RE: Do any of you Dominants have a desire to make your submissive more dominant?

RE: Do any of you Dominants have a desire to make your submissive more dominant? (Full Version)

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SocratesNot -> RE: Do any of you Dominants have a desire to make your submissive more dominant? (5/22/2010 7:43:38 AM)
quote: All these poor little submissive types, thank goodness we have dominants to fix us up and make us better people, we would be fucked without them You see, I already achieved therapeutic effect on you. The very sentence you just typed sounds very assertive and dominant!

LillyoftheVally -> RE: Do any of you Dominants have a desire to make your submissive more dominant? (5/22/2010 7:43:45 AM)
[8D] - to Jeff, not to the knicker twister above

lally2 -> RE: Do any of you Dominants have a desire to make your submissive more dominant? (5/22/2010 7:48:08 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: leadership527 quote: ORIGINAL: jbcurious Get it through your head.... that in my submission is where I feel value, not in my ability to take charge. Don't worry jb... I'm sure we can fix that for you. can you fix me too, can you, pleeaase! - do a job lot - all us weak, lowly, messed up subs can be freed from the torment of getting sick pleasure from pleasing our partners. no more spankings, no more amazing orgasms - oh wait ......................[&:] (shuffles off - doomed to be wrongly treated forever)) (sigh)

SocratesNot -> RE: Do any of you Dominants have a desire to make your submissive more dominant? (5/22/2010 7:55:18 AM)
quote: can you fix me too, can you, pleeaase! - do a job lot - all us weak, lowly, messed up subs can be freed from the torment of getting sick pleasure from pleasing our partners. no more spankings, no more amazing orgasms - oh wait ...................... I would NEVER try to fix your "sick pleasure" and amazing orgasms you derive from being spanked and pleasing your partner. Actually I would provide such pleasure to you. The only thing I would ever try to fix is a lack of assertiveness in real life situations. If I felt that my sub acted as a doormat in real life vanilla encounters with other people, this would be the only thing that I would try to fix. Though I am not sure if my methods would always work, but if they don't I would experiment with different approaches.

SocratesNot -> RE: Do any of you Dominants have a desire to make your submissive more dominant? (5/22/2010 8:00:50 AM)
BTW I would never be very attracted to someone with submissive personality. If they act as doormats to everyone, what is then so exciting about them being submissive to me? I would be only attracted to strong individuals who know how to stand up for themselves, who just happen to be submissive to me. If they happen to be lacking some of these "survival skills" (which includes taking charge, being assertive, etc) which are needed in human society, but I am still attracted to them for some other reason, that would be the only thing that I would ever try to fix.

leadership527 -> RE: Do any of you Dominants have a desire to make your submissive more dominant? (5/22/2010 8:02:30 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SocratesNot Yes I 've read it, and responded to it. Yes you did... and despite having fairly decent answers, you learned nothing. quote: I think that most of you her underestimate the number of people who really have issues with depression, self esteem, self image etc. Most of them never try BDSM at all. But also, there are probably many submissives who are recruited from these groups of people. And NONE of them would ever be in a relationship with me. Honestly, I got over the wet-puppy phase somewhere in high school or early college. I'm looking for strong, healthy, vibrant partners. Yes, we call carry our fair share of baggage, but I don't want a project, I want a life partner. Why on god's green earth would you want anything different? quote: My intent was not to offend anyone at all. My intent was only to suggest that it might be a good thing to help someone with such issues if she happens to be your submissive. I totally agree. I very much help Carol with various problems because... you know... I love her. Yet you DID offend because you made ridiculous assertions. Honestly, people would be mocking you much less on these boards if you asked more questions and stopped debating the answers you got in favor of seeking to understand them. For the most part, the people who are responding to your posts have vastly more life experience than you do and infinitely more experience with BDSM than you do. Why do you seek to debate what you are told? quote: Most of people who are depressed aren't even aware of this fact. Most of them who are aware, would never admit it, because they don't want to be considered mentally ill. There is much more negativity hidden behind "all are happy, all is good" situation which is manifested on the surface. My friend and I conducted a research on depression in high school and we concluded that it might be the case that maybe even 30-40% of young people are depressed . Again, that's all nifty, but healthy people do not seek unhealthy partners. I honestly do not care if 40% of people are depressed and 99% of subs are depressed. I don't care because 100% of the people I marry will not be. quote: As a dominant I would try to heal these wounds in my sub if they were present. I would try to lead her to develop a stronger personality on her own. I wouldn't direct her much at all. I would try to unleash her own natural strength that was probably been repressed for years by strict parents, bullies at school, or abusive partners. All very wise... but I certainly wouldn't consider the personality you're describing as a "sub". I'd consider it a "beaten down mess of a human being". But as a suggestion, if you want to get involved in mental health counselling, then you really should just do it. That will require a masters or better in psych along with some certifications depending on exactly what field you're going into (varies state by state). You would be doing people a much better service by doing so. As a general rule, it is ill advised to mix into serious problems in people you cannot be objective to even if you DO have such training.

lally2 -> RE: Do any of you Dominants have a desire to make your submissive more dominant? (5/22/2010 8:17:25 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SocratesNot BTW I would never be very attracted to someone with submissive personality. If they act as doormats to everyone, what is then so exciting about them being submissive to me? I would be only attracted to strong individuals who know how to stand up for themselves, who just happen to be submissive to me. . ........ and youve just described a large proportion of the submissives who have written to you on this thread, myself included. many subs are only submissive to their Dominant and are strong, capable, resourceful people the rest of the time. for many Dominants the pleasure is in having a strong, capable, resourceful woman (or man) submit to them because of who they are and what they represent to that submissive.

leadership527 -> RE: Do any of you Dominants have a desire to make your submissive more dominant? (5/22/2010 8:19:54 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SocratesNot BTW I would never be very attracted to someone with submissive personality. If they act as doormats to everyone, what is then so exciting about them being submissive to me? Well, I can try to answer that. Will you try to understand the answer? Not all of us do this because it is "exciting". I like submissive personalities because I am a dominant personality so we fit together nicely in a yin-yang sort of way. I'm not seeking to be excited by dominating Carol. Owning her does not get me all hot and bothered. I'm not seeking to validate my dominance by it. I'm not really seeking anything other than another human who fits me well. Between us, it's all rather boring, mundane, and normal -- all except for the vast love we share for each other which, predictably, produces a large amount of happiness. I can tell you that my own personal preference in submissives is that they actually have a submissive personality. Much as I really like and admire a variety of the subs on these boards, I would not want them to be my submissive. Several I'd take for a life partner, but not as a submissive. For me, there is a breath-taking simplicity with Carol because for her, the act of submitting is pretty much entirely automatic. There is seldom ever any struggle or resistance and when there is, it's in places where I routinely see other subs and even slaves say, "oh hell no!" As an analogy, consider it like the difference between driving a 4x4 off-road and enjoying the challenges of that versus driving a fine sports car through sweeping mountain curves and enjoying how smoothly and easily it responds. Some people like one thing, some the other. Neither is inherently better or worse. I also enjoy the fact that because Carol has very little resistance of her own, that makes ME the limiting factor in the equation. How trustworthy can I be? How honorable can I be? The higher the bar I can jump over, the more thoroughly I can own her. Like a lot of type A personalities, I like challenging myself and I like growth (even though it generally sucks to actually do the growing part laughs). I very much enjoy scaring the crap out of myself with additional levels of responsibility then seeking to rise to that challenge. And Carol provides a pretty much limitless challenge on her side. I hope that shed some insight on why ONE person would like owning a doormat.

VaguelyCurious -> RE: Do any of you Dominants have a desire to make your submissive more dominant? (5/22/2010 8:21:12 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SocratesNot quote: All these poor little submissive types, thank goodness we have dominants to fix us up and make us better people, we would be fucked without them You see, I already achieved therapeutic effect on you. The very sentence you just typed sounds very assertive and dominant! [sm=rofl.gif][sm=rofl.gif] Fella, I've met this girl. She's plenty assertive aaaaaall by herself. Although I do know how to shut her up...:P

VaguelyCurious -> RE: Do any of you Dominants have a desire to make your submissive more dominant? (5/22/2010 8:31:54 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SocratesNot I think that most of you her underestimate the number of people who really have issues with depression, self esteem, self image etc. No, we don't. We just don't see that submissives suffer more than any other social grouping. Are there subs with issues? For sure. Are those subs a higher proportion of subs than those in the general population with issues? Not as far as I can see. quote: My intent was only to suggest that it might be a good thing to help someone with such issues if she happens to be your submissive... ...As a dominant I would try to heal these wounds in my sub if they were present. I would try to lead her to develop a stronger personality on her own. I wouldn't direct her much at all. Somebody above said that you can't provide therapy to a person you are in a relationship with. She wasn't kidding, she wasn't being snarky-she was right.

SocratesNot -> RE: Do any of you Dominants have a desire to make your submissive more dominant? (5/22/2010 8:33:20 AM)
Leadership 527, do you really think it is OK to have a doormat so that you can experiment with how much of the extremes of whatever (pain, domination, control) are you able to inflict on her in a responsible manner? If she happens to accept anything from you, do you think that it is OK to use this situation to do the things to her that are so extreme that even you are scared to death? I see a lot of potentially dangerous tendencies in your relationship that you describe as perfectly harmonious. Don't take offence, just try to answer my question.

SocratesNot -> RE: Do any of you Dominants have a desire to make your submissive more dominant? (5/22/2010 8:38:02 AM)
quote: you can't provide therapy to a person you are in a relationship with Absolutely wrong! There are numerous real life examples of people benefiting enormously from a relationship, benefits include solving many mental-health and other issues. There are also numerous books and movies in which this situation is finely described.

thishereboi -> RE: Do any of you Dominants have a desire to make your submissive more dominant? (5/22/2010 8:39:57 AM)
quote: I got this idea by for example reading profiles of slaves and submissives who every now and then mention things like they are worthless or they want to be taken advantage of and similar things. Well, maybe you should step away from the computer and check out the people in the real world. Then you won't get confused between the actual people on cm and the trolls who make profiles to get good wanking material.

VaguelyCurious -> RE: Do any of you Dominants have a desire to make your submissive more dominant? (5/22/2010 8:41:47 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SocratesNot quote: you can't provide therapy to a person you are in a relationship with Absolutely wrong! There are numerous real life examples of people benefiting enormously from a relationship, benefits include solving many mental-health and other issues. There are also numerous books and movies in which this situation is finely described. Ok, I've officially run out of the energy necessary to keep arguing with you. Lally's given up. Laurell's given up. I'm giving up for now. Someone help me out with this?

Jeffff -> RE: Do any of you Dominants have a desire to make your submissive more dominant? (5/22/2010 8:42:29 AM)
Dude. have you ever thought of listening and learning? Do you always insist that your perceptions are the only genuine ones? " I have no experience as a dominant", those are your words. I am actualy not mocking you.... right now. Perhaps there are folks who HAVE some experience. Perhaps is itmore than theory for them. Don't be such a douche

jbcurious -> RE: Do any of you Dominants have a desire to make your submissive more dominant? (5/22/2010 8:44:09 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: leadership527 quote: ORIGINAL: jbcurious Get it through your head.... that in my submission is where I feel value, not in my ability to take charge. Don't worry jb... I'm sure we can fix that for you. Hmmmm you're not planning the electrode experiment again are you?? [:D] To the Op who's head is so far up is own ass he's got vision in the back of his head... If you are an amazing electrician and I put you on the Broadway stage in a musical production....how comfortable are you going to be? You're not an actor or performer, being on that stage is wrong for you. It doesn't make you less valuable as a person, it just means that you're better at being an electrician. A lack of self esteem, not being able to deal with things in vanilla life has nothing to do with being submissive and are traits you will find in every walk of life. We are submissive because we are. You are obtuse because you are.

thishereboi -> RE: Do any of you Dominants have a desire to make your submissive more dominant? (5/22/2010 8:45:05 AM)
quote: This is extremely interesting. Even though you love to be hit and have a personal experience of enjoying it, there is something deep into your psyche that tells you that hitting another person so that it hurts is just wrong. If you didn't have this belief (of which you are maybe not even aware) you would have no problem whatsoever to hit your Master. But you do have a HUGE problem hitting him, even if he wanted it and enjoyed it. I am quite sure that you think deep down that it is wrong to hit a person, no matter what are the circumstances or their wants and needs. At the same time you have no problem whatsoever being hit. Which means that you think the following: Some people should always be respected and revered and never treated wrongly, not even if this is their desire (for example your Master), and some other people can (and maybe even deserve to) be treated wrongly (for example, you). Which then means that some people are simply more worthy, more valuable and have more human dignity than some other people, and you do not belong to this group. Which, after such analyses shows that I was not so terribly wrong when I assumed that subs "quite often" have the issues with self-esteem. Of course, I still believe and hope, that this happens only in minority of situations, and that most of them want to be submissive in relationships for completely different reasons. If you have ever considered a career in psychiatry, you may want to rethink that.[8\|]

LillyoftheVally -> RE: Do any of you Dominants have a desire to make your submissive more dominant? (5/22/2010 8:51:17 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SocratesNot quote: you can't provide therapy to a person you are in a relationship with Absolutely wrong! There are numerous real life examples of people benefiting enormously from a relationship, benefits include solving many mental-health and other issues. There are also numerous books and movies in which this situation is finely described. Yeah thats true, its where I learn all my life lessons, novels and films, its why I am holding on for my hero to come rescue me from the top of this tower that I seem to be stuck in. Ok less sarcasm, I have a lot of real life experience of mental illness, and I am sorry to have to say that mental illness can't be solved, mental issues (be it illness or not) can be helped, managed, soothed, understood, but it is very rare that a relationship provides any long term solution. The best thing a partner can do with anyone who has mental health issues is listen. I read before your belief that many people are wandering around totally unaware of themselves, I would suggest that is simply not true. I am pretty good at talking to people with different kinds of problems because I have a good memory and nine times out of ten people with problems will tell you what they need to help them cope. It is never smart for a partner to try and fix their other half, never, because often they will get it wrong, make it worse and then be blamed. I am not sure where your knowledge of mental illness comes from but I would suggest that it is flimsy at best. I would also suggest that trying to link mental illness and wiitwd never goes down well mostly because it is a pretty weak link. My advice to you generally would be to stop posting as many original topics, sit back and read, look around you, talk to people because as I see it you have a fair bit to learn, and the best way to start learning is to start listening

leadership527 -> RE: Do any of you Dominants have a desire to make your submissive more dominant? (5/22/2010 8:51:41 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SocratesNot Leadership 527, do you really think it is OK to have a doormat so that you can experiment with how much of the extremes of whatever (pain, domination, control) are you able to inflict on her in a responsible manner? If she happens to accept anything from you, do you think that it is OK to use this situation to do the things to her that are so extreme that even you are scared to death? It is OK as long as it is OK. So far, it's been quite a bit better than "OK". Might a be making some colossal mistake? Yes. But in the end, people talk about "TPE"... total power exchange. This is what the word "total" means. And you have to have the courage to belly up to the bar if you want to play the game. "Total" is not 98%. By it's very nature, it is extreme. quote: I see a lot of potentially dangerous tendencies in your relationship that you describe as perfectly harmonious. Well, for starters, I don't describe it as "perfectly harmonious". Carol and I have our ups and downs like all couples. Sometimes I've posted those downs here on these boards. But yes, as a general rule, we are very happy as a couple. At the 15 year mark, we look more like newlyweds than an old. married couple. All that being said, I absolutely and completely agree that what we are doing is dangerous.... in some cases, potentially very dangerous. In fact, I'd say there is nothing "safe" at all about TPE. But if you're looking for safety, then a great place to start is by avoiding extreme things. Neither of us is looking for "safety" in that sense. What we want is a totality of commitment to the relationship that is never going to be "safe". quote: Don't take offence, just try to answer my question. No offense taken. I think I've pretty much gotten it into my thick little head that what we do is highly troubling and offensive to a wide variety of people. As I noted, it is even sometimes troubling to ME. And as a side note (referring to your next post), you seriously, seriously need to stop going to books and movies for sources of definitive information. I'd wager you'd have a very hard time finding ANY licensed therapist who would condone doing any sort of serious therapy on someone with whom they cannot be objective. Light weight stuff? Sure. But nothing heavy duty. If you want definitive information, what you do is actually ask experts in the field in question... preferably more than one so you can get a balanced viewpoint.

laurell3 -> RE: Do any of you Dominants have a desire to make your submissive more dominant? (5/22/2010 8:54:33 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: jbcurious We are submissive because we are. You are obtuse because you are. jb I love you....really...seriously....you are fucking awesome!

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