Attitudes of people in BDSM community about vanilla lifestyles

Attitudes of people in BDSM community about vanilla lifestyles (Full Version)

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SocratesNot -> Attitudes of people in BDSM community about vanilla lifestyles (5/23/2010 8:20:57 PM)
It is often said that "vanilla people" can't understand BDSM, and that they are quite often intolerant to it. What happens in the opposite direction? Can people who are into WIITWD really get vanilla folks? Of course there is tollerance and "live and let live" philosophy. And also the philosophy of "this is not of my business". But what I am interested in now is not endless repeating of these phrases. I am interested in how BDSM community really views entire vanilla lifestyle and vanilla values such as monogamy, democratic decision making, equality, etc. Do you feel that vanilla lacks substance? Is it somewhat outdated? Are vanilla relationships more superficial? Why you can't be satisfied in vanilla relationships? Please, I mean please, don't start again with these "no generalizations" posts. If you don't want to constructively answer questions, it's better not to post anything.

IronBear -> RE: Attitudes of people in BDSM community about vanilla lifestyles (5/23/2010 8:32:57 PM)
Fuck me dead! Your question could be asked to people in the general Pagan Community (where you'll be likely to get responses telling you about intolerance and persecution by the single minded Christian fanatics), the Muslim community living in Christian lands and any alternative lifestyle group. In a nut shell, where there is difference there will be both acceptance and opposition. Personally I have no feelings one way or another about any group different to my lifestyle unless they become openly and physically hostile and then there is war.

LadyAngelika -> RE: Attitudes of people in BDSM community about vanilla lifestyles (5/23/2010 8:34:44 PM)
Most of my friends are vanilla. I don't find them very different then me. Then again, I'm not in their bedroom. So bottom line, no, I find certain people lack substance, some in BDSM and some vanilla, and some are awesome, some in BDSM and some in vanilla. None of my vanilla friends (friends, not acquaintances) are in superficial relationships as far as I can tell. That is a rather small sample. That said, I don't feel comfortable commenting on the level of superficiality of other people's relationship. I have been in vanilla relationships and satisfied in them on many fronts as I tend to date gentlemen. I just happen to prefer BDSM relationships and have made the decision to only pursue these as they meet my needs. - LA

lucylucy -> RE: Attitudes of people in BDSM community about vanilla lifestyles (5/23/2010 8:53:18 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SocratesNot I am interested in how BDSM community really views entire vanilla lifestyle and vanilla values such as monogamy, democratic decision making, equality, etc. Do you feel that vanilla lacks substance? Is it somewhat outdated? Are vanilla relationships more superficial? Why do you can't be satisfied in vanilla relationships? First of all, I think it's a mistake to assume that monogamy, democratic decision making, and equality are vanilla values. I value these things as much now as I did when I was in my 20-year vanilla marriage. My Master and I are mostly monogamous (the same can be said of many vanilla relationships), we practice democratic decision making (in which he has veto power and exercises it regularly), and we consider ourselves to be equally important in the relationship. I was in a vanilla marriage for 20 years. It didn't lack substance and it was very satisfying in many ways. It wasn't at all superficial. I couldn't be satisfied in the relationship because of things that could very much have happened in a D/s relationship. D/s isn't magical. My own relationship has had some bumps in the road, and some of them are ones that could occur in a vanilla relationship. I am more satisfied in a D/s relationship than I ever was in my vanilla relationship because aspects of myself that I thought my vanilla husband wouldn't accept are accepted. To be perfectly honest, I never gave my vanilla husband a chance to accept or reject those parts of me--I kept them secret from him. However, even if my vanilla husband had accepted those aspects of me, the things that caused us to break up would still have caused us to break up.

SocratesNot -> RE: Attitudes of people in BDSM community about vanilla lifestyles (5/23/2010 9:01:05 PM)
I think the thread is going in a good direction. Thanks for your answers. Of all the questions that I asked in my first post, I think the most important one is Why you can't be satisfied in vanilla relationship? This should be answered only by those who really can't be satisfied in vanilla relationships. Many of you probably can do both D/s and vanilla. So only those of you who really can't be satisfied in vanilla relationship, should try to answer why is that so.

porcelaine -> RE: Attitudes of people in BDSM community about vanilla lifestyles (5/23/2010 9:15:45 PM)
SocratesNot, quote: Do you feel that vanilla lacks substance? Is it somewhat outdated? Are vanilla relationships more superficial? Why you can't be satisfied in vanilla relationships? I don't draw a distinction between the two nor do I utilize the terminology either for the "other" group. I've always felt it was demeaning and something I didn't agree with. Humans have differences. Some feel a need to stress that in good and bad ways. For some, it gives them a sense of self importance or mock betterment. I don't think kink is better in any way. It is simply something I enjoy. Just like golf is as well. That doesn't make non kink loving golfers any less than I, they merely have other forms of enjoyment which is fine. ~porcelaine

LadyHibiscus -> RE: Attitudes of people in BDSM community about vanilla lifestyles (5/23/2010 9:17:07 PM)
I have to ask, what is your motivation for your posts? Are you writing a thesis? Taking a general survey? There is nothing magical about being kinky. Even 24/7 couples have jobs to go to and laundry to do. Being kinky does not mean a person is tolerant--you will find some very vicious opinions held by some. We are not satsfied in vanilla relationships because our needs are broader than most vanilla relationships can provide.

SocratesNot -> RE: Attitudes of people in BDSM community about vanilla lifestyles (5/23/2010 9:23:42 PM)
quote: I have to ask, what is your motivation for your posts? Are you writing a thesis? Taking a general survey? I'm just curious. Trying to learn. Trying to reevaluate some of my standings. Trying to find some information on which I could base my opinions about certain things in the future. And also, trying to understand some of my own kinky tendencies. All that accompanied with being young, inexperienced and naturally curious. quote: We are not satsfied in vanilla relationships because our needs are broader than most vanilla relationships can provide. That's exactly what I was waiting for. Could you elaborate this please? I'm very interested.

LordJessie -> RE: Attitudes of people in BDSM community about vanilla lifestyles (5/23/2010 9:26:12 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus We are not satsfied in vanilla relationships because our needs are broader than most vanilla relationships can provide. No "we" about it. If you feel your "needs are broader than most vanilla relationships can provide" that's great. I do not feel that way at all. I don't think that just because I like the sexual and perhaps deviant things I like that I have "broader" needs than anyone else, vanilla or not. Nope, not the case for me...........luci

LadyHibiscus -> RE: Attitudes of people in BDSM community about vanilla lifestyles (5/23/2010 9:40:45 PM)
Well, no, I am not going to elaborate. My reasons and desires are not the same as anyone else's, even if we are similar on the surface. Perhaps you could read some of the many archived threads on these very topics? You will find a wealth of opinions, and some actual knowledge.

dreamerdreaming -> RE: Attitudes of people in BDSM community about vanilla lifestyles (5/23/2010 11:44:04 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: IronBear Fuck me dead! Well that wasn't exactly what I had in mind, but if you insist... [:D]

GreedyTop -> RE: Attitudes of people in BDSM community about vanilla lifestyles (5/23/2010 11:52:19 PM)
First. .. define VANILLA, as you see it. what I consider vanilla may be ultra kinky to some folks.

myotherself -> RE: Attitudes of people in BDSM community about vanilla lifestyles (5/24/2010 12:04:18 AM)
What GT said [;)] The only difference between the relationships I prefer now and the relationships I've had before is that the sex is a hell of a lot better because I have the freedom to ask for more of the pain play I enjoy so much without fear of feeling judged by my partner. Having said that though, I have had that (to a lesser extent) in some of my previous relationships. I also prefer the male to have the final veto on decisions. But then again, I've had that before in previous relationships. Monogamy, equal partnerships, all that ordinary 'relationship' stuff has always been a part of my relationships, and always will.

reynardfox -> RE: Attitudes of people in BDSM community about vanilla lifestyles (5/24/2010 12:21:48 AM)
People are not born with Kink or vanilla written on them. The fun is finding out. Most of my play friends had no idea they were kinky until they tried it. Seduction is half the fun. I have had people take off when they found out what we were, but so what? The main difference between a vanilla and a kinky person is often three glasses of wine and a promise of keeping quiet afterwards!

allthatjaz -> RE: Attitudes of people in BDSM community about vanilla lifestyles (5/24/2010 1:42:42 AM)
We are spending an awful lot of time with our vanilla friends at the moment. Our local munch is pretty dire. Its full of people wearing inappropriate clothing for a vanilla bar and standing around and talking about anything but this lifestyle. Our vanilla friends seem a lot more open minded (they have no idea about what we get up to) and fun. We talk about anything and everything including strap-ons and whips and chains but its much more light hearted banter. We have one woman in our group that has been nick named 'The Dominatrix' because she's bold and assertive. The guys think that assertion is highly attractive. She confides in me that she would love an assertive man for a change and not sure why she always ends up with men that are so willing to run around after her! Another couple are very D/s and yet they are vanilla (I think) he is very much her leader and she follows beautifully. They are an extremely happy couple that have found the route of what they need without being involved in BDSM. I believe that just because your vanilla, does not mean you won't connect on your own level. Not everyone is into being led or leading and very few of us are into giving or taking pain. That doesn't make them boring or leave them with an unfulfilled sex life, its just different than ours. I couldn't be in a vanilla relationship because I like this lifestyle too much. I couldn't be with someone who was not turned on or tuned into it because I would be making too big a compromise.

sunshinemiss -> RE: Attitudes of people in BDSM community about vanilla lifestyles (5/24/2010 1:45:07 AM)
Everybody wants the same thing - everyone wants love, to be intellectually stimulated, to do work they can be proud of, to feel safe and happy. It's just the details that are different.

crazyml -> RE: Attitudes of people in BDSM community about vanilla lifestyles (5/24/2010 2:59:16 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SocratesNot I am interested in how BDSM community really views entire vanilla lifestyle and vanilla values such as monogamy, democratic decision making, equality, etc I'm with lucylucy - I don't see these values as being vanilla per se, they're just a set of values that may or may not be associated with any relationship. quote: Do you feel that vanilla lacks substance? No, absolutely not. It would be a little absurd and patronising to suggest that "vanilla" relationships are less substantial/meaningful than non-vanilla relationships. quote: Is it somewhat outdated? I don't think so - vanilla and kink have been side by side for millenia quote: Are vanilla relationships more superficial? Absolutely not - there are plenty of super superficial kinky relationships out there. quote: Why you can't be satisfied in vanilla relationships? Cuz I yam kinky. quote: Please, I mean please, don't start again with these "no generalizations" posts. Oh... in that case won't make the point that posts that seek generalisations of this kind are generally pointless.. quote: If you don't want to constructively answer questions, it's better not to post anything. "constructive" is in the eye of the beholder surely? This is a public forum, so people are free to post as they choose (within the forum rules). More generally.,, Sometimes, I feel a little jealous of people who are content in a vanilla relationship - I've always felt that being kinky is a double edged sword - yes, it's fabulous when it works, but on the other hand finding a partner who is compatible in a nilla sense as well as a kinky sense is a fair bit harder than finding someone who is just a nilla match or just a kinky match. I certainly need both - I need a functional "nilla" connection as well as kink compatibility. I don't believe that it is possible to generalise this one - I'd hazard that a significant number of the people on this site are looking for a kinky shag - they're not here for deep and meaningful. Speaking only for myself - I cannot imagine myself being in a long term relationship that wasn't fulfilling as a nilla relationship as well as a kinky one. I'm not looking for a 27/7 slave to keep in a dungeon - because kink is not my life, it's a part of it.

RCdc -> RE: Attitudes of people in BDSM community about vanilla lifestyles (5/24/2010 3:25:31 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SocratesNot It is often said that "vanilla people" can't understand BDSM, and that they are quite often intolerant to it. Which means you have only online interactions or you are from the states. Or both. quote: What happens in the opposite direction? Can people who are into WIITWD really get vanilla folks? There really isn't a them and us. quote: I am interested in how BDSM community really views entire vanilla lifestyle and vanilla values such as monogamy, democratic decision making, equality, etc. The above are not non BDSM values only. quote: Do you feel that vanilla lacks substance? No. quote: Is it somewhat outdated? No. quote: Are vanilla relationships more superficial? No. quote: Why you can't be satisfied in vanilla relationships? There is no them and us - only in the heads of people who want there to be. the.dark.

DesFIP -> RE: Attitudes of people in BDSM community about vanilla lifestyles (5/24/2010 4:18:55 AM)
Those of us who are hard wired to need a power relationship cannot be satisfied in an egalitarian relationship any more than a person who is hard wired to be heterosexual could be satisfied in a homosexual relationship. So why can't you be satisfied in a homosexual relationship? You can find everything you need there. If you are monogamous, there are monogamous gays. If you are poly, there are poly gays. Et cetera. The vast majority of us come from vanilla backgrounds. We love our vanilla friends and family even though we don't share their same likings. Just like we love our vegan and vegetarian friends even when we are still meat eaters. Vanilla lacks substance for us just like a soy based diet lacks substance for someone desperate for a steak. Is being a vegetarian outdated or superficial? Not at all, it just doesn't satisfy me. And again, the questions you are asking assume we are different somehow from vanillas. The only way we are different is that we are happier in a power relationship than in an egalitarian one. There are no answers that you can accept because you can't accept that we aren't different. We have the same requirements for good communication in order to have a long lasting relationship. We have the same requirements for love, respect and acceptance of our authentic selves in order to have a long lasting relationship. The only difference is that some of us need to have the power to make final decisions and others of us need to not have to make final decisions.

IronBear -> RE: Attitudes of people in BDSM community about vanilla lifestyles (5/24/2010 5:03:12 AM)
Would I be satisfied in a Vanilla (Mundane) relationship? Stone the crows, no bloody way! Leaving BDSM out, my family was pagan my this I mean we worshipped the ancient Gods of the Celt. I have always been alternative but from the start I learned to mask it so as to appear as mundane as those about us. To me living a vanilla or mundane life would be as about enjoyable as being in prison. Much better to life outside the little boxes and smell freedom.

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