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RE: Do submissives prefer the "bad boy" type? - 5/13/2010 6:10:44 AM   
lally2


Posts: 2621
Joined: 4/16/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MysticMaster2u

From many of the comments I read in profiles, it seems submissives receive rude, arrogant, insulting, presumptuous, and disrespectful responses from some Doms.  Aside from the those who enjoy humiliation, do you think this type of attitude and approach is effective?  Do submissives think that in order for someone to be Dominant, they also have to be abusive, unmannerly, uncaring, selfish, and possess a four letter word vocabulary?  It seems to me that on some level this type of approach must be working or Doms wouldn't keep using it.  Your thoughts... please and thank you.


when you read those sub profiles theres usually a comment along the lines of 'dont write to me if youre a rude, arrogant arsewipe' - so i wouldnt say that the approach that some of these people adopt is working particularly.  generally it just puts peoples backs up.

it amazes me really - how does anyone imagine that the rude arrogant approach is going to get them anywhere.  i think its more a case of people not fully comprehending what a Dominant is all about and assuming that to be rude, arrogant and presumptious is what subs expect or want from prospective partners.  to me it just suggests a total incomprehension of what Ds or Ms is all about.

then again, once in a while you get a new D type on here asking if being polite and pleasant is the way forward because theyre all too often accused of being 'too nice' - so the problem comes from both sides of the kneel.  there are subs out there who wouldnt know what to do with a polite, respectful man and automatically assume they cant be Dominant if theyre being pleasant and wanting to pass the time of day with a bit of casual chit chat.

_____________________________

So all I have to do in order to serve him, is to work out exactly how improbable he is, feed that figure into the finite improbability generator, give him a fresh cup of really hot tea ... and turn him on!

(in reply to MysticMaster2u)
Profile   Post #: 41
RE: Do submissives prefer the "bad boy" type? - 5/13/2010 2:22:27 PM   
porcelaine


Posts: 5020
Joined: 7/24/2006
Status: offline 		lally,

Here's the problem. Your polite may be my offense. It's really hard to generalize what behaviors are acceptable. All that anyone can say with some measure of certainty is what appeals/repulses them. I've encountered behaviors that I found offensive or indicative of poor breeding. Yet someone else might be oblivious or view them with amusement. Neither are right or wrong, but merely reflections of our own personal preferences.

And what is a dominant all about? In some respects that comment can be taken in several directions. For the most part we have some consensus about the traits we feel should be present in one who assumes that role, but when you get down to the nitty gritty, it's probable my idea of dominance bears little resemblances to someone else's. Nor should it in my opinion.

It takes all types to make the world go round. What we deem unsuitable may be the perfect compliment someone else is seeking. I don't believe these supposedly offensive persons are always happening upon submissive women that find their behavior inappropriate. Their continued presence and measure of success (on some level) of cultivating an exchange gives some suggestion that someone (albeit no one I know) finds favor and thoroughly enjoys their "brand" of dominance.

~porcelaine


_____________________________

His will; my fate.

(in reply to lally2)
Profile   Post #: 42
RE: Do submissives prefer the "bad boy" type? - 5/14/2010 12:56:41 AM   
lally2


Posts: 2621
Joined: 4/16/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: porcelaine

lally,

Here's the problem. Your polite may be my offense. It's really hard to generalize what behaviors are acceptable. All that anyone can say with some measure of certainty is what appeals/repulses them. I've encountered behaviors that I found offensive or indicative of poor breeding. Yet someone else might be oblivious or view them with amusement. Neither are right or wrong, but merely reflections of our own personal preferences.

And what is a dominant all about? In some respects that comment can be taken in several directions. For the most part we have some consensus about the traits we feel should be present in one who assumes that role, but when you get down to the nitty gritty, it's probable my idea of dominance bears little resemblances to someone else's. Nor should it in my opinion.

It takes all types to make the world go round. What we deem unsuitable may be the perfect compliment someone else is seeking. I don't believe these supposedly offensive persons are always happening upon submissive women that find their behavior inappropriate. Their continued presence and measure of success (on some level) of cultivating an exchange gives some suggestion that someone (albeit no one I know) finds favor and thoroughly enjoys their "brand" of dominance.

~porcelaine



i agree with all of that - but heres the thing for me i guess.

invariably that approach is indicative of a person who has very little grasp of what a sub is about and how a sub is wired.

in my very early twenties i ended up with a guy whose approach was entirely cavalier and irresponsible.  he did not know how to handle or bring out the best in a submissive type.  he recognised the sub trait in me and took total advantage of it.

so what is a dominant.  in my view its a person who enjoys the submissive personality and takes responsibility for his needs as well as hers.  the trouble with the types we're talking about here is that they tend to only be focused on what they want and need and have not taken the trouble to understand the submissive wiring, personality and needs within that sub.

so when some guy writes to me for the first time and comes up with some fantasy la la BS i know deep down that this guy hasnt got a single clue what he's doing or who he is talking to.  from experience, believe me, when i first started doing this on the net i had my fair share of these clowns, i even went down the track a bit with one or two.  ive been there, done it and had the sharp learning curves to prove it.  99% of the time they are idiots who havent got a clue what a submissive is all about and they dont want to know either.  its all about them and thats all fine in fantasy realm behind a screen.  in real life it just doesnt pan out and can end up causing a great deal of damage

_____________________________

So all I have to do in order to serve him, is to work out exactly how improbable he is, feed that figure into the finite improbability generator, give him a fresh cup of really hot tea ... and turn him on!

(in reply to porcelaine)
Profile   Post #: 43
RE: Do submissives prefer the "bad boy" type? - 5/16/2010 4:03:40 PM   
January


Posts: 891
Joined: 4/17/2004
Status: offline 		Some subs do have a desire for a powerful bad boy to run rough-shod over them. Some Dominant males dream of ordering around a groveling, naked woman. I suspect most of the time it's a fantasy, though.

A Dom who wants to be abusive in a real relationship should start out acting like an asshole with a potential sub. That way he can avoid interacting with those whole, happy and healthy kinky women.

January



_____________________________

[link: http://www.bookstrand.com/miss-you-sir] Miss You, Sir by January Rowe is available from Siren now! It's my latest smokin' hot bdsm romance.[/link]




(in reply to MysticMaster2u)
Profile   Post #: 44
RE: Do submissives prefer the "bad boy" type? - 5/16/2010 4:04:57 PM   
laurell3


Posts: 6577
Joined: 5/5/2005
Status: offline 		Having a naked, groveling sub/slave is "abusive"? REALLY?

_____________________________

I cannot be defined by moments in my life, but must be considered for by the entirety of my existence.

When you fail to consider that I am the best judge for what is right for me, all of your opinions become suspect to me.

(in reply to January)
Profile   Post #: 45
RE: Do submissives prefer the "bad boy" type? - 5/16/2010 4:07:15 PM   
rajaa


Posts: 34
Joined: 9/21/2005
From: edmonton, alberta
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: laurell3

Having a naked, groveling sub/slave is "abusive"? REALLY?




ABUSE ME PLEASE!!!!! heheheh

(in reply to laurell3)
Profile   Post #: 46
RE: Do submissives prefer the "bad boy" type? - 5/16/2010 4:13:48 PM   
January


Posts: 891
Joined: 4/17/2004
Status: offline 		You're missing the point, honey.

_____________________________

[link: http://www.bookstrand.com/miss-you-sir] Miss You, Sir by January Rowe is available from Siren now! It's my latest smokin' hot bdsm romance.[/link]




(in reply to laurell3)
Profile   Post #: 47
RE: Do submissives prefer the "bad boy" type? - 5/16/2010 4:20:54 PM   
laurell3


Posts: 6577
Joined: 5/5/2005
Status: offline 		I think maybe you are....what is "abusive"? It's not really a word to throw around here.

_____________________________

I cannot be defined by moments in my life, but must be considered for by the entirety of my existence.

When you fail to consider that I am the best judge for what is right for me, all of your opinions become suspect to me.

(in reply to January)
Profile   Post #: 48
RE: Do submissives prefer the "bad boy" type? - 5/16/2010 4:31:08 PM   
January


Posts: 891
Joined: 4/17/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: laurell3
Having a naked, groveling sub/slave is "abusive"? REALLY?


Not sure how you got that from my post, 3.

To paraphrase: snarky, mocking comments to posts are rarely a good source of friendship.

Screaming, unasked for remarks like yours usually indicate a lack in self-control and/or courtesy, or perhaps just a poor grasp of the written language. Too bad.

January



_____________________________

[link: http://www.bookstrand.com/miss-you-sir] Miss You, Sir by January Rowe is available from Siren now! It's my latest smokin' hot bdsm romance.[/link]




(in reply to laurell3)
Profile   Post #: 49
RE: Do submissives prefer the "bad boy" type? - 5/16/2010 4:38:43 PM   
January


Posts: 891
Joined: 4/17/2004
Status: offline
quote:

what is "abusive"?


The definition of abuse is not the subject of this thread. I certainly didn't define it.

Before you even think of telling me which words I can and cannot use on this forum, read the OP's question. Then read my response.

Your apology will be accepted.

January

_____________________________

[link: http://www.bookstrand.com/miss-you-sir] Miss You, Sir by January Rowe is available from Siren now! It's my latest smokin' hot bdsm romance.[/link]




(in reply to laurell3)
Profile   Post #: 50
RE: Do submissives prefer the "bad boy" type? - 5/16/2010 5:20:26 PM   
laurell3


Posts: 6577
Joined: 5/5/2005
Status: offline 		Wow overract much? I screamed? Where is that? Your attempt to toss out childish insults and bait me isn't paticularly friendship worthy and yes, posters do comment on others posts here, it's called discussion. Stereotypical IAMDOMHEARMEROAR emails are idiotic and certainly not going to generate much of a positive response it seems from the majority of responses here, but it's rare to hear them called "abusive". I again ask you, as you pointed out that you didn't define it, what is "abusive" in the context of your post?

_____________________________

I cannot be defined by moments in my life, but must be considered for by the entirety of my existence.

When you fail to consider that I am the best judge for what is right for me, all of your opinions become suspect to me.

(in reply to January)
Profile   Post #: 51
RE: Do submissives prefer the "bad boy" type? - 5/17/2010 10:38:37 AM   
startoverslave


Posts: 14
Joined: 12/15/2009
Status: offline 		  In an interaction between a potential Dom and myself I look for the  in personality and his ability to ability to demonstrate this contrast.  These are the emails and talks that intruige me to no end.

(in reply to bondmaid123)
Profile   Post #: 52
RE: Do submissives prefer the "bad boy" type? - 5/17/2010 11:44:40 AM   
porcelaine


Posts: 5020
Joined: 7/24/2006
Status: offline 		lally,

quote:

so what is a dominant.  in my view its a person who enjoys the submissive personality and takes responsibility for his needs as well as hers.


I don't discount the validity of what you've said at all. I believe in calling a spade what it is. Due to the fact that I've mentored quite extensively in the past, it's important that I see things from varying perspectives. I realize that everyone approaches this path from a different place. Although I can see the things you're pointing out, if the submissive hasn't reached that level of maturity it could fly right over her head. There's also the other side of the coin that we're not touching on. The very thing you or I find inappropriate appeals to the other person because they possess specific ideas/behaviors that make his 'behavior' acceptable. You really can't have one without the other. That's the difference between indulging and simply saying not for me.

quote:

so when some guy writes to me for the first time and comes up with some fantasy la la BS i know deep down that this guy hasnt got a single clue what he's doing or who he is talking to.


In my less than surrendered mindset I was guilty of making those same assertions. But truth has many shades of gray and I'm always filtering it through my ideologies and experiences. I could be spot on or way off base and I'm not oblivious to it. What I can say is that his approach may not be in step with mine. We're not compatible and if I partnered with him I would not be happy doing so. I could turn those things around and apply them to the people I've conversed with that wouldn't fit your description. Now what? The same holds true. In terms of my slavery and what works best for me, they're not a suitable choice. However, they could be precisely what another girl with different motivations is seeking.

quote:

99% of the time they are idiots who havent got a clue what a submissive is all about and they dont want to know either.


My slavery is founded on the principles of accountability and brutal self truth. As bad as situations of that nature can be - and  I've had my share of stumbles - I played a part in all of it. Acknowledging my willingness to do things that didn't pan out as planned is important in rectifying behaviors that are not for my betterment. I have a hard time pointing the finger too sharply or making him the bad guy. They say it takes two and these people didn't get involved with themselves. I willingly joined the party and choices have consequences. The fallacy about his ability to cause damage is an inability to admit the girl possessed some measure of damage going in. Otherwise she'd have made a different decision.

~porcelaine


_____________________________

His will; my fate.

(in reply to lally2)
Profile   Post #: 53
RE: Do submissives prefer the "bad boy" type? - 5/25/2010 8:50:14 PM   
VonTeese


Posts: 7
Joined: 5/25/2010
From: Jamaica
Status: offline 		One being in control has nothing to do with one needing to be forceful or aggressive. Men who do that are the ones who are probably new to the life style and they think being a master is like what is seen on tv where you bark orders and the slave and whip em non stop and other such things. Although there are many different types of slaves/masters it seems like a bad idea to be treating someone you don't know like that. If the person is a torture slave or enjoys that kind of stuff fine. However I think you ought to at least try to know em a bit before you choose your method of approach to em after all that's why profiles and all the questions on the profiles were invented for....

_____________________________

You can't hide what's really there.... It will some out sooner or later than you think....

(in reply to DesFIP)
Profile   Post #: 54
RE: Do submissives prefer the "bad boy" type? - 5/26/2010 7:23:27 PM   
CaringandReal


Posts: 1397
Joined: 2/15/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MarcEsadrian

Pontifications about online mirages aside, I tend to suspect this is part of what's wrong with a lot of the irksome "dominance" I've seen over the years off-line (in men in particular)—the locus of which resides more in their thinking than in the desires of their female counterparts. Most submissive females I've known have molded their ideals based upon a more refined and sophisticated male archetype that is discriminating and a pinch unsettlingly—but intriguingly—cold. A certain combination of dark intelligence and even arrogance perhaps, but one that isn't crass and artless.



Or, to put it another way, many submissive women read or have read romance novels or those romance novels trying to pass as another genre (usually horror) to get past the prejudice against romance novels. If you want to learn how to pick up subs, get a popular vampire novel or two from the grocery store rack and study up!

You're right, of course. Am I mistaken in thinking there's a slight implication here that men who want to succed with submissives should assume these personality traits the way one dons a costume before going onstage? I see a lot of men on collarme trying to act this archetype, particularly in their profile presentations. And because it's an act (or perhaps because they're not good actors) the whole thing comes across as studied and fake. That's abhorent in it's own sweet little way.

Assuming dominants are reading this thread for advice: if such traits such as those described above haven't been a part your natural personality for years, don't try to fake them. You will be seen through by anybody worth having. Go for another archetype. There are plenty of attractive ones that might be more central to your core: Daddy Dom, for instance.

I've known one extremely intelligent man who was a bad boy (violent, predatory, misogynistic, rape-minded) at heart and due to his intelliget way of expressing that side of himself, was a sub magnet, no a chick-magnet. Vanilla women were equally fascinated by him, although he rarely dated them because they couldn't deal with his reality.

I've also known an almost superhumanly intelligent daddy type and a very brilliant, cold, aristrocratic type. All three were successes as dominants, I think, because these archetypes weren't acts for them, they were very close to who they actually were inside and because their brains lent the archetype they personified considerable substance, reality, interest, and, most importantly, seductiveness. Thinking of those three, I can't say there is one of these archetypes I prefer relating to above the others, but I do know I am really turned off when any of these is done stupidly and falsely, as they so often are in the collarme personals.

_____________________________

"A friend who bleeds is better" --placebo

"How seldom we recognize the sound when the bolt of our fate slides home." --thomas harris

(in reply to VonTeese)
Profile   Post #: 55
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