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im confused now!! - 6/7/2010 7:37:00 AM   
lally2


Posts: 2621
Joined: 4/16/2009
Status: offline 		something jb wrote started this.... so blame her!   and another thread on Ask a Master contributed to this too -

it seems sometimes, or maybe its just me, that contradictions go around and around and frankly theyd make me dizzy if it actually mattered much to me, which it doesnt, cos ive sussed it  (for me) but i do wonder sometimes what new folk make of it and i do remember hitting these contradictions and eventually filing them away as idiosyncratic and left them to collect dust.

but right now we have a thread that (basically) is discussing how some Dominants come here believing that the way to a subs heart is to be a cold, hard unfeeling distant cruel bastard and then we have what jb has pointed out, that most Dominants want a sub with a brain.

so which is it. 

_____________________________

So all I have to do in order to serve him, is to work out exactly how improbable he is, feed that figure into the finite improbability generator, give him a fresh cup of really hot tea ... and turn him on!
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RE: im confused now!! - 6/7/2010 7:40:48 AM   
LadyCimarron


Posts: 625
Joined: 12/29/2009
Status: offline 		I think you stated it well. I think most of them WANT a sub with a brain. But some of them just THINK they have to have an " overly Dominant attitude" in order to get you girls to want them.

(in reply to lally2)
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RE: im confused now!! - 6/7/2010 7:41:04 AM   
Jeffff


Posts: 12600
Joined: 7/7/2007
Status: offline 		I vote brain. The brains to form an opinion . Then the stones to defend it and the self respect to disagree with me when I am wrong.

All that makes the conquest and surrender, sweeter.



_____________________________

"If you don't live it, it won't come out your horn." Charlie Parker

(in reply to lally2)
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RE: im confused now!! - 6/7/2010 7:44:23 AM   
BitaTruble


Posts: 9779
Joined: 1/12/2006
From: Texas
Status: offline 		Cold and heartless rarely works for long-term but can be a hell of a lot of fun. Like most things, moderation and a hefty dose of realism go a long way in life so, for long term, I vote for brains.. for a bita fun, cold and heartless works for a while but getting me hot and bothered with that method is not going to be capturing my loyalty, devotion or love as it generally only relates to parts of my body.. and pretty much the least important part in a lot of respects.

_____________________________

"Oh, so it's just like
Rock, paper, scissors."

He laughed. "You are the wisest woman I know."


(in reply to lally2)
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RE: im confused now!! - 6/7/2010 7:47:44 AM   
jbcurious


Posts: 717
Joined: 3/13/2010
Status: offline 		FFS Lally... like I don't get in enough trouble on my own??

Read my last post on "responsibilities of ownership"... I'd cut and paste but my phone doesn't do that.

_____________________________

'Smile... it's the second best thing to do with your lips.'


I have an explosive personality...


(in reply to lally2)
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RE: im confused now!! - 6/7/2010 7:51:14 AM   
IronBear


Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline 		I can only respond for myself and none other lally sweet lady. I am not terribly interested in micromanaging a slave (never had anything owner wise to do with subs, so they are a bit of a mystery to me). Any slave of mine will need more than a bit of brain, she will need to be able to act independently of me when completing tasks (if she screws up there are no fireworks, but rather a debrief to ascertain why and if I need to be clearer in some instructions). If she is in my personal collar, she will need to do personal service as a butler or "gentleman's gentleman would regarding my clothing and preping baths etc (lets leave the erotic aspect out). If I need her to she will be my uniformed chauffeur, armed body guard (esp if I am carrying cash or valuables and will be licensed as such after being specifically and comprehensively trained by me). She may need to operate plant or machinery if I need a hand in the workshop. She will need to do or learn to do therapeutic massage and she will need to be able to report to me her doings or other matters I may have her check out for me including anything which needs maintenance which I may not be aware of. All in all she will double as my AdC (Aide d'Comp) aka PA. With all this she will be a well trained slave.

_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to lally2)
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RE: im confused now!! - 6/7/2010 8:13:28 AM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline
quote:

is discussing how some Dominants come here believing that the way to a subs heart is to be a cold, hard unfeeling distant cruel bastard and then we have what jb has pointed out, that most Dominants want a sub with a brain


a) they believe it because plenty of women are willing to slobber all over themselves to get with THAT guy.  Granted in four months they come weeping to the boards about it, but at the time, they leap in full force and will laugh at anyone trying to say "WAIT!"

b) most doms actually do NOT want a sub with a brain.  They say it, because that's the party line they know we want to hear, but in the reality of the relationship, questions are shamed and punished, creativity is stymied, and they really just want someone to suck them off when they want and otherwise be a mommy to them.

Most doms aren't capable of handling actual mature solid adult relationships.  Neither are most subs- which is why most relationship fail so regularly.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to IronBear)
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RE: im confused now!! - 6/7/2010 8:15:51 AM   
DomImus


Posts: 2004
Joined: 3/17/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: lally2
but right now we have a thread that (basically) is discussing how some Dominants come here believing that the way to a subs heart is to be a cold, hard unfeeling distant cruel bastard and then we have what jb has pointed out, that most Dominants want a sub with a brain.

so which is it. 


Those two things cannot exist together?




_____________________________

"Regret for the things we did can be tempered by time; it is regret for the things we did not do that is inconsolable." Sidney J. harris

(in reply to lally2)
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RE: im confused now!! - 6/7/2010 8:31:05 AM   
LadyPact


Posts: 32566
Status: offline 		The problem is that, on occasion, new folks come believing the stereotype.  This tends to be true more often in the case of female Dominants, but it comes across for the males as well.  It gets assumed, through very short glimpses of windows, that a Dominant must be that mean, cruel, yadda, yadda, whatever because they don't understand how the warm, compassionate, caring types have the ability to be the sadists, the disciplinarians, the wielder of authority.  It seems to make much more sense for some to make the easy, yet untrue, assumptions.  Same thing goes for the 'sub with a brain' thing.  After all, it must be so much easier to obey if a person doesn't think on their own.  (I hope that's coming through with the sarcasm that I intend.)

When folks come here with these preconceived notions (oh, and especially the ones who claim to have years doing this) they lack all versions of balance.  I honestly don't see how they can have such myopic standpoints.  They have their quick glimpse of what they think it is, but don't have the full, multi-dimensional vision of how people interact for more than just short intervals.  They don't see all the sides of a person or group of people.  It gives them away at times of just how little they really have seen with their own eyes.


_____________________________

The crowned Diva of Destruction. ~ ExT

Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

Please do not send me email here. Unless I know you, I will delete the email unread

(in reply to IronBear)
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RE: im confused now!! - 6/7/2010 8:33:01 AM   
Kana


Posts: 6676
Joined: 10/24/2006
Status: offline 		Aw fuck-lets not get to complicated. Doms like steaming wet cunts-anything after that is a bonus :-)

_____________________________

"One of God's own prototypes. A high-powered mutant of some kind never even considered for mass production. Too weird to live, and too rare to die. "
HST

(in reply to DomImus)
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RE: im confused now!! - 6/7/2010 8:34:32 AM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline 		Pact well said- they also avoid the doms/top who GO SLOW because they want it all now.  So they actually avoid the ones best suited to them, best able to help them take it easy, explore securely and will run right past them into the arms of the ones who will go hot hard heavy fast- and burn out the quickest.

Their choices, their consequences.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to Kana)
Profile   Post #: 11
RE: im confused now!! - 6/7/2010 8:35:32 AM   
IronBear


Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline 		My friend, how could I not disagree with you? Like you I have seen this too.

As a good Pagan friend oft says "Gods grant me courage to withstand and re-educate the ignorant, serenity to accept the challenges in my path and the foresight to hide the bodies of my failed self-control!"


_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to LadyPact)
Profile   Post #: 12
RE: im confused now!! - 6/7/2010 8:50:43 AM   
ranja


Posts: 2111
Joined: 11/1/2007
Status: offline 		Well, i cannot speak for others but in my case; my Husband is not a type that is intouch with His feminine side... i do not think He has a feminine side and would most definitely more suite the cold bastard description... no feelings on His sleeve
... luckily i have brains enough to know His soft spots.

(in reply to lally2)
Profile   Post #: 13
RE: im confused now!! - 6/7/2010 9:04:08 AM   
AQuietSimpleMan


Posts: 1410
Joined: 11/15/2009
Status: offline 		The NEW to the lifestyle what what the fantasy looks like, SO yes there are those who want the quivering in the wind, can't think for themselves slave who bends her will to the Dominant who have no feeling for her at all.

I like to call spades here, A majority of people who find themselved in this lifestyle as a reality came to it from a fantastic point of view, either from literature or erotica that presents reality in a fairly skewed way. There are exceptions to all these rules but I must say in my experience I have met more who come into it thinking that it's all beatings and blow jobs than those who understand that it is just like any other relatiopnship with a some defined kinks and a defined Power Dynamic.

I think that in most cases the only realy DIFFERENCE in a BDSM relalationship from a Vanilla one is the defined boundaries that we use.

In the end People what what they want. I have met women who have been in this lifestyle for years who want the unfeeling, uncaring, Asshat of a Dom who literally treats them like shit, I have met Dom's who want a girl so stupid that they can feed them any line of bullshit and they'll take it.

There is NO common line when it comes to this lifestyle stop trying to find one. The wants of people are as unique as the people themselves.

QSM

_____________________________

Guy Stud =Vs= Girl Slut ~~ Debate ENDED!

"If a Key opens many locks, then it is a Master Key, If a Lock is opened by lots of keys, then it is a Shitty Lock"

(in reply to ranja)
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RE: im confused now!! - 6/7/2010 9:34:53 AM   
allthatjaz


Posts: 2878
Joined: 8/20/2008
Status: offline 		I agree with LuckyAlbatross and LadyPact but I also agree with AQuietSimpleMan.

I believe that many potential relationships fall at the starting gate because everything is based too much on the ideal fantasy.
I know a guy that isn't dominant at all but uses dominance to pull what he calls, young meat. He finds it quite amusing to call a girl 'cunt' and watch her drop her knickers. If you sat listening to his little act, you would probably think he was a tough arsed dominant but actually he's just found a useful tool that reaps him rewards. If he had to do that for more than a day or two, it would exhaust him and thats why his relationships are very short lived!

I know some submissives enjoy being treated like meat. I know some dominants enjoy treating their sub like meat but I often wonder what it must be like to run a relationship where I had such a heartless indifference to my partner. Being a hard nosed bitch all of the time would be a lonely place and certainly not one with a meeting of minds.

I believe the majority (not all) of guys/women that go down this route are not experienced and have read too many erotic BDSM novels or spent too long in cyber chat without getting out and experiencing the real thing.




_____________________________

S&M (Steve and Maria) persona libre de convencionalismos


Fan of edgeplay.co.uk

(in reply to AQuietSimpleMan)
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RE: im confused now!! - 6/7/2010 10:11:47 AM   
UniqueRaven


Posts: 1237
Joined: 9/30/2009
From: Austin, TX
Status: offline 		The reality is that people are people, and we are all human beings.

People tend to do things out of deep-rooted need that manifests itself on the surface as motivation. The motivation is the factor that determines the actions, ultimately.

We can all give examples all day long of Doms and subs who have rushed into relationships, taken advantage of one or each other or both, or who have put on a false front in order to achieve a goal of simple sex, submission, and/or service on both sides of the kneel.

i think that one thing we tend to overlook on the boards is that not everyone wants what we consider a healthy long term or even short term relationship. There are a lot of men and women who are here simply for fantasy fulfillment, or to ignore some deep rooted issue, or distraction, or whatever. We can't project onto others our reasons for what we do - people don't always do what you think that they should, so there can't be judgment - only acceptance.

Ultimately it comes down to compatible goals, wants, and needs. For me, i have been taking my time to identify all of those - which i have now - and honestly, there's a lot of variability as to what i would consider a "successful" long term M/s relationship for me - from a position of simple service similar to what IronBear outlined, all the way to deep love and connection of relationship-based slavery. i know what i have to offer as a slave in my value equation, and the key to my being Owned again ultimately will be - again - compatibility of that deep-rooted need..both mine, and my Owner's.

People are people, we can discuss all day long why they make the choices that they do - but ultimately we have to accept the simple fact that those are the choices that they make, and either accept them, or not.

< Message edited by UniqueRaven -- 6/7/2010 10:12:07 AM >

_____________________________

"My life has no purpose, no direction, no aim, no meaning, and yet I'm happy. I can't figure it out. What am I doing right?" ~Snoopy (Charles Schultz)

My blog is at http://takinghishand.wordpress.com

(in reply to lally2)
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RE: im confused now!! - 6/7/2010 11:01:52 AM   
leadership527


Posts: 5026
Joined: 6/2/2008
Status: offline 		Well, it wasn't all that log ago that I was that new dominant coming here. I didn't actually give much thought to what "most subs" were expecting of me. I was more interested in trying to understand the overall lay of the land and how I might or might not fit into it. Even had I been single at the time, I can't imagine myself defining my own self on the basis of what "subs" want. Had I come and determined that in fact "subs" did want cold and heartless, I'd have just concluded "wrong pool for me to be dipping my toes in".

_____________________________

~Jeff

I didn't so much "enslave" Carol as I did "enlove" her. - Me
I want a joyous, loving, respectful relationship where the male is in charge and deserves to be. - DavanKael

(in reply to lally2)
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RE: im confused now!! - 6/7/2010 11:10:28 AM   
lally2


Posts: 2621
Joined: 4/16/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DomImus

quote:

ORIGINAL: lally2
but right now we have a thread that (basically) is discussing how some Dominants come here believing that the way to a subs heart is to be a cold, hard unfeeling distant cruel bastard and then we have what jb has pointed out, that most Dominants want a sub with a brain.

so which is it. 


Those two things cannot exist together?

yes they can, and thats the whole point in a way.
 
as bita says, its hot when he turns the bastard tap on but as maria says and bita says thats not sustainable (we know that). how soulless would that be.  and i agree that there are people who use this to tap into that part of the female sub psyche that kinda likes a bit of rough treatment and there are some that love it all the time.
 
i agree with you uniqueraven and others whove said the same, that its all about choice but im still curious how two new Doms have both said recently that they came here thinking it was all about being a bastard and are discovering that actually it isnt and that more can be achieved by just being themselves, loving, caring and careful.
 
i think LP and others who said that its all about being exposed to fantasy literature etc are probably on the money there too - but ive certainly met guys who reputedly had plenty of experience but still held on to the idea that to be distant and austere is the route to go.
 
im kinda with LA in that many men dont want a woman with brains - least thats not what they set out to find.  pretty much all of the men ive dated were after tits, arse and something to hit - when they found i could be entertaining cerebrally i honestly saw a turn around in their thinking - they began to enjoy engaging my brain too.
 
im fairly certain that it is the new folk on the block, armed with fantasies and no clue who probably out number 'us' - perhaps its just a learning curve people have to go through.
 
the fact that people think this though and its obvious that they do - that all dominants are abusive bastards and all subs are weak fuck ups seems unavoidable.
 
thanks guys xx





_____________________________

So all I have to do in order to serve him, is to work out exactly how improbable he is, feed that figure into the finite improbability generator, give him a fresh cup of really hot tea ... and turn him on!

(in reply to DomImus)
Profile   Post #: 18
RE: im confused now!! - 6/7/2010 11:41:27 AM   
lally2


Posts: 2621
Joined: 4/16/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: leadership527

Well, it wasn't all that log ago that I was that new dominant coming here. I didn't actually give much thought to what "most subs" were expecting of me. I was more interested in trying to understand the overall lay of the land and how I might or might not fit into it. Even had I been single at the time, I can't imagine myself defining my own self on the basis of what "subs" want. Had I come and determined that in fact "subs" did want cold and heartless, I'd have just concluded "wrong pool for me to be dipping my toes in".


yes i was thinking this a time ago.  that of course we are all focused on what we want - and maybe thats where it goes a bit pear shaped for some as a relationship evolves.  the sub then reverts to focusing on want the Dom wants and the Dom carries on thinking about what he wants - because of all the reasons we've already mentioned.

that is the impression ive been given by many of the Doms ive dated - to the point of me having no 'wants' of my own atall. 

so where do these guys get their unrealistic assumptions from - im not citing one or two people, statistacally im talking pretty much 80% of the guys ive dated in the past.

ok, to a certain extent i was attracted/attracted - but for a while there i really believed that was what a Dominant was, there was no other option available to me and when i discovered there was it took a bit of time to adjust to that.

i dont know what im saying here, just i find it interesting. x

_____________________________

So all I have to do in order to serve him, is to work out exactly how improbable he is, feed that figure into the finite improbability generator, give him a fresh cup of really hot tea ... and turn him on!

(in reply to leadership527)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: im confused now!! - 6/7/2010 11:43:52 AM   
DesFIP


Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline 		Both and more, but all at the right time. When we're discussing how to repair the house, sadism doesn't fit the bill but his brain does. If I have a panic attack, then neither of those, just calmness and him radiating the fact that it's safe and he is in control. When the teen is being a royal PITA, then the cold heartless bastard comes in useful.

I need him to be a multifaceted person, just like I am.


< Message edited by DesFIP -- 6/7/2010 11:44:22 AM >

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!


(in reply to lally2)
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