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RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers - 6/14/2010 11:04:27 AM   
subrob1967


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery
Unfunded tax cuts will do that.

Not all states are in this position--comes down to which ones planned ahead, and which ones bought votes.


I really try to understand this logic, I really do, but then common sense slaps me in the face. Raising taxes is a sure way to kill off any hope of making your state attractive to new business, which brings in new residents, which brings in more tax dollars.

The problem with governments is, they suck at managing money, stop spending what you don't have, and you won't run into budget shortfalls!!!!

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RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers - 6/14/2010 11:25:21 AM   
pahunkboy


Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		Very few people in my region got a COLA.   This means food taken off my table for increased costs.

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RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers - 6/14/2010 12:00:53 PM   
juliaoceania


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From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
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quote:

They failed.  I want my time back- I and others learned nothing.


That is obvious by how you post.....


But you can't blame them for the fact that one can't make a silk purse out of a sows ear...

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RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers - 6/14/2010 12:27:25 PM   
pahunkboy


Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
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quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

quote:

They failed.  I want my time back- I and others learned nothing.


That is obvious by how you post.....


But you can't blame them for the fact that one can't make a silk purse out of a sows ear...


I will tell you how this is going to go.  A month ago- I posted that you been robbed of your 401K.   People laughed- and now- the teachers are about to be robbed.  Did I post that your 401k has been looted?

So now- my 401k, and anyone who lives in PA- their 401k- is lessened when one has to pay 30% more in property tax.   In a restaurant I can choose not to eat there.  But I must LIVE somewhere!   Only suicide would be an answer to op out of this madness.

Retirement funds should have been in CDs- that is how the elders did it.  Not in flash trade fiat stocks.   Now the peons must make all the the government workers whole?

Why?   We got none of the upside.

--I will tell  you how this goes- at a certain point- the public simply will not accept higher costs. 

Therefor cuts are coming. I did not create the derivatives casino.   And now I am being forced to pay the casino.  

While I am at it- Social Security for current people is going to be cut by 2/3.

In time we will see price controls and wage controls.



My schooling failed to teach me that the central bank is private-funds all wars- and has been collapsing nations since the 4th century.

I will I could locate my old co-worker- who moved here from NJ.  She infiltrated the teachers union to expose their games.

They pulled a maneuver that denied the elected board its negotiating powers.   We wont get me started on how they also needed an expense new building!  In the past 5 years- 3 superintendents quit.






IMO teachers salary ought to BE the average household salary for that zip code.   Lets take my town- the average household income is about $9500 a year.  We have a portion of the homes that do not have running water.   So- for our area they should be paid $9500 a year.  Not the 65k a year they currently get.

I have no children- and if all of us voted by not having children- their jobs would be obsolete.   Factor in too that someone from India could do the same job for 1/5 what they arrogantly get paid to do.

If however- teachers did a GOOD JOB, and the household income for my zipcode was 200k a year- then I am in favor of paying the teacher 200k a year.   So if they improve life here then let them be paid.

The other option is to home school.



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RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers - 6/14/2010 12:44:08 PM   
Musicmystery


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quote:

ORIGINAL: subrob1967

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery
Unfunded tax cuts will do that.

Not all states are in this position--comes down to which ones planned ahead, and which ones bought votes.


I really try to understand this logic, I really do, but then common sense slaps me in the face. Raising taxes is a sure way to kill off any hope of making your state attractive to new business, which brings in new residents, which brings in more tax dollars.

The problem with governments is, they suck at managing money, stop spending what you don't have, and you won't run into budget shortfalls!!!!


I didn't say raising taxes.

Explain to me the logic of 12 years of Gov. Pataki cutting taxes in a failed attempt to build his national credentials with conservatives--all while increasing borrowing and fees, getting us into the mess we are in now.

Know what attracts residents? Good jobs. Know what attracts good jobs? Highly qualified labor pool--THAT'S the top cost of every business. Quality of living--beautiful parks, arts, sports, etc. can all help too. And quality education is a must.

But instead, a system THAT WAS ALREADY PAID FOR was suddenly unfunded and replaced by nothing by buying right wing votes with tax cuts.

How is that benefiting the state now?

I understand the business climate argument--I am a business man, after all. But the point is often presented as the end all and be all--and it's simply not. It's "a" factor, not "the" factor, and not even the most important factor at that.

When people leave here, they don't go to lower tax states--they go to places with high tech jobs and higher paying educational opportunities.

Yet somehow fixing the damage done by unfunded tax cuts is then "raising taxes," when we did fine for years and years with those "higher" taxes.

Also---I've lived and worked in four states, and I'll happily pay higher taxes here because the quality of services is SO much better.

So you almost got it--the problem with governments is, they suck at managing money, stop cutting funding for the spending you have to fund your programs and initiatives (including pro-business ones), and you won't run into budget shortfalls!!!!



< Message edited by Musicmystery -- 6/14/2010 12:45:45 PM >

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RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers - 6/14/2010 7:52:46 PM   
Musicmystery


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quote:

IMO teachers salary ought to BE the average household salary for that zip code. Lets take my town- the average household income is about $9500 a year. We have a portion of the homes that do not have running water. So- for our area they should be paid $9500 a year. Not the 65k a year they currently get.

I have no children- and if all of us voted by not having children- their jobs would be obsolete. Factor in too that someone from India could do the same job for 1/5 what they arrogantly get paid to do.

If however- teachers did a GOOD JOB, and the household income for my zipcode was 200k a year- then I am in favor of paying the teacher 200k a year. So if they improve life here then let them be paid.


So the rich districts automatically get the top teachers, and the poor districts get no teachers at all because no one is going to teach for $9500/year.

Excellent way to ensure the poor districts continually remain poor.

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RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers - 6/14/2010 8:26:12 PM   
pahunkboy


Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		Excellent way to ensure the poor districts continually remain poor./snip

higher pay in this area the last 40 years has done nothing-

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RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers - 6/14/2010 8:28:08 PM   
Musicmystery


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Status: offline 		Sure it has. You at least have teachers.

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RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers - 6/14/2010 10:05:52 PM   
pahunkboy


Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

Sure it has. You at least have teachers.


Why are they so inept that Wall street put their pensions into a black hole?

Aren't those in education- supposed to set the example, be a role model?

As a group this union was not smart- was swindled out of their 401ks.

Same teachers are spreading this "knowledge" to me?

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RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers - 6/14/2010 10:12:20 PM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline 		You have no idea what you're talking about, for starters.

Teachers don't have 401(k)s--they have 403(b)s, and those are on top of their pensions.

And guess what? Far from being swindled, they're doing great.

The union has nothing to do with it.


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RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers - 6/14/2010 10:17:44 PM   
tazzygirl


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Joined: 10/12/2007
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quote:

I have no children- and if all of us voted by not having children- their jobs would be obsolete. Factor in too that someone from India could do the same job for 1/5 what they arrogantly get paid to do.


1 - Its obvious you have no children by example of what you posted.

2 - Not having children makes us ALL obsolete in a few decades.

3 - These teachers are trained to do what they do. Some do it well, some not so well, some poorly. Forcing them to make poverty income would only drive the best of the breed from the profession.

Sometimes i wish you would think before you click ok to post, pa.

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RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers - 6/14/2010 10:18:01 PM   
pahunkboy


Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		If they are doing so great- why is a 30% property tax increase now required?

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RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers - 6/14/2010 10:19:29 PM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline 		You just answered your own question.

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RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers - 6/14/2010 10:23:19 PM   
pahunkboy


Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		http://www.zerohedge.com/article/mercer-pays-500m-settle-pension-suit

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RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers - 6/14/2010 10:46:12 PM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
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quote:

IMO teachers salary ought to BE the average household salary for that zip code.  


So they should take out student loans, give away 5 or so years of their life in college (years they could have spent making money) to teach kids whose parents are ungrateful pricks like you? I wouldn't teach kids, why? Because it doesn't pencil out for my bottom line...

You obviously never went to college. You do not know how hard you have to work to get a degree, or how much money you have to pay for one, and you expect others to give their time away... why? Because you are too lazy to seize the day and do something with your life. It is easier to piss and moan about those who did something of value with theirs, and try to penalize them for it then it is to do something with your meat suit... whatever dude.,

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RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers - 6/14/2010 10:53:17 PM   
pahunkboy


Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		You obviously never went to college./snip.


Wrong.   I did 4 years in 3 - and graduated with honors.

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RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers - 6/14/2010 10:58:01 PM   
pahunkboy


Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		Happily- my home does have running water.  

I fail to see how people are not concerned over property taxes.   Prior to the civil war- we did not have them.   My brother is stuck paying 17k a year.   Luckily houses are cheaper here. 

But why has management failed so miserably?

We have the best and the brightest.  Where are they?

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RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers - 6/15/2010 6:54:32 AM   
thishereboi


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Joined: 6/19/2008
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quote:


They failed. I want my time back- I and others learned nothing.


I don't normally agree with pa, but this time I think he might be spot on


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RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers - 6/15/2010 7:03:54 AM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline 		To go through that experience and come out learning "nothing" is a fault in one's self.

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RE: Schools struggle to pay retired teachers - 6/15/2010 7:11:20 AM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

You obviously never went to college./snip.


Wrong.   I did 4 years in 3 - and graduated with honors.




I find this hard to believe.... I mean you have no respect for teachers, you have zero respect for the FREE education you received from your state, you call your teachers "failures"... and yet they prepared you to go to college? You really are a thief if you get services without paying for them as you got that much out of your primary education



You make other posts that sound as though you are an expert on social security and disability, and I cannot find the thread, but I could have sworn you talked about being disabled... so it is okay to collect on social security, but not the other pension programs you paid into? That is like stealing. So your answer to being "robbed" as a taxpayer is to steal from the very people who educated you, that in my book is a totally fucked up worldview.




_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

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