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RE: Reality of BDSM porn and fantasy - 5/28/2010 8:39:40 AM   
caelestis


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeffff

Come to me and I shall heal you. Even if it takes weeks I shall not give up!

And if perhaps, you need this evil beaten out of you, I am good with that too.


*perks up*

I think I may need some of that type of healing

_____________________________

"We are a fountain of shimmering contradictions, most of us. Beautiful in the concept, if we're lucky, but frequently tedious or regrettable as we flesh ourselves out."
— Gregory Maguire



(in reply to Jeffff)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: Reality of BDSM porn and fantasy - 5/28/2010 8:40:51 AM   
ReginaMirus


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quote:

ORIGINAL: SocratesNot

OK, this human ashtray thing isn't that important to the topic discussed. Maybe this isn't extreme. But still people fantasize about extreme things, such as amputation, shit, castration, total isolation, etc.

Some even fantasize about being used as sexual slaves in sense that they must have sex with whoever their Master decides, including people of the same sex. even if they are not homosexual.



Oh, the HORROR!!!

Is this really, really, deep down, what you MOST fear will happen to you? Really?

(in reply to SocratesNot)
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RE: Reality of BDSM porn and fantasy - 5/28/2010 8:41:09 AM   
Jeffff


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Doin' right ain't got no end!


Capt. Redlegs

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RE: Reality of BDSM porn and fantasy - 5/28/2010 8:47:31 AM   
SocratesNot


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Joined: 5/17/2010
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quote:

Some even fantasize about being used as sexual slaves in sense that they must have sex with whoever their Master decides, including people of the same sex. even if they are not homosexual.



Oh, the HORROR!!!

Is this really, really, deep down, what you MOST fear will happen to you? Really?


Regina, there are women so unattractive that I would never be able to fuck them. And I am straight.
Being forced to have sex with men is simply a hard limit for me. I am not afraid of it. I simply know that this will never happen to me.
It's out of question.


_____________________________

Amicus Plato, sed magis amica veritas. - Aristotle
Plato is my friend, but truth is a better friend. - Aristotle

(in reply to Jeffff)
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RE: Reality of BDSM porn and fantasy - 5/28/2010 9:21:15 AM   
LadyPact


Posts: 32566
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I'm going to attempt to answer some of these.  However, I'm doing so on the basis that I want a new understanding between you and Me.  In My answers, I am going to be honest with you to the best of My ability.  In exchange, I want you to accept that I am doing so and listen to what I have to say from that premise. 

quote:

ORIGINAL: SocratesNot
After all said I have some questions:
Why is fantasy sometimes very extreme and in this case people would never do what they are fantasizing about in RL, but still, they are aroused by such fantasy?

In some cases, I think people are frightened of certain extremes.  They might end up enjoying it more than they feel they can come to terms with.

The more common answer, however, is that certain fantasies clash with ethical or moral standards in some way.  An example of this would be that many people, both tops and bottoms, are turned on by rape scenes.  While many would happily engage in this activity as a 'role play' scene, they would never want it to be real in a situation where the person (to be technical about it, the victim) did not consent to the activity.  One is fun, the other is criminal.
quote:

How does this attraction to extreme and unsafe stuff which is depicted in fantasy influence their real life relationship?

I did skip ahead to post six to see what you considered extreme and unsafe.  The only one of those that I really identify with is the one regarding using someone as a human ashtray.  I'm actually surprised that one made your list at all, since flicking cigarette ashes into someone's hand is also technically being used as an ashtray.  (Putting the cigarette out on someone is the more extreme, which is probably what you meant.)  Literally, unless you want to get into the second hand smoke debate, I'm amazed that one even made your list.
quote:

If someone fantasize about bad and abusive Dom or Domme, what are the chances of him / her really ending up in such relationship?

Very slim.  As I said earlier, most people involved in wiitwd are not especially immoral or unethical people.  The ratio of folks who actually are abusive is no higher or lower among kinky folks than they are among vanilla folks. 

quote:

What is the thing in someone's mind that cause him to be turned on by extremely unhealthy and destructive things, even if only in fantasy?

I can answer that for you any better than I can answer why some people are sadists or masochists.  I have no idea why kinky folks are wired differently than non kinky folks.  It could be something in our DNA or the electrical impulses in our brains fire differently.  I honestly don't know if we will know why during the course of My lifetime.  I accept the fact that I'm sadistic without the knowing why.
quote:

I understand that such people would never actually do this, but they still fantasize and still get turned on. What is the part of us that makes us aroused by some
really fucked up shit?

On this one, you're just going to have to take My word on it.  When I use My little flippant phrase about "I don't have fantasies, I have goals" there is a truthful basis for that.  I tend to fantasize about things that I can actually accomplish.  I take My topping skills very seriously.  I educate Myself about risks and minimize them as much as possible.  I have a huge hang up about folks who are ignorant (meaning they didn't bother to educate themselves) about certain types of play, yet believe they are competent to engage in that activity with another human being.  To Me, it's reckless and there's not a reason on the planet for it that I think is justified.
quote:

I think this is not what THEY do. This is what WE do. All of us are sometimes turned on by the things which, if they became reality,
would have really bad consequences.

I think I addressed that already.
quote:

Can presence of such fantasies really have bad effect on our relationships.

Taking you very literally here for a moment.  A fantasy never harmed anyone.  Only actions can do that.
quote:

I mean the more you pursue satisfaction of these dark fantasies the more risky, unhealthy and dangerous relationship can be.
However,
the less you pursue satisfaction of such dark fantasies, the more boring, empty and unsatisfying relationship can be.

For someone like Me, that first sentence tends to be the other way around.  I consider Myself always in the pursuit of being a better top.  I never stop seeking to better educate Myself, learn new techniques, and use that knowledge when I play.  I'm still of the school that says if you're going to play with that whip, you should have it in your hand practicing before you ever go near a living target with it.

The second sentence I'm not especially sure if I consider true.  If a person has a fantasy, a rape fantasy for example, it doesn't necessarily mean they are bored with their sex life or relationship if they don't live it out.  It might turn them on to think about it while they are with their partner and could potentially make their sex life hotter if they use it in that fashion.
quote:

How to be wise in such things?

Education, plain and simple. 



_____________________________

The crowned Diva of Destruction. ~ ExT

Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

Please do not send me email here. Unless I know you, I will delete the email unread

(in reply to SocratesNot)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: Reality of BDSM porn and fantasy - 5/28/2010 9:30:22 AM   
January


Posts: 891
Joined: 4/17/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: SocratesNot
Most of people here despise any elements of BDSM that are somehow connected to things depicted in BDSM porn and fiction.


I love participating in the random stupidity forum. Because I know responding to the OP is stupid. It's like talking to a brick wall.

But here goes:

I write BDSM fiction. I depict things. I do things, too. (Actually, things are done to me...). I do not despise what I write. I don't see a disconnect between what I write and what we (meaning what me and my husband) do. So your first statement is incorrect, at least for me.

With such an incorrect premise, I can't read the rest of your theory.

You might want to start with something correct and work your way up.

January

_____________________________

[link: http://www.bookstrand.com/miss-you-sir] Miss You, Sir by January Rowe is available from Siren now! It's my latest smokin' hot bdsm romance.[/link]




(in reply to SocratesNot)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: Reality of BDSM porn and fantasy - 5/28/2010 9:41:31 AM   
MarcEsadrian


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Joined: 8/24/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: SocratesNot

quote:

What is extreme and unsafe?


Castration, amputation, cannibalism, extremely prolonged chastity (longer than a year without pauses), being kept in cage for long periods of time, total isolation from the outside world, micromanagement in TPE (TPE and IE is not unsafe of itself, but if micromanagement becomes extreme, in that case it can be), extreme psychological humiliation (being told over and over that you are worthless or being forced to say things such as "I am worthless" I am a poor excuse for person. I don't exist), consumation of shit (actually swallowing it), being human ashtray, etc. Such stuff.


Amputation and cannibalism, I'm willing to guess, this isn't too high on the most popular fantasies list—particularly if you're using BDSM pornography as a metric. Heavy humiliation, "degrading" sex acts and whipping / caning scores high, though. None of those are far at all from the imagination or reality of an M/s relationship. Further:

• Being kept in cages for long periods of time
• Total isolation from the outside world
• Extreme humiliation
• Toilet slavery
• Human ashtray

I've experienced these things on the giving and receiving end in reality, and haven't lost my soul.



_____________________________

Omnes una manet nox

Founder, Humbled Females

(in reply to SocratesNot)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: Reality of BDSM porn and fantasy - 5/28/2010 9:55:04 AM   
EvilEyes269


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Joined: 7/27/2009
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Never mind.

< Message edited by EvilEyes269 -- 5/28/2010 10:30:24 AM >

(in reply to January)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: Reality of BDSM porn and fantasy - 5/28/2010 10:33:35 AM   
SocratesNot


Posts: 812
Joined: 5/17/2010
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Lady Pact, thanks for your answers.

When it comes to human ashtrays, the only thing that I meant was actually eating (and swallowing) ashes and even whole cigarette butts.
Knowing that it is highly toxic, I can't think of it as safe.


_____________________________

Amicus Plato, sed magis amica veritas. - Aristotle
Plato is my friend, but truth is a better friend. - Aristotle

(in reply to EvilEyes269)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: Reality of BDSM porn and fantasy - 5/28/2010 10:51:03 AM   
LadyPact


Posts: 32566
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SocratesNot

quote:

Some even fantasize about being used as sexual slaves in sense that they must have sex with whoever their Master decides, including people of the same sex. even if they are not homosexual.



Regina, there are women so unattractive that I would never be able to fuck them. And I am straight.
Being forced to have sex with men is simply a hard limit for me. I am not afraid of it. I simply know that this will never happen to me.
It's out of question.


Then I propose to you that you do not attempt to become involved in a dynamic where the other person owns you completely and has the authority to command you to do so.

Edited  because I forgot My manners.  You are welcome.


_____________________________

The crowned Diva of Destruction. ~ ExT

Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

Please do not send me email here. Unless I know you, I will delete the email unread

(in reply to SocratesNot)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: Reality of BDSM porn and fantasy - 5/28/2010 11:04:36 AM   
LadyHibiscus


Posts: 27124
Joined: 8/15/2005
From: Island Of Misfit Toys
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael

Pulling your head out of your ass would be a good start.



This.

Jesus palomino, first I'm agreeing with Domi, now this...

_____________________________

[page 23 girl]



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Profile   Post #: 31
RE: Reality of BDSM porn and fantasy - 5/28/2010 11:19:46 AM   
insearch0f


Posts: 10
Joined: 5/9/2010
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Be careful now your starting to sound like lobodomyslave with his rants against all things femdom. Btw I like the first two straw items on your list to off set the real message. Don't let things u can't control control you, or else your a slave to everything that moves u out of your comfort zone, son.

quote:

ORIGINAL: SocratesNot

quote:

What is extreme and unsafe?


Castration, amputation, cannibalism, extremely prolonged chastity (longer than a year without pauses), being kept in cage for long periods of time, total isolation from the outside world, micromanagement in TPE (TPE and IE is not unsafe of itself, but if micromanagement becomes extreme, in that case it can be), extreme psychological humiliation (being told over and over that you are worthless or being forced to say things such as "I am worthless" I am a poor excuse for person. I don't exist), consumation of shit (actually swallowing it), being human ashtray, etc. Such stuff.

(in reply to SocratesNot)
Profile   Post #: 32
RE: Reality of BDSM porn and fantasy - 5/28/2010 11:46:04 AM   
stef


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Joined: 1/26/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: SocratesNot

It's not judging. It's just stating the fact. I don't think they are evil because they do it. I just stated the fact.

You're a clueless troll.  I'm not judging you.  I don't think you're evil because you do it.  I'm just stating a fact.

~stef


_____________________________

Welcome to PoliticSpace! If you came here expecting meaningful BDSM discussions, boy are you in the wrong place.

"Hypocrisy has consequences"

(in reply to SocratesNot)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: Reality of BDSM porn and fantasy - 5/28/2010 12:07:38 PM   
thishereboi


Posts: 14463
Joined: 6/19/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus


quote:

ORIGINAL: SimplyMichael

Pulling your head out of your ass would be a good start.



This.

Jesus palomino, first I'm agreeing with Domi, now this...


You obviously need to get out more, maybe coffee with some really nice boi is in order? We might even be able to drag H out of the house too.


_____________________________

"Sweetie, you're wasting your gum" .. Albert


This here is the boi formerly known as orfunboi


(in reply to LadyHibiscus)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: Reality of BDSM porn and fantasy - 5/28/2010 12:09:55 PM   
SocratesNot


Posts: 812
Joined: 5/17/2010
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quote:


You're a clueless troll. 


To say this you have to evaluate me and my behavior and to assume many things about my mind. This is sort of judgment.

What I said about them was based on their own admission and the reality of things that I have seen or read about.

I didn't judge them. I stated the fact. You did judge me.


_____________________________

Amicus Plato, sed magis amica veritas. - Aristotle
Plato is my friend, but truth is a better friend. - Aristotle

(in reply to stef)
Profile   Post #: 35
RE: Reality of BDSM porn and fantasy - 5/28/2010 12:10:42 PM   
SimplyMichael


Posts: 7229
Joined: 1/7/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: stef

quote:

ORIGINAL: SocratesNot

It's not judging. It's just stating the fact. I don't think they are evil because they do it. I just stated the fact.

You're a clueless troll.  I'm not judging you.  I don't think you're evil because you do it.  I'm just stating a fact.

~stef



Stef, its only a fact when I say it, your just an opinionated bitch where I am a factual asshole.

(in reply to stef)
Profile   Post #: 36
RE: Reality of BDSM porn and fantasy - 5/28/2010 12:30:13 PM   
DesFIP


Posts: 25191
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From: Apple County NY
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If you're pursuing a dark fantasy then you've taken it out of the fantasy realm and are working on making it real.

As to why people watch it? Same reason they ooh and ah at Harry Winston ads when they know damn well they aren't ever going to spend $65,000 on a diamond and emerald necklace. It's entirely in your imagination. For that matter, it's the same reason older men buy fast cars they can't comfortably sit in and sell a couple of years later.


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Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!


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Profile   Post #: 37
RE: Reality of BDSM porn and fantasy - 5/28/2010 1:44:07 PM   
LadyPact


Posts: 32566
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SocratesNot
To say this you have to evaluate me and my behavior and to assume many things about my mind. This is sort of judgment.

What I said about them was based on their own admission and the reality of things that I have seen or read about.

I didn't judge them. I stated the fact. You did judge me.


The question is, how do you know that what you are seeing is authentic?

Who's admission?  Are these people that you've met in the real world?  How many folks have you met who have amputated their leg strictly resulting from their interest in BDSM?

Do not confuse the shock factor that drives porn sales with what people do in reality.  Do not confuse what is typed up on the net because people want to use it to talk about fantasy.


_____________________________

The crowned Diva of Destruction. ~ ExT

Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

Please do not send me email here. Unless I know you, I will delete the email unread

(in reply to SocratesNot)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: Reality of BDSM porn and fantasy - 5/28/2010 2:00:33 PM   
Jeffff


Posts: 12600
Joined: 7/7/2007
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Pact?.... you are being so kind....


There goes your rep.

_____________________________

"If you don't live it, it won't come out your horn." Charlie Parker

(in reply to LadyPact)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: Reality of BDSM porn and fantasy - 5/28/2010 2:39:11 PM   
laurell3


Posts: 6577
Joined: 5/5/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SocratesNot



Some even fantasize about being used as sexual slaves in sense that they must have sex with whoever their Master decides, including people of the same sex. even if they are not homosexual.



This is how I had my first bisexual encounter. I am so incredibly glad that he pushed me to open my mind and try it and supported me when I was hesitant and unsure, because I was wrong and foolish and judgmental and the experience opened my eyes and mind to many things.

The reality is there isn't any real "forced" in wiitwd, consent is given in a variety of ways, but things that are truly nonconsentual and/or seriously life-threatening aren't favored by "the community" or supported.

A number of the things you listed in your many meandering threads, I have done or tried and don't consider extreme, and you will never know whether they are or not (other than the obvious decapitation, etc) until you get out there. My definition of extreme changed one whole hell of a lot over my 18 years of experiencing. I'm a fanatic about being safe and even avoiding unnecessary illness and any partner I have must support that as well.

_____________________________

I cannot be defined by moments in my life, but must be considered for by the entirety of my existence.

When you fail to consider that I am the best judge for what is right for me, all of your opinions become suspect to me.

(in reply to SocratesNot)
Profile   Post #: 40
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