I'm curious-- how does the reaction of a submissive man differ from a non-submissive man when you do these things?

Regards,
ATP



Its hard to explain - this is not all that I do when I want to know, but just what I can think of that I could EXPLAIN that I do...make sense...?  The not too "just because I KNOW" part. 

So, HERE'S a real-life example!  There's a guy that friends and I know that we see out in a certain club/bar now and again.  I don't talk to him much (its loud) but something tweaked My "hmmm...I wonder" button, lol.  So, I wore some slightly fetishy shoes (we're not talking very obvious here - just really high heels, that sort of thing)...and a couple of guys had come up to compliment Me on them during the evening...as he sat on a bar stool in a corner...I placed My foot just on the little triangle of seat left between his thighs so that he could "admire" them - IF he wasn't interested or didn't pick up the hint he could have just smiled and looked (most men are not bothered by an attractive woman moving into their space)...but he used it as an excuse to pick up the foot and shoe ostensibly to examine more closely, but when he placed it down again the heel was much closer to his groin.  He just barely moved forward, as if to grab a beer or something behind Me...and pressed quite hard into the spike heel.  I picked up the cue and pressed forward harder...what an expression.  Nice!

Anyway, OBVIOUSLY that's a bit more agressive than usual, I don't run about putting My feet in guys groins or anything, but its the example I could think of - see, he had an opportunity to move away or just do the obvious, he responded to the gesture, the inquiry.  We (a friend and I) are bringing him to the house next weekend to play with - since then we've been more openly asking/teasing him about it and he's very interested.  :)

Hope that answers your question Aimtoplease101!

(in reply to Aimtoplease101)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: Do Dominant Women recognize a submissive male when ... - 4/7/2006 6:02:06 AM   
DiannaVesta


Posts: 1087
Joined: 2/6/2006
From: Mid-Atlantic area
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Jasmyn

On one hand I view any man has the potential to submit and so on that level yes I could/would employ tactics to push buttons and make their submission to me inevitable.  And on the other because of the way I am, act, etc it's plausible that any man attracted to me has submissive intent. 

But in answer to your question yes I have noticed a submissive quality in guys and acted upon it because I saw it.




I agree with this. A man may not be submissive per se but I will study him and find that spark to ignite fully. Sometimes I can sense something and want to explore it. Then there are men who are more submissive then others.  


_____________________________



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Profile   Post #: 39
RE: Do Dominant Women recognize a submissive male when ... - 4/7/2006 11:42:30 PM   
UtopianRanger


Posts: 3251
Status: offline
quote:

For Myself, I would say that a sub boy who is too quick to agree with everything and everyone, especially when he turns it into his own platform to share his particular fantasies or explicit experiences, turns Me off. I see that a lot lately.
It doesn't represent submission to Me, as much as it shows a creative way to get wanking material or a real time hook-up.


Gotta love your street smarts *Wink* - No good woman worth her salt likes a phony ass-kisser. It's kinda funny when you watch someone's demeanor/opinions change when the wind shifts direction.


 - R


_____________________________

"If you are going to win any battle, you have to do one thing. You have to make the mind run the body. Never let the body tell the mind what to do... the body is never tired if the mind is not tired."

-General George S. Patton


(in reply to GoddessDustyGold)
Profile   Post #: 40
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