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RE: Well trained sub/slave... - 6/9/2010 2:20:34 PM   
IronBear


Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline 		To wit and wisdom, old chap you may add silliness to which passes for over the top humour. Underneath, as folks get to know you, you may find some jolly good friendships develop with kinky folk with similar situations as you have. There some rude, ill mannered, cold hearted couldn't give a fuck arseholes here to as you'd expect from any large group of people. You've been polite, friendly, haven't tried to lecture and have a reasonable profile all of which many good folk will find all to the good. I'm going to enjoy watching you develop here. 

_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to sir1969)
Profile   Post #: 41
RE: Well trained sub/slave... - 6/11/2010 4:31:28 AM   
zephyroftheNorth


Posts: 8159
Joined: 10/5/2009
From: The Great Frozen North
Status: offline 		First of all, love your profile and kudos for taking the rants out of it 

Oh jeez people will say anything in their profile whatever their side of the kneel, from fudging of the truth to out and out lies. I once met this Dom who claimed to be 56, when we met it turned out he was well over 60 - and married!

As to your thoughts on previous experience, I would look for someone with enough RT experience to be (hopefully) past the fantasy of what being owned really is. Then again it really depends on the individual sub, not all who have no experience have an unrealistic view of what being owned really entails.

Good luck on your search, I hope you find the one you are looking for.

zeph


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The pain gonna make ev'rything alright ~ Black Crows

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(in reply to sir1969)
Profile   Post #: 42
RE: Well trained sub/slave... - 6/11/2010 5:23:08 AM   
LadyPact


Posts: 32566
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: sir1969

Just curious about something.  Wife and I have been searching for our sub for 2+ years now, no luck.  Mostly run into fakes or when we do communicate for a while, they'll just up and vanish.  Maybe just our bad luck as some people on here are actually finding what they seek - at least that is what I wish to believe .

My question though is more about what some subs/slaves put in their profiles.  Often, many will claim they are well trained by such and such a dom/domme, etc.  As if that is a strong selling point.
But I'm wondering if that is actually a good thing.  Just because they are "trained" doesn't mean they would be a good sub/slave for me - I have very particular tastes and rules, etc.  It almost seems it would be better to find someone with little or no training.  Maybe just enough experience to know they want more.

Thoughts?


As to your first paragraph, I think there is something you should keep in mind.  You are literally in competition with every other couple who wants to add a female sub to their household.  There really is a reason that they call it unicorn hunting.  There has been more than enough said on the subject on the poly board.  You may want to read some threads there.

As for your second paragraph, I'm going to go against the grain.  If I released My boy tomorrow, and he put up a new profile to reflect that he was in My service for three years, I do think that would give him some bonus points.  That doesn't mean to say that any new Domme that he would have wouldn't have to train him in particulars regarding serving her.  Still, I don't think it's nearly the same as starting from scratch.

IronBear specifically mentioned prior training as a Gorean slave and I'd have to say the say thing for those of us who run dynamics that are more leather oriented.  The next Dominant in his life wouldn't have to teach him about leather protocols, how to serve properly at a high protocol dinner, how to care for her leather garments, toys, etc, and a ton of other things that I could list here.

So, yes, I honestly think that would be an advantage for him. 


_____________________________

The crowned Diva of Destruction. ~ ExT

Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

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(in reply to sir1969)
Profile   Post #: 43
RE: Well trained sub/slave... - 6/11/2010 5:52:36 AM   
IronBear


Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline 		The way I am looking at all this, is that there is a place for Formal Training, Experience and Aspirations (including wants and needs). In the formal training I would include such things as Butlering, Silver Service (of the standard as used in the great houses on both UK and France), Personal Maid (Correct handling of clothes etc), The correct way to deal with silver and crystal ware and so on but may include other services such as remedial massage, caring for invalided or disabled persons.  All of these are formal training and each one of them I can locate suitably qualified and experienced people to train some one, should I require it.

Therefore ideally, I would like to see a written CV from a prospective slave showing:
  1. Formal training including support documents in some cases. 
  2. Experience - This would give me an accurate picture of the experience of service, personal service, BDSM aspects and the areas which the slave believes he or she excels in (giving head to two or three men at once springs to mind for some abstract reason). and should include hard limits.
  3. Finally there should be the aspirations of what the slave would like to do or learn. It may well be she wants to graduate to be the Master's slut or even his personal whore. This is very personal so most be left open to be dealt with as such.
Do I seriously expect this? No of course not but these are the things I will be wanting to find out anyway.


_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to LadyPact)
Profile   Post #: 44
RE: Well trained sub/slave... - 6/11/2010 6:55:43 AM   
porcelaine


Posts: 5020
Joined: 7/24/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: IronBear

The way I am looking at all this, is that there is a place for Formal Training, Experience and Aspirations (including wants and needs). In the formal training I would include such things as Butlering, Silver Service (of the standard as used in the great houses on both UK and France), Personal Maid (Correct handling of clothes etc), The correct way to deal with silver and crystal ware and so on but may include other services such as remedial massage, caring for invalided or disabled persons.  All of these are formal training and each one of them I can locate suitably qualified and experienced people to train some one, should I require it.


Your viewpoints run parallel with my own. If I received instruction in the areas mentioned inside of the household I would label it as such. However, training that was gained by attending a reputable facility that prepared me to serve as a household manager or personal assistant would be duly noted. We have a wonderful program in the U.S. that covers that quite well. :)

quote:

Therefore ideally, I would like to see a written CV from a prospective slave showing


The slave CV isn't mentioned very often, but I recommend putting one together.

~porcelaine


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His will; my fate.

(in reply to IronBear)
Profile   Post #: 45
RE: Well trained sub/slave... - 6/11/2010 7:04:06 AM   
CarrieO


Posts: 2432
Joined: 1/27/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: porcelaine


The slave CV isn't mentioned very often, but I recommend putting one together.



I knew there had been a thread here about that...  http://www.collarchat.com/fb.asp?m=2792736

A rather interesting read.



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(in reply to porcelaine)
Profile   Post #: 46
RE: Well trained sub/slave... - 6/11/2010 10:00:00 AM   
porcelaine


Posts: 5020
Joined: 7/24/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: CarrieO

I knew there had been a thread here about that...  http://www.collarchat.com/fb.asp?m=2792736

A rather interesting read.


Thank you for sharing the link. I remember it quite well.

~porcelaine


_____________________________

His will; my fate.

(in reply to CarrieO)
Profile   Post #: 47
RE: Well trained sub/slave... - 6/11/2010 10:33:18 AM   
SubsDom2


Posts: 1
Joined: 11/29/2008
Status: offline 		I just wanted to thank everyone for all of the comments and advise for Sir and I. Believe me, I know how difficult it is going to be for us to find our third. This has been a goal of mine for my entire adulthood. A triad is simply logical and desirable to me. I also realize the uniqueness in that perspective, given that I am a female. Yep a female who is secure enough with herself, her relationship, and status with her Sir and the world to not experience jealousy. It simply has never been one of my traits and has no place in service nor Domination.   But the reality is we are a hard sell simply because we require a sub to relocate. We accept that, it is just the mass of truly fake people on here that I must sort through. It just gets old. Mind you, we have had some great contacts with real subs who simply do not have the same life goals as us. Those are actually energizing. However, even those are so far and few between; it can get disheartening.     Since I do most of the searching, my patients and fortitude are truly being tested. I would be neither the good sub nor Mistress I know I am without both of those. So again, thank you for all of your support and honesty.   Smiles ^_^

(in reply to CarrieO)
Profile   Post #: 48
RE: Well trained sub/slave... - 6/11/2010 11:15:55 AM   
leadership527


Posts: 5026
Joined: 6/2/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: IronBear
...but these are the things I will be wanting to find out anyway.
Interesting. For me, the 64 million dollar question is "will this slave obey?" From what I can tell reading collarme, finding an obedient slave is a lot tougher than finding a needle in a haystack.

_____________________________

~Jeff

I didn't so much "enslave" Carol as I did "enlove" her. - Me
I want a joyous, loving, respectful relationship where the male is in charge and deserves to be. - DavanKael

(in reply to IronBear)
Profile   Post #: 49
RE: Well trained sub/slave... - 6/11/2010 11:28:17 AM   
porcelaine


Posts: 5020
Joined: 7/24/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: leadership527

Interesting. For me, the 64 million dollar question is "will this slave obey?" From what I can tell reading collarme, finding an obedient slave is a lot tougher than finding a needle in a haystack.


You'd better provide your definition before you respond. 'Cause there's a lot of spin on that one.

And the needle can be found. Trust me.

~porcelaine


_____________________________

His will; my fate.

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Profile   Post #: 50
RE: Well trained sub/slave... - 6/11/2010 4:36:55 PM   
IronBear


Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline 		The way I see it Jeff, is that were I to make assumptions or just treat her like a sex doll, I doubt if I'd get a lot of obedience. Now lets agree that we are talking about reality here with real live people and not a fantasy or a short time hook up with a "rent-a-slave/sub". Ask your self this, if you employed, even casually someone as a home help or domestic, wouldn't you want to know some history and reliability as well as whet the hired help can and can't do first. Assuming that you have sorted any language problems even prior to seeking other information? Y'see mate, I look at any slave as being potentially an important part of the business of running Bruin Cottage rather then a social appendage. being a Poly home the slave will become part of the family and part of our lives. Obedience in my experience, and unless there are legal means of compelling it (E.g. the Military), is somewthing which is earned in the final analysis and if the slave is going to stay. An awful lot of stuff gets sorted out in the "Wooing Period" or in my case the Probationary Collar" period. But hey old chum, we each have our own techniques, way and means of doing things don't we?


_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to porcelaine)
Profile   Post #: 51
RE: Well trained sub/slave... - 6/11/2010 8:40:43 PM   
leadership527


Posts: 5026
Joined: 6/2/2008
Status: offline 		@Ironbear:
*nods* I would never argue that other methods aren't perfectly workable. And given how radically different your household is from mine, it's almost a given that different methods would be prudent. I think my emphasis on obedience is largely because I'm spoiled by Carol. In her, I have an almost totally malleable person to work with. I honestly cannot conceive of how a similar person would not be workable into the existing structure. Conversely, it's hard to imagine me taking the risk of adding someone in who was not so flexible because for me, it would not be a hierarchy. It wouldn't be Carol first, then this other person. If it fell apart, it'd be for all the marbles.

_____________________________

~Jeff

I didn't so much "enslave" Carol as I did "enlove" her. - Me
I want a joyous, loving, respectful relationship where the male is in charge and deserves to be. - DavanKael

(in reply to IronBear)
Profile   Post #: 52
RE: Well trained sub/slave... - 6/11/2010 8:51:19 PM   
IronBear


Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline 		Agreed mate. I often admire how you process and do things. Noit sure if I could do anywhere as good in a home based on yours. Isn't diversity a wondrous thing? We get to see results of all sorts of matters from one end of the spectrum to 'tother. Wonderful learning experience this. 

_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

(in reply to leadership527)
Profile   Post #: 53
RE: Well trained sub/slave... - 6/12/2010 9:00:54 AM   
CaringandReal


Posts: 1397
Joined: 2/15/2008
Status: offline

A lot of dominants do not want experienced submissives, and while they often justify that desire with the assertion that someone trained one way cannot be (easily) trained in another way, the real reason is sometimes simply that they relish the joys of introducing somebody new to bdsm to... well... all of that "newbie stuff" that strikes one so hard and profoundly when one is brand new. They also like being the expert and maybe feel too insecure to assume that role with someone who has been doing bdsm longer than they have.

To me, such individuals perhaps lack insight if they do not see that there are more profound experiences that lie beyond all the newbie stuff. Getting the preliminaries out of the way (a process that can take years with somebody new to bdsm--see Lally's "Letting Go" thread) as quickly as possible leaves much more room/time to explore the really deep waters.

I was talking to someone once with whom I had a large age discrepancy and I asked him if my extensive experience as a slave was intimdating to him. He laughed and said, "All of your extensive experience is with obeying authority." Perfect answer, I thought. :)

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"How seldom we recognize the sound when the bolt of our fate slides home." --thomas harris

(in reply to sir1969)
Profile   Post #: 54
RE: Well trained sub/slave... - 6/12/2010 9:22:56 AM   
PeanutTigerinBox


Posts: 1624
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: CaringandReal



A lot of dominants do not want experienced submissives, and while they often justify that desire with the assertion that someone trained one way cannot be (easily) trained in another way, the real reason is sometimes simply that they relish the joys of introducing somebody new to bdsm to... well... all of that "newbie stuff" that strikes one so hard and profoundly when one is brand new. They also like being the expert and maybe feel too insecure to assume that role with someone who has been doing bdsm longer than they have.


~ FR ~

Very well said, yesterday I had one who claimed "you need a strict master to take care of you since it seems you cant on your own now can you"...what a surprise that, once I stated some facts to him that I can do very well on my own and "that there is a difference between a sub/slave who enjoys serving a master out of her nature to one who does it out of stupidity due to not being able to manage life on her own" he pissed off and deleted my next email unread

< Message edited by PeanutTigerinBox -- 6/12/2010 9:23:57 AM >

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aka Phoenixpower

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(in reply to CaringandReal)
Profile   Post #: 55
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