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RE: SLAVE AND RELIGION - 6/3/2010 5:38:57 PM   
Andalusite


Posts: 2492
Joined: 1/25/2009
Status: offline 		Calla, "Lord" used by male humans strikes me as Ren Fair-ish, rather than an attempt at deification, along the lines of "Earl" or "Duke." I won't consider anyone who attempts to use "goddess" to address me, via e-mail or in their profile, since it strikes me as sacrilegious. I did have one person attempt to convert me, but we were in an egalitarian kinky relationship (if anything, I leaned to the Toppy/somewhat Dominant side with him), and he didn't bring it up until after we'd been dating for over a year. He didn't want me to worship him, or even convert to his faith, just to anything but Christianity. Anyway, I refused, but we did have a lot of interesting discussions on faith, philosophy, morals, ethics, and so forth.

Jeff (leadership), that made me chuckle, and seems like a reasonable requirement to make of her.

(in reply to DesFIP)
Profile   Post #: 61
RE: SLAVE AND RELIGION - 6/3/2010 8:46:47 PM   
Firebirdseeking


Posts: 477
Joined: 9/3/2006
Status: offline 		Normally I dont react, at least overtly, to a post, but this is a preposterous post. You are suggesting: 1. repression in freedom of religion 2. controlling another's spiritual life, which is odious 3. that a master is in the same league as the Creator, or Great Spirit, or God, or whatever Higher Power to which one ascribes.

Do you really think these things are "masterful" behaviors? It sounds like insecurity inconsummate.

Some on line legend in his own mind once sent me a list of his rules which included specifics on when I should "pray"; my music should be Christian or Classical. I was still pretty new at that point but nothing made me recoil more than those rules or demands or egotistical ruminations, whatever they were.


(in reply to moutas)
Profile   Post #: 62
RE: SLAVE AND RELIGION - 6/3/2010 8:51:37 PM   
IronBear


Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Andalusite

Calla, "Lord" used by male humans strikes me as Ren Fair-ish, rather than an attempt at deification, along the lines of "Earl" or "Duke."


A question Andalusite old chap, am I correct in believing that your reference to male humans using the term "Lord", "Earl" or "Duke" and I would imagine you'd add "Count" too, refers only to their use within the  BDSM area? I mean, those titles are both legal and are used in areas of society where they have real meaning pertaining to someone (mostly) hereditary status. Bloody hell I'd hate to be thought of being Ren Fair-ish when formally addressing my Peers, especially as there is no attempt, consciously or unconsciously, in deification of anyone, just good manners to address people in a manner in which they are entitled if socially required.

_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to Andalusite)
Profile   Post #: 63
RE: SLAVE AND RELIGION - 6/3/2010 9:01:40 PM   
GraciousLady


Posts: 529
Joined: 7/7/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: moutas

I think that a slave must not be entitled to follow a personal religion in an usual form because her god must be her master so either the slave is atheist so god and master are the same recipient, or the slave is believing in a religion and she has to consider that her master is the only intermediary between her god and herself. So she has to address her prayers and devotions only to her master. It is not of her business anymore if her devotions and prayers are transmitted to an eventual creator. Her actions in religion are to stop at the first level: her master!
The leash of the slave is not long enough to go beyond this door!

Of course I think that it is the same for male slave and mistress.

(Neither of us is obligated to agree with the other's point of view)



This just sounds to me like your getting a little carried away with your own importance. You have nothing to do with anyones communication with their Diety. If you require a submissive to speak their prayers in front of you and they agree that's ok. But I assure you that you are not an intermediary between anyone and their Deity.

(in reply to moutas)
Profile   Post #: 64
RE: SLAVE AND RELIGION - 6/3/2010 9:19:00 PM   
IronBear


Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline 		Sounds like the OP needs time, a lot of time, in fact many, many years in a monastery after taking a vow if silence with no computer access to contemplate his navel or any other part of his anatomy to discover the meaning of his own divinity. Perhaps self flagellation three time a day and menial work will help purge his mind, body and soul of his apparent aspirations of reaching deity. 

_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to GraciousLady)
Profile   Post #: 65
RE: SLAVE AND RELIGION - 6/3/2010 9:28:08 PM   
TheRaptorJesus


Posts: 640
Joined: 6/3/2010
Status: offline 		The original poster needs to learn to differentiate fantasy from reality. This sort of heresy cannot be condoned lest he find himself in the clutches of Satanasaurus Rex.

A slave must unto its own self remain true, as we are all servants of the most high but express that service in whatever manner is unique to ourselves.


_____________________________

What if your God... were a motherfucking DINOSAUR?!

(in reply to IronBear)
Profile   Post #: 66
RE: SLAVE AND RELIGION - 6/3/2010 9:36:38 PM   
Rochsub2009


Posts: 2536
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: moutas

I think that a slave must not be entitled to follow a personal religion in an usual form because her god must be her master so either the slave is atheist so god and master are the same recipient, or the slave is believing in a religion and she has to consider that her master is the only intermediary between her god and herself. So she has to address her prayers and devotions only to her master.



Damn!  Where is Silence8 when we need him? 

(in reply to moutas)
Profile   Post #: 67
RE: SLAVE AND RELIGION - 6/3/2010 9:42:09 PM   
IronBear


Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline 		In nomine Patris, et Filii, + et Spiritus Sancti. Amen

Indulgentiam, + absolutionem, et remissionem peccatorum nostrorum, tribuat nobis omnipotens et misericors Dominus.

Dominus vobiscum



_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to TheRaptorJesus)
Profile   Post #: 68
RE: SLAVE AND RELIGION - 6/3/2010 11:27:30 PM   
reynardfox


Posts: 417
Joined: 9/8/2009
Status: offline 		I didn't notice that the shuttle from planet dickhead had arrived.

(in reply to moutas)
Profile   Post #: 69
RE: SLAVE AND RELIGION - 6/3/2010 11:31:02 PM   
DogGoneBad


Posts: 40
Joined: 11/25/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: TheRaptorJesus
The original poster needs to learn to differentiate fantasy from reality. This sort of heresy cannot be condoned lest he find himself in the clutches of Satanasaurus Rex.

A slave must unto its own self remain true, as we are all servants of the most high but express that service in whatever manner is unique to ourselves.


Awwwwwhoooooooooooo... don't let this idiot put the fear of Satanasaurus Rex into you. that stripped to the bone MoFo is stuck on display at the Smithsonian. slaves serve your masters in whatever manner they require of you. Don't listen to this ancient bonefull sinful lies, The Great Dog (God) flooded and sorched the earth of this foul evil menance. Ash to Ash and Dust to Dust. Don't let this evil take hold again else humanity will suffer the same fate.

< Message edited by DogGoneBad -- 6/3/2010 11:44:19 PM >

(in reply to TheRaptorJesus)
Profile   Post #: 70
RE: SLAVE AND RELIGION - 6/3/2010 11:53:14 PM   
Whiplashsmile4


Posts: 2305
Joined: 12/2/2008
Status: offline 		well son of a bitch. You mean somebody can actually take a slave and name her Eve and sick her in their Dungeon of Eden?

_____________________________

Жизнь ума ебет.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nUzJI4Palq0

(in reply to mistoferin)
Profile   Post #: 71
RE: SLAVE AND RELIGION - 6/4/2010 12:06:41 AM   
Aswad


Posts: 9374
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Andalusite

Calla, "Lord" used by male humans strikes me as Ren Fair-ish, rather than an attempt at deification, along the lines of "Earl" or "Duke."


The word does not carry the same connotations everywhere. It has been common in many cultures for a slave to address the master of the house so. The same goes for a vassal to a liege, clergy of sufficiently distant relative station, and so on. There's nothing particularly odd about the use of the term. If you want to go looking for ridiculous points of origin, consider 'master', a proper form of address for a child of a certain age in some households.

Deification, incidentally, is a feature of Christian doctrine, as laid out by the purported saint, Saul of Tarsus, and is certainly a living tradition in many regards, including the notion of the pope as a veritable incarnation of the divine among Catholics, and the similar traditions with regard to priests in many churches. The Dalai Lama has parallells to the pope in this regard, and for a time the same held for Krishnamurti. If you want to see real deification in modern times, consider Mustafa Kemal Attatürk. He is practically worshipped among the secular Turks, and not far from it among some of the muslim Turks, either.

Hell, the Beatles were worshipped, neither the first mortals, nor the last, to be so among the idolu of the West.

Hitler is still worshipped, mostly among Jews, and generally as a demonic figure.

quote:

I won't consider anyone who attempts to use "goddess" to address me, via e-mail or in their profile, since it strikes me as sacrilegious.


I would think it might be prudent to give half a second consideration as to whether they mean the same by that word as you do. For the most part, it does not carry the connotations of religious worship, although I suppose it may be more a matter of degree than of intent. Attraction can lead some to adoration, which is right next to veneration, which is worship, regardless of how much the Mary cultists of the Vatican might rationalize otherwise. But what creator would create humans who are wired so without intending for humans to view each other along a spectrum that reaches for the stars?

Health,
al-Aswad.


_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.


(in reply to Andalusite)
Profile   Post #: 72
RE: SLAVE AND RELIGION - 6/4/2010 12:17:14 AM   
bethsmith1988


Posts: 26
Joined: 12/1/2008
Status: offline 		The Bible says I should not bow down to another god and when I was naked and tied outside and forced to bow down he became my X as soon as I got free

(in reply to Aswad)
Profile   Post #: 73
RE: SLAVE AND RELIGION - 6/4/2010 12:17:40 AM   
GreedyTop


Posts: 52100
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Savannah, GA
Status: offline 		[hijack]YAY!!  Aswad posted!! Hope you are well.. good to see you!! [/hijack]

_____________________________

polysnortatious
Supreme Goddess of Snark
CHARTER MEMBER: Lance's Fag Hags!
Waiting for my madman in a Blue Box.

(in reply to Aswad)
Profile   Post #: 74
RE: SLAVE AND RELIGION - 6/4/2010 12:19:57 AM   
Aswad


Posts: 9374
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Whiplashsmile4

well son of a bitch. You mean somebody can actually take a slave and name her Eve and sick her in their Dungeon of Eden?


Until she eats the forbidden fruit after being enticed by the 'snake'...

Health,
al-Aswad.

_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.


(in reply to Whiplashsmile4)
Profile   Post #: 75
RE: SLAVE AND RELIGION - 6/4/2010 12:54:48 AM   
Aswad


Posts: 9374
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: bethsmith1988

The Bible says I should not bow down to another god and when I was naked and tied outside and forced to bow down he became my X as soon as I got free


Ex hic inferne simiarum liberate me ...

I hope you're joking. The prohibition against the worship of idols is more applicable to watching TV and Hollywood movies than it is applicable to prostration, a practice with long standing roots in religion and secular use alike. Was he an inanimate object, out of silver or gold, like the idol that was placed on top the Ark of the Covenant, or an inanimate depiction of an animate object, as the jews turned to when Moses was away from home for too long (reverting to their Egyptian religious practices, in point of fact, hence the prohibition).

If God had taken an interest in the Bible, its sale to the masses would have been the first prohibition therein.

Health,
al-Aswad.


_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.


(in reply to bethsmith1988)
Profile   Post #: 76
RE: SLAVE AND RELIGION - 6/4/2010 12:56:28 AM   
Aswad


Posts: 9374
Joined: 4/4/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: GreedyTop

[hijack]YAY!!  Aswad posted!! Hope you are well.. good to see you!! [/hijack]


Don't get all excited yet. I'm just stopping by very briefly on my way to bed. Still, thanks.

Health,
al-Aswad.

_____________________________

"If God saw what any of us did that night, he didn't seem to mind.
From then on I knew: God doesn't make the world this way.
We do." -- Rorschack, Watchmen.


(in reply to GreedyTop)
Profile   Post #: 77
RE: SLAVE AND RELIGION - 6/4/2010 12:58:13 AM   
GreedyTop


Posts: 52100
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Savannah, GA
Status: offline 		warmest wishes to you and yours, as always.. :)

_____________________________

polysnortatious
Supreme Goddess of Snark
CHARTER MEMBER: Lance's Fag Hags!
Waiting for my madman in a Blue Box.

(in reply to Aswad)
Profile   Post #: 78
RE: SLAVE AND RELIGION - 6/4/2010 6:41:46 AM   
kuppykake


Posts: 125
Joined: 7/22/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: moutas

I think that a slave must not be entitled to follow a personal religion in an usual form because her god must be her master so either the slave is atheist so god and master are the same recipient, or the slave is believing in a religion and she has to consider that her master is the only intermediary between her god and herself. So she has to address her prayers and devotions only to her master. It is not of her business anymore if her devotions and prayers are transmitted to an eventual creator. Her actions in religion are to stop at the first level: her master!
The leash of the slave is not long enough to go beyond this door!

Of course I think that it is the same for male slave and mistress.

(Neither of us is obligated to agree with the other's point of view)



In terms of Christianity, the Bible says that the head of a woman is man, and the head of man is God.  Even if you do not accept this faith, I see nothing wrong with a slave submitting to a higher power and her Dom simultaneously, just my opinion. 

Ultimately, none of us can prove what is right and wrong when it comes to religion....existence of a higher power is based on an individual's faith.  So you think you should be the only higher power your slave complies with?  Good for you (note my sarcasm), but it is ludicrous for you to expect her to change her faith/beliefs to match yours.  To me, a D/s relationship, much like any other relationship, involves a lot of compromising.  Just because you believe something should be done a certain way does not mean you should close all other doors that do not comply with your standards.  Seriously, don't let your narcissism get in the way of a potentially good relationship.

This reply was not meant to offend anyone, I am simply encouraging having an open mind.

(in reply to moutas)
Profile   Post #: 79
RE: SLAVE AND RELIGION - 6/4/2010 6:47:37 AM   
DarkSteven


Posts: 28072
Joined: 5/2/2008
Status: offline 		Actually, I am an observant Jew and part of that involves me bowing to the Torah as a symbol of G_d.  If a submissive isn't comfortable seeing me bow to my G_d, it ain't going nowhere. 

I am a Dom but do not have the hubris to claim that I am any kind of G_d.  If she worships, then her commitment to G_d is no less important than her commitment to me.


_____________________________

"You women....

The small-breasted ones want larger breasts. The large-breasted ones want smaller ones. The straight-haired ones curl their hair, and the curly-haired ones straighten theirs...

Quit fretting. We men love you."

(in reply to kuppykake)
Profile   Post #: 80
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